| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:06:25 PM | I have been raised with dogs all my life, show dogs, I have trained dogs and horses. I know a little about dogs.
If a gun kills someone, due you blame the gun or the person who shot the gun??? Pit Bulls are strong dogs, with powerful jaws, they are not the type of dog a novice or inexperienced person should have for a dog. The pit bull and other aggressive breeds should be owned by people who know what they are doing and can take on the role as alpha (pack leader).
I feel that people with these types of aggressive dogs, should pass a law that requires them to either take full obedience and personality training dog and owner, and or prove that their dog is safe, trained and a good citizen. Over here in California people are upset about the horrid abuse of stupidity running rapid in Colorado, where they kill pit bulls friendly or not, just because they are that breed. They are doing Pit Bull marches here in California, where friendly Pit Bulls and owners march for the rights of the abuse going on.
They train people how to handle guns, train the owner how to handle the more aggressive dogs, make the owner have to have the property certified that their aggressive breed cannot escape, and the problems will be greatly lessened. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:30:55 PM | All dogs regardless of breed have the potential to be equally as aggressive ... it's just that pitbulls have more power packed into their punch as some others.. even though the intent is the same and unfortunately there is too many irresponsible dog owners out there .
Large or small it dosent matter when it comes to aggression. ... a 15 lbs Chihauhau once had my 100 lbs German Shepherd running scared with it's tail in between it's legs .
I do agree that they should be muzzled... for public peace of mind because unfortunately we cannot ban stupid owners.. which is the real problem ... it's like putting a gun into the hands of someone untrained and with a mental disorder.. stupid right ?? Yeah ..... | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:33:27 PM | | I do not agree with the muzzle, I agree with training and educating owners and their powerful dogs. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:36:54 PM | Stupid owners have no business owning a pit bull or any aggressive breed. Pit Bull breeds many times are owned by people who want to look tough, but no training in what they own. The owners have the wrong attitude from day one, and expecting their dog Pit Bull to be tough. That is another reason the breed is having problems. Don't blame the gun, blame the shooter.
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:43:02 PM | Pianosinger I agree with 99 % ... I am a professional dog trainer.. and unfortunately we cannot completely stop stupid people from owning dogs .. even thought I agree with you about having them REQUIRED BY LAW to register the dog and complete the training by a master trainer and receive certification of canine good citizenship.. etc etc...
But unfortunately there is still many people who do not understand this breed and just as a matter of public peace of mind is why I say yes to the Muzzle rule.... as these people have a walking law suit on their hands | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:44:43 PM | | The truth behind most of the pitbull bans is that they are really targeting dog fighters and breeders. If it is legal to own a pit as a pet it is more difficult to locate and prosecute criminal dog fighters. If they look at the statistics realisticly there is no big problem of pit attacks on people. The ASPCA, Humane Society and others are behind much of this ban mentality as a means of getting at the dog fighters and breeders. These organizations start out well intentioned but end up infiltrated and taken over by unrealistic extremist fanatics. The bias media jumps on board and sensationalizes it and the blind uninformed sheep follow the leader. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:47:18 PM | I know my dog dislikes muzzles. Again until they owner can prove there aggressive breed dog can be a good citizen, then muzzle. But after training and proof of good citizen,take that muzzle off the dog.
Then owners have to insure their dog with a insurance company(get rid of those who just want to have the dog to look like a tough guy).
This will help owners also with finding homes for their dogs. Which is hard enough for dog owners, and even harder for aggressive breeds. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:47:20 PM | Regardless of what is done to try and educate owners it will still happen ... guns still get into the wrong hands even though we are require to take a course and pass a test and register our guns.. etc etc
It's just not worth a child loosing it's life... I would love it if I could stop certain people from owning dogs ( of any breed ) .. but unfortunately I cant | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:53:20 PM | You can make all the laws you want but the truth is we can not enforce the laws we already have.
