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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/19/2006 9:59:41 AM | | The way I teach them not to jump takes less time and involves no contact what so ever. You see them come up you take a step back out of reach and tell them "No! Off!" (Down means to lay down) The contact (any contact) is reward to a dog jumping. Its hard for the owners to teach it if the dog is only jumping on visitors so this kind of thing works especially well if the owner is vigilant and a visitor is willing to help out. The dog gets no physical contact unless his four feet are planted on the ground. I had one "confirmed jumper" retrained with in a week. I saw her TWICE for an hour total in that week, the owner did the rest. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/19/2006 10:32:04 AM | I have been raising and breeding pitbulls since I was 9, I am 30 years old now,
Pitbulls aren't for everyone, they are high strung hyper dogs with strong fighting instincts, (depending on how it was bred) there are some that are missing that instinct ( which I would never own ) but they are also beautiful, smart strong and loyal dogs. All dogs or any animal for that matter is capable of biting someone, I have been bit by several breeds of dogs from toy sized dogs all the way to very large dogs, even been bit and scratched by ferrets, fish cats and birds.
The problem is not the dog, but the owners, If you teach the dog to fight and be mean then that is what he is going to do, If you make the dog playful then that is what he going to be. If you take any dog and stick it on a chain and never train it, It will be a stupid dog, that as soon as it gets off of the leash it runs wild. If the dog has never been socialized how do you expect it to know how to act around people.
My male and female pitbull or just as big and bigger than my kids, and I have no problem or fear leaving either one around my baby unattended, but I wouldn't leave my female dog unattended around another dog, because I know she don't get along well with other dogs she don't know, However I will leave my Male dog around other dogs because I know his personality is laid back, and he is not really that interested in other dogs,
The reason I know this because I am a responsible owner, who knows both of his dogs personalities very well, and have taken the time to train them.
Most people who want bands on pitbulls are owners of mixed breed mutts, or owner of toy breed dogs, which can't protect the family from anything. | |
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allh2h
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Joined: 3/23/2006
Msg: 378 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/19/2006 11:32:11 PM | My heidi, the kneeing does absolutely NOT work. My step dad did that and all it did was make her mean to him. I have found that ANY type of harmful contact with her is not good, aside from the fact that I DO NOT abide it to any of my animals or kids.
With me she knows Off- and has grapsed that if she wants something that her azz has to be planted firmly on the ground with her front paws too. She has been ill of late and I have been a bit lax with some things due to having to tend to her but in the last 24 hours she has improved dramatically (thank goodness-she has had me sooo worried) and her sassiness is coming through a bit much with me. Today she got put in place before we left and she did not appreciate that, but before that door got opened her azz was firmly planted on the floor-so good doggie there.
And to the post of the person who hates being jumped on. I agree with you totally, sometimes it is cute (if you know the dog and give the command to tell them too, liek heidi has a command with me where she is allowed but that is the only time she allowed with me. I have never been able to get neighbors or friends to cooperate in hleping me with that with strangers) and if she were not literally a "moose" of wieght where her hyperness would mow you down (because she is not going to harm you at all, she just sounds 10' Tall and Bullet proof and with her head and the look of a pitt, that stereotype, it freaks people out) WHere you get hurt is the fact that she does mow you down and concrete hurts on your backside lol and her wieght being compounded in such a small body-that is one little cannon ball to come at you on impact. Most people do nto mind but I do because I do not want her doing that, i think it is rude and do not want other people;s dog to do it to me. Plus she really not a dog to be feared but she has that "look" and sounds ferocious and protects her "home" (by barking and letting me know someone is there, if you do approach she will back yuo off some but only to the end of her leash, which goes to the end of my patio, that is if you try to come in instead of holloring for me or going to the front door) when people get close so...if you have doggie smarts even though you are not an