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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/28/2009 6:24:22 PM | | What "time" is he charging for? It's a little different if the advice isn't shady and fake. To be honest, the same things I've said about descamgelo could be applied to a lot of psychologists as well. That's another area that preys on people in their weakest moments, milks them of their money and gives advice that people already know. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/28/2009 6:36:08 PM | The Jerk thing doesn't work. Trust me.
I have said this a zillion times, when a woman falls for a man he isn't a jerk at first, but become's one when we are already attached and sucked into his drama. That is where the myth women like jerks comes from. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/28/2009 10:14:49 PM | Why would someone need to "double their dating"? What's with the urge to date as many women as you possibly can? Can't find a good ONE? Driven by EGO? If you feel the need to date lots of women...you're completely driven by ego...and ego is insecure...
He's a salesman...selling quick tips and techniques for guys who are desperate...the underlying psychology that he touches on makes sense...and is completely obvious when you're slapped in the face with it....but his delivery is flawed...you can't give millions of men a cookie cutter formula for talking to women.....
If that book is gonna be of any use....you have to basically reverse engineer it...you gotta work your way past the "c*cky + funny = complete jackass" crap and figure out why women were running away from you....then you have to start on a journey to discover who you REALLY are and how you need to portray that to your dates....
Why doesn't he talk about why it's important to show a little nervous energy when you're assertively asking the woman out? Why doesn't he talk about why it's important to drop the act and show her that you're not as "cool" "swave" and perfect as you are so desperately trying to be with your rediculously formulaic "humor"?
Women need BALANCE...they need to connect with someone real....
In the end his ideas just perpetuate ego... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/28/2009 10:25:55 PM | I haven't read any of the posts except for the 1st page and the last one so keep that in mind.
I'm female l and I've read this stuff in addition to a bunch of other PUA stuff and I'm going to go with DYD isn't THAT bad. There is MUCH WORSE out there.
I agree with what some people have said in that there's some stuff that's pretty good and some that isn't. You have to be able to filter out what you need and what's morally acceptable. There are a lot of guys that aren't good with girls - they can't start conversations with girls, can't ask them out, can't talk to them, don't have self confidence. The benefit of DYD is that you're building up your self confidence and getting yourself out there and learning how to be attractive to girls. If you had a guy who was dressed poorly with clothes that don't fit well, slouched over and can't say anything to a girl beyond "hi" compared to a guy who is dressed in clothes that fit his body, stands confidently and can maintain an interesting conversation with a girl - who do you think she's going to give her attention to? There are some guys out there who are completely clueless and have to learn to talk comfortably with a girl. I have met them. DYD is helping you build confidence and social skills but you will have to work hard to make them fit with who you are.
In reply to the**** + funny, I mainly think it's to know how to tease and joke around with girls. I think the majority girls like that (but I can't say that for everyone). He's giving a method of how to do that without seeming creepy or offending. It's worked on me.
Overall, depending on the person. I'd recommend it. Maybe sign up for the e-newsletters first and see if you get anything from that. But I will say again, there are also some things I don't like about this stuff and beware about what you choose to internalize and how you do it as a lot of it can be very demeaning to women and that is never a good thing. I think David Deangelo is on the beginning of the PUA community and it can get much, much worse. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/28/2009 10:36:20 PM |
In reply to the**** + funny, I mainly think it's to know how to tease and joke around with girls.
You don't need to focus on getting that "formula" right...that can actually screw you up big time because you're too busy thinking about what you need to say...that you can't act naturally.....
All you need to do is observe how you interact with family and long time friends...and start acting that naturally around women you're interested in....you know we ALL like to tease eachother a little bit...it's NATURAL.... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 5:47:22 AM | The main thing I got from it is not giving up your power in a relationship to your woman, and to be the man. I gave up my power to my ex-wife, and it made me miserable--her too. In fact, if I'd known the DYD stuff before we married, we may not have gotten married--all the signs were there, but I ignored them and was 'nice'.
