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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 11/23/2007 9:44:30 AM | Then homeschool and don't send your kids to a public school where they can potentially pass serious illnesses on to other children.
Thats easier said than done...
Charles, how did you refer to homeschoolers in another thread? Something about usurping the system...
Anyway...
As misguided as that may be; there are many people who hold that view. Homeschoolers have been put in jail for educational neglect as it is. Now if the parents were the use the Immunization issue as a reason to homeschool; they would still run the risk of being accused of medical neglect. Which is worse than educational neglect. IMO
Get your kids Immunized; but have it done at a private doctors office. This way you would have more legal options, if something goes wrong. The US government is next to impossible to sue these days. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 11/23/2007 12:09:26 PM | People like absolutes. In certain situations it promotes safety in thinking rationals that cause people to feel safe and reasured that all is well, even if it is not. Self deception I believe it is called.
Whether or not a vaccination promotes a shield against one or more diseases for a child in this case for a long or short time period, just knowing that the child has recieved a vaccination means all is safe and well in that situation/area. If you are not going to be a participant to help people feel safe by doing as the rest are doing, you will hear of it by someone.
Unfortunately in this case some over anxious thinking individual thinks vaccines are the final answer to mending all childhood illness woes and if your not vaccinating your own child then your endangering the health and well being of the entire school/social area the rest of the community is a participant of and you should be jailed because your not doing what is claimed to be the correct thing to be doing.
Face one fact; a large growing portion of the world is becoming very socialistic and wants the rest who are not that way to become that way in thinking and deed. What once was abhored and fought against is now being reembraced with new terminology. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 11/24/2007 4:56:20 PM | Dont you just love the way people hijack threads in order to rant about their hobby horses be they US Foreign policy, illegal immigration , birth control, war, sex education or whatever youre having yourself 
Where it is only one or two kids without vaccination then it makes little difference to the vaccinated population .
Surely even if 99% are unvaccinated it makes no difference whatsoever to the vaccinated population ?
and pregnant women or children too young to recieve the vaccine .
maybe a valid point but......
Vaccinated people, after coming into contact with some virii, are still capable of transmitting it to the unvaccinated.
So then surely it doesnt matter whether the people one is coming in contact are vaccinated or unvaccinated ?????
previously limited diseases can become epidemic among the unvaccinated population with all the attendant public health care costs.
Agai possibly a valid point (In countries with comprehensive state provided healthcare) but it still goes back to my original point of where do we draw the line
one could accuse people who dont get their kids vaccinated of being negligant regarding their own childs health but then again one could say the same about parents who smoke around their kids or allow them to eat junk food or dont make them exercise.
Is jailing people the answer for one thing there are circumstances where locking upgroups of unvaccinated people close together for a time only to eventually release them back out into the community could backfire rather spectacularly. For another who do we let out of our overcrowded prisons to meke room for these people -murderers or rapists ? And then theres all those liberal sentimental notions about it being wrong to lock up people who arent deliberatly doing anything to harm anyone ? | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/12/2007 5:38:39 PM | 12/12/07
Merck is recalling about a million doses of a vaccine known as HIB which prevents meningitis and pneumonia.
The move was made after testing showed problems with sterilization. This vaccine is a three dose shot recommended for all children under five.
So far, Merck says they're not aware of any harm to children who've received the shots. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 3:55:30 AM | | Hep B is much easier to acquire than HIV. The virus can live outside the body much longer. HIV virus does not. Children often bite, a bite can lead to Hep B, an extremely serious disease, esp. in a child. Please don't post misleading information. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 5:33:35 AM |
The best question left here was -if your child is vaccinated- what threat does an unvaccinated child really pose?
Vaccines have never guaranteed 100% protection from infectious diseases. However, the symptoms suffered by an immunized child who contracts the infection are almost always milder than those in an unimmunized child.
There are a number of reasons why efficacy rates are variable. All infectious diseases do not respond to vaccinations in clinically identical ways. Vaccinations for measles (causal agent ~ virus) tend to be more effective than vaccinations for whooping cough (causal agent ~ bacterium).