owner you can avoid the pitfalls that some fall into. Like no matter how cute the dog is do not approach it without permission of its owner even if tail is wagging. It could be happiness but that could mean other things. Never pet a dog without permission (i think it is just rude to do otherwise, that dog could be a service animal and most service animals are "busy" when in public so most owners do not want them distracted-me being one of them) plus that aliviates the possibilites of there being an incident, and if an owner says no, don't get offensive or take it personal. That dog is not there for your personal pleasure, I had a woman get irrate with me because I told her that her daughter could not pet my dog (I was having a bad time with my epilepsy and had her in work with me getting some paperwork, heidi is a social dog but when I am upset or not doign good she is on the spot with me) This woman started getting in my face about it, yelling at me flalling her arms about. I asked her to please leave me alone, already having a bad day and she just kept at it. The one thing you have to keep in mind the best guard dog is a dog that is not trained to be a guard dog-heidi and maxi are not trained to be guard dogs. It is a dog that is one of the family, they will protect there pack when threatened. And this woman was a threat to my well being and physically as far heidi was concerned (when she was yelling and got an inch from me) especially with me already being in a bad state to begin with, so that just added to the situation so little heidi (which she only stands about 16 inches tall maybe) was up in this womans face in one leap, never touching her but with that bark, growl, and those jawz of herz... Scared the hell out of the woman then she got mad and called the cops and said that my dog attacked her. Heidi never touched her just "got in her face" to back her off from me. Thank goodness I was at work...cameras got it all on tape and everybody at work knows heidi is not a dog to attack unless provoked so they all vouched for me. The people that I worked with that were not dog lovers loved her, she is just that lovable and sweet. But ya, that was a mess, all because of anothers stupidity. In any other situation I would not have minded and usually do not. Most of the people in my local stores always ask how she is when I do not bring her in with me because she is a great dog. I jsut prefer that you ask because not all people understand that you should let a dog sniff you first, because a dog that senses that they do not like you will growl to tell you to go away and those that do not listen will then get bit if the owner is nto there. Not the dogs fault, the dog was telling you to go away, you were just not listening.
Like with mine, she is cute and everybody wanted to play with her until she got her adult bark...she didn't sound like a bulldozer (or have the build of one either) then but now she does so it tends to back people off some. Which I do nto mind. I live around some loonies so that keeps them at a distance plus when I have my son outside playing she is not far from him so I never have to worry about anybody approaching him. Plus with his Maxi, who is a dobe, german shepard husky mix and he is twice the size of Heidi and with the rep that dobes have (he looks all dobe except for his tale...it looks like someone curled it with a curling iron) people tend to stay away from my apartment and my son. Which nowadays with all the wierdos I have no objections, if I know you then I introduce you to them and if they like you then you are welcome but if not, well...to bad. And when we are outside playing I have the field to our left to myself...lol that makes it nice hahaha but they are so lovable, they are just furry little babies that you have to train differently. After learning with Heidi how to train and what not to do training maxi has been a breeze, although he still does not know what sit is. He knows down (where nose to tail is on floor) and off and go and stop and no and a few others but sit he just looks at me like "Huh?" wehre with heidi it is the down command we have issues with and sit she has down great. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 12:51:47 PM |
My heidi, the kneeing does absolutely NOT work. My step dad did that and all it did was make her mean to him. I have found that ANY type of harmful contact with her is not good, aside from the fact that I DO NOT abide it to any of my animals or kids.
Thats prob cause he did it to hard & didn't give the command to sit.. if you just knee the dog hard, then ya, its gonna tick off the dog duh
I trained a dobbie, 2 guard Rotties, my lab + rottie + pit mix, a Collie mix, an English Springer, a black lab, Walker Hound, pit bull (the one that bit me by accident) & some kind of mutt... I taught them all the sit command, then when they jumped up I lifted my knee & commanded them to sit.. It only takes a week to train the dog, if done daily...