All that time up until I read DYD, I thought that I wanted to be the 'nice guy', and always do what my partner wanted and cooperate with her even if she didn't cooperate with me. What I had thought was 'nice' was probably wimpy.
Its ok to be decisive and not agree with her all the time, and its alot more fun. Amazing when you give yourself more credit how that affects your esteem with women. DYD helps you get over being intimidated by women, too.
Highly recommended -- all of it won't work for you, but its a paradigm shift from what your mom always taught you to do with women. Being oh so polite is nice, but its not the way to have a good relationship. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 8:20:32 AM | | Exactly. He's trying to sell something everyone already knows. He doesn't offer any solution to the real problem. It's the same as the guy who goes to the doctor and says "My arm hurts when I bend it like this". The doctor says "Don't bend it like that. Pay the receptionist on your way out". It's obvious advice with no real answer or solution on how to magically be the person who can actually enact it. Just for the record, most psychologists and therapists are also dispicable money grubbers leeching off of the weak in my opinion. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 9:37:13 AM |
He's trying to sell something everyone already knows. He doesn't offer any solution to the real problem.
I beg to differ. I think a lot of his stuff is exaggerated for motivational value, but then again, many conditioned "Nice Guys (tm)" need that for any hope of actual change.
I watched a seminar he had on video once, and browsed a few of his articles... and I will say that much of what he says, in GENERAL, is known by a lot of guys, but not all. Of course, that's the same for ANY motivational/health/fiance/romance speaker or author, am I right? And I'm counting the ones who DO good things for people, because after all, much of it's MOTIVATION, not necessarily learning something completely enlightening... although with many of them, they will enlighten you on a few key things that hold the glue together for some.
I think his main thing is that you don't go out of your way to try and make a girl "like you". Some guys disagree with that, so I don't think everyone already "knows" (agrees) with it. Their mom told them otherwise, and they can refer to a girl or two they succeeded with (why did she dump him?), in which going out of his way to playcate to her needs got him a success. It breeds beta-male, which women don't like.
A lot of it is how to improve yourself for you, and for potential women to date, which 90% of it is not too far from common sense... but some people don't see them as "big deals", when in fact, they are.
I think the main complaints about him (and others like him) is the absolutism he has about being a very confined arena of not having the slightest beta-male quality come out... It's focuses too much on a rigid form of your alpha-maleness-only to come out, which is over the top... but again, some guys need an exaggerated shove, and some shouldn't take it -too- literally on the extent it goes. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 5:38:56 PM |
Exactly. He's trying to sell something everyone already knows. He doesn't offer any solution to the real problem.
My god, are you serious? I've met so many guys over the years who are absolutely clueless about how to be successful with women. And some of them are old enough that you'd think they would know better.
The extent of their knowledge seems to come from romantic comedies that imply the key to a women's heart is to show up at her workplace the day after a first date and read her a sappy poem in front of her co-workers, or stand outside her house late at night holding a boom box above your head.
Some men need help, and a lot of it.
I'm certainly not saying that David Deangelo is the end all be all. He's like most people who offer advice and self help. Some of it is good, some not so good.
But, I can say with certainty that a guy is a lot better off with a program like Double Your Dating than listening to the bs that popular culture tries to convince us is the way to succeed with women. And what's even worse is listening to his female friends who'll give him horrible advice about how to impress a girl. Men can get downright confused over the years by listening to the conflicting messages they get from females. Women will tell a single guy how to act based on the way they wish the world was, not on how it actually is.
Guys like David Deangelo can be quite beneficial for confused, frustrated males who have absolutely no luck with women. It's just important not to assume his every word is gold.