One of my daughters was 20 months old when she contracted whooping cough. What initially appeared to be just a common cold turned into a nightmare of paroxysmal hacking coughs followed by vomiting. Having worked as a clinical scientist in immunoserology and bacteriology for years, as soon as I heard the characteristic inspiratory "whooping" sound, I knew that my daughter needed antibiotics as soon as possible to start working on the infection.
Of course, this happened to occur on a weekend so I took her to a clinic. I told the attending physician that I suspected my daughter had whooping cough. He patronizingly asked if all her immunizations were up to date. When I replied in the affirmative, he informed me that since my daughter had been immunized against pertussis, there was no way it was possible for her to get that infection. When I informed him of my background and the fact that it was indeed possible for an immunized individual to contract the infection immunized against, he rolled his eyes, told me my daughter just had a "bad cold" and sent us away with no prescription.
On my return home, I phoned my daughter's pediatrician at his home. Cognizant of my medical background and trusting my judgement, he phoned in a prescription for antibiotics to be delivered to my home immediately. We also arranged to bring my daughter to his office at 8 a.m. Monday morning for swabs and blood samples to be taken.
This pediatrician took one look at my daughter on that morning and said "WOW". He had seen numerous cases of whooping cough in his career and told me that my daughter's symptoms were truly impressive. He also asked for the name of the attending physician in the clinic so that he could "ream his sorry, ignorant ass out". To the surprise of nether my pediatrician nor me, results of the serology and cultures grown demonstrated a whopping bordetella pertussis infection.
Because I was so familiar with this infection and knew what to look for, my daughter was able to get on antibiotics quickly (pertussis does not respond well to antimicrobial therapy in the latter stages). However, there is not a doubt in my mind, that had my daughter not been immunized against whooping cough, she likely may have died. I cannot imagine what she would have suffered with absolutely no protection.
So to those who "don't believe" in childhood immunizations ~ your exposed child is still capable of infecting immunized children. Sure hope your "beliefs" work for ya and you never have to bury your child or live with the long term consequences of your ignorance. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 6:53:05 AM |
Having 11 and 15 year old daughters, I have done extensive research on this subject and I will not allow my children to receive the HPV (Gardasil) vaccine regardless of whether it becomes mandatory....I'd much rather educate my daughters on the risk of STDs and the importance of safe sex and regular Pap tests than allow them to be used as guinea pigs in a real life drug study.
chatter_box ~ this is hands down, one of the most intelligent and well researched posts I've ever seen in this forum and I sincerely wish that readers would forward it to their friends and family.... I have posted similar info on other websites.... your daughters are blessed to have you as their mom !
from Health Canada ~
HPV is a sexually transmitted virus that is quite common, especially among younger women. However, there are over 100 types of HPV and only a few are high risk types. Only a fraction of women infected with high risk types will develop cervical cancer.
The Papanicolaou (Pap) smear test is used to detect changes in the cervix before they become cancerous or when they are at a stage when treatment can be effective. Since the introduction of the Pap test more than 25 years ago, the death rate from cervical cancer has declined dramatically, dropping almost 50 percent. The survival rate is 74 percent over five years ( nb ~ this statistic covers all stages ).
Health Canada http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/iyh-vsv/diseases-maladies/cervical-uterus_e.html
from the American Cancer Society ~
About 3,670 women will die from cervical cancer in the United States during 2007. Cervical cancer was once one of the most common causes of cancer death for American women. The cervical cancer death rate declined by 74% between 1955 and 1992. The main reason for this change is the increased use of the Pap test. This screening procedure can find changes in the cervix before cancer develops. It can also find early cancer in its most curable stage. The death rate from cervical cancer continues to decline by nearly 4% a year.
Cervical cancer tends to occur in midlife. Half of women diagnosed with this cancer are between the ages of 35 and 55. It rarely occurs in women younger than 20.
The 5-year relative survival rate for the earliest stage of invasive cervical cancer is 92%. The overall (all stages combined) 5-year survival rate for cervical cancer is about 72%.
