eazk
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Joined: 9/8/2006
Msg: 26 | |
| abused
Posted: 12/5/2007 9:50:46 PM | OutMind~...From reading your other posts I can pretty much ascertain that you have the ability to engage in fairly intense conversations with women. I have no idea how many women you've dated, nor how many you've gotten to a level of interaction where these types of discussions can take place.
What I do know is that once I started paying attention to the number that came forth with these types of comments...and I qualified them enough to know we weren't talking spankings as a child, I've been astounded at the numbers. While I certainly can't verify the authenticity of every report, I've gleaned enough information, including emotional hot spots, that I have no problem believing 75+%. Even among the apparently healthy ones I've seen it...including 1 counselor, 1 child psychologist, and 1 psychologist and professor.
As far as the 25%...psychology studies vary...lowest numbers I've seen are around 20% of the adult female population were physically or sexually abused, highest is about 35%. Point being, the ratios are radically out of sync...soooo...what's that make you wonder?
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| abused
Posted: 12/5/2007 9:58:07 PM | | I didn't say anything about proven stats.I said about 90% of the women I have been with,have been abused.And I did mean sexually.It was just a figure.My xw was aboused as a child ,by an uncle got to 3 of her sisters. I had asked if I had come across a high amout of women.I have no proof as to what the exact % of women have been sexually abused. Hopefully it's not that high. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/5/2007 10:00:39 PM | | Proven stats are useless if nobody comes forward and reports the crime! | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/5/2007 10:01:28 PM | | This is a sad but enlightening post. I noticed several years ago before I got married and when I was dating that MANY women told me they had been raped at a younger age. i would say 1 in 3. I was shocked to hear this. Most instances were date rape. But I have no problem believing it is far more common than society admits. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/5/2007 10:06:54 PM | stc888,
Same with my XW, only it was the grandpa. Got her, her dad, and both of her sisters. I always wondered why her family didn't like me. Well, actually it wasn't me. It was men in general. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 5:14:03 AM | I think the 90% is a touch unrealistic, but I'm a guy and we seem to have a different definition to what abuse is, ( don't go jumping down my throat quite yet) to a man abuse would have to contain some form of violence or a threat, to a woman it might be not that clear cut, either way, if a woman feels that she was abused, then she was abused, it may not have been a violent rape at knife point, it might have been an uncle who squeezed just a little to tight, abuse is like hunger, nobody can tell how hungry you are, nobody can tell when you feel abused
I think it would be interesting to know how many men suffer in silence. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 6:18:45 AM | I don't know about the 90% of the female population but I can tell you I was raped as a child. I was 6,7 and 8 years old he did the same thing to his sister. When I turned 13 my father went to prison for rape of 13 year old girls. "That is a long story and more to it"
Most of my friends were children of sexual abuse as well and if they were not it was physical abuse.
Even still if the abuse did not happen to them they knew a close relative or friend whom it happen to..
As far as the ratio is I would would believe it to be 1 out of every 3 had a serious abuse.
I went to my 20th high school reunion and was really surprised to find out the most popular girl ran away from an abusive home life.
I have worked through the things in my past. They have made me very strong I don't even sweat the small stuff which most of my friends freak out over. I have been told that I hide my emotions to well even family say that they can not read me.
These things have made me who I am and I love the person I am. I guess as long as my childrens lives are good then everything I went through was worth it.. | |
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Posted: 12/6/2007 6:30:08 AM | Its more common than you would think
And no, you cant tell just by looking at someone... | |
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Posted: 12/6/2007 7:01:46 AM | | This maybe a bit off subject but any man or woman who takes a child or adult in this way rape is the lost form of scum ever to crawl out from under a rock. Sorry just had to give my two cents. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 7:05:54 AM | OP,
90% of women out there to be sexually abused sounds pretty high for me...
90% of women saying that they were abused in one of the following ways
(physically,emotionally, psychologically, or sexually,etc ) at one point in their life... sounds more realistic to me...
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 7:26:59 AM | Is is possible to then draw a line. And I know all this is indeed a gray area, because in the one side, abuse can be almost anything. I got abused my my coaches, they screamed at me, made me run until I was under a lot of pain, made me hit other people or go into a situation where I knew I was going to get hurt. Yet with all the pain I would never call that abuse because it made me better. I can say the same thing to many other people in my life. Now let's switch to women, are some of these episodes, which to a man are considered character forming, for the woman is abuse? And here, where I would call it the point to draw the line, which ones would require intervention, by the law, or a professional or a counselor? Would we still be at that high number?
I do have to say in retrospect that I have gone out a lot with damaged women. And the only ones that had nothing wrong happened to them, were in such high horse that they thought they sh!t diamonds.
So my question, if you draw that line, would the percentages be as high as said by the OP? | |
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eazk
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Joined: 9/8/2006
Msg: 37 | |
| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 8:01:51 AM | I think the key here about abuse is that it is tied to you not being able to control/avoid what is happening to you. Being abused by coaches was your decision to be a part of that team. You could have quit without painful ramifications. I believe abuse must be tied to a real or perceived threat against safety and well-being, either of yourself or of ones you love.