The lab was the harded to train as she was a bitter.. I ended up muzzling her & then trained her.. she turned for a nasty dog (ok she wasn't mean her stupid old owners played with her mouth as a pup so she thought bitting was a form of play.. most of the dogs I worked with were shelter dogs.. I trained them for free to help them find homes faster).. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 1:12:14 PM | | Pit bulls are beautiful, loyal and sweet, as long as they are trained properly and socialized. BSL is B.S. It is the bad owners that need to be banned. A dog does what it is taught. If you teach your dog manners and treat your dog properly it will become a good canine citizen. I own a pit bull and have taken him to several dog obedience classes. The instructor wanted my dog to become a therapy dog. I also own 3 cats, one of which follows the pit around and constantly rubs on him while purring loudly. I have caught them on several occassions curled up in a chair sleeping together. | |
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lira
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Joined: 6/8/2006
Msg: 381 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 6:36:57 PM | I think banning pitbulls and other agressive dogs is a good idea. I am an animal lover but I think pittbulls can attack for no reason as I know it happened to our neighbors teenage daughter when her own pittbull attacked her. This was a buautiful 15 year old, with a pretty figure whos legs were left very scarred because of this. And I dont mean just a little scare.
Lira | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 6:57:20 PM | | But the fact is you have (and many others) have been bitten by different types of dogs and lived. You may not have had the same lucky outcome had you been bitten even once by a pitt bull. Every one makes a good point by saying that it is more likely the owner of the dog that caused it to be dangerous and not so much the dog itself. And, like a few people have posted here I think muzzling is an excellent solution. Personally I had never been around a pitt bull untill recently when a co-worker brought his to work. A beautifull dog. It played with a female german shepard and a mini pinscher. Both the other dogs were totally and completely safe. The pitbull (named julie) was a creampuff. They had a great time together. But, I think muzzling and perhaps training should be requirments to own a pitt bull. Not a total ban. Just my opinion. | |
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allh2h
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Joined: 3/23/2006
Msg: 383 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 7:23:36 PM |
Thats prob cause he did it to hard & didn't give the command to sit.. if you just knee the dog hard, then ya, its gonna tick off the dog duh
Pissed Momma off too...through him out and told him not to come around for long time...made me mad. Wanted to do that to him. Ever since I use the off and I ignore her and push her away. The tone of my off in a hurt or irrate way gets the point across quite nicely with me and kaleb (my son) strangers though... that is why the leash and I have to get it through THERE head to NOT pet her or pay attention to her until her azz is planted on the ground. My new landlady is a dog person so she understands, plus she had to be introduced so fi she ever has to come in while I am not here Heidi will not go ape while in her crate and try and get out. The dog can bend steel with her head and snout-that just blew me away! She ate part of her first crate...we are on number 3 currently. Only the door is kinda in a U shape. | |
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chinua
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Joined: 9/30/2005
Msg: 384 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 7:37:42 PM | | allh2h.........that women who freaked on you is an idiot!! I've been taught since I was little.......never run up to a dog..........only pet it if the owner is there(if its a dog you don't know) and they say its ok........and let them sniff your hand palm up.....i guess some people were never taught that; it sounds like that woman thinks dogs are there for everybody's entertainment. | |
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allh2h
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Joined: 3/23/2006
Msg: 385 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 6/20/2006 8:03:41 PM | Oh ya Chinua...that she is. When I was first getting Heidi used to being in stores I kept her in a cart on a short leash and did not let people pet her because so many people and teh noise scared the hell out of her, not to mention her still being a pup she would piddle when upset. One woman wanted to pet her and approached the cart. I politely said no and told heidi to sit as heidi was going to greet her, she announced loudly that "there was a vicious dog in that cart and to stay away" my mom was soooo pissed and went off on her. Granted my mom has not been the best to heidi and for that reason is not allowed around heidi unattended but my mom just adores her (when she got sick this past week and I had to take her to the er my parents handed me a blank signed check then when they knew I could not drive because of how upset I was they took us and waited for 4 hours while we found out what was up with her most likely) and knows how much she means to me. She got in that womans face and set her straight. I thought they were going to through both my mom and that woman out of the store, security was called.
it sounds like that woman thinks dogs are there for everybody's entertainment.
