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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 1:25:42 PM | Miss Eyre --
"Grooms, on the average, were much older than their brides. Noble women sometimes didn't marry until the age of 24, but this was rare. More than 3/4 were married before they reached 19. By today's standards, western Europe was inhabited by the young, with more than half of the population under 20 years of age."
http://www.medieval-weddings.net/
"In Ancient Rome, people didn't marry because they were in love. Folks married to carry on the family bloodline and for economical or political reasons. Women were under the jurisdiction of their fathers, so young girls were often married off when they were between the ages of twelve and fourteen. Some young men married at the age of fourteen also.
During the Middle Ages, the practice of youthful marriages continued and women married as early as fourteen. Men generally waited until they were more established in life which was usually when they were in their twenties or early thirties. In 1371, due to the plague, the average age at marriage for men was 24, and for women it was 16. By 1427, the average male of all classes did not wed til he was in his mid-30's, usually choosing a bride about half his age."
http://marriage.about.com/cs/teenmarriage/a/teenmarriage.htm
Now, what were you saying? | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 1:30:58 PM | vixenette -
"What would you do if you had a sister or a daughter who was 16 or 17 and a man in his 30's was having sex with her? I don't think you'd like it very much."
I would have no objections whatsoever.
We have extended adolescence way beyond its natural or historical limits. Because of the pressure to get a college education, many do not get out of school until well into their 20s. Grad school? Then until you're 30 or even later for medical school. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 1:39:57 PM | Yes, Adrian,.. and in Victorian England, young children were used by chimney sweeps to climb up chimneys to clean them,.. this led to the deaths of many 7 to 11 year old boys.. Just because something happened in the past, doesnt make it right. In some places in the developing world, a girl who has a period is thought of as marriageable age.. if she is only nine years old, she would still be thought of as mature,.. in parts of the Indian Subcontinent and parts of Africa, child marriages are still practised,.. it happens in this day and age, but it doesnt mean that its right.
I cant imagine many people agreeing that marrying off children at 14 years of age was ever a good idea,.. looking back in hindsight,.. we now understand the terrible emotional damage such abuse does.
You obviously have no feeling of protectiveness towards younger people Adrian Esquire. If you could envision a sister or daughter of yours being used for sex by a 3o something year old man,.. and have no objections to that,.. then I can think of nothing more to say to you. Miss Eyre. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 1:42:42 PM | Miss Eyre -- "I cant imagine many people agreeing that marrying off children at 14 years of age was ever a good idea,.. looking back in hindsight,.. we now understand the terrible emotional damage such abuse does."
Well, when you lived until 35 if you were lucky, how is that abuse? This statement of yours is so incredibly naive I have no response that I can put into writing. You simply have no notion whatsoever of the historical development of marriage. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 1:53:06 PM | Adrian esquire,.. You're being ridiculous man,.. What has the age expectancy and marriage laws of Medieval times to do with our society now? We do not have to force young girls into marriages of convenience for social or economic reasons now,.. I dont care if a man or a womans instincts tell them that they want to 'have' some nubile young thing,.. we are more than animals,.. or at least some of us are trying to be.
When you can look at people as more than bodies, and commodities,.. then you will understand that your puerile baiting of me is making you come across as a very dubious individiual. I do not separate the argument from the person, Adrian Esquire,.. if you are trying to play Devils Advocate with arguments such as the ones you've just espoused, then you are on thin ice indeed.
I am not from the Neolithic period,..I should hope you are'nt either,... have your wiring redjusted, and catch up with the modern world Adrian. Miss Eyre. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 2:00:59 PM | Lets get ready to rumble this is such a good post. And the best thing about it is that most people are acting like adults and respecting each others opinions......(Sarcastic). Come on not every man in this God awful world is out to manipulate women. Some are hell I'd say most are. But it just as equal as women wanting to manipulate guys. Using there beauty to get what they want wither its flirting with a guy at work so you can just sit there while he does all the work or being just a simple golddigger who don't give a Damn about the man they are with just want there money.
Attention  Attention
There are bad people of both genders. GASP!!!!! | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 2:53:22 PM |
have your wiring redjusted, and catch up with the modern world
OK, let's talk about today's society in real terms.
Almost all governments acknowledge the age of consent is 18 or younger.
The average age for first sexual contact involving intercourse is as follows:
United States- 16.9 years
Great Britain- 16.6 years
Canada- 17.0 years
Ireland- 17.3 years
Germany- 15.9 years
Iceland- 15.6 years
So unless statutory rape is being completely covered up and ocurring at incredible rates, Miss Eyre's desire that a person's initial sexual experience occur with someone their own age is already happening. Most young women are not being snatched up and deflowered by manipulating older male predators who use them and leave them.
