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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 5:10:02 AM | | All relationshiops start out as friends first. from there it either goes further or dont. if it done it just wasnt meant to be. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 5:24:26 AM | hmmmm....ever really work?
that's a broad topic
and, it depends on how many friends you need.
For me, I think friends first with intentions known is the logical way to go, as opposed to being on a mission to find true Love,(or Lust) and then 'hoping' that you will be good friends as well somewhere down the road.
When a woman automatically places me directly into the friend pile, it only means that she is still looking for Mr Perfect....based on whatever her preconceived notions of what 'perfect' is.
For most of these women I know, they will probably search forever...and ever.
At this point, I have enough women as friends...haha
'Kimbo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 5:37:18 AM | | That depends I guess on if both parties agree right off the bat that friends first will lead somewhere else in the end...Or there is some kind of potential for more. The feelings basically have to be mutual on both sides. Otherwise you end up with a 1 sided relationship and one of the other parties feeling very different about the other. But there are things you have to be careful of, like not letting it slip into the ok so now I don't wanna ruin the friendship so let's just be friends zone. Or the, now you feel more like a brother/sister to me so nothing is going to happen zone. It's all about communication, and telling the other person how you feel, after all that is what friends are supposed to do right? | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:02:40 AM | | How do you treat your same sex friends?You will spend time with them,you will get to know about them and then decide to be friends or to move on.You should do the same for someone you are attracted to.I call the attraction certain chemistry.If the chemistry is mutual it will turn into romance.This is the kind of relationship that after a couple is married you will hear them say "I married my best friend. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:40:24 AM | Mike,
It is not gender-exclusive, this 'friends only' thing. I have been in the same situation only recently, and the emotional pain is truly crushing. You've been smarter than me in that you moved on before she started dating someone else. I stuck around longer and got devastated even more.
You sometimes wonder what does it mean, 'Friends only'. I can for sure said my only friends are people I've known my whole life and it's only two or three people, not more than that. So all these 'fake' friends who use you because you are a nice person and your feelings push you to do extraordinary things for them... well, they are just users, and nothing else. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:40:27 AM | | I've dated enough best friends to discover that even if you date after being friends first, you're always a friend, nothing more. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:52:00 AM |
It is not gender-exclusive, this 'friends only' thing. I have been in the same situation only recently, and the emotional pain is truly crushing. You've been smarter than me in that you moved on before she started dating someone else. I stuck around longer and got devastated even more.
"Friends only" is pretty self explanatory, and means never more than friends (unless the meaning of this changed recently) - this thread is about "friends first" which is a world of difference.
You sometimes wonder what does it mean, 'Friends only'. I can for sure said my only friends are people I've known my whole life and it's only two or three people, not more than that. So all these 'fake' friends who use you because you are a nice person and your feelings push you to do extraordinary things for them... well, they are just users, and nothing else.
For me "friends only" or "just friends" wouldn't be about using anyone. It would mean that I enjoy someone's company and we have fun together but there's no spark there. It's up to them to decide they agree, or won't get past any interest they may have (if they do). It means we can't date, but let's still hang out and do things together...
"Friends first" specifically means I have attraction/interest in someone and don't want to rush into anything or get too serious too soon - I want to hang out with them in a low pressure, laid back type way and learn about them before dating them. If I didn't date someone I was "friends first" with, it would be because one or both of us learned something about the other despite the attraction that we consider a dealbreaker. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:56:17 AM | I doubt you will get (assuming the OP is reading this post anymore) many responses that it does work...as this is a dating site...and if it worked the successful couple wouldn't be here to respond...
One problem inherent in the question (other than where it is being asked) is definition of friendship. Some people have responded that everyone starts out as friends. I personally believe this to be false as my definition of friendship is a relationship that lasts a significant amount of time entailing a depth of emotional attachment without attention to physical attraction. Some people define friendship as simple reciprocation of friendliness between two people. Therefore you are going to get different ideas of what a friend is thereby creating a vague question and highly subjective and somewhat meaningless answers, unless they define their concept of friend. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 9:58:59 AM |
"Friends only" is pretty self explanatory, and means never more than friends (unless the meaning of this changed recently) - this thread is about "friends first" which is a world of difference.
