|
|
|
|
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 12/31/2007 10:33:55 PM | | Baber You question is a silly one. You seem to blame God for all this either wrong or could be wrong today. Since so many religions exsist, there is a strong possibility theres an inherited feeling of a god. I your question you speak of Rev. with all that is going on today, it also sez the same thing........ So if you accept there is a God & the bible is HIS written Word, the time is close to correcting the problems. Man thought he could rule himself without Gods help & guidenceas God allowed them to try. Like so many....there is never a God until things turn bad, then its Gods fault. Man cant do it himself.. Look at the Paradise that was given to man & what he did with it....God cant do any better, HIS orginial plan & creations were perfect. Things are getting warm now & YOU now look to way isnt God here? Silly Question ~Jr_Senator~ | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 12/31/2007 11:49:55 PM | Baber, have you ever been to a business meeting? I have.
There are usually 2 people on the client's side. One guy just talks and talks. The other sits back and says nothing. It may seem like the talker is running the show, but if you watch, every so often, the talker flicks his eyes at the other one, and the other one just slightly moves, letting the talker know which way to make his point. If you follow these meetings, you understand that the talker is a figurehead and a spokesperson, and the quite person is the one making all the decisions.
There is a very good reason that businesses conduct meetings in this way. If the talker made all of the decisions, then you would do your utmost to persuade him, but not make any sense. You'd try to play him, like a male player plays a woman. Your commitments would be worthless, because you'd offer things you cannot afford to keep doing in the long run, you'd never reveal any weaknesses that could easily be resolved, and you'd never provide a genuine business plan that would work for everyone. In short, you'd be a waste of time.
By making the talker make NONE of the decisions, it makes it no good to try and persuade him. So you give a good-sounding pitch, but one that will still look good when looked at later on, in the fullness of time, and with a calm mind. In other words, you give a great business plan, that works for everyone.
You would use different talkers for different audiences, but the same person would make the decisions, so the quiet one would be the same person at all the meetings.
You think that G-d is any different? G-d knows how to be a good businessman. That is why G-d sits quietly at all the meetings, dealing with the "business" of the people, but the talker (the religious leader) changes for different audiences.
There is even a verse in the Old Testament that shows this, 1 Kings 19:11-12:
11 And he said, “Go out and stand on the mount before the Lord.” And behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind tore the mountains and broke in pieces the rocks before the Lord, but the Lord was not in the wind. And after the wind an earthquake, but the Lord was not in the earthquake.
12 And after the earthquake a fire, but the Lord was not in the fire. And after the fire the sound of a low whisper. G-d knows when to keep His "mouth" shut. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/1/2008 1:10:18 AM | It is a normal and in fact a human need to belong. So strong is this need that religions, groups and governments are held together at any cost and let me tell you the cost is high... When people know better and look at the sickness that is being perpetrated from the above mentioned yet still have the hard-wired need to belong there is a pull to wake others up and become part of the enlightened group that sees the truth of the matter.
It is the same however and is based on the need to belong or be part of something greater then themselves. The Roman Catholic Church did a study on the new age movement, why? They couldn't understand how it could attract so many members without constructing a central authority. They needed to understand how it was being held together. No one can fight human nature, it can be exploited and it is. Out of that exploitation new paradigms are being created in opposition but they are still the same thing with a different smile.
If God did existed he would definitely be irresponsible. Gods are born in our image and there for they will always be imperfect and fallible. While the conditioned will not see the fallibility others will yet they will create their own version of God that will be fallible to the next or take an oppositional stance to the believer. When we understand human nature better we see just how impressionable we truly are and how we have been exploited, used and mislead. It will be a sad day indeed for all religions on that day. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/1/2008 6:27:42 PM |
Not one religion has a diety powerful enough to show his presence to the world … so people may follow this wonderful entity's way of life… The question is … would you not do things better?
I am a god and a part of god, and I do things as I do them, not “better” or worse – so would say the pantheists who believe that the Universe, or nature, and God are equivalent. God's presence is in us and around us and throughout all of creation, and we cannot help but observe god and express the will of god and live as god hath ordained. To suggest otherwise, i.e. that some act or particle in the Universe is not god, is an absurdity born of a tiny ego hell-bent on projecting its personal interests out into the empty sky. Fie! Blasphemy!
