| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 3:04:43 AM | | Dreamcatcher and Cutie you both have been so defensive and insulting to many people just putting there view forward. I have to be honest and say its very unattractive and it looks like more people are against your view than supporting them and thats coming from a lot of girls. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 4:34:38 AM | Soulmate, your prediction is wrong. i respect your opinion because you give it without insults.
I think i have held my tongue fairly well in this thread. i have been called a prostitute, been told i have granny panties,entitlement princess,user. probably could dig up a few more if i really wanted to. all because i have enough self esteem not to allow a man to try and treat me in a way i feel is disrespectful. Ironic thing is, i didnt see you jumping in and trying to scold them. Me thinks the insults are coming fairly evenly from both sides.
My opinions do not come from a lack of knowledge, cause one thing i do know is, nothing says i value you, like, will you go out with me and pay your own way. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 7:00:43 AM | I'm trying to come up with a new wrinkle on this tired topic, it's not easy, but here goes...
There seems to be some sort of poor argument posed by women associated male dutch daters and guys looking for early nookie. If anything, I'd make the opposite knee-jerk association, that a guy who pays everytime on a first date regardless of the circumstances is looking for the shortcut into the ladies panties. He's the one associating money with sex. I can't see the association with not spending money and getting sex. Just trying to follow logical reasoning (you don't get unless you give), but I don't think logic is being applied by people just blindly following one mindset (Dutch) or the other (Entitlement and Largesse).
If anything, logic would people as individuals, and interpersonal relationships are complex issues. Not simple. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 7:59:12 AM |
I bet you will be dinning alone much of the time OR you will end up with a woman who stands up to pee like you do and then you might could compare who has the bigger one............IMAGINE THAT
Has Cutie just left PoF? Shame! The above really made me want to dump my current gf for her... | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 8:06:26 AM |
If anything, logic would people as individuals, and interpersonal relationships are complex issues. Not simple. Geez this sure doesn't make sense, sorry. The gist here is that an individual's personality make-up is complex, and interpersonal issues like this are complex. Then again, people often don't associate logic thought processes with decisions regarding romance. Whatever. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 8:22:00 AM | Has Cutie just left PoF? Shame! The above really made me want to dump my current gf for her...
Maybe the mods have deleted her profile because she has made many rude remarks to people on this thread and other threads. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 8:36:26 AM | Bikeman, i really do understand your side of the debate. For me it is more of a respect issue than a money issue. If a man prefers to not spend money on a woman he just met, that is fine. Cut me a bouquet of flowers from your garden and accompany me on a walk along the waterfront. To me, this says i value you. To ask me out to dinner and then expect me to cough up my half of the bill, just reeks of tackiness.
if a man cant afford to take a woman on a date then he shouldnt ask her out. If a man were to say to me, Dreamy, i would really like to spend some time with you, but i just dont have the money to take you out on a proper date, so would you like to come to my place for dinner, i would likely accept. I would feel valued enough that he felt he could be honest. Just dont pee on my leg and try to tell me its raining out, by asking me on a date and then saying, your total of the bill plus the tip and half of the cost of the flowers comes to............ That is just to tacky for my tastes.
Yes people i do expect flowers, entitlement princess that i am, even if they do come from your own garden. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 10:28:41 AM | Just curious, but has a WOMAN ever asked a MAN out on a first date?
By your logic, that would mean SHE would pick up the entire tab, because she is the one who asked him out?
I doubt any man would allow a woman to pick up the tab just because she was the one who asked the man out on a first date. And if she expected me to pay my half of the bill for dinner, I certainly wouldn't consider her a cheapskate, I would consider it FAIR because we both wanted the opportunity to learn about each other.
Perhaps this is WHY women so seldom ask a man out on a first date, because they believe if they make the first move, they'll have to pay?? Ohhhh, I hope that's not it, or dating may be headed to extinction.
just my 2 cents. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 11:08:05 AM | That this is already such a long thread illustrates the problem with the topic.
My pitch is that it dosen't and shouldn't matter. If my date perfers for me to pay I'm happy, and if she wants to pay that's great too. ITS ONLY MONEY. We're supposed to be aiming for the 'spending old age together' thing, why judge on a cup of coffee?