But to trash the guy as being a totally useless scumbag is ridiculous considering you'll find guys in this very thread (myself included) who have benefited from some of his advice. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 6:29:05 PM | | Nobody has benefited from his advice. That's the beauty of his whole scheme. It's like this: Desperate guy finally decides he can't take it anymore, he tracks down one of these so called "experts" who basically says a bunch of things you should do that are common sense ideas that you already knew anyway. This makes you think you did something special and have it all figured out so you finally give it a try. It may not work or it may work. If it works you say "Wow, Descamgelo is a genius!" when it was just something you could have done without any advice whatsoever. His whole scheme is kind of like religion that way. So pathetic. I just can't wrap my head around how so many people are not only duped by this but feel the need to defend him in an almost cult-like way. It's sad but really creepy at the same time. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 8:39:57 PM | Your missing the whole point cw35. Most guys don't figure these things out on their own. They need to see it laid out in front of them to understand and apply new behavior. This is what self help is about in general. There's tons of self help books out there that have helped people see things in a new light, practice new behavior, and improve their life in the process.
It would be awfully naive to simply say "Nobody benefits from self help advice. It's something you could have done without any advice whatsoever."
Stop trying to apply your own bias to everyone else and insisting that your 100% correct, and no one could possibly have benefited from David Deangelo's advice, even if they say they have. Don't you realize how pig headed and arrogant that sounds?
Fine, you think he's scum. You think his methods and advice are a scam. You have decided that you don't need his advice as it's common sense anyways.
But how about showing some respect to people who actually claim they learned some things from his program and it's helped them. Your word isn't the end all be all just because you've decided you know better than everyone else.
I was exposed to his program years ago. It helped me. It motivated me to change. You can argue all you want that these things I learned were common sense and I should have known them without his help. But, I'm sorry, I didn't. Because like most things in life, sometimes you need an impetus to get you to change. You can't just magically pull new knowledge out of your butt and change your life. You need something tangible to enlighten you. This can come in different forms, and for some guys that form is David Deangelo.
I'm sure you'll just respond in the same dogmatic way that you have, since you seem unwilling to concede that someone might have a different opinion on this matter than you. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 8:53:01 PM |
Nobody has benefited from his advice.
So since YOU say so, it must be true, right?
If the evidence contradicts your presupposition, then it is the evidence that is false. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/29/2009 9:38:57 PM |
all of it won't work for you, but its a paradigm shift
I've got an even more profound paradigm shift...
"Self esteem is what you think about yourself. Ego is what you think other people think about you. To base your self image on what others think of you is to lack self esteem"
and Gregory says:
It also has absolutely nothing to with ego and insecurity,
Why does someone become a pick up artist? Going around...boosting his "confidence" by seeing how many phone numbers he can get in one night....
Someone like this needs women's approval to feel good about himself....now go back and read MY paradigm shift....
Yes it has everything to do with ego and insecurity because EGO IS INSECURE....
And as far as feeling the need to "double your dating" goes...sure it makes sense to play the numbers and get a better chance of meeting a quality woman....but look at it this way....if you "double your dating" for the sake of feeling better about yourself...you're most likely dating the wrong women anyways....you're just WASTING your time...
So you sit and waste your time with all these women who aren't good for you...when you could be building your true self confidence by having some "me" time and start to appreciate yourself, BY yourself, because of yourself....NOT because you've got a woman on each arm all the time....DD brags about dating multiple women at a time...what the hell is the point? Anyone who does this is just boosting their ego....hence they are insecure....
you are going to get rejected more than you are going to be given a chance
You still believe that after reading the book? Perhaps you're going after the wrong women...
You make some good points...I don't necessarily disagree with what you're saying...I'm just giving you a different perspective....
I also wholeheartedly agree with the dude who says you've known this shit all along...everytime I come across an interesting idea or a very good point...something clicks and I just feel like I've known it all along....the problem is just all the social conditioning that gets in the way..... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 5:19:12 AM | Ok -- so now we know Vanders Mark and cw35 are studs that need no help. Be it with finding the one perfect woman or just already knowing all that it takes to get a woman, maybe we could learn something from these guys.
And yet, they're on POF looking for women! WTF?
DD is not cult-like and no scam artist. If anything, he states that he knew nothing and was a failure with women -- and honestly I can see that in him -- but he met and learned from 'naturals' who already knew what it took to meet and have a relationship with a woman. Maybe naturals like Vanders Mark and cw35? Can't tell...