By the time the average woman is 21 she has already had almost 3 sexual partners (2.8).
It appears that according to the law and to most of the world that women of this age are perfectly capable of making decisions for themselves and Miss Eyre, there fore you unfortunately are in the Moral Minority. Basically, our societies have decided it's OK for these women to choose to sleep with an older man or anyone else if they choose and conversely it's OK for an older man to pursue said women.
So...
then you will understand that your puerile baiting of me is making you come across as a very dubious individiual. Not really.
I do not separate the argument from the person, Adrian Esquire,.. if you are trying to play Devils Advocate with arguments such as the ones you've just espoused, then you are on thin ice indeed. Adrian, it appears you have been judged by the Holy God Miss Eyre and found wanting! Take notice that you're on thin ice.
...in the immortal words of James Hetfield: Holier-than-thou.... you are!
And before you cast another stone from your glass house, please know that if my 18 or 19-year old daughter or sister was having sex with a 30-year old man, you bet I'd be pissed and telling her what a mistake she was making. But if her parents had not raised her to make better decisions by that age, then there's no way anything said or done at that point would probably stop her. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 3:06:08 PM | I totally get what your saying textodd11. Being adults they make there own decision's no one make it for them. I know in a parents eyes it doesn't matter if the son/daughter is 2 or 60 there always going to be there "baby." As long as the boy/girl is a legal age no matter where they are then it is ok. Is it morally wrong yes but its wrong for both genders not double standards like most have implied. So just because one girl/guy may not be mature enough to make a "sound" decision, but how do we become mature? By making mistakes and learning and growing from them. If you don't learn and grown then there could be a problem.
I look at it this way as long as there are women wanting younger men and saying theres nothing wrong with it and her girlfriends are saying "go for it" then I will try for younger women. But like I said before age is a number its how you feel and how you act on what age group you portray. If the person is underage then it is very wrong. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 3:10:24 PM | textodd,.. I cant recall implying that the 'majority' of young women were being preyed upon by older men,.. my concern is for the ones who are. Maybe they are in a minority,.. but being in a 'moral minority' myself,.. I can care about minorities too. Being the odd one out in a crowd is not unusual for me,.. so being the moral minority on this thread is not bothering me in the least.
It surprises me that some men will go to such lengths to defend their right to go after a young woman.
if its so important to some men to be able to have young girls of lets say, eighteen, or nineteen, or even twenty,.. well, i can only say that this tells me a lot about that particular man. I've just about given up the will to live after being hit with such nonsensical stats from Adrian esquire,.. so I'm going to go Holy Roll over to my throne of righteousness,.. and show my husband GOD a list of names of people on this thread,..lol.
The Holy God(ess) Miss Eyre. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 3:15:17 PM | A little help from Miss Eyre's perspective. Quick facts: I am 25 years old, my parents are 10 years apart. I was a pasters' son, the kind that stays out of trouble, but I'm not very religous. I wouldn't date a 17 year old. I go to college and I can never tell how old a person is by looking at them. Even if I go to a 21+ bar a lot of people have fake id's. To me, some people don't look thier age. There aren't a whole lot of women my age that I know of in this very small town, most of the females in the area are 18-23. I've been told often when I shave I look 16-20 but when I grow out the facial hair I've been told I look 25-30. I don't have a whole lot of experience dating, only had two girlfriends. I moved 16 times which makes me extremely introverted to women I'm interested in until I've hung out with them for 2-3 weeks. I know a lot of people because I'm very active on my campus and am in a fraternity. When it comes to the women I can't seem to go from the friend zone to dating. Questions: What do I do? Is it acceptable in my position to date an 18 year old? | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 5:05:21 PM | Eh I've been lied to by girls that turned out to be 17. They're nuts. I have a rule to never date anyone under 21, so naturally the girls lie up. Its insane, they're immature. They can be very mature in one aspect, but when it comes to relationships, its insane. What I have observed is the 17 year old girls pick fights with their older boyfriends like they pick fights with their parents.
I personally view it as I would be taking advantage. However, the girls that turn out to be 17 want to be taken advantage of. At least the ones that I have dated. I personally get blinded by looks, and lied to. Its been a cycle for the past 3 years.