*mutters… of course that blasphemy is also part of the divine (tee hee) | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/1/2008 6:45:42 PM |
The question is to this forum... if you were GOD would you not do things better? One presuming how they would do things better than God or presuming to know the thoughts or actions of God, have no understanding of God nor have they met Him and therefore cannot be taught or understand such matters.. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 4:28:33 AM | I always find that writing in religiuos forums to require HUGE volumes of responses concerning a HUGE volume of areas. It's hard to sum up so many different thoughts and ideas in a few sentences let alone respond to other people's questions or accusations.
For now I feel it's important to clarify what "irresponsible" means versus "blaming God for all the problems in life." I concur with what one of you said in that all actions and reactions are a result of human will. You cannot attribute your disdain of your life events or the terrible condition the world is in at the moment (whether it be corrupt leaders, undeveloped countries, genocide) to God when humans themselves ares responsbile for what they have done to the world.
Consider what happens when a new baby is born in this world in Africa. He or she has been born into a family that is so incredibly poor that they have to wait for days to get water or food, have infections and viruses running rampant all around, (enter more debilitating conditions), and so on and so forth. It is the way the country is run, with it's poor political leaders, poor resources, (underdepenedency as some advocates would see it from first world countries), poor family conditions, that have put the child in the poor state to begin with. As a result of the limited education and opportunity to grow beyond menial means, the parents of these children spend more time away from home resulting in a child deprived of love, discipline, and you name it everything else. This emotional weakness combined with poor financial weakness (and education), while at the same time, adding physical and mental abuse in the equation (heck why not even throw AIDS in there for sport!), would it be not a suprise at all that the person is a little ****ed up? Perhaps their ethical compass is thwarted simply becuase he/she didn't really have one to begin with?
Limited exposure to life results in limited thinking capacities and the inability to see things beyond unehalthy self perception. Who knows maybe this kid has been raised up Racist as well seeing how his entire country was thwarted by Mr. white, brown, black, or yellow man?
The point being to all this is that MAN himself has caused things to happen to themselves. Whether it's corrupt political leaders, lack of economic resources, lack of jobs, or foreign limits and restraints, the kid has very limited choice for success in this world (at least in the first world senses).
To use another example, say you have five kids and you decide to leave them to do what they wish. With the parent/father gone from their lives, these kids grow up together competing in the limited family resources they by themselves. (Go figure a lot of people in the war-striken countries lose their father due to a bomb blast here or there). One of the brothers decides to take control of the situation and eventually forms a dislike for one or two of the other younger brothers. He'll deprive of their fair worth, control, wealth simply becuase he thinks so. Three brothers will fight with one another over a single piece of wealth whether it be a slinky or a car.
Now say if God/Father didn't actually leave the picture. To resolve the problem with the two brothers fighting over one piece of wealth whether it be a slinky, a car, personal space to call their own, or heck even OIL, natural resources he makes decision to resolve the conflict. He buys both of them slinkies, cars, gives them their own rooms, and puts a fair share of OIL, natural resources in each room. He uses a utilitarian approach in divying up resources, the most amount he could possibly give to all of his children without discrimination . Would the problems be resolved?
At least in terms of conflict they are. But they way humans have chosen to deal with these situations is to make borders of their countires how they see fit, with guns blazing at one another. We have countries such as Canada with a massive amount of land but only 30 Million people versus China or India, with the latter being the size of just one mere U.S> state (Texas) , with a population reaching a billion. Add in Zimbabwe where resources are so scarce that one wonders why the borders are even set out they way they are! How about giving them some piece of harvestable land? Or giving them land connecting to the oceans for some export material (fish, etc)? No! We'll have comletely whacked allocation of res0urces with some countires having all of something and others having none of something. But the point is, HUMANS, not God, have made this allocation system over the years they way they have seen fit.
Now if it was up to God would you not want to spread the wealth and the joy of the plaent with all his creation equally? Could he not have given each one of us (as countries or as people) a fair share of the pie so we are not left disadvantaged right from the start as little African boy mentioned previously? Certainly it would save wars,famine, genocide, (add every other ostracity happening in the side of the world) if only there was someone there acting as a father figure (as only GOD can ultimately can) rather than ditching them, abandoning them at their time of desperate need?
I'm sure there are around 1,000 people somewhere in the world dying from starvation as we speak, crying, hurt, in serious pain with their prayers not being answered. And when they die miserably (thinking of the Jewish Internment Camps during World War II) people say "it's all God's will and God knows best..."