I read Dave after my sexless marriage broke up, and it helped me. I had alot of fun with women before my marriage, but lets say I needed a little confidence after not being touched for years. Dave helped with that alot.
The first woman I dated was attracted to my confidence which was partly from DD, and it worked with her, but as soon as I fell for her and slipped back into old ways of being too nice and 'clingy' and she lost interest and bolted. So from personal exprerience, I think he's on to something for men to act like men. And be confident and funny in place of being sweet and over-considerate.
Most guys don't know this. They do what what their mom told them -- shoot my dad was saying it too!
If you're a natural like other stufmuffins on this thread, you don't need it, so why read it and comment negatively on it? If you're so confident, why do you feel the need to?
I"m sure each guy takes from DD what works for them. Some want to bed everything in sight, some want to find someone wonderful and be confident enough to attract her and keep her. I'm the latter, and its helped just by telling me which one of the attitudes about women-- that I already knew -- worked best. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 6:36:59 AM | | You should show me where I said I knew everything about women or was great at picking up women because I don't remember saying that. That DOES NOT mean that I don't recognize when someone like that idiot is trying to exploit me in my moment of weakness. Seriously, does it really take a genius to figure out that when you cling and dote on people you drive them away and when you act like you aren't interested they're drawn to you? This is a pretty obvious principle that applies to almost anything since we were kids but somehow this a*shole is taking credit for it as if it's some kind of miracle revelation. Anyone who hasn't lived their whole life under a rock would know this. This knowledge doesn't do anything. You pretty much have to change your personality to be a pick up artist if you aren't one. This would take a lot of therapy and effort. If you suddenly change after reading his crap, you're really pretending to be something you're not. I'm sorry but all the women in the world aren't worth me jumping through those kinds of hoops and I'd feel sleazy (just like him) if I walked around doing that. It's pretty simple as far as I'm concerned. If women are interested and are serious about wanting to meet someone they'll let you know. I've had dates and relationships and in every case they were the ones doing the asking, not me. | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 7:27:54 AM | but he met and learned from 'naturals' who already knew what it took to meet and have a relationship with a woman. Maybe naturals like Vanders Mark and cw35? Can't tell...
"Natural"? I'll be the first one to tell you that I'm anything but a "natural" ...you know I've met someone like this...silver tongue...outgoing...could make you feel "comfortable" ...and NATURALY...women seemed to be drawn to him.....
Well I got to know this guy and in the end...he really didn't know a god damn thing...IN FACT...he ended up being a manipulative lying a$$hole that weaseled me out of a fair chunk of cash...and when I called him on it and cut him loose....you shoulda seen his body language...completely lost for words....true colors showing right through.....
DD learned from someone like that? Go figure....you know...just because you can jump through the hoops of a social structure that women seem to embrace...doesn't mean you know anything about how to really connect with a woman....
Nowhere did I say I learned nothing from reading that book...it served to slap the social conditioning out of my head so I stopped acting like a brainwashed polictically correct idiot....but that's all I took from it...
If you're a natural like other stufmuffins on this thread, you don't need it, so why read it and comment negatively on it?
Way back when when I read it...I thought I needed it...but I continued to evolve and came across realizations that showed me what I really need....do my comments really come across as negative? Am I blowing smoke? bashing for the sake of bashing?
No, I'm no "stud" ...in fact my ego's been giving me some serious problems lately...but at the end of the day...when I can sit by myself, reflect on the events in my life, take it as a learning experience...and feel good about how I'm evolving...THAT's where true confidence comes from....
I personally don't date several girls at the same time, but I should.
Why? is it that hard to invest two weeks in one woman and then move on when you aren't a good match? Are you just meeting women anywhere and everywhere...simply going on looks alone?
The more women you meet, the bigger chance you find one that is truly right for you. Like I said, nothing to do with ego and insecurity.
OK but you're just repeating yourself....care to comment why you disagree with my sentiments about ego & insecurity....DO you disagree? Our ego's have so much control...that sometimes it's very hard to even aknowledge that they exist.... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 4:27:52 PM | If everyone is sooo busy being cool, hot, impressing the opposite sex w/ a program..who'll be left to fall in love?