Alot of people think that, that are not pet owners and I think it is just wrong. I will pet a dog in public if I have the owners attention. I will shower it with total and complete attention :) if they are ok with it. But only if they are ok iwth it. I am an animal lover and when I worked petting animals and playing with the babies that came in to work was the only way I made it through my days to get back home to my babies. My regular customers started bringing there dogs in with them and coming through my line (I was a cashier) and letting me play with them. I would have this big long line and nobody would go to other lines...it was funny and a compliment to me in general. I miss it. This one kid had this shy puppy that a lot of my co-workers would try to play with and it would hunker down and whine and snarl (the I am afraid of you, get away from me, I do not want to bite you but I will if you do not leave me alone stance) and it jumped out of the cart to get away from one lady (stupid people) and went and hid by me. I just bent down the owner said no let me get him and by then the pup was trying to crawl up inside my pant leg. I let the owner get him and after that the pup and I would play every time time they came in the store. After that is when I became the resident co-worker to ask on how to deal with a dog when they had issues with there dogs. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/3/2006 3:47:47 PM | I have two problems with muzzling my dogs. First, most people who see a dog wearing a muzzle assume he is wearing it because he wants to attack everyone and everything in sight.
I have muzzles for my dogs, and when I put them on, the dogs actually look meaner. You'd think they were off to rob a bank. I feel the people behind the breed bans know this, and it plays right into their hands.
Second, and I'm pretty sure any owner of a "pitbull-type dog" will agree, because of their large heads, any muzzle that will fit is not manufactured for a short-snouted dog. The muzzle has to be removed so they can drink. It is also a problem in the winter. I've had to stop, remove my dogs' muzzles, and clean the snow off them, just so the dogs can breathe. They stop to sniff something, the next thing you know, the muzzle is full of snow.
Incidentally, I DO allow my dogs to sniff and explore a bit on walks, to the end of their leashes. The idea is that, if by some chance they ever DO get out of the yard, the neighbourhood will not be totally strange to them, and they might have a better chance of finding their way home.
I am also quite sure the politicians who pass breed bans are also well aware that the muzzle could be considered inhumane under certain circumstances, but count on people who realize that removing them, thus leaving themselves open to police harassment and fines. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/3/2006 4:15:49 PM | ^^ I tend to think the muzzle is more for the peace of mind for those who are afraid.. Regardless of if there is any logic behind it . I'm not saying I agree or disagree with you .
That's why I live in the country . I don't have to worry about all that crap . I run free with my dogs...... | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/4/2006 11:48:46 AM | I had to take Cyrus' Muzzle off lastnight. I thought the poor thing was gonna passout! He was walking to slow & trying to hard to pant properly, but the stupid Muzzle got in the way!
Now that I have a little exp. walking a dog with a muzzle (he doesn't need it, stupid laws) its horrible!!!!
Also every other Pitty I see, isn't wearing am uzzle & they are mean as hell!!!! Last night we walked by this American Pit Bull Terrier & he really wanted to attack Cyrus!! Cyrus just looked at him & was such a good boy, he didn't say a peep & kept walking with me.
Anyone with muzzle exp know if the wire muzzle allows for better panting? Will their tongues & lips get stuck to it during the winter? My landlady keeps having to buy Cyrus a new Muzzle every month or ever other week.. Its getting stupid! Cyrus goes to the dogpark & always plays with the other dogs.. it only takes a quick second for another dog to rip the muzzle or break the clip  I'm wondering if the wire muzzle is stronger that it can withstand dog on dog play? | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/4/2006 7:26:46 PM | ^^^^^ When you walk him, keep him close to you. Use a short leash, and a muzzle with a quick-release clip at the back of his head. If your dog is muzzled, and no one else's is, sooner or later you're going to have to get it off him, fast, just so he can defend himself.
I'm thinking the wire muzzles would be a problem in cold weather, it wouldn't be much different than a kid licking a wire fence.
In hot weather, walk him slowly, stop often, bring a bottle of water. If he can't pant, he can't cool himself, except for the bottoms of their feet, dogs have no sweat glands. This means he'll need to drink a lot of water.