Bull )(*@#SHyt! No father would let his children go through these things knowingly without doing something about it. Certainly he has the power but chooses to remain irresponsible.
(I've just barely begun writing on the topic here - stil have so much to write in responses to everyone .. and yet already it's an essay!) | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 6:00:02 AM | Hi Baber,
you bring up some good points about peoples experiences in Africa. I don't know if that is the case but it wouldn't surprise me if it was even worse they you portray. Clearly if there was a God he has forsaken those people hasn't he?
Being i don't believe there is a God it could be argued that we have forsaken them making us no better then the invented idea of God. Surely with All the money, talent and people willing to help we could solve such problems? Or is it in mankind's best interest to have varying degrees of suffering? for example population explosion limited resources etc... It would stand to reason that we could solve such problems quite easily with short term and long term solutions. We can turn deserts into thriving gardens, build self suitable houses for next to nothing that can support its inhabitants without the need for central distribution systems for services.
Boarders are important as is governments and groups. It helps people feel like they are part of something meaningful. If we felt connected to our brothers and sisters who were dying in Africa how could we live with ourselves? But because i live in the UK i can say the UK contributes to aid in Africa so we are doing our part *cough* If i belonged to a church i could further say our church has contributed to aid in Africa so i'm doing even more for them. The more connected we are the more we are to blame for someone's misfortune. The less connected the less accountability we seem to have. And the more separate we can make ourselves the more we can point the finger at someone else. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 6:11:17 AM | It never ceases to amaze me that when we humans mess up, God is brought into the picture.
The only way "God" is to blame for the state of our earth today is that "He" created us.
The Creator is allowing us to indulge in our creativity, whether it be for good or bad, nothing more. We got ourselves into this mess, we have to get ourselves out. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 7:14:04 AM |
Bull )(*@#SHyt! No father would let his children go through these things knowingly without doing something about it. Certainly he has the power but chooses to remain irresponsible.
If I told my Son not to touch the stove when the burner is lit and he listens to me he would not be hurt. If I told my Son to plant a seed in a garden to grow food and he does it then he would eat.
Now IF I told my Son not to touch the stove and while I said so he is standing their with his fingers in his ears sticking his tongue out going LALALALALA I don't hear you cause i don't believe you know whats best for me, and then touches the stove, is it my Son's fault he got burned or mine?
Sure I could run over and grab his hand to prevent him from touching the stove. However, if I did that and thus my Son didn't learn anything as a result then likely when I turn my head he will do it again.
The first way I may be there to hug him and dry his tears to let him know even though he made a mistake that I still love him. The first way I could apply burn cream or take him to the Doctor if it is a bad burn.
After that day my Son will likely NEVER touch that stove again.
Now if I ran over and grabed his hand to prevent him to touch it by force, my Son wouldn't have that experiance of a mistake made to draw wisdom from for his future.
Since he doesn't have that to base a future choice from, then he would likely make that mistake again. What if during that time I wasn't around to do the comforting or the mending of the wound it caused. Or if I was not there to take him to the Doctor for a serious wound.
As a parent I would rather be there to comfort my Son during a mistake to let him know I still love him and if he learned from a mistake then he will grow and learn from the mistake.
You talked about Africa and the restriction of the enviroment to grow crops due to a lake of rain etc.
I am not going to list a specific spot there but.... If a area has a lack of rain thus resulting in a lack of water thus resulting in a lack of crops thus resulting in a lack of food etc.
Now in that area there is a King that wears enough Gold to sink a ship. Lives in a Palace big enough to house a whole city in extravagance. But his people are starving because they can not grow food.
Yet he could buy his people a power station that brings light to there area that the byproduct of the process would cause moisture to form rain clouds. A sacrafice by their king will feed many for generations. Is it then Gods fault? NO IT IS NOT! It is the arrogance of their KING and HIS desire to live better than his people that prevents them from living better.
It is his NEED to be in control by not providing them knowledge to live better that is the result of their suffering and lack. Yet that KING would likely also be saying there is no God or that God would feed the people. What I see is God gave that man who fancies himself as a King the ability to take care of his people and progress his Kingdom but due to selfishness and ritual needs he doesn't HIMSELF accept knowledge and understanding.
I said in another threed Ignorance travels downhill to all those under you. If your leader is ignorant and unable to lead with LOVE, Understanding, Compassion, and Caring then as a direct result that is what will be recieved.
