| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 9:39:42 AM |
OP, did you notice how quickly the way you do things turned into a character attack and how you are "passive"? I think you're thinking of "passive-aggressive" -- "passive" isn't particularly a negative thing, just something that can get wearing after a while if it's taken to extreme. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 9:46:31 AM | Dan_Pf,
As a fellow former indecisive man allow me to offer you a piece of advice that worked for me:
Plan dates with two-three alternative activities in the same general area of town. That way the date is free to flow depending on how things are going, and you can offer a woman some input while still asserting the fact that you are a male and have put thought into the outing.
So I'll pick a place to eat (and possibly an alternative), somewhere to grab a drink/dessert, and possibly a place for a fun activity (like a pool-hall, dance club, or some live music).
I direct her to one place, and when we're about to move on, I offer her an alternative or two while SUGGESTING which one I'd like to do next. 
Its worked great for me, they're always appreciative of the planning effort I've put in, and receptive to the fact I respected them enough to at least ask their opinion while still fulfilling the traditional "male" role.  | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:06:20 AM | I can always make suggestions on what to do, and then when I don't feel like it I simply ask the man to arrange something - so far I have not been disappointed! It does not need to be super creative or out of this world either.
However, if the man still doesn't want to suggest after I have asked him if he would, I probably would not continue to date him as that is not the type of man I am looking for.
It sort of goes back and forth or if one of us has a great idea for something to do, we bring it up! Kinda like we do with our friends no?
There are limits of course.....I would not go skydiving lol
As i said before, i'll rely on women saying they would prefer to do something else if they genuinely don't want to do as i've suggested.
Definitely and I am not shy so I would say so if I wasn't interested in doing that and suggest something else and I expect him to do the same. Sometimes it can be hard to think of things to do - just talk it out! | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:10:52 AM | I think it depends on how far into a relationship I am with the guy...
If it's only a few dates in, then I would definitely expect and respond to "A man with a plan". I absolutely hate to get picked up and then asked, "What do you want to do?"
If you haven't decided yet because you want us to be happy, I like the suggestion already given.... Give us 2-3 options and let us pick, but don't just dump it on us. There are several reasons for this - Mainly, I don't want to suggest dancing, if the guy doesn't like that, I don't want to suggest a bar, if the guy isn't into that scene, nor would I want to suggest someplace expensive when I don't know his budget.
Therefore, get a backbone, come up with a few ideas and let her choose. If she doesn't like any of them, then she'll suggest something else. If she scolds you or demeans you for your choices, then that speaks volumes about who she is as well. A man who is too passive is a turn off... not a deal breaker, but definitely not a "winning trait" either.
Just my 2 cents!
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:12:38 AM | I don't think it has anything to do with putting the decision on them but they may feel that you cannot take charge. I think a good mix of asking someone what they want to do and sometimes saying, do you want to eat at whatever, should accomplish what you want without making you out to be a woos. Tiger Woods said it quite well, follow that advice and you should be fine.
I have a male friend that I eat with on a fairly regular basis and we always go through this thing that he doesn't care where we eat and I don't either, with the caveat for me that as long as it is not fish, I am cool. It would probably be nice if either of us grew a set, lol. I think in the initial stages, most people appreciate your considering their input. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:23:52 AM | A lot of women find a 'man with a plan' to be quite appealing... but (Don't you just hate those 'buts'?) there should also be consensus.
' oh what a life, what a life....'
WWoE
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:33:15 AM | my opinion:
i think most women don't realize how much a man wants to please them on the first date, hence he asks for suggestions. he wants to know what WE want to do, so he doesn't make a "mistake".
for a long time it pissed me off that guys who asked me out NEVER had a plan, never. i mean, how hard is it to decide where to eat? lol
now, if he asks, i have no problem offering 2 or 3 ideas. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:42:14 AM | I hear the same thing said about women -- myself in particular when it comes to deciding what to eat and where. And I've even had former female friends become downright confrontational about the fact that, for the most part, I could care less as long as I eat. Not lately but in the past, I have had so many decisions (from the minute to the life altering) to make on any given day that the last thing I want to do is weigh the pros and cons of serving a particular vegetable.