Keep in mind that 5-year survival rates are based on patients diagnosed and initially treated more than 5 years ago. Improvements in treatment often result in a more favorable outlook for recently diagnosed patients.
http://www.cancer.org/docroot/CRI/content/CRI_2_4_1X_What_are_the_key_statistics_for_cervical_cancer_8.asp
In my educated opinion, the Gardasil HPV vaccine campaign is NOT about protecting our daughters from cervical cancer but rather about further lining the deep pockets of Big Pharma. It is a crafty work of fearmongering intended to persuade those too lazy to do the research. And now a mandatory vaccination program ~ overkill is too impoverished a word to use here. Would you call the fire department to haul in their hoses to put out a few candles on your daughter's birthday cake ??? | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 7:34:00 AM | Fist off, let me just say that I am thoroughly impressed that there wasn't more mud slinging done on this very controversial topic. 
Secondly, while I believe fundamentally in vaccinations, I do believe it is the individuals right and responsibility to decide if and when they should receive any vaccine. In the case of minor children, that responsibility falls onto the parents. I do not believe it is up to the school district/board, the city council, or the government to dictate what an individual does with their own body.
I know a family who had an extremely bright, bubbly, outgoing, *NORMAL* child, who upon receipt of his 18 mo MMR vaccine is now severely handicapped and yes, it can be directly linked to the vaccine. I have personal experience with this as well, altho not to the same extreme. I was told my oldest son was vaccine damaged as a result of his MMR vaccine when he was about 5 or 6 yrs old, after 2 yrs of trying to find an explanation for his behaviour. Personally I do not believe that is the case for him as I am sure I would have seen much more violent reaction to the vaccine at the time it was given, not 3 or 4 yrs down the road. Being told this tho, at the time my second was coming up for his 18 mo shots, I sat down with his drs and explained my concerns to them. Not wanting to risk potentially harming another one of my children in the name of protecting others. They told me it was up to me if I wanted him vaccinated or not. It wasn't a matter of *IF* for me, more a matter of *WHEN*.
I was pushed by the preschool for my oldest when he was 3 yo to have him vaccinated for chicken pox. I refused. I did the research on my own, sat down with his dr and had her explain to me WHY I should vaccinate him. She said not to do it. She listed off a whole bunch of reasons why it wasn't necessary for my child. I listened to her, and came up with my own plan. If he didn't have them by the time he was a teenager (13-16) I would educate him on the risks, have him speak with the dr, and allow him to make his own (informed) decision. My youngest had the pox at 4.5 mo. I was told he would more than likely have it again because of his age. He did. Just before he turned 2 yo. At that time my oldest who was almost 6 came down with them too. Problem solved. No chicken pox vaccine necessary now for either one of my children. The way it was explained to me is the vaccine does not PREVENT you from coming down with the disease. It just lessens the severity of it if you do contract it.
In 1994 I was exposed to HepB by a FWB. This was someone I'd known for about 10 yrs, and trusted him to be honest with me. He wasn't. He nearly died. I lost all trust in him. Had the tests done (negative), talked with my dr, and then had the vaccine. A simple kiss is enough to transmit this. How many of our children are in playgroups as infants, toddlers and preschoolers? How many times have you seen a child pick up and mouth something another child just had in their mouths??? This is one I am a FIRM believer in. Oldest son had the shots for this at birth because of the area we were living in. Youngest hasn't had them because we were living in a different location that does not vaccinate for HepB starting at birth, and we couldn't afford the cost of the vaccine, which we would have had to pay for out of pocket.
BTW... I have been vaccinated for small pox, but I do not have the scar as I was given and ORAL dose.
VERY controversial topic. Everyone will have their own opinions on this and their own feelings pro and con. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 8:50:38 AM | I think that vaccinations are a good thing. However, isn't forcing people to get vaccinated is a violation of Civil Rights?
That being said, I think that most people think most vaccinations help children to get over diseases, with a couple of exceptions:
1) The Flu Vaccine.
Seems that it doesn't help a lot of people who get vaccinated to NOT get the influenza, and some people even get it FROM the vaccine. So a lot of people don't want to get vaccinated, even if it's free.
2) The MMR Vaccine.
