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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 1/31/2008 4:30:26 PM | We comprehend the gravity of the situation but convincing a jury to convict someone of manslaughter isn't going to happen in this case,unless the boys opened up the cage or moved a branch in front of the wall they won't be charged.
unfortunately, that's in all probability true. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 1/31/2008 4:47:45 PM | In today's world of nihilistic apathy and social alienation I have to say that (you might not like it)... if they were drinking and taunting the animal... that those guys are a bunch of JACKASSES! What a joke eh?
Whenever I've ****ed up royally and gotten injured, maybe even seriously, I've always retained my sense of humour, infact the more absurd the situation, the more it's purely my fault, the funnier it seems to me... now... mauled at the zoo by a tiger after throwing beer cans at it (not neccissarily what actually happened), shit... I would have died laughing.
I'm sure that dude is laughing with me from the otherside.
His familly and friends of course might disagree. | |
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Mulva
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Joined: 12/28/2007
Msg: 153 | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 2:49:54 PM | | Lost..........your name says it all. You are entirely lost. Cougar attacks were done to people because THEY were invading their territory. Again justification. I worked in the jungles of Africa, I was not there on a holiday or a photo safari. The main reason animals today feel threatened and hungry is that their natural habitats have been taken away from them. A human when threatened will fight back also. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 3:14:45 PM | Sunshinenpa,
So now we can't go outside because we might be invading some animals territory?
So are you saying it's ok for animals to kill humans?
I guess if you had to choose to save a human or an animal...you would choose the animal.
I'm done with this thread,some of you animal rights people need to get help.
 | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 5:28:33 PM | it's sad that you aren't able to grasp reality.
yup, if i was driving down the road, and had to make a choice between hitting you or hitting a dog, you'd damn sure better be moving. there's no way i'll hit the dog | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 6:02:37 PM | Hmmm...
Ya know, after reading the majority of the responses here, I can't help but think that, if we change the story JUST a little, how feelings might change.
First, let's say that rather than being drunk teenagers, prone to yell and wave at tigers, these were, oh, I don't know, 8 or 9 year olds, also prone to yell and wave at tigers.
RESPONSE:
They werent cute 8 or 9 year olds yelling and waving at the tiger. They were almost grown adults acting like 8 or 9 year olds!!! They should have know better. If someone locked me in a cage and people threw things at me and tormented me all the time, I might get mad enough to attack them myself! I believe that zoos should not exist for people to come and stare at animals, already stressed and pacing in cages. If they want to protect them, put them in a sanctuary. Where they can live out their lives without having people staring at them and teenages taunting them! We will never know to what extent these drunks aggravated or even tortured this animal. Only the tiger knows, and he is dead! Shame on man for mistreating these wonderful creatures! | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 9:45:46 PM | The poor tiger, when will stupid people stop abusing animals for amusement? Where is the humor in teasing an amimal, or abusing an animal? Actually I am glad they were attacked, but very sorry they shot and killed the tiger. Mankind thinks that they can overpower or outsmart wild animals and when they think wrong, the animal always pays with its life. That is why I am embarrassed to be a human being, they do the stupidist and meanist things to animals, to other humans and to themselves.
I pray that zoos will learn from this and protect the animals from humans. I am sure the real truth is that the drunks were throwing things at the tiger, taunting it and teasing it, otherwise what possible motivation would the animal have to attack them, wander around then go back and attack them again, any other story or "lets pretend" is just BS | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/2/2008 10:08:44 PM |
I believe that zoos should not exist for people to come and stare at animals, already stressed and pacing in cages. If they want to protect them, put them in a sanctuary.
Problem is there's no money to pay for it. Zoos do what they can but in the next 20 years 2 more subspecies of tigers will probably become extinct. The zoos can barely keep the 3 most popular species going as it is.
Can you imagine having a huge animal attacking you like that?