So you say to give them harvistable land. ALL land is harvestable if treated properly. As long as nutriants are replenished to the soil through the rain drops you will be able to grow something in the land.
It all starts with KNOWLEDGE! If you require your people to be stupid mindless robots that can not think for themselves then you will have control of them. If you put yourself in a position that they recieve NOTHING unless you give it to them then they are only able to have what you have and willing to share. If they were granted KNOWLEDGE then they could discover ways to provide for themselves.
So again I state....... IT IS NOT God that is irresponsible. It is Human Kind that is. Somewhere in the world is a person that HAS the solution to solve ANY problem that someone else may have. If everyone with the knowledge was willing to share it with someone else this world would be completly different world.
Like example....
If I had the equipment needed to provide someone something they need it will come back after time. The problem is many times the ones that have what is needed by someone else are lacking that Compassion element. Since that is the case it requires another step in the chain of events for someone with that compassion to find the money to be able to buy the equipment needed. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 6:43:23 PM | Without getting into a long drawn out response to the topic of "Human suffering" (even though I have so much I'd like to add to it), i do believe that it is the responsiblity of the governments to look after their peoples. From the municipal (city) level, to province level, to a federal level.. whichever level that is appropiate, it is the FUNCTION andt he very defintion of government to provide the eseential services to their people that they have been put into power to do. This includes education, employment, industry, and a quality of life, etc. (Google Human Development Index please on this topic if you'd like to know more)
Clearly the governments of third world countries are unable to do so either due to a lack of competence, corruption, or a lack of resources.
But as crazytilting mentioned, it isn't the responsiblity of every man or woman on this planet to look after every other man or woman.. from other countiers or heck even different cities for that matter. If we feel close to them sure we would on a personal level (say you met a lover down in a country and care about her and her family for example), but on a large scale it isn't our repsonsiblity. Giving them money sure would help them out for the short run, but the real helpful changes occur on a large scale... to adopt a child and give him an education so he/she could get a job or better yet providing infrastructure (schools and JOBS) that give them the means to support their future on their own. Again responsiblities of the bigger government and not of one or two individuals.
It's a little much to ask people to contribute to such things though. I mean come on, look our own countires and the serious inequalities of wealth between the rich and the very poor. We can't even clean up our own poverty sticken streets let alone clean up someone elses. But our governmetns have at least provided most necessities to the most part.
Authority and reponslibity of care comes on an interesting range of micro and macro levels if you really think about it this way.
On the micro, home level we have kids looking up to their parents for their well being .. mother and father... and among the two, the father moreso being the head honcho especially in partriachal cultures. Move beyond the family home and then we have employers looking after our fathers and mothers' well being with progress human resource policies.. (healthcare, childcare, benefits, etc).. move a bit further up that and we have municipal governments looking after our employers, provincial governments looking after municipal ones, and then the federal level. Above a national level comes the world level, with the U.N. assuming a "super government" above the rest (but we all know how underhanded it is with the U.S> calling the shots) . So really the person we need to be asking for change and to do something about world suffering is the U.N. Which I do think they do attempt to some degree with their peace keeping and foreign aid efforts. They make a decision which gets sent down the ladder to national governments, to provincial, municiplal. employer,and finally to the home level. But of course there's not real profit in that and countires are already in debt to their own national or world banks - claiming that "debt reduction" should be their sole concern (which is ridiculous if you realize what the American Revolution for Soverignty was all about) - so at the end you get a "no thank you we can't afford to do so" reponse.
Bascially it's a variety of reasons why our super government chooses not to bother.. but I'm sure they would listen and act (just like every other person on the planet would) if God actually made his prescence clearly known and commanded us. Sure come down in a huge obselisk of light, move a couple of moutnains, lakes, around an I'm sure you'll get the majoirty of people believing in you ...
Consider "I am Legend" a recent movie where a virus kills off five billion people in the world, and the speech Will Smith makes when he meets two survivors. How could God allow such an ostracity to happen? Fine maybe a group of people are fighting and thousands or heck even millions die (30,000,000 deaths in WWII for example), but come on! You're still not going to act or do anything when 5,000,000,000 people in the world die? I can't even count to 100,000 let alone those astronomical numbers. How many people must you watch suffer and die before getting up from your irresponsible throne to do something? | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 7:01:57 PM | I like when people use the oven statement, I've heard it many times. However the oven doesn't burn forever, and many teach that Hell does. The pain in your son's hand would go away, many teach the pain in Hell is eternal. Quite the difference, if you ask me. Could I let my son learn pain by touching I stove? Yeah, I'd sleep at night. Could I let me son put his entire body in an oven and turn it on with no way out? I think I'd be willing to make sure that didn't happen, even if he lived in ignorance.
