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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 2:17:25 PM | I think it is rather humorous. Obama's campaign suffers a public relations problem and people are willing to excuse and say "it's ok, he probably didn't hear those speeches". I don't even know if the usual media outlets have reported much about it.
Any other campaign has any hiccup or possible problem(or GOD forbid, saying he is where his is because of his color), and it is all over the place. The offending party must "fall on thier sword", appease the masses, and resign.
Obama's campaign should be held to no lesser standard. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 2:38:08 PM | | Double post... | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 2:42:09 PM | Well in watching that "Hillary was never called a ...." clip, one thing hit me.
I think I could do a re-write of the same basic concepts that Wright speaks about, in a MLK style, and it would resonate with many people.
Presentation wise, it's not the same, nor anywhere near close.
Here's what I mean, if one looks at MLK's presentation and language as compared to Wrights :
The contemporary tendency in our society is to base our distribution on scarcity, which has vanished, and to compress our abundance into the overfed mouths of the middle and upper classes until they gag with superfluity. If democracy is to have breadth of meaning, it is necessary to adjust this inequity. It is not only moral, but it is also intelligent. We are wasting and degrading human life by clinging to archaic thinking.
The curse of poverty has no justification in our age. It is socially as cruel and blind as the practice of cannibalism at the dawn of civilization, when men ate each other because they had not yet learned to take food from the soil or to consume the abundant animal life around them. The time has come for us to civilize ourselves by the total, direct and immediate abolition of poverty.
Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. "Where Do We Go From Here: Chaos or Community?"
http://www.drmartinlutherkingjr.com/wherewearegoing.htm
Discrimination is a hellhound that gnaws at Negroes in every waking moment of their lives to remind them that the lie of their inferiority is accepted as truth in the society dominating them.
Martin Luther King, Jr., speech, Southern Christian Leadership Conference, Atlanta, Georgia, August 16, 1967
When we ask Negroes to abide by the law, let us also declare that the white man does not abide by law in the ghettos. Day in and day out he violates welfare laws to deprive the poor of their meager allotments; he flagrantly violates building codes andregulations; his police make a mockery of law; he violates laws on equal employment and education and the provisions of civil services. The slums are the handiwork of a vicious system of the white society; Negroes live in them, but they do not makethem, any more than a prisoner makes a prison.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
The bombs in Vietnam explode at home; they destroy the hopes and possibilities for a decent America.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Many of the ugly pages of American history have been obscured and forgotten....America owes a debt of justice which it has only begun to pay. If it loses the will to finish or slackens in its determination, history will recall its crimes and the country that would be great will lack the most indispensable element of greatness--justice.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Somehow this madness must cease. We must stop now. I speak as a child of God and brother to the suffering poor of Vietnam. I speak for those whose land is being laid waste, whose homes are being destroyed, whose culture is being subverted. I speak for the poor in America who are paying the double price of smashed hopes at home and death and corruption in Vietnam. I speak as a citizen of the world, for the world as it stands aghast at the path we have taken. I speak as an American to the leaders of my own nation. The great initiative in this war is ours. The initiative to stop it must be ours.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
A nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift is approaching spiritual death.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
The limitation of riots, moral questions aside, is that they cannot win and their participants know it. Hence, rioting is not revolutionary but reactionary because it invites defeat. It involves an emotional catharsis, but it must be followed by a sense of futility.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time: the need for man to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence. Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Nobel Prize acceptance speech, Stockholm, Sweden, December 11, 1964.
Man was born into barbarism when killing his fellow man was a normal condition of existence. He became endowed with a conscience. And he has now reached the day when violence toward another human being must become as abhorrent as eating another's flesh.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Why We Can't Wait, 1963.