When I'm cooking for others I will tell them what I've got that's doable and ask them to make a decision. When necessary I will settle a tie-breaker. And when out in a restaurant if I can't decide, I will simply borrow a page from 'When Harry Met Sally' and say "I'll have what he/she's having". It wouldn't bother me in the least to find a like-minded guy. We could make a game out of it and say that the very next restaurant we come to is going to be it and just experiment. The list of things I don't like is short so hit and miss generally works out fine. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 11:29:46 AM | | That is/was my main way of thinking misspriss, it wasn't always that i didn't know where i wanted to go or what i wanted to eat, i just didn't want to take women there and them to act like they were happy with the choice when they weren't. Especially if she knew the area better than me (something i often do with the first few dates so she get's home quicker), she would know the places better so i would always ask them what pub etc they would prefer. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 11:47:54 AM | Wow.Time to man up a little.If Im paying for the date,Im doing what I want to on it.If the chick likes you and likes your interest,your choices will be 1st rate.If not.Teller ta get walk'n.  | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 11:58:37 AM |
A woman wants a man who can make up his mind but isn't overbearing. So, my solution is to state my preference but give an alternative: "Hey, I thought we'd do seafood tonight. Hemmingways and the Fish House are both good. I haven't been to Hemmingways in a couple of months, lets go there." Yes, this is good. I like your approach.
One guy who asked me out had no idea where to go, no set time to go there, and while he *may* have been trying to be accommodating, I took his lack of a plan as lack of real interest. There's a fine line between "whatever you want" and just "whatever"-- and neither are attractive. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 12:01:14 PM | dan pf:
thanks. :)
I got that little tidbit out of a CD set I bought called "Out of Synch with the Opposite Sex." (Alison Armstrong)
Sometimes women really have no idea what men are thinking, but we are soooo sure we know what's going on. lol. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 12:05:39 PM | | I hate indecisive men, i had that problem just today with my bf. i asked him what he wanted to do, he was like, i duno, what do u wana do? i got the same response for where we should eat, etc . ohh my god it gets tiring. id rather he had the suggestions, and if i didnt want to do what he did, i would say and we could come to a compromise or do what i want to do. please guys dont do this indecisive thing!!! | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 12:11:17 PM | I have on my profile that I dislike constantly being asked what to do , where to go, or what to eat.
I think instead of saying "Would you like to go out on Friday?" You could say would you like to go to a concert, go bowling, go to eat at restaurant a, b, or c, would you like to go see such and such movie with me.
Just a few thoughts! | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 12:23:38 PM | This has been a pet peeve of mine for a while... I have tried to keep in mind that probably the guy's motive is that he is trying to be considerate and show that he cares about what i want, but truthfully, it feels more like the guy is kind of too lazy to come up with some ideas, and puts the work on me to do it. I mean, HE asked ME out right? So why do i now have to figure out the details? Yet, reading above, I see some women do appreciate being given the opportunity to choose a venue they feel safe and comfortabel in, so what's a guy to do? Perhaps as Peter above says, the answer is to be yourself, and if that's the type of guy you are, then the right woman for you is one who appreciates being given the opportunity to make the decisions.
All that being said, here's my suggestion: Come up with 1 or 2 suggestions of something to do, and give her the choice, with the 3rd choice always being something else altogether if she has something in mind. That way, you are not forcing her to do the work, but giving her options. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 3:57:46 PM | The only thing this thread makes clear is that men should know better than to make women stop and think - it tends to backfire. 
for a long time it pissed me off that guys who asked me out NEVER had a plan, never. i mean, how hard is it to decide where to eat? By the looks of things, not as hard as it is for most women.
And I'm being nice  | |
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vro312
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Joined: 11/22/2007
Msg: 42 | |
| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 4:01:47 PM |
The only thing this thread makes clear is that men should know better than to make women stop and think - it tends to backfire.
Yeah . . . that's the problem . . . women don't like to "stop and think."
Good luck to you. And don't forget to let us know how this logic works out for you in the dating arena. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 5:47:40 PM |
Yeah . . . that's the problem . . . women don't like to "stop and think." I was half-joking, but thank you for agreeing.
Good luck to you. And don't forget to let us know how this logic works out for you in the dating arena. Since you are such the curious funny bunny (and old enough to know better), I'll gladly share. It works horribly for me, because I actually DO let women stop, think, and make decisions for themselves, before doing something they might regret, rather than pressure them that they'll "lose" me, since I'm so popular and chased, eliciting "action". You should be asking the guys who use alcohol to circumvent the decision making process I speak of, just how well knowledge of that logic works for them. 