Will God be there to comfort his children as the potentially spend eternity in Hell?
Is it our fault that we do not choose Heaven over Hell if we do not know either? You speak of touching the oven. Perhaps if God gave us the option of sitting in Hell for a day or two, we'd be more inclined to make our decisions a little more wisely.
You say your son may make the same mistake if he doesn't touch it now. How can we not make the mistake if we do not touch Hell? | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 7:18:52 PM | | IMO, God gives people what they want. Hell is simply the place people that have no desire for God live in. Much like the world we live in now. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 7:29:25 PM | | rockondon -----------You not god.... not even good with evolution...maybe more study | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/2/2008 7:56:25 PM |
Will God be there to comfort his children as the potentially spend eternity in Hell? His children will need no comfort, having never tasted hell...
Is it our fault that we do not choose Heaven over Hell if we do not know either? Fault lies only in he who tastes God, hears His voice, (spoken through His vessels) and still "chooses" otherwise...therefore "fault" is ones own.
Perhaps if God gave us the option of sitting in Hell for a day or two, we'd be more inclined to make our decisions a little more wisely. Ahhh, the beloved idea of the imaginary "purgatory"..if said place existed, God would be the God of all mankind, evil men seeking their own self preserving paths as well.
You are close, doll. Soooo close. Actually, too close to never come to enter so I'll welcome you as a brother, present or future.
 | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/3/2008 10:35:52 AM | Well I would like to think that i would do thing's better but when I think this thought,
I think this.
To get to Heaven(told by the Apostlic's that the only way to get to Heaven is to live a great tribulation.
So with that said, then look at the world with that in mind. Then you might see that all that's going on in the world is ment to be part of the tribulation.
Well that's my thought on that. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/3/2008 8:07:29 PM | God has never done bad to set up a Kindom for man.. Man did it himself, & to prove that man is unable to rule himself the world is the example. It also shows God was able to know the end result by writting it down long before now.
Heaven is never promised to anyone in the bible. If you think it is, I be pleased to read it...Just quote the verse....Its always refered to As the Kingdom Come.....thy will be done.....so on...... You have to read the bible to quote is, that is why so many errors exsist. God is who will solve any & ALL problems of the world it is written ~Jr_Senator~ | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/3/2008 9:39:00 PM | Billy Graham's daughter was interviewed on the Early Show and Jane Clayson asked her 'How could God let something like this happen?' (regarding Katrina) Anne Graham gave an extremely profound and insightful response. She said, 'I believe God is deeply saddened by this, just as we are, but for years we've been telling God to get out of our schools, to get out of our government and to get out of our lives. And being the gentleman He is, I believe He has calmly backed out. How can we expect God to give us His blessing and His protection if we demand He leave us alone?'
In light of recent events...terrorists attack, school shootings, etc. I think it started when Madeleine Murray O'Hare (she was murdered, her body found recently) complained she didn't want prayer in our schools, and we said OK. Then someone said you better not read the Bible in school. The Bible says thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said OK.
Then Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem (Dr. Spock's son committed suicide). We said an expert should know what he's talking about. And we said OK.
Now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves.
Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with 'WE REAP WHAT WE SOW.'
Funny how simple it is for people to trash God and then wonder why the world's going to hell. Funny how we believe what the newspapers say, but question what the Bible says. Funny how you can send 'jokes' through e-mail and they spread like wildfire but when you start sending messages regarding the Lord, people think twice about sharing. Funny how lewd, crude, vulgar and obscene articles pass freely through cyberspace, but public discussion of God is suppressed in the school and workplace.
Are you laughing?
Funny how we can be more worried about what other people think of us than what God thinks of us. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/5/2008 8:20:38 PM | | The way I see it, religion started with a way to explain the unexplained before science. Now that we have some scientific and technological brakethroughs, there are people that believe it to be fact. Whatever you believe way deep down is where your electrical signals will go when you die. I'll be hanging around as a ghost haunting people and scaring the crap out of them. And yes, I will laugh when I give somebody a good scare. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/5/2008 8:58:38 PM | | maybe God only really cares about life in general: as long as the world goes around there is nothing thats all that matters to him...this is the reason why the ONLY time he decides to show up is when is planet (life) is about to be destroyed by man himself...God will never show up unless his creation is about to be hit hard...it may sound ridiculous but if you read the bible carefully there is no moment where he really decides to reveal himself but in the book of revelation, when man decide to start a destructive war...does that tell us something about his caracter? | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/7/2008 6:07:35 AM | I have trouble understanding how God could possibly BE fair and just, and therefore responsible.