Most people I know want to immunize their kids against Measles, Mumps and Rubella (German Measles). However, what they DON'T want is an All-In-One Vaccine, that seems to be associated with Autism. They would rather just do it in 3 separate vaccines.
Makes sense. When you get a Vaccine, it's not like an upgrading your Immune System. You're actually infecting yourself with a small dose of the illness. But it is very small, and accompanied by antibodies from horses, so there is only a very small chance of getting a full infection from the disease. However, it's still a drain on the body. So, it's not so clear that it would be a good idea to put the body under stress from 3 diseases at the same time.
But doctors seem to like it. Cannot understand why they don't just give people the choice:
MMR or 3 vaccines in 3 months. They could keep a record of who gets what, and then compare that to who develops Autism, High Functioning Autism and Asperger's Syndrome, and in 10 years, they could have a true study that could settle the issue once and for all. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 9:04:00 AM | | The problem with non-vaccinated individuals is that they can get sick and we all know how some viruses can mutate quickly, spreading new, drug-immune variants of themselves. Even one non-vaccinated person can eventually lead to an epidemic. Anyone who thinks otherwise should do some research. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 1:44:32 PM | for scorpiomover ~
Cannot understand why they don't just give people the choice:
MMR or 3 vaccines in 3 months. They could keep a record of who gets what, and then compare that to who develops Autism, High Functioning Autism and Asperger's Syndrome, and in 10 years, they could have a true study that could settle the issue once and for all.
In 1993, Japan, which manufactures its own vaccines, withdrew MMR after possible indications that the strain of mumps vaccine it contained was linked to cases of meningitis. The MMR was replaced with single vaccines.
Researchers from the Yokohama Rehabilitation Center and the Institute of Psychiatry looked at the incidence of autism spectrum disorders among 31,426 children up to the age of seven born from 1988 to 1996 and the findings were subsequently published in the Journal of Child Psychology and Psychiatry.
The results of this study showed that the annual rate of autism spectrum disorders increased progressively from 47.6 per 10,000 for children born in 1988 to 117.2 per 10,000 for those born in 1996. This clearly shows a rise in reported cases after the withdrawal of the MMR vaccine.
If causality were definatively able to be shown between MMR and autism, one would have expected the rate to fall after the MMR vaccine was withdrawn. On the contrary, the reverse was true ~ the rate continued to rise. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 12/13/2007 4:11:31 PM |
The problem with non-vaccinated individuals is that they can get sick and we all know how some viruses can mutate quickly, spreading new, drug-immune variants of themselves. Even one non-vaccinated person can eventually lead to an epidemic. Anyone who thinks otherwise should do some research. Vaccination greatly decreases the risk of people getting a disease, but does not eliminate the possibility. However, the current wave of Superbugs that are not eradicated by antibiotics like Penicillin, such as MRSA, are not blamed on a lack of use of antibiotics, but rather that because they are used so widely, the ONLY viruses to survive are the ones that are resistant to penicillin, and because the non-resistant viruses have been wiped out, they are free to breed at will. In the same way, in an environment where everyone HUMAN is vaccinated, the normal viruses will have no humans to thrive on, but they will have animals to inhabit. The viruses will produce mutations, and both the mutations and normal viruses will both attempt to pass themselves to humans. But only the mutations will survive. Since the mutations will not be stopped by the vaccine, it will have a free hand. Since everyone will expect that no form of the virus will exist in any human, no-one will look for it, so it will thrive and thrive, until it passes to others, who are equally not vaccinated by the mutation. That could produce an epidemic, because our own sense of false security is not expecting it.
In 1993, Japan, which manufactures its own vaccines, withdrew MMR after possible indications that the strain of mumps vaccine it contained was linked to cases of meningitis. The MMR was replaced with single vaccines. The Japanese could have bought UK stocks, or stocks from plenty of sources, because I haven't heard of the MMR vaccine being contaminated in the UK. However, changing procedure is more likely to have caused more problems, than buying stocks from somewhere else. So it would be pretty flimsy to suggest that was the real reason they changed the system.