So while the abuser doesn't need to brandish a knife or go, they do have the ability to exert power and control over your life. Those are the types of parameters I consider when I hear stories of abuse. IOW, rough sex is not (necessarily) abuse...although if it is a first time and waaaaaaayyyyy over the top and the person leaves the relationship because of it, then yeah. Spankings up to the emotional age of about 12-13 are discipline, not abuse. Fathers/brothers walking around unclothed with young girls (and typically a weak-willed mom) is emotional abuse.
But in the end, each person has to clarify in their mind, what it is. Just like one poster said...if I say I'm hungry, who are you to say I'm not? However, in our current, blame-centric society I do believe that there are cases where women have over-stated it...but the mere fact that there is enough there that it could be over-stated means there was something there to beging with...and that is the problem.
Of course, the real problem is "WTF is with all these fathers, uncles and grandfathers that think sexual activities with daughters, nieces and granddaughters is acceptable? What so screwed with their brains that they are seeing this as behavior they can live with? Why is it adult males think it is OK to forcefully take whatever they want...to unload their inadequacies and fears and frustrations on women they had committed to love?" To me, much of it says they have a complete lack of respect for all people, especially women, and more especially, their wives. And it's really sad to think about how these guys have perpetrated that disease onto their sons.
JMHO - | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 8:15:24 AM | Dashriprock, you kinda came out swinging. This thread was started by a GUY who said that in his experience 90% of the women HE met had been sexually abused. That is his subjective experience and some women agreed from their own subjective experience. Of course the statistics from what is known...is 25 % ....1 in 4 women have been sexually abused or molested. How many told no one? Obviously this is the tip of an iceberg. Now that being said....it doesnt mean we continue to be victims. Most are survivors. Hence the reason we still date because we still have faith that there are decent men out there.
oh and it doesn't mean 90 % of men are abusers....ever heard of repeat offenders? I believe that the sort of men who do this kind of thing, usually do it to more than one woman. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 8:28:06 AM | From a child of rape and a daughter of a rapist I can tell you from first hand knowledge... They do not see what they are doing is wrong they can only see their own needs and desires to be met.. When we are young children we really don't have any other way of surviving other than to believe the world revolves around us.
My theory is that the people who commit such selfish acts never really outgrew that feeling. Only their needs and feelings matter and the rest of us are here for entertainment and to fulfill those needs.
I also know that their brains do not work the same as the general population. They do not see or feel things the way "normal" people do.
My father saw a man beating up his girlfriend he beat him to an inch of his life. He thought that was the worst thing in the world. But then he goes out and sexually abused many girls "young girls" and saw nothing wrong with that.
I honestly wish just for a minute I could jump into his brain and see why it works the way it does..
No conscience I do not know born that way or made that way I do not know.. what I do know is it happens we are not to blame..
Women of abuse of any kind are not damaged like so many have said. the people who hurt them are.
Most blame themselves and until they can see it was not their fault they will have problems in everything they do.
For the men who had a sexual problem with a "damaged' women so sad she did not fit into your perfect world. She did not ask to be hurt and with your feelings on the subject what you do and say does not make it any easier. Your words to me come from ignorance and could be considered a form of abuse also. Adding to the problem she already is trying to deal with..Not nice what would your mother say? | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 8:35:57 AM |
I also know that their brains do not work the same as the general population.
Your candor deserves applause. You're a brave woman. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 9:49:36 AM | Outmind I do not need applause I am a survivor I do believe that everything I have been through has helped out many. When a friend has any kind of problem they come to me because well most often I know how they feel.
I have become a more sympathetic person and I do care about others most often more than I do myself.. This world is horrible if you live in the hurt but it can be beautiful if you learn from the hurt instead. If everyone would help others with what they know we would not have as many women still being "damaged".
Bad things happen to everyone I just feel that others do not need to add to the hurt.
UPDATE
One more thing everyone is right a woman will not be happy till she deals with the pain of the abuse.. But I can promise once she does she will be a force to be reckoned with. We are very strong stubborn independent people. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 10:21:22 AM |
I've spoken with alot of women.I'd have to say that about 90% have been abused in one way or another.Whether it was as a little girl,by a relative.or raped either on a date or just at random.
Have I just run into alot of girls that have been abuse,or is it really like this?
I have to agree, sad but true, there is a lot of things considered "abuse" that ALL people endure throughout life. I met someone recently and I'm firmly convinced he's an abused spouse. She's vicious, vile, mean, manipulative and violent. He thinks that is how life is. I don't know if it can be just women, because I think my son is verbally beated to hell by his gf. That isn't up to me to determine however.
Have I been a victim, yes, but it's been so long ago, those things are no longer a part of who I am. 22 years later, hopefully one has had enough counseling, life lessons and one or two people who have taught them love isn't about hurting one another, it's about filling each other with warmth, kindness, support and all the other good things that we can offer one another if we choose. You just have to determine what you can tolerate, how long ago the alleged "abuse" happened and how that person dealt with the situation. Ignore it? Not an option to be with me, counseling, a lot of self-work and a lot of healing and anyone can overcome just about anything. At least that is what I have witnessed in family/friends who have suffered. Then again, my theory is: you're only a victim ONCE. After that, you are an active participant. But, that's just how I view it.  | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 11:08:03 AM | Everyone keeps saying 90% is high, but it's low. Most incidents are unreported so an accurate number is impossible. People's preconceptions on what abuse is makes the topic hard to pin down, but keep in mind that chucking your coffee cup across the room in a demonstation of anger, even if it's not directed at anyone lands you with a simple domestic assault charge.