The silly thing is some are put out if I pay. However, if you ask whether she would prefer to pay or not beforehand, you're sunk. I try to avoid discussing money at all, my normal approach is to pay quietly if my date goes to the ladies or something like that. People often seem to wait to see if you to pay and then tell you it wasn't required, dating or otherwise. I'd prefer it was a non-topic.
It would be easier if dates carried a little card that states their preference. Or if it went on profiles - Smokes - Does Drugs - Pays - Has Kids. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 11:19:24 AM |
I think i have held my tongue fairly well in this thread.
Yeah, maybe if you consider calling people unromantic cheapos for a preference when they haven't insulted you holding your tongue well. I guess the word 'well' could be used rather loosely. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 12:11:02 PM | Bikeman, i would be honored to take you up on your invitation.
Zopz, im sorry if i offended you hon. Me bad sometimes. I have a really cute 18 year old daughter, maybe you, Bikeman, me and the daughter could go on a double date, she believes in dutch. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 12:20:17 PM |
Zopz, im sorry if i offended you hon. Me bad sometimes. I have a really cute 18 year old daughter, maybe you, Bikeman, me and the daughter could go on a double date, she believes in dutch.
Well, the Dutch exist whether you choose to believe in them or not... | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 12:34:52 PM | Well I must say this topic sure has brought out the worst in some people. I think the topic is expecting Dutch without discussing it. I say in the dating world expect and be prepared for anything.
Where this has gone off topic is dating in general equating being a gentleman with paying for the dates. POPPYCOCK!!!!!!!!! Yep I know that word is dating me and too bad. Good Lord if someone is taking a woman out on a regular basis and they have th e same bills to pay such as rent , elec, etc etc etc there is nothing wrong with a woman going Dutch or paying once in a while when going out.
Then it went so far as to talk about doing laundry...cleaning....household chores. THATS A RELATIONSHIP, not dating. I have never been privy to seeing women attack other women in such a manor. Can we not state our opinions without attacking. Attacking someone because of gender or age seems to run rampant in these forums. Sometimes I look at a profile and am amazed at the ages of some of the people making these derogatory statments and I cant believe it.
I know you will all say you dont care because you dont know these people. But it matters. It is a testament as to your character. When someone is 19 or 20 and asking for your advise you dont have to disrespect them for what they dont know. They are asking for help. Conversely just because I am over 60 doesnt mean I am not a viable contributor to society. Please remember words can cut a person as sharply as a sword. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 1:55:02 PM | | I think going dutch is stupid. It helps me decide to never go out again --if he talks dutch, he has seen the last of me. If he mentions it before we go out, well I figure he is a cheapie, so I will make an excuse such as: I am sorry dude I have to stay home and paint my toenails to cover the yellow fungus! If that doesn't turn him off, nothing will except to say that I don't go dutch!!!!!!!!!! | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 2:03:53 PM | I think going dutch is stupid. It helps me decide to never go out again --if he talks dutch, he has seen the last of me. If he mentions it before we go out, well I figure he is a cheapie
Other posters and myself have mentioned this to other women and I will repeat it to you. I could easily turn that around and say a woman is cheap if she is expecting a man to pay the entire bill. At least the man who prefers to go Dutch is actually paying his share of the bill. The woman who expects a man to pay for the entire bill is paying NOTHING. | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 2:36:30 PM |
--if he talks dutch, he has seen the last of me. If he mentions it before we go out, well I figure he is a cheapie
That seems to be a biggest generalization about this whole topic, dutch means he is cheap. If so, we get to use the generalization "thats the way we men use to weed out gold diggers"  | |
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| 1st Date Expecting Dutch without discussing beforehand
Posted: 2/28/2008 3:27:33 PM | My standard operating procedure is that I bring enough cash to cover me and my date, and if she decides to jump in and pay her end (which usually happens) great, if not then it's all taken care of anyway.
Considering that most times the woman will pay anyway, I think this is the safest route to go nowadays. You don't get considered cheap for asking ahead of time about payment, and you have credit for at least being able and ready to pay, even if she pays herself.
Safest way to go. | |
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