Walk him at night if possible, it's cooler and there's less chance of meeting other dogs or dog-hating pinheads. | |
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lira
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Joined: 6/8/2006
Msg: 390 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/5/2006 5:57:53 AM | | I am a dog lover(not for aggressive type dogs).My favorite is a german shepard, but thats not the topic, I know so I will move on. Take the dog on more frequant walks, but shorter walks.Keep the muzzle on.As far as other dogs not having a muzzle, yes, that can be a problem for a muzzled dog to defend itself.So laws should be made that require all dogs to be muzzled, when taking a walk.I know people love their pittbulls,as I love german sheaperds,but in order to keep people and other pets safe from pittbulls,they need to be muzzled, and to keep the muzzled dog safe, my german shepard must be muzzled. Even a gentle dog may attack another dogs for different reasons.I really dont have a german shepard, I was using it as an example, but I have 2 cats,and a bittbulls owner loves their dog as I love my cats.I wouldnt want to kill my cats because some people dont like cats. | |
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lira
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Joined: 6/8/2006
Msg: 391 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/5/2006 6:02:35 AM | | I know its uncomfortable for the dog to have to wear a muzzle at first, like a teen getting braces,mine hurt at first, then later, no pain. Start as puppies and they will grow up with it and no discomfort.I hope I made sense on that one. | |
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allh2h
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Joined: 3/23/2006
Msg: 392 | |
| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/5/2006 1:47:10 PM | | ^^^^Yes...she is one of the ones not breaking that law....she is worried about the others that are. Hence laws cannot fix stupidity. The leash law in my town is soemthing that very few in town follow. Due to it, I take a stick and my squirt bottle with 1/2 water 1/2 vinegar in it. It will not stop a big dog from attacking but it sure stops those dam ankle bitters in there tracks. Which is most of what we have in my neighborhood with the exception of my two. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/5/2006 2:48:41 PM | | guns don't kill people and just like the gun isn't responsble neither is the dog. It does not matter if it is a pitt-bull or a chichua it is the owners fault. I have owner pitts so sweet they would lick you to death. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/6/2006 7:32:23 AM | ^^^ thats the only fear I have of Cyrus.. the darn thing over powers me & licks me to death.. I can hardly breath as I'm giggling so hard & hes licking my face really fast..
Rule #1 when a pitty is licking you to death & you cannot breath, DO NOT open your mouth to breath!  Air + Pitty tongue does NOT mix
^^^^^ When you walk him, keep him close to you. Use a short leash, and a muzzle with a quick-release clip at the back of his head. If your dog is muzzled, and no one else's is, sooner or later you're going to have to get it off him, fast, just so he can defend himself.
I'm thinking the wire muzzles would be a problem in cold weather, it wouldn't be much different than a kid licking a wire fence.
In hot weather, walk him slowly, stop often, bring a bottle of water. If he can't pant, he can't cool himself, except for the bottoms of their feet, dogs have no sweat glands. This means he'll need to drink a lot of water.
Walk him at night if possible, it's cooler and there's less chance of meeting other dogs or dog-hating pinheads.
I always walk Cyrus right beside me, unless I'm letting him take a quick sniff or potty (I'm strict on walks (no walking on peoples front lawns, there are park/own lawns to potty on). I only take Cyrus for walks after 11pm, as thats the only time I'm free to walk him..his owner takes him to the dog park during the day time & they have a pond he swims in, so heat isn't an issue there. Cyrus wont drink from a bottle, i tried.. he just stands there, so I usually force it into his mouth, but he spits it out.. darn beast! Maybe I'll make an A/C coat for him lol.. fill it with ice packs hahaha
Cyrus has already been attacked by 2 Dobbies.. the first one wanted to kill him & drew blood & the 2ed was muzzled as the owner knew it couldn't be trusted, but was working with the dog... I think his muzzle is a quick release, its just a little clip that holds it on.. its also soooo easy to break.. but my fear is, what if i don't see the other attacking dog & I fall over & drop the leash, then I have to try to not only catch up to the dogs, but get to the clip (I would just pull on the muzzle to break it, as it would be faster)... But then how the heck do I stop the attacking dog & stop Cyrus!! If its smaller then a Rottie then i can take it on & stop it, but I cannot over power a pitty as they are just too strong & fast. I can easly kill any dog that I pin, so if there is no owner, I will kill it.