There are no insurance companies that will knowingly write liability policies for pit bull owners.  | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 9:54:17 PM | All dogs dislike muzzles.... but unfortunately you will never be able to change everybody's mind and the fact is alot of people are scared of pitbulls.... so as a respectful thing to your fellow neighbours and for THEIR peace of mind ... the muzzle should be in place
I know better and you know better Pianosinger but it's not always about us | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 10:51:05 PM | I didn't read the previous 16 pages so maybe my point is covered already... I have had 4 different pitbulls and they make great dogs if you are willing to spend the time training them. Yes they are powerful and yes they are stubborn.
In most cases children < 5 are bitten and in the face. In most cases 90%+ as I recall there is no adult present at the time of the bite.
It's so much easier to say "vicious pitbull" than "negligent parent". Little kids like to poke and pull ears, tails etc. I remember someone let their toddler come up to pet my dog. (Parent didn't know it was a pitbull either). First thing the kid did was wrenched on her ear. My dog yelped and when the kid let go gave a big lick in the face. If I had not raised the dog with frequent tugs to her paws and ears maybe she would have bitten. Would it have been the dog's fault? How about my fault? Or the parent's fault?
Yes, pitbulls are more powerful than many other breeds and yes they have the highest number of fatal biting cases. However, first it is a dog, second look at the breed. All dogs should be respected. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 11:10:59 PM | | Perhaps we should all be less concerned about the very small percentage of people killed or injured by pitts, and a little more concerned about the very large percentage of people killed by people. By the way, I am the very proud companion of the bulliest of the bullies. Over 500 lbs. of two, unaltered male Mastiffs. I suppose that makes me someone that needs the image of a killer dog. | |
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Don_26
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Joined: 3/13/2006
Msg: 313 | |
| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/13/2006 11:43:02 PM | Great!!! This is the best news I have heard in a while... cant wait for this ban...when is it happening and is it all over Canada? Sorry guys too many bad owners. That is always the case "Blame the owner not the breed" But yet it seems like the breed attracts bad owners. As far as there being other aggressive dogs, there sure are... and if that breed gets out of hand with the owners that like to have them.Then they will be banned as well.Like I have said in previous posts in other threads you can **** and moan about not blaming the breed, but until you convince the general population ...they will be banned.Because the owners of these animals do absolutly nothing for your credibility.
But I would also like to see a different alternative then just outright destroying these animals.That is very sad,because humans are the ones who have made them this way.And it would be a sin if man had to destroy them...that would just be uncool.What right do we have really? I think with the proper laws and legislation we can find an alternative to what I feel is going to happen.A muzzle at all times would be good and i mean at all times.Not once in a while but as soon as you leave the ****ing house!...actually this would be great!
Then you will have people crying about this and how it is cruel.Well I am sorry but as it stands they(the owners then okay!) are just too dangerous...way too dangerous. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 3:37:13 AM |
As far as there being other aggressive dogs, there sure are... and if that breed gets out of hand with the owners that like to have them.Then they will be banned as well.
Well then be prepared to start banning labrador retrievers, doberman pinschers, golden retrievers, rottweilers, chesapeake bay retrievers, pointers, chihuahuas, dachshunds, all terriers, miniture pinschers, collies, siberian huskies, german shepard dogs, border collies, kuvasc... shall I continue?
And so what if the pit breeds are banned, thats not going to stop the people that really shouldn't have the breeds from having them. It'll just make them want them even more, creating a breed of dog that's worse then how they are already perceived. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 5:52:14 AM | Pit Bulls are commonly used as therapy dogs.
Pit Bulls are used in Search and Rescue work
Pit Bulls serve as narcotic and bomb sniffing dogs.
Pit Bulls are great with kids.
Pit Bulls are not human aggressive.
Sgt. Stubby. A Pit Bull war hero.
Pit Bulls score an 83.4% passing rate with the American Temperament Test Society. That's better than the popular Border Collie (a breed who scores 79.6%)
They are dogs not killing machines.
All breeds of dogs bite
A Labrador has bitten the face off of a woman.
A Pomeranian has killed a newborn.