I did find 2 things on the internet: the standard age for the MMR vaccine is about 12-13 months, and these kids were tested up to 7 years, which means that the latest these kids could have got the vaccine is 1990, a full 3 years before Japan banned the MMR vaccine. So I cannot relate the fact that Japan stopped using MMR in 1993 to this experiment.
It sounds like the Japanese decided to play it safe, like I suggested, but didn't want to speak out publicly against the Yokohama doctors, as it would make them "lose face", which is a big deal over there for the Japanese. So, they may have invented this excuse to allow the doctors to "save face", quite a common practise over there, but not over in the West.
Researchers from the Yokohama Rehabilitation Center and the Institute of Psychiatry looked at the incidence of autism spectrum disorders among 31,426 children up to the age of seven born from 1988 to 1996 and the findings were subsequently published in the Journal of Child Psychology and Psychiatry. I believe the standard method of Scientific testing is as follows: Have a test group, the non-MMR kids, and a control group, the MMR kids. But don't let the kids or the parents know which kids got the MMR vaccine and which kids got them the vaccines separately. Then monitor them until 18, so you fully observe their Autistic tendencies. That way, you can be sure of what happens to both. In this case, they didn't follow standard procedure. Why, I don't know.
The results of this study showed that the annual rate of autism spectrum disorders increased progressively from 47.6 per 10,000 for children born in 1988 to 117.2 per 10,000 for those born in 1996. This clearly shows a rise in reported cases after the withdrawal of the MMR vaccine. In a proper experiment, the important thing is to have a control, a baseline that can allow your test to confirm that it has not been tampered with, and that no other things are affecting the results. Without this, any test is pointless, as you might be jumping to the wrong conclusions. If MMR was NOT linked to Autism, what they should have seen was that the numbers REMAINED THE SAME. The fact that the numbers went up, means that other things are going on, and the experiment is not reliable.
Understand that I am all for the MMR vaccine, as it would ensure less kids get sick, because they get all of the vaccines at the same time, not some now, and some later. Neither am I convinced on either MMR being linked to Autism, or unconnected. But this experiment doesn't make it clear at all.
The centre needed to pick parents who would agree to have their kids used for these experiments, set up a test group and a control group, and follow them to adulthood, because the experiment also included the whole autistic spectrum, which would include Aspergers and High Functioning Autistics, so it would include slow development of social & dating skills, so you'd need to see how they reacted as teenagers and young adults as well.
If causality were definatively able to be shown between MMR and autism, one would have expected the rate to fall after the MMR vaccine was withdrawn. On the contrary, the reverse was true ~ the rate continued to rise. The mere fact it rose, destroys the effectiveness of the experiment. It shows that something else was making it rise, so it could be that if the MMR vaccine had been kept, the numbers might have risen much, much higher. We just don't know. All we know is that the experiment failed its required conditions. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 4/14/2008 9:04:37 AM | I like how everyone just started a flame war against what some of us said, I was merely stating that I do not want my government choosing what I put in my body, I believe it should be up to the parent, not big brother, yes I did site some of the prison planet articles, but the reasoning is not for saying GET RID OF VACCINES, no educate yourself, I got some vaccines but some I refused to my father, but my reasoning was that they hurt "I was only a little boy at the time".
In school, the teachers actually call me and my brother and father in for a conference and told us, "IF YOU DO NOT GET YOU CHILDREN VACCINATED, THEY WILL BE EXPELLED" and my father said ok will get them their vaccinations, so we went and got our tetanus shot, and my father told them what they said, and my father and the physician went to a little room and talked, then supposedly" " we got all of our shots.
I do not want someone telling me what I should put in my body.
No I do not want any polio and small pox, fuk you are calling us crazy WTF, how does that sound reasonable at all, really you think I want to go back the the dark ages of medicine, I never said that, never.
NO LAW< NO LAW< KNOW LAW | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 4/14/2008 4:42:22 PM | I dont think mandating immunization is a form of human rights abuse. It prevents the spread of disease in the population. The good of the many and all that kind of thing.