Oh, you don't have to imagie it, you can see it in this video taken atop an elephant. The tiger jumped up and took out the guy next to the cameraman. Look at the frame at 2:09
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LjG7S8aqJg
And here's proof tigers don't make the best dinner guests either:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG9hfBVf_P0
"Please get off the nice guest. There's a good tiger".
What were they thinking? Were they thinking? | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 2:39:58 AM | | I still dont see how waving and making animal sounds is being cruel to animals. I do see how it could provoke an animal.I also think that the fact the zoo security did not respond to the report of the attack and waited 30 minutes to call police should be grounds for a lawsuit and the fact that the moat was to low.Another thing that gets me, I "think" I read somewhere that when they got off the rails, thats when the tiger came out of the bushes.Wouldn't they have seen the tiger getting out if they were teasing it? So it sounds as if Titania was not being teased, maybe, the others, while Titania was off in another part of the exhibit escaping.I did read that the investigation is on hold. As foryou animal rights people, I think you are doing a good deed, but I think some of you are taking it to far.As for the person who said they would hit a person before hitting a dog. think of how you would feel if you or you child was walking down the road, a dog came out to chase a passing car. The driver swerved to miss the dog and hit you child, causing permanent injuries or death.Then when the driver was questioned, he replied, He had to hit your child to keep from hitting a dog.As for what I saidI did to a spider and the caw, I also had a horse that I would blow pot smoke in his face to get him high and I also gave my dog a bowl of beer to drink.I do not think what I did was right, but I was a teenager at the time. I was young and stupid.And I have absolutely no shame in what I did. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 4:46:29 AM | I also had a horse that I would blow pot smoke in his face to get him high and I also gave my dog a bowl of beer to drink.I do not think what I did was right, but I was a teenager at the time. I was young and stupid.And I have absolutely no shame in what I did.
RESPONSE:
I think that is sad. As human beings we have a choice on what we do to our bodies, but animals dont have the same choices. Anyone who would blow pot in a horse's face should have been punished. Regardless of their age!! Where were your parents at the time?
As for pouring beer in your dogs bowl, that is a disgrace! Again...Where were the parents? And if it was after you moved out on your own, then you were old enough to know better. I met a guy once who had turned his dog into an alcoholic by pouring beer in his water bowl. The dog died at the age of 7 because of it. I was livid when he told me what he had done!
As Americans we coddle our kids. Keep them babies too long. We are raising a generation of irresponsible adults who think they should not be held accountable for anything they do. How many young adults still live with their parents because they are too lazy to get jobs? And if you read the paper or listen to the News, it is obvious by the number of children being murdered by their own young parents that this generation is not capable of taking care of their responsibilities.
I think the zoo should be fined for allowing the tiger to escape, but I dont think these parents should receive a cent.... | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 8:30:15 AM | As for what I saidI did to a spider and the caw, I also had a horse that I would blow pot smoke in his face to get him high and I also gave my dog a bowl of beer to drink.I do not think what I did was right, but I was a teenager at the time. I was young and stupid.And I have absolutely no shame in what I did.
Interesting that you keep trying to turn this thread around to you and your disgusting torture of animals or other living creatures. Make no mistake the things you did are wrong and maybe you should seek professional help. That you feel no shame is shameful in itself and if you were a person who touched my day to day life, I'd watch you like a hawk and never trust you with my animals or another living being. If you want to brag about your past sick, twisted deeds, start your own thread. This one is not about you. | |
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mizbex
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Joined: 8/8/2007
Msg: 163 | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 10:28:29 AM |
I still dont see how waving and making animal sounds is being cruel to animals.
Look back in previous posts, where there was reference, quotes from, and a citations of the applicable parts of the Endangered Species Act that prohibits the "harassing" of any animal listed therein.
There are also references to Assumption of the Risk. In short, you taunt a tiger, you get hurt, you took your chances, and you lost. Your buddy got killed, and you got mauled. Tough bananas. You played and you lost.
I also think that the fact the zoo security did not respond to the report of the attack and waited 30 minutes to call police should be grounds for a lawsuit and the fact that the moat was to low.