I do know of many relationships where teen women meet men 10 or 20 years older than them and get married right out of HS. My cousin is one of them. My cousin lied to her 10 year older husband and they've been together for ten years. So it can work out for the best. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 5:25:26 PM | thanks lostintheshuffle for bringing this story up. Girls lie about there age to get with a guy. So your limit is 21 so she must had lied to get with you . OMG a girl that lied to get with a older man what is this world coming to. OMG, gasp!!!!
And a cousin has been married to a 10 years her senior for 10 years, Oh I thought I heard that those relationships never work. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 6:07:15 PM |
It appears that according to the law and to most of the world that women of this age are perfectly capable of making decisions for themselves.
I think it's pretty ironic, when you think about it. So far, the argument against younger women being allowed to choose older men if they want to has pretty much been that they're incapable of making that decision for themselves (they've been manipulated, are too immature, etc). I'd imagine that most of the women who espouse that view would call themselves feminists in that they support equal rights and all that good stuff... well, one of those rights (and the crux of the abortion debate) is the right to choose what you do with your own body.
Unless they'd be fine with someone else trying to dictate who they should or shouldn't be allowed to have sex with, they really shouldn't try and force their opinion on others - especially since no one short of a telepath has any real idea whether or not it's a legitimate relationship or a case of "predatory" men. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 6:27:08 PM | Wonkabar,
With that line of reasoning, you could take it to its ultimate conclusion and say that no one is allowed to have an opinion on anything anyone else does who is legally an adult,.. so lets just shut down these Forums then,.. whats the point if we're not allowed to have opinions on others behaviours?
As you very well know,.. being literal about government laws about the age of consent is just a convenient way of bypassing the grey areas in this debate.
Yes, a girl or boy of sixteen or eighteen, depending where they are from, can legally have sex,.. but as an older adult, do you want to shrug your shoulders and maybe watch a young boy or girl get into a situation that you may feel will be hurtful for them? Will you be content to let them 'make their own mistakes'?
Maybe you will,.. but I think some women and men have more of a protective instinct towards younger people,.. c'mon Wonka bar, which mother, father, brother, or friend is going to stand by and watch a thirty odd year old man try to date their 18 year old daughter, or sister, or friend etc.
Just because the law says an eighteen year old can have sex, and yes, that is their right, doesnt mean that there are'nt or have never been men and women who have taken advantage of gullible or naive younger adults.
If I come across as interfering, so be it,.. but its better than being so stupidly permissive as to let young women make blunders that might affect their whole lives.
Manipulation and predatory behaviours flourish when there is no one else around who is trying to help the younger person understand what is going on. At least I would try to talk a young person out of such a scenario, the decision will be theirs, but some people seem actually happy that these situations arise,.. these would be the people who want to date younger nubile youths. Miss Eyre. | |
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| do men in their 20's and 30's prefer 17 year old girls better than older women?
Posted: 3/7/2008 7:04:34 PM |
With that line of reasoning, you could take it to its ultimate conclusion and say that no one is allowed to have an opinion on anything anyone else does who is legally an adult,.. so lets just shut down these Forums then,.. whats the point if we're not allowed to have opinions on others behaviours?
Reducto ad absurdum, I think they call it. Taking an argument to its most ridiculous conclusion in an attempt to disprove it.
In other words, labelling men who like younger women "pedophiles" and insinuating they'd bang a 'tweener if she was game. Which is why I said in my last post that this topic was "loaded" from the start.
No, I wouldn't just stand by and "watch" if someone I knew or cared about was making a potentially life-altering/threatening mistake. I'd express concern, I'd ask them about it, and do my best to make sure they were okay, and knew what they were getting into... but I would not make the decision for them, especially if they were an adult.
Otherwise, what's the cutoff? You'd feel compelled to 'protect' an eighteen year old, how about nineteen? Twenty? Twenty one? Twenty two? What arbitrary number am I allowed to stop at? They're all adults, and different people mature at different times in their lives. My friend, who I mentioned before, was more together at eighteen than a lot of women in their thirties I've met since. I haven't seen her in years, but I wish her well.
And on that note, when I was 21 and originally expressed concern to my (then underage) girlfriend that maybe her parents wouldn't be too keen on us being together, she said, "are you kidding? They're thrilled. You're the best man I've ever brought home."
By all means, show concern and be protective in a healthy, constructive way. But immediate, outright condemnation spurred by the simple difference in numerical ages, smacks of irony as I mentioned above. | |
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Just kidding, really that is just an exaggeration and it makes you sound bitter. I prefer Miss Eyre =)