I agree with you on that. However, what Mike was referring to (and myself as well) is that some people push the boundaries. They act like they are into you, spend all their free time with you, and make you believe all they need is time and patience. I wouldn't necesseraly spend hours on the phone every day with someone I don't have deeper interest in. I have great friends who I speak to once or twice a week.
I think some things got 'lost in translation' here. The point is - when you start developing feelings for someone who is your friend, you have to come clean and speak to them about it. If the feeling is not mutual, there is no amount of good deeds you can do, or anything you can say to change their mind. You just end up being hurt and maybe miss out on someone who is truly worth your time and attention. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 10:18:36 AM |
I agree with you on that. However, what Mike was referring to (and myself as well) is that some people push the boundaries. They act like they are into you, spend all their free time with you, and make you believe all they need is time and patience. I wouldn't necesseraly spend hours on the phone every day with someone I don't have deeper interest in. I have great friends who I speak to once or twice a week.
Ok I admit that is odd behavior for someone who's not interested in something - that's a lot of hanging out together. No, I wouldn't do that if I wasn't interested in a romantic sense.
I think some things got 'lost in translation' here. The point is - when you start developing feelings for someone who is your friend, you have to come clean and speak to them about it. If the feeling is not mutual, there is no amount of good deeds you can do, or anything you can say to change their mind. You just end up being hurt and maybe miss out on someone who is truly worth your time and attention.
Point taken. I never develop feelings for someone I haven't already decided I was attracted to in the first place (and made that clear), or not left my options open to meet anyone else I might be interested in, so I can't say I can identify. IME, men tend to be the ones that become interested over time, not always in the beginning, whereas with me where you start is where you stay...some women develop feelings where there were none, but not many that I know of. But I understand what you're saying. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/13/2008 10:29:06 AM | All I can say on this is that the 'love of my life' as I call her was the best lover and my greatest friend but, we started out dating and became friends in the process, therefore the 'attraction' was always there. I think there at three elements; Lust, Trust, Love and they break down as follows:
Lust: That instant attract when you wanna rip the clothes of the other person
Trust: Knowing that you can tell the other person ANYTHING and it will go no further
Love: What you feel for a family member etc from your heart.
And that relate to relationships as follows:
Lust leads to a One night stand / affair; Trust is always key to a friendship; Love is when you'll give your life for the other person but, YOU NEED ALL THREE to having a meaningful relationship. One or two out of three aint bad but, why settle for second best??
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/14/2008 10:27:57 AM | In my experience, and observations, really, the friends first mostly only works in the mind of most women, or, they're not articulating what they mean precisely enough (communications gap).
Here's some general differences.. and i do mean really general(ized) ... In any non romantic (read: SEX!) relationship, A guys interest for a woman will drop considerably over time in regards to a romantic relationship and all the stuff besides sex that comes with it. A woman's interest may tend to grow, but it just as likely to end up in a relationship where there was a big spark and they just went for it.
Yeah, its in some of those dating books, but I've seen it as true.. if a woman sees someone as a long term prospect, they'll hold off on sex, but they're also more likely to get into a relationship with someone they're already getting it on with.
What does it boil down to? Stop fooling yourself about friends first, or at least realize it doe shave to be more than "just friends". While that doesn't have to include sex, some obvious hints of attraction, or that this can be going somewhere are needed, and basically required. Yeah, there will be a bunch of guys that will just follow a woman around, and effectively just simper and whine until they get rejected for a date enough, then usually storm off after enough pain and disappear. They lack the self confidence to say "that doesn't work for me' in the first place, as well as being needy to the point of screaming "I did all this for you now why wont you love me!?!??!1!!11".. mostly because the guy has emasculated himself enough to be one of the womans 'girlfriends' and now thats just what he is.
seen it happen way too many times. ladies, pipe up here and let me know if what i'm seeing is right here. Look at all those failed friends first deals and see if thats not just whats happening a majority of the time.