When I became a dad I took a child abuse prevention class, when I became a husband I took a domestic violence class. Go out and educate yourself as preventitive measures to unintntional abuse. The classes are free and available in every county in the u.s., and going voluntarily is only going to make you a better person.
How many times guys have you pestered your significant other about sex and went to do the deed without 100% clear consent even if she let you have you way? Well like it or not that's rape in the eyes of the law, sex offender's registry anyone?
Women are not exempt from this either, i'm getting a divorce now from a woman that I let beat me and emotionally/sexually abuse me for nearly 6 years. Men have a pathetically low report ratio though, and i'm guilty of it too, so you almost never hear of it. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 11:13:52 AM |
Outmind I do not need applause I am a survivor I do believe that everything I have been through has helped out many.
I don't mean any disrespect with my use of the word "applause" if anything, understanding, support, appreciation, recognition. My current gf is a survivor. So even though I cannot tell you ever that I've been in your shoes or trully understand your experience, it is close to me. So if anything you have my admiration. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 11:23:45 AM | | The statistics as of 2006 are that one in four have been abused. This rate is even getting close for men also. No longer are we looking at a gender based issue but a national issue. The real concern is why are we allowing our children or our past children, which is some of you, to be put into these circumstances. Our national conscience seems almost non-existent. | |
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Posted: 12/6/2007 12:56:08 PM | | Studies point to economic hardship as thr primary reason for domestic violence, the same as minority vs. minority violent crimes. So as our economy fails and more people drop below that absurdly low povery line the numbers of violent crimes start to become an epodemic. Education and real community and political leaders are needed to right this. We shouldn't have to live in fear of our spouses just because of national mismanagement boardering on negligence. But ultimately everyone here has the choice of hurting those that love you out of frudtation and still losing everything, or being an adult and accepting what you can't change but having someone woth you to forever share the burden out of love, not fear. | |
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| Abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 5:48:39 PM | I agree men are abused just as much as women are in a relationship.. They are however do not report it or most often do not even talk about it.
Listening to the news it is however not just the poor or minorities that are beating and hurting each other. One of our political people working for Detroit's mayor was just accused of beating his wife. I believe it happens everywhere most are hiding it.
But if you look you can tell the women in my case who are being or have been abused..
When I take my son to preschool all of us mom's are standing around I could tell you which ones are in a abusive relationship. Which ones have a good relationship with common problems and which ones are treated like a queen.
Really it just takes watching people to know.
It will not change till everyone is willing to take a stand against any form of violence. If these abusive people knew that others would not turn their backs and look the other way. That a child who is being abused was taken in by neighbors and family instead of let go back to the home. If parents of an abuser would admit that their child has a problem and find it unacceptable. If everyone when they see or know of abuse steps up and says no this will not happen with my knowledge.
These abusers would have to stop to avoid the persecution of everyone they know. But now everyone is all about themselves don't get involved for fear of being sued.
I don't believe also that the system we have for the protection of children and women and even abused men really works. I have seen many children given back to abusive parents because they went through classes that the courts required. So in doing so they got their children back to abuse them again.
Until every man woman and child says no, no more are we going to let this keep happening will it end.
But it is not going to happen so we have men who say that is upset them that a woman they were getting intimate with start crying. Finding out that she was abused and something they had done reminded her of it. I feel sorry for those women you in turn treated them pretty bad not as bad as the abuser but for me that would be right up there.
If you are looking for a drama free woman I think there are a few new mom's of daughters in the hospital if you get there fast enough. You might be able to claim one for yourself. Wait till she is 18 keep body guards around her till then. May be just may be she might stay drama free.
I am rambling ignore me!!!!! | |
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| Abused
Posted: 12/6/2007 6:02:53 PM |
That's about right.
Nothin' like getting hot, heavy and romantic with a girl, then she starts crying....... cause you inadvertently did something her rapist did, like hold her leg a certain way.
You are as bout as deep as a shot glass with the empathy of an alligator.
So ya She's been abused so what does it make Her or them any less of a person? | |
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| Abused
Posted: 12/7/2007 4:37:38 AM | ("Then again, my theory is: you're only a victim ONCE. After that, you are an active participant. But, that's just how I view it. ")
ONLY if it's an adult that is the "victim", might i add. And still, it aint as cut and dry as all that...if only life were so simplistic, eh!
Also, any person who questions how often women are the victims of abuse is probably an abuser themself and trying to justify it. I reckon over a whole lifetime it may be AT LEAST 90%, yes. | |
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| abused
Posted: 12/7/2007 4:42:16 AM | Uh huh,
Yup, yeah. Lots of women.
Lots of men too. And when everyone stops lying those stats. are going to swing together in some interesting ways. | |
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