Since 1975,the following breeds have been involved in one or more fatal attacks on human beings: Akita, Australian Shepherd,Boxer, Bulldog, Bullmastiff, Chesapeake Bay Retriever, Chow Chow,****r Spaniel, Collie, Coonhound, Dachshund,Doberman, Golden Retriever, Great Dane, Husky, Labrador Retriever, Lhasa Apso, Malamute, Mastiff, Mixed Breed (withno recognizable dominant breed), Newfoundland, "Pit Bull" type, Pomeranian, Rhodesian Ridgeback, Rottweiler, GermanShepherd, Saint Bernard, Sheepdog, West Highland White Terrier, Wolf/Dog Hybrid, Yorkshire Terrier.
"Pit Bulls" (not even an actual, definable, single breed) have no monopoly on aggression to humans.
Any dog is potentially aggressive, both to other dogs and to humans.
Overall bite statistics by breed place bothLabradors and Golden Retrievers in the top five for bite incident frequency.
Pit Bulls are powerful dogs, and can be dangerous, just as any dog can be under the wrong circumstances. It is the responsibility of their human masters to properly supervise and care for them.
Due to the tenacity and physicality of the Bull and Terrier breeds, people have decided to make them one of the primary representations of a bad dog. People use the dog to compensate for their own insecurity and to promote a macho image.
Any breed that threatens, attacks, bites, or even shows aggression toward a person should be neutered at the very least or, preferably, should be destroyed.
Seventy percent of all bites involve male dogs that haven't been neutered. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 6:41:15 AM | Oh yes and that must be why there are so many people that are afraid of these other breeds.You can argue till you are blue in the face.Get mad at me it means no difference.Until the owners of these dogs learn to control thier animals and these animals can be thought of as respectful citizens in the eyes of all(not just a bunch of people who have had a good experience with them) then there will be a ban. Again I would love to see an alternative.But you dont want that ...nope you just want to argue how "I have been areound pitts allmy lifeand they are so loveable" Hey and I agree with you in some cases.A friend of mine had a pit-bull named Cronic; the most loveable dog and most loyal friend.Until he seen another dog or until he was frightened.Poor dog was stabbed horriably one time and actually survived.This pit-bull would be allowed around my son any day...but sad to say I cannot say that for all.The ban will be put into place it is just unsafe having these powerful dogs.What do you want to do about it argue with me on the POF forums.I dont have to do anything apparently , there will be a ban I do not need to prove my case.And yet all that you can come up with is an argument to a fellow poster.Trying to make him look the fool in front of all kinds of pitt lovers.Just posting makes me look the fool! Idiot! Go out and save your breed! Protest...try to change legislation...muzzle your dog! Get rid of the image on the dog...cause there has to be something don?
Again do you even want to save the breed? You sound like hard-core smokers (I smoke by the way) when they still argue about not being able to smoke in indoor public places...the time has passed and it will never come again.It is not enough to say dont blame the breed. You have to prove it.Actions speak alot louder then words.The words are being said.But the dogs are still uptown...unmuzzled, growling, intimadating and almost seems like they cant wait to get off the leash to bite you.This is why people are afraid.
And by the way you can throw stats till it hurts your fingers from typing.Actions speak more loudly then words!
Ill be here all week to sign your books, breasts or whatever else you would like my autograph on  | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:12:52 AM |
Any dog is potentially aggressive, both to other dogs and to humans.
Overall bite statistics by breed place bothLabradors and Golden Retrievers in the top five for bite incident frequency.
Most of what your saying....browneyedbrunette is true, I don't know about that temperment test or about a Pittbull's search and rescue abilities. It would seem there are other breeds much better suited for that kind of work.
There are far more Labrador and Golden Retreivers out there than any other breed and yes any breed is capable of biting so it's quite possible your correct.
However, there is a big difference between lets say a Retreiver attack and a Pittbull.