To be fair, my last relationship started as friends first, but it happened more than was stated. about 2 dates in, a lot of stuff happened, and she simply said, I want to date you, I just can't right now, I have too much going on in my life, but I like you and want to hang out with you and spend some time together when we can. there was flirting back and forth all the time, a it more than a friendly peck on the lips here, and a but grab there, etc.. finally, we were working on some of those things that were an obstacle and were like, woot, we're done. lets go celebrate, and got totally schnockered, ate, had fun, blew off a bunch of steam and then when getting ready to head home, more or less got tackled and er.. mutually let off about 4 months of built up sexual tension. So afterwards, I look over and jokingly say in my best surfer imitation 'so uh like, does this like mean we're dating?' , and she deadpanned back to me "yep, right after we fix the holes in the walls, the bed and night stand we busted up tonight". we looked at each other for a minute and burst out laughing and we hit it off from there.
how did it work? we knew where it was going, but set and accepted that the 'intro' period was just going to be really long and slow. There wasn't that "inequality of desire" that busts up so many starting relationships. since the lack of feeling on one side will quickly frustrate both people and things fall apart.
Of course, maybe I'm also just patient as hell for the right thing,, as long as theres true hope in sight | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/14/2008 10:59:31 AM |
What does it boil down to? Stop fooling yourself about friends first, or at least realize it doe shave to be more than "just friends". While that doesn't have to include sex, some obvious hints of attraction, or that this can be going somewhere are needed, and basically required.
I totally agree with this, friends first should be explained along with a clear indication of interest and wanting to get to know them better. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/15/2008 8:19:18 AM | | Guys & Girls the brutal truth is do yourself a favor if they don't want to kiss you,hug you, and hold your hand put your energy into a person that does ! You'll both have so much more fun becoming friends and falling in love. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/15/2008 2:52:33 PM | | Friends first is the only way I've ever had a relationship. It makes more sense to be in love with someone who can be your best friend as well. Why love someone you wouldn't want as a friend? | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 5/15/2008 2:55:58 PM | The friendd first or just friends problem is a great question. I have thought about it, and in the end the guy always wins. There's always a power play between the sexes and women have the edge in the battle because for the most part they get to decide about pursuing sexual relations as the fairer sex. Anyone who has sowed their wild oats and has wild sex every which way comes around to the truth that sex with love is the best. What could be better than loving sex with someone who's a great friend that you care about, that you share with, with whom you share common interests. But girls are no different in that they are looking for a hot partner that they are thrilled by and have hot sex with.
But of course, the nice guy, the good friend, always wins, always comes out on top.
When I see women that have turned me down and they look sad because I'm doing great and have a beautiful woman on my arm, I don't rub it in. I just look at them with an expression of "why didn't we? we could have had fun together." | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 7:18:35 AM |
All relationshiops start out as friends first
No, "all" relationships don't start out as "friends first". In fact, all of my long term relationships ended up including sex on the first date, because the attraction was overwhelming, and none of the relationships I tried to "make work" , when sex was delayed, ever turned into much of anyhting.
I believe that there is a fairly strong correlation between relationships that are meaningful and enduring, and those that are "sex first". Those who are content with "frriends first" are usually more interested in "companionship" than the intensity of a passionate, romantic man/woman connection.
For me, at least, the only kind of woman, who I would imagine being my match, would be a woman with a fairly strong sex drive, who is comfortable with her own sexuality. In talking prior to meeting, that doesn't mean that sex is a "given". I don't want to sleep with someone, if we aren't really "into" each other, but if we are, I'd be very concerned about a woman, who is unable/unwilling to act on attraction, or for whom it's a secondary consideration.