- Your Excogitator | |
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vro312
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Joined: 11/22/2007
Msg: 44 | |
| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 5:57:37 PM |
Since you are such the curious funny bunny (and old enough to know better), I'll gladly share. It works horribly for me, because I actually DO let women stop, think, and make decisions for themselves, before doing something they might regret, rather than pressure them that they'll "lose" me, since I'm so popular and chased, eliciting "action". You should be asking the guys who use alcohol to circumvent the decision making process I speak of, just how well knowledge of that logic works for them.
I would love to respond to this (in some sort of on-topic way), however, after three readings I can make neither heads nor tails of it.
Am I the "curious funny bunny"? I guess that's kind of cute--thank you. And am I old enough to know better? If so, better than what?
The alcohol comment is interesting. I don't actually spend a lot of time with men who drink alcohol, and I almost never ask them for anything . . . least of all to "cirucumvent the decision making process [you] speak of." 
Okay. Even after breaking it down, I still don't understand your post. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 7:12:15 PM | Just entered this thread and scanned a fair bit of it.
I could easily be called "indecisive" if judged solely upon a "where would you like to go" type question. But anyone who knows me beyond that knows i am far from being indecisive. As a friend of mine says, dont confuse weakness and kindness.
But what if i spend 60 hours a week being decisive and dont really care about where i go, so long as I'm with you. Ie- if I REALLY want to eat ribs, but she is a vegetarian, I am not gonna propose a rib joint. My goal on the date is to fullfill the specific need of spending QT with her, not my food jones. I can always deal with that later.
If its dinner, and we are at "mexican, indian, or cajun", I will pick.
what if i say, i dont know, lets meet at XXXXXX cafe, look at the paper to see whats happening and decide together?
what if I have been single for a year and she has been single for 7 years and she possesses a better knowledge of bars and clubs and local bands than I do?
Do you discern an indecisive person from a collaborative one?
Another example, at one point i told my GF that I dont really like to dance and im not that good at it. then, somewhere down the line, after our we finished our initial 'date plan,' we ended up at a bar with a funk band. She said if we went, she would likely want to dance. I grunted and went cuz i love funk. we ended up dancing for 2 1/2 hours, we both had a great time, and she likes the way i dance. We've been dancing a few more times since then.
Then finally tonight, she came to a public hearing/protest i helped organized and listened to my public testimony/argument. The question of decisiveness will never come up again. Now she believes me when i tell her 'i dont care where we go so long as i am with you'. and 'lets just talk about it and agree.'
sorry for rambling, JMHO. I could be wrong. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 8:54:22 PM |
that this has gotta be reasonably boring for women sometimes having to decide almost everything.
Yes. I makes it seem like the other party isn't *interested* in making decisions. | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 9:19:08 PM | Okay.....so when he asks me out, if I have to decide.....when I ask him out, do I then make HIM decide?
And who pays, the asker or the decider? | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:11:36 PM | Dan~
I definitely find it annoying when I make plans to go on a first date with a guy and he has no ideas or suggestions on what to do. Or if the guy suggests seeing a movie, ...seeing a movie obviously defeats the purpose of a first date. Which is to talk with and get to know the person...
I agree with the previous statements about the guy picking out a few different ideas and asking the girl to pick one of them....it shows that they put some thought into the date and it also gives the girl a choice =) | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 10:59:49 PM | Wow, excellent thread... I had no idea that the ladies felt so strongly about it.
I know I always ask for my dates input, certainly wouldn't want to take her to the place where her ex proposed. Never imagined I might be perceived as lazy. Usually it just doesn't matter to me.
I do like the idea of offering up a couple of choices. I'll have to work that into my next date.
On a side note guys, don't you hate it when your date says she doesn't care what you do and then wants to change the plans mid date for whatever reason??? | |
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| Men who are indecisive when out with women
Posted: 1/29/2008 11:42:59 PM | OP:
It's a good question. I think many guys struggle with that. IMO, here's the answer: when planning dates, you should plan for the things you enjoy. Period. Plan to take her to the places you like to eat; the bars/clubs you like to go to; and to the sporting events you go to. You want to show her your world, and you want her to make a decision about whether your world is for her. You want a girl who will enjoy what you enjoy. Obviously, if she has a suggestion of something she'd like to do, then it's good to work that into the dating schedule; but otherwise, you plan dates around what YOU like to do, as if she weren't even going to be there. That's the honest, most effective way to see if you're compatible with her.
When guys start second-guessing themselves and get into the role of finding out what the date wants to do and conforming to that--it makes the guy look insecure. Women want guys to handle shit. Line up the events on a date and take her into your world without asking for suggestions. If she has a big problem with your plans, then you're not compatible with her. No harm, no foul. | |
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