Read my post on the previous page about total numbers of dogs per breed and deaths resulting from dog attacks per breed. Pittbulls are at the top of that list, Retreivers near the bottom. The likelyhood of serious injury from a Pittbull attack are also much more likely
as it is much harder to get a Pittbull to stop an attack and they are quiker to anger than most other breeds. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:13:28 AM | It's not just pit bulls, i believe it's also bull mastives and rotweiller's (excuse the spelling if I got it wrong).
The only problem I can see with these 3 breeds is the fact that they have EXTREMELY strong jaws and they lock on and its very hard to get them off. They also appear to me to be quite a bit on the agressive side compared to some other breeds.
So why can't the owners just muzzle them (preferable with a strong steel cage)???
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:29:04 AM |
By the way, I am the very proud companion of the bulliest of the bullies. Over 500 lbs. of two, unaltered male Mastiffs. I suppose that makes me someone that needs the image of a killer dog.
Are you sure about that, A Dog wieghing over 250lbs should just about be able to make into the Guiness book of world records. A friend of my brother's had a male Bull Mastiff who was a Canadian grand champion....he wieghed 178lbs.
Does anybody know how big a Pittbull can get ?
Another thing ...Lnstarkiss are you able to controll your dogs in any situation, a small lady like yourself with 2 huge unaltered male dogs ? I also had very large dog but I could physically control him at any time .....and He knew it. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:30:15 AM | | ther are very few bad dogs just a lot of bad owners a muzzle law would protect us you never heard of these dogs before before the crackheads started breeding to exploit all thier bad traits and you have to ask why would society let someone who prob isnt responsible enough to have thier own children be allowed to walk around with a potentially loaded weapon?oh and just for the record i dont care for them but thats just my preference i just cant see penalizing responsible people for the acts of others | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:34:23 AM | Where should I start.. hhmm.. Lets start with I own 2 large dogs.. One is a pitbull/black lab and the other is a boxer/rottie.. Both dogs went thru puppy school, then 2 full classes of training .. any dog ( I think ) should go thru socializing and obedience training.. especially big dogs... If you are goin to own one and you are in control of one, train it.. thats where the problem starts.. My dogs are my kids.. We have been attacked numerous times on walks.. the dogs were a rottie, jack russell, german sheppard, beagle, and a collie.. I was bit 18 times by the beagle.. I had to kick the rottie in the head to get him off of the dogs and I .. is that right ? If the ban is goin to put in place dont you think it should be all dogs ? Doesnt any dog have the potential to bite ? ( yes including mine ) pitbulls arent on the top 5 biting list.. Do we only hear of them becuz they're bite is bigger then others ?
The ban.. do I agree with it ? sure.. cuz I know they're are alot of younger guys n girls gettin the big bad dog to look kewl.. they dont train them.. they fight them down at the park.. It makes me sick and its those dogs who are givin my lick monsters the bad name...
SO what does it come down to ? Muzzle all dogs so I can walk in peace.. so I dont have to worry about some other dog comin after my trained and obedient dogs... And how about a leash ? another gripe I have but I wont get into that one..
Should pitbulls have to suffer becuz of stupid owners ? | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:37:59 AM | Seeking_stellar...
AHMEN to that !!! | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:41:08 AM | | Does anybody know how big a Pittbull can get ? Well there is whats called a throw back where some pitbulls have been very tall and some have ben up to 130lbs. Its rare to see them but amazen at the same time. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:45:41 AM | "Are you sure about that, A Dog weighing over 250lbs should just about be able to make into the Guiness book of world records. A friend of my brother's had a male Bull Mastiff who was a Canadian grand champion....he wieghed 178lbs."
I saw a guy on tv that weighed well over 1000# I know that he would not be a grand champion human but he was big. | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/14/2006 7:58:11 AM | | I have a question. If a pitbull must be muzzled in public how would it posibly defend itself or its owner against an attack from another dog. Please don't even tell me that it is unlikely to be attacked by another dog because I have walked dogs and I know better. Most dog attacks are not when the owner takes them off there premises anyway. Usually they are on their own turf. If they are not it is usually because they escaped their kennel, house or chain in which case they would not be muzzled. | |
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