If I recall correctly from a post you made, you work in a place where people may, or may not, be telling you the truth, and where people may become violent. A patient (I presume you call them patients.), that doesn't have much credibility, comes to you and says "Ms. Whoever has gotten out of her restraints, and is attacking people. Now, you have dealt with Ms. Whoever in the past, and feel reasonably certain that the patient reporting the problem may, very well, not be telling the truth; and has come to you, merely to get you to react.
Do you sound the General Alarm for an immediate lock down of the facility; and call for an immediate response of the SWAT team to control Ms. Whoever?
Do you arm yourself, grab as many people as you can, arm them, and respond with deadly force to quell the felonious Ms. Whoever?
Or do you go see for yourself whether Ms. Whoever is, in fact, free of her restraints, and/or attacking people, before you call out the National Guard?
While people taunt animals at zoos, young men also taunt Security Officers. Zoo Security likely did what any reasonable person would have done. Gone to check to see if, in fact, at tiger was loose. This 30 minute reaction time for Zoo Security is some of the mud being slung by the attorney for the two surviving brothers. Since no one knows exactly what time Tatiana got loose, or what time the escape was reported, I sincerely doubt it took 30 minutes for the Police to be called.
The facts that the moat was empty, and the fence was too short (both issues addressed in previous posts as well) had no bearing upon the felonious acts of the two surviving brothers, which is what triggered the chain of events, leading to the tiger's escaping and killing Mr. Sousa.
Another thing that gets me, I "think" I read somewhere that when they got off the rails, thats when the tiger came out of the bushes. Wouldn't they have seen the tiger getting out if they were teasing it? So it sounds as if Titania was not being teased, maybe, the others, while Titania was off in another part of the exhibit escaping.
Again, I refer back to previous posts, where I stated that no matter how far removed one may be, if one sets a chain of events in motion that lead to the death of another, the one setting the chain of events in motion may be held criminally liable for the death of the person killed. I.e., taunt any tiger, a tiger escapes, regardless whether it was the one you were teasing, and kills someone, you can be charged with Murder.
There have been no reports that either Tatiana, or any other tiger, had ever escaped from that enclosure in the past. Regardless whether it was the tiger's good will toward men, or a 100 foot fence, keeping the tigers inside their enclosure, no tigers had escaped that enclosure, before these young men taunted the tigers. Again, I refer you to previous posts where the zoo's duty of taking precuations against foresseable hazards was discussed.
Couch it any way you'd care to, spin it till it can't be spun anymore. The facts are the facts, the law is the law. Just because you state your position with the most passion, or the loudest, doesn't make you right. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 12:30:03 PM |
As for pouring beer in your dogs bowl, that is a disgrace! Again...Where were the parents?
The dogs parents were drinking wiskey out of the other bowl.
There are said to be about 5000 - 7500 tigers left in the world.
Old data. More like 4000 today. It'll be less next year.
The zoo is supposed to have guys with dart guns 24x7; it's in their emergancy plan. They didn't however. | |
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mizbex
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Joined: 8/8/2007
Msg: 166 | |
| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 12:45:52 PM | Which makes it an even sadder day for the Tiger world. How ever you look at this, the zoo, the (*(cough) victims) this was caused by human error and the one that dies of course is the beautiful tiger.
Next people are going to start jumping into fires and blaming the matches. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 2:33:04 PM | and stupid.And I have absolutely no shame in what I did.
RESPONSE:
I think that is sad. As human beings we have a choice on what we do to our bodies, but animals dont have the same choices. Anyone who would blow pot in a horse's face should have been punished. Regardless of their age!! Where were your parents at the time?
As for pouring beer in your dogs bowl, that is a disgrace! Again...Where were the parents? And if it was after you moved out on your own, then you were old enough to know better. I met a guy once who had turned his dog into an alcoholic by pouring beer in his water bowl. The dog died at the age of 7 because of it. I was livid when he told me what he had done!