In Ontario they are now introducing Gardisil, an HPV vaccine, free of charge, for high school girls,, read..age 14ish. I think its prudent to support this program, cervical cancer is preventable. And abstinence aint gonna happen!
I dont really care if you dont want something put in your body. I dont want you running around spreading smallpox and polio! | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 4/14/2008 5:32:31 PM | As I say again.
It is just crazy to think that I or anyone would want a pandemic.
I just don't believe that the government should have say so in what I put in my body, IF I THINK that a vaccine is useless or the ingredients are dangerous and unnecessary, THEN it should be UP TO ME or a PARENT to decide so, not the government.
Its not like we are saying, NO MORE VACCINES, no the ones speaking out against the vaccines want safer vaccines, we want choice in vaccines, and we want to educate the public.
One more idiot saying, "DO YOU WANT A POLIO OR SMALL POX EPIDEMIC" I will fuking burst.
Importantly, no one I know even gets the Small pox vaccine, so WTF? Why site that as your argument. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 4/14/2008 7:31:46 PM |
One more idiot saying, "DO YOU WANT A POLIO OR SMALL POX EPIDEMIC" I will fuking burst.
DO YOU WANT A POLIO OR SMALL POX EPIDEMIC? (had to say it)
These parents who don't want their children vaccinated shouldn't go to jail, but the schools have every right to kick the kids out of school until they do.
I just don't believe that the government should have say so in what I put in my body, IF I THINK that a vaccine is useless or the ingredients are dangerous and unnecessary, THEN it should be UP TO ME or a PARENT to decide so, not the government.
I agree, they shouldn't have the right to force you to put something in your body that you don't want to, but they do have to the right to tell you to stay away from certain places if you don't comply.
The same way they have the right to make you smoke outside of public buildings, they would have the right to make you stay out of public schools if they wish, and if you don't follow the law, you could infact, end up in jail.
I'm thankful, that to get into the school my kids attend, you must have proof that your kids have had all thier shots. It's bad enough they are bombarded with the flu and the occational case of head lice... but I would hate to get a letter home from the school saying has been an out break of the measels, mumps or rubella.
As for the whole autism argument... there is no proof that the immunizations are what cause it. If you'd rather beleive Jenny McCarthy (who has no medical background) screaming that her son got autism from the vaccines, then so be it. IMO, she was looking for something to blame the autism on and that's all she came up with.
There has been plenty of scientific studies done on autism and nothing has come up conclusive stating that the MMR vaccine is the cause of autism.
Environmental factors that have been claimed to contribute to or exacerbate autism, or may be important in future research, include certain foods, infectious disease, heavy metals, solvents, diesel exhaust, PCBs, phthalates and phenols used in plastic products, pesticides, brominated flame retardants, alcohol, smoking, illicit drugs, and vaccines.[5] Although parents may first become aware of autistic symptoms in their child around the time of a routine vaccination, and parental concern about vaccines has led to a decreasing uptake of childhood immunizations and an increasing likelihood of measles outbreaks, there is overwhelming scientific evidence showing no causal association between the measles-mumps-rubella vaccine and autism, and there is no scientific evidence that the vaccine preservative thiomersal helps cause autism. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 4/15/2008 11:18:46 AM | I'm in 100% agreement with this school district. Even when I started school way back vaccinations were mandatory so why is this even an issue?
Then some wonder why health care costs continue to rise unless of course you're on some type of Governmental funded program and you don't pay a dime. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 6/10/2008 3:22:07 PM | i have been immunized....i think every-one should be...ASAP.....
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 6/10/2008 11:22:25 PM | The immune system is an extremely complicated system that modern science has not even come close to fully understanding. If they ever do , it will be a break through of enormous advancement in health care. Hopefully , modern medicine is putting heavy emphasis on immune system research . But , I thnik these mega- corp cartels are more intersted in treating chronic illnesses , without much incentive for developing cures.
It would be nice to see the government break up the big pharma cartel allowing the creation of a free market for competitve small companies. Unfortunately , big pharma and government have a very cozey symbiotic relationship through the FDA.