Sex when in love is so different from just sex...have we become so jaded that we just use sex for sport? What about as an expression of love??? | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 5:08:55 PM |
They'll assume the role of the confident whose shoulder is always there when the woman needs to vent and cry, the role of the psych when she has issues. This does nothing but lower the women's interest level. You don't want to be a woman's sensitive confident, you don't want to be her psych. You want to be her MAN.
MAN & CONFIDANT aren't mutually exclusive....there's even a woman in here telling you straight up that your logic is misguided....
Sex when in love is so different from just sex...have we become so jaded that we just use sex for sport? What about as an expression of love???
Here...I'll translate for you gregory:
What she's saying is women need to feel connected to their man in order to have mind blowing sex...you can NEVER feel a real connection if all you ever do is joke around, tease, and never let her see your vulnerable side....because we ALL have doubts and fears...gotta unlock them eventually....
You know that's my biggest objection to all this pick up artist crap...they'll have you believe that a real man has no crack in his armor....but the reality is a real man has the perfect balance of fun and vulnerability.... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/30/2009 10:07:33 PM |
Seriously, does it really take a genius to figure out that when you cling and dote on people you drive them away and when you act like you aren't interested they're drawn to you? This is a pretty obvious principle
Just because something is obvious to you doesn't mean it's obvious to everybody.
For example, algebra is obvious to me. I can do algebra in my sleep. Most people struggle with it, though, and when I was in grad school I made pretty good money tutoring algebra to people taking remedial college classes. So was I a charlatan and a fraud because I charged money to teach something that should be obvious to people? | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 7/31/2009 3:05:00 PM |
I think the anger shown towards David D. and the likes in reality isn't direct toward the man itself or the advice he gives, but the external manifestation of extreme frustration upon realizing that those women you've put on a pedestal since you've been a child respond to stimuli that you consider denigrating and disrespectful to them. How can they!?!? The nice guy syndrome indeed, as another poster put it.
Perfectly worded.
It's obvious advice with no real answer or solution on how to magically be the person who can actually enact it.
You really might want to research some of these things before you start making bogus claims.
http://www.daviddeangelo.com/DeepInnerGame/index.asp?s=24000&gclid=CIzWuID3gJwCFSDxDAodY1iS_g | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 8/8/2009 8:37:34 PM |
I feel sorry for the guys who can't shed off the "women are pretty flowers that must be grown with tender care" hymns they've been saturated with their entire life.
Where are those men? I want to meet one.....all the men I know think that THEY are pretty flowers that must be grown with tender care.... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 8/8/2009 8:45:05 PM |
To be honest, the same things I've said about descamgelo could be applied to a lot of psychologists as well. That's another area that preys on people in their weakest moments, milks them of their money and gives advice that people already know.
The real purpose of psychology is for the therapist to help the patient solve his/her own problem.
People in their weakest moments, often can't see the forest for the trees, and a good therapist can help him/her regain his/her perspective, so that he/she can make good decisions, and find good solutions to problems...... | |
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| David Deangelo Double Your Dating - Any feedback?
Posted: 8/23/2009 12:07:47 AM | Hello well I am thinking about reading that book from Deangelo but i have one issue. In his latest newsletter he is answering this guys question on how to get this girl he in interested in.
The deal with this one was that this girl has like zero dating ability and so Deangelo proceeds to tell him to be careful because they could be headed to vegas to get married.
Now i can try to understand this in two ways, one is he is trying to help this guy avoid a doomed marriage or two, he is trying to help this guy avoid the aisle all together even if it would be a good thing.
I suppose it is the latter because he goes on to elaborate "well unless you want to drop of your future kids to a soccer game while wearing dockers and answering her calls be my guest!".
So in conclusion I believe his stuff is good but at the same time I do not believe his ultimate goal for his students is to find good women to marry but to find women to bed and my concern is does that sort of not help me anymore or what? | |
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