The curse of poverty has no justification in our age. It is socially as cruel and blind as the practice of cannibalism at the dawn of civilization, when men ate each other because they had not yet learned to take food from the soil or to consume the abundant animal life around them. The time has come for us to civilize ourselves by the total, direct and immediate abolition of poverty.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
[I]t is necessary to understand that Black Power is a cry of disappointment. The Black Power slogan did not spring full grown from the head of some philosophical Zeus. It was born from the wounds of despair and disappointment. It is a cry of daily hurt and persistent pain.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Discrimination is a hellhound that gnaws at Negroes in every waking moment of their lives to remind them that the lie of their inferiority is accepted as truth in the society dominating them.
Martin Luther King, Jr., speech, Southern Christian Leadership Conference, Atlanta, Georgia, August 16, 1967.
When we ask Negroes to abide by the law, let us also declare that the white man does not abide by law in the ghettos. Day in and day out he violates welfare laws to deprive the poor of their meager allotments; he flagrantly violates building codes and regulations; his police make a mockery of law; he violates laws on equal employment and education and the provisions of civil services. The slums are the handiwork of a vicious system of the white society; Negroes live in them, but they do not make them, any more than a prisoner makes a prison.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
It may be true that the law cannot make a man love me, but it can keep him from lynching me, and I think that's pretty important.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Wall Street Journal, November 13, 1962.
Success, recognition, and conformity are the bywords of the modern world where everyone seems to crave the anesthetizing security of being identified with the majority.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Strength to Love, 1963.
Like an unchecked cancer, hate corrodes the personality and eats away its vital unity. Hate destroys a man's sense of values and his objectivity. It causes him to describe the beautiful as ugly and the ugly as beautiful, and to confuse the true with the false and the false with the true.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Strength To Love, 1963.
I am aware that there are many who wince at a distinction between property and persons--who hold both sacrosanct. My views are not so rigid. A life is sacred. Property is intended to serve life, and no matter how much we surround it with rights and respect, it has no personal being. It is part of the earth man walks on; it is not man.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
The bombs in Vietnam explode at home; they destroy the hopes and possibilities for a decent America.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
We must combine the toughness of the serpent and the softness of the dove, a tough mind and a tender heart.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Strength to Love, 1963.
The church must be reminded that it is not the master or the servant of the state, but rather the conscience of the state. It must be the guide and the critic of the state, and never its tool. If the church does not recapture its prophetic zeal, it will become an irrelevant social club without moral or spiritual authority.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Strength to Love, 1963.
Power at its best is love implementing the demands of justice. Justice at its best is love correcting everything that stands against love.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
The Negroes of America had taken the President, the press and the pulpit at their word when they spoke in broad terms of freedom and justice. But the absence of brutality and unregenerate evil is not the presence of justice. To stay murder is not the same thing as to ordain brotherhood.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Many of the ugly pages of American history have been obscured and forgotten....America owes a debt of justice which it has only begun to pay. If it loses the will to finish or slackens in its determination, history will recall its crimes and the country that would be great will lack the most indispensable element of greatness--justice.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Man is man because he is free to operate within the framework of his destiny. He is free to deliberate, to make decisions, and to choose between alternatives. He is distinguished from animals by his freedom to do evil or to do good and to walk the high road of beauty or tread the low road of ugly degeneracy.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Measures of Man, 1959.
A good many observers have remarked that if equality could come at once the Negro would not be ready for it. I submit that the white American is even more unprepared.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go From Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Being a Negro in America means trying to smile when you want to cry. It means trying to hold on to physical life amid psychological death. It means the pain of watching your children grow up with clouds of inferiority in their mental skies. It means having your legs cut off, and then being condemned for being a cripple. It means seeing your mother and father spiritually murdered by the slings and arrows of daily exploitation, and then being hated for being an orphan.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
Now , in many of those passages King is not far from Wright in basic context. What differs is a far more polished and different style of expression.
I'm not trying to equate MLK and Wright here, not at all.
I'm just saying that many of the base ideas are expressed in different ways by both.
One in a very polished and well presented way, and the other far less so . | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 4:22:18 PM | | Comparing Dr Wright to Dr King just shows your desperation..is it your contention that 2008 America is equal to the climate of America in the 60's? Have there been no laws enacted to protect the rights of minorities have most barriers based on skin color not been torn down? Dr Wright obviously