Vaccines tamper with our immune systems , there are many who feel that vaccine safety studies are surprisingly few and often biased in the favour of the intere$t of big pharma . Many feel that vaccines are very suspect.
I think it is healthy to be very skeptical of vaccines , especially with the explosion of immune system disorder related illnesses .
I very much think vaccines should not be forced on the public. | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 6/10/2008 11:57:31 PM | There are two sides to most issues. I feel for the parents that believe their child developed Autism after receiving shots.
I am happy that Polio is no longer the threat is was, and several others as well, what about people flying in from other countries? Are they required to have shots before entering our country? If, we are all given the shots and some work and some dont, then a person from another country flys in and spreads a disease, then who are we protecting? | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 7/1/2008 6:19:34 PM | I'm gonna start by admitting something that will make me the enemy of all people terrified of vaccines. I am the grandson of an Abbot Labs pharmacologist and inventor. His projects that are popular today include fan favorites like Selsun blue, an anti-depressant nasal spray, and the IV. When he told me about what it was like working there, I can confidently say that I don't fear big pharma. When developing new drugs, vaccines, and procedures they don't just start by mixing stuff up. They start with theories, then go to detailed math and chemistry, look at similar research, run simulations, then when they finally make the first variant, there is a series of animal testing. After that, there are human trials. Nothing can make it onto the market without at least 2-5 years of observing effects in humans. Usually, it takes longer than that because they have to go through multiple different variants.
I will admit there are two critical flaws in that system as it exists. First is that the clock on copyright starts when it is developed, not when it's released or approved. Second, is that the FDA isn't notorious for having high standards. Competing in Europe is part of what keeps our meds safe.
Now, I have a question to ask: why don't we trust the people who know stuff about medicine make decisions about medicine. And let people who know stuff about being paranoid, make decisions about being paranoid. We already legislate that people aren't allowed to bring machine guns to school, why not stop them from bringing other deadly weapons (diseases) to the schools?
Oh, and there is a religious exception form you can fill out if you have a legitimate religious objection. there is also one allowing a medical exemption if the vaccine would be dangerous to your child (a real doctor has to sign it though). | |
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| Immunize or Go to Jail
Posted: 7/1/2008 6:46:41 PM |
Diseases naturally die off. When most vaccines where introduced the disease where dieing off, the government should have no say in what i choose to put in my body.
I was going to read all the responses before responding to this thread but the above statement was just too good to resist. It is true! Diseases do actually die off eventually unless they are able to survive dormant in a carrier host. The way they "naturally die off" is by killing their host. Ya know, the human 'host' who had the misfortune to catch the disease! So, sure we can certainly wait while all the diseases in the world "naturally die off". After all at least a few people are always immune to any given illness so there would be a few people left alive! The question is, Who is willing to spin that roulette wheel and hope that they are one of the rare immune folks. Remember before the advent of antibiotics and vaccines most humans died in their 30s or 40s. Now with the superbugs we have managed to grow through biological engineering and just plain inappropriate use of antibiotics, we just might bring that number down to the 20s or younger.
Also to the person who asked why their child must be immunized if all the others are?
1. What if everyone thought that way?
2. Some children are unable to be immunized with live vaccines such as MMR because they have dieases that effect their immune system. For example, children with AIDS, Cancer, Rheumatoid arthritis, etc. Essentially any disease affecting immunity or any drug that suppresses the immune system might make it dangerous for the child to receive a live vaccine. Children with these are not required to be vaccinated with the live vaccines but would be in danger if other children are not.
3. If a disease is not able to be caught or carried by any animal host and if every single person is immunized for the disease, it can literally be eradicated from the face of the earth. This has essentially occured with Small Pox. Small Pox vaccine is no longer required because so much of the population was immune that there were no longer any infected people to spread the disease and so the CDC recommended stopping its use. There was only a small amount of the bug stored in a test tube culture in a few research facilities. With the advent of Terrorism, it was felt that the disease might escape from some of these labs and there was some question of possibly resuming administration of the vaccine. I'm not sure but I believe it was decided that they would just moniter the situation but keep enough vaccine on hand that they could start immunizing people quickly if an outbreak occurs. | |
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