As Americans we coddle our kids. Keep them babies too long. We are raising a generation of irresponsible adults who think they should not be held accountable for anything they do. How many young adults still live with their parents because they are too lazy to get jobs? And if you read the paper or listen to the News, it is obvious by the number of children being murdered by their own young parents that this generation is not capable of taking care of their responsibilities.
I think the zoo should be fined for allowing the tiger to escape, but I dont think these parents should receive a cent....
you are absolutely ten thousand percent right, on everything. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/3/2008 3:29:54 PM | Hey I was 16, My parents cant be with us all 24/7. There were 3 of us girls, and only 2 parents. The navy took my father away alot during our childhood. And I agree, I should have been punished. But I never got cought, so I never was.
Endangered Species Act that prohibits the "harassing" of any animal listed therein.
I will rephrase what I said. I dont see how waving and making animal sounds is harassing animals. I do see how it could provoke an animal.
f I recall correctly from a post you made, you work in a place where people may, or may not, be telling you the truth, and where people may become violent.
Every threat of violence, is to be taken seriously on my job,so yes we do respond. We do sound alarms. But there is no lock down, nor can we arm ourselves. No weapons are allowed in the building. Not even by police. And according to your post, you must think the zoo security knew the victims and the victims made emergency calls all the time. I am sure emergency prank phone calls are made, but still all calls should be taken seriously.When someone is in restraints, a staff member is within arms length of that patient at all time. As for untruthful patients lieiong. all patients are in view of the staff. All staff have alarms. We monitor the patients, not the other patients.
he felonious acts of the two surviving brothers, which is what triggered the chain of events, leading to the tiger's escaping and killing Mr. Sousa.
Has this been proven? | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/4/2008 12:34:46 AM | | HAHAHAHAHA kids got drunk and did something stupid and now one of them is dead ...im glad you are all celebrating this here... yeah miss claudia im sure u and all of your saintly siblings never did anything stupid. the zoo is at fault here for not being up to code,as it has been many times in the past. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/4/2008 1:14:02 AM |
HAHAHAHAHA kids got drunk and did something stupid and now one of them is dead ...im glad you are all celebrating this here... yeah miss claudia im sure u and all of your saintly siblings never did anything stupid. the zoo is at fault here for not being up to code,as it has been many times in the past.
E X A C T L Y.
and maybe what the tiger did wasn't ENOUGH.
You strike me as a bitter woman.
Am I correct?
Before you "flame" me like everyone else you disagree with, I might add that I am an avid animal lover as well - good job rescuing the doggies.
Cheers,
Chris | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/4/2008 1:51:05 AM |
he felonious acts of the two surviving brothers, which is what triggered the chain of events, leading to the tiger's escaping and killing Mr. Sousa.
Has this been proven?
One of the surviving brothers has admitted "taunting" the tigers. No need for proof, the wrongdoing has been admitted to. | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/4/2008 2:52:19 AM |
Paul Dhaliwal, 19, told the father of Carlos Sousa Jr., 17, who was killed, that the three yelled and waved at the tiger but insisted they never threw anything into its pen to provoke the cat, according to a search warrant affidavit obtained by the San Francisco Chronicle.
Is waving a felonious act? Is yelling a felonious act? As I said, I can understand this behavior provoking an animal, but I cant see how it is taunting.Does you really believe no one has ever yelled or waved at the tiger?And the victim did not admit to taunting the tiger. "Taunting" is a word that is being misused.Do we not teach our children animal sounds through songs like "Old McDonald"? Do we not teach our children to wave? So why is it wrong to do it as an adult, or teen? | |
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| Tiger attack victim was drinking, admitted taunting
Posted: 2/4/2008 5:13:00 AM | Once again, I would like to remind people of the supreme fact;
If the teens had acted maturely, they would be alive today, but the risk of that tiger attacking someone would still exist
If the Zoo had acted responsibly and had its enclosure up to code, NONE of this would have happened, period.
Both parties acted poorly. One had the opportunity to stop it from happening that day, the other had the opportunity to stop it from ever happening. | |
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