I started to carry my knife once I realized that no one (mostly those stupid gang kids!!!) is following the muzzling laws & these pitties are NOT friendly.. also ran into a mean Rottie, but the owner knew his dog was bad, so he walked off the path & made his dog site & kept it under control (as in not getting away or pulling like mad, it was just snarling & snapping up a storm)..
& like the gun laws, the laws are only here to punish the good & allow the bad to continue on with their law breaking lives.. You think the government would have learned that if the gun laws don't work casue criminals don't follow the laws, then the pit bull laws aren't gonna work, cause criminals aren't gonna follow the laws anyways *GRRRR* | |
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allh2h
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Joined: 3/23/2006
Msg: 395 | |
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| pit bull dog ban
Posted: 7/7/2006 8:26:03 PM | The ban exists in Ontario ... I am thankful it is being grand-fathered in (my guy is an American Staffordshire Bull Terrier). It makes things easier ... I don't mind walking him with a muzzle either; and my backyard has a fence. This is great for those who fear doggies like him, or believe they can be harmful.
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 9/6/2006 6:40:45 AM | I agree with u 100% it is not the dogs but the owners. I breed and raised pitbulls about 12 years ago for a long time. I breed and sold them for gaurd dogs and personnel protection. In doing so u do not socailze the dog to alot of people so they would tend to get real protective. I had 6 pit bulls one was a house dog but I raised her right gave her alot of attention and discipline. People would freak out when they would come over and my little girl who was 3 at the time would be trying to ride the dog pulling her ears and tail and the dog would just play I was never worried she would go into the other ones kennels and pet and play with them. However they are naturally aggressive dogs so they are not for everyone. You HAVE to spend time with them and disicipline them and teach them.
I only have one now but I know her and her personallity she is a one person dog because that is all she has been raised around but If i introduce someone to her it takes a couple of times then she is fine once she relizes the person is not a threat. Dogs can sense things abouy people. She is the one in the pic with me. She is so loving I cant believe it sometimes.
But just my thoughts and opinins its all about how you raise anything kids, dogs anything you have to give them love, discipline, and TIME> u cant just throw a dog on a chain and expect it to know how to act.
Each to his own.
robert | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 9/6/2006 11:03:35 AM | There is a new dog to our neighborhood who is radical - he cannot be told "no" or "down" - he charges my boyfriend and I - the boyfriend is a tall, well built guy. He charges us from the middle of Our driveway or from the side of Our house.
The dog is huge, stocky and obviously has some pit in him - the head.
I know he will eventually catch one of our cats and kill it - then he'll be onto a good game for his enjoyment.
I just don't like the fact that he doesn't know His yard from mine, front or back. He wants to control the entire neighborhood.
He'll end up getting shot by one of the neighbors and if he attacks me or my boyfriend - he'll get shot by one of us.
I realize it's not the dog's fault that he is aggressive. But it's not going to be my fault for putting him out of his obviously misurable life. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 9/6/2006 2:04:57 PM | Ashley, what you describe is highly unusual behavior for a pit. About the only breed of dog I know that will treat any territory as his own, is the Chow.
Are you certain the charge is aggressive? You say he cannot be told "down". This implies to me that he has caught up with you or your bf and jumped on you. Since you are still around to tell about it, I am guessing that this might be an overly friendly, poorly trained dog who has no intention of harming you. Correct me if I am wrong, I'm just speculating here.
Any dog can be a danger to cats if not properly trained. Conversely, any dog can be taught to leave cats alone. My dog knows the command "Leave the kitty alone".
PS, if his owners let him run loose, call animal control before you take the law into your own hands. That is what they are for. | |
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| Re: pit bull dog ban
Posted: 9/6/2006 3:48:11 PM | unfortunately there isn't an animal control in the country. My country house is 8 miles outside the city limits and it's a very small town.
And no, he hasn't jumped on us. Down is a command most people use with a hand motion - so I use it with dogs I don't know.
He barres his teeth and puts his head lower and advances. We retreat. Some day he won't let us.
He's definitely not a chow. He's like a standard size boxer or larger dog and stocky with muscular shoulders. Clean short hairs like the pit. Brown. He has the bald head look and face of a Pit. | |
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