The "natural purpose" for man/woman relationships is tied into our mating instinct, or sex drive. How can anyone make an argument that sex is unimportant, or secondary, in a romantic relationship?
Friendship is fine. Some people aren't sexually driven, and may be perfectly content with "friendship" based "relationships", but I already have friends, men and women, that I can "do stuff with". I can't imagine going through the hassles of "dating" someone new, if it weren't in response to the natural, human sex drive.
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:23:39 AM | Yes, friends first does work. Somewhere along the line someone started this thing about men being put in the "friend zone". Now many men think that if that happens the relationship will never progress to more and they move on. It's a vicious circle because if you talk to anyone who has been in a successful long term relationship they'll tell you that they are friends, usually best friends.
I think that's one of the reasons I've remained single for so long. I want a lover, but he has to be my friend. To have the first without the second is just a supperficial, short term thing in my eyes and usually ends up feeling rather empty.
I still have hopes of finding that friend and lover. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:27:22 AM |
All relationshiops start out as friends first. from there it either goes further or dont. if it done it just wasnt meant to be.
Not all. Many get lust mixed in there which can be rather blinding and the person see's what they want to see, not what the other person is really like. These relationships end badly when the lust wears off and the true reality of the missmatched personalities become obvious.
Friends first, imo, is the way to go. If you don't like them for who they truly are, a deeper relationship is unlikely to work out in the long run. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 8:30:17 AM |
I want a lover, but he has to be my friend. To have the first without the second is just a supperficial, short term thing in my eyes and usually ends up feeling rather empty.
In my experience, great lovers always become great friends. The intimacy of a deep connection creates a need to be together more, doing more things, and through sexual intimacy, a man comes to truly cherish his lover.
However, "great friends" do not necessarily become great lovers. In fact, in my experience, if it's "friends first", the sexual attraction can't be very intense, or else it wouldn't be denied.
For me, if it isn't sexual attraction that puts it all in motion, then it's not going to be a "great love/grand passion" and isn't worth pursuing. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 9:30:04 AM | To me, friends first means friends only.
It might work, but for the most part, the women I've discussed it with had some emotional difficulties that disualified them from the relationship category. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/20/2008 9:31:50 AM |
hmmmm....ever really work?
that's a broad topic
and, it depends on how many friends you need.
How many friends do I need? Zero.
How many do I want? The more the better. | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/22/2008 8:32:11 AM | Thank you wigglesticks (post 262) !! And that's a GUY, who wrote:
the 'love of my life' as I call her was the best lover and my greatest friend but, we started out dating and became friends in the process, therefore the 'attraction' was always there. I think there at three elements; Lust, Trust, Love and they break down as follows:
Lust: That instant attract when you wanna rip the clothes of the other person
Trust: Knowing that you can tell the other person ANYTHING and it will go no further
Love: What you feel for a family member etc from your heart.
Just as I have female friends who show different and wide range of interests, views, conflicts, lifestyles--I would expect to have men friends with the same wide ranges of interests, values and proclivities. My women best friends are consistent, understanding, have their own productive lives, share some tales of woe and struggles, but the friendship is beyond simply being each other's psychologist--we share certain interests, we share about our busy schedules.
Yoodle | |
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| Does Friends first ever really work?
Posted: 7/22/2008 8:44:39 AM |
Lets say a guy is at a party, a girl walks in, he looks up and thinks nothing of her. He gets to know her over time because of mutual friends, he finds out she is really cool and they become friends, he will NEVER fall in love with her because that instant attraction wasn't there. .......... Lets say a girl is at a party, a guy walks in, she looks up and thinks nothing of him. She gets to know him over time because of mutual friends, she finds out he is really cool and they become friends, she WILL fall in love with him because of his personality, his charm, wit, intelligence - because of all that - attraction has grown. ..........
This can and has happened the other way too...
With that being said, you men have it much easier than we women do, women can be worn down if your are persistent and are genuine in your friendship.
Not in my experience. Once a women puts me in the friend category, forever shall I be there. | |
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