One of the simplest of arguments is that most often posed by children: Why do others starve to death? Have the children of the impoverished and deprived any fewer rights to be 'saved' than a terminally ill Christian child?
It seems that every time a calamity befalls mankind, Christians claim it to be humanity's fault. It's this country's fault for causing this war etc. God has no part in it etc. God allows us free will so that we may do as we wish, those people who brought war, brought this upon themselves etc. But of course, when someone steps forward and does good, it's all due to God's wisdom and advice, and gift etc.
So, when a bunch of violent militia storm a peaceful village in the forest, it's purely man's fault. But, when the UN or whomever sends assistance or foreign aid, it's all thanks to God.
What God would allow the actions of man to cause such suffering amongst many? Torture and rape of innocents is NOT OK in my mind, under ANY circumstances. Tell the Cambodians that it was their fault that Khmer Rouge slaughtered so many of their family.
It all seems fine when it's not actually happening to us, now doesn't it? Living in the Western World is like living in an aquarium; everything's provided for you in a controlled and relatively comfortable environment. Everything else on the outside's up for conjecture and comment, yet very few, if any ever go out there and come back. "It's God's will", "Judgement will come to those who do evil" etc. etc. Well, hear this:
You live once. Imagine if that one brief moment of mortality (that which you and I draw pleasant memories and valuable experiences from) was filled with fear for your life and your family and the agony of your body being torn off your bones.
NOW tell me that God is fair and perfect. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/10/2008 11:08:50 PM | The question is to this forum... if you were GOD would you not do things better?
The answer (my Answer) is No! If I take a spinner (top), and spin it...I let it Ride! Why? Because I want to see what it is capable of doing on its own. Not to mention that everytime I touch it, it faulters before its time.
We have freewill. Wills of our own.The planet we live on has a will of its own...Nature. The universe has a will of its own...Quantum Physics. Of course, those two are not of an intelligent freewill, but a freewill nonetheless.This is only my opinion, but I see no other way for us to exist, in any form, and still have freewill. For without freewill, What would we be? Not Human...
No interference=Freewill | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/11/2008 2:39:26 AM |
Baber wrote:
And amongst all these religions not one religion has a diety, a God, that is powerful enough to show his prescence to the world, unquestionably, undeniably, and BODLY so people may follow this wonderful entity's way of life as HE has ordained us t0 live.
Incorrect. Christianity attests a God powerful enough. But whether or not he 'can' and whether or not he 'will' are two very different considerations. And to conclude that he 'cannot' based on the fact that he 'will not' is faulty reasoning; there are many things I can do but will not. | |
|
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/11/2008 10:11:22 AM | Baber:
And amongst all these religions not one religion has a diety, a God, that is powerful enough to show his prescence to the world, unquestionably, undeniably, and BODLY so people may follow this wonderful entity's way of life as HE has ordained us t0 live. Ryft's response:
Incorrect. Christianity attests a God powerful enough. But whether or not he 'can' and whether or not he 'will' are two very different considerations. And to conclude that he 'cannot' based on the fact that he 'will not' is faulty reasoning; there are many things I can do but will not. So you conclude that God "will not" show himself simply because he has not... ?
Pointing out percieved faulty reasoning with faulty reasoning.. well now that's a new one! Lol... | |
|
| |
| The Irresponsible God?
Posted: 1/11/2008 10:37:44 AM | From the OP:
The question is to this forum... if you were GOD would you not do things better? imo this question arises from the perception that things are not perfect...
And I don't believe that things ever will be...
abandon them and not give them the REAL and proper guidance they should be given from a parent/fatherfigure. Some people do not actually see God as a father figure in the sky.. I certainly do not...
I see God as being inextricable to who I am... no separation... only that which is percieved...
My life is a co-creation with the divine.... I use my free will amidst the forces over which I have no control...
Having said all that.. my answer... to quote one of my heros.. is: "Be the change you wish to see in the world"  | |
|
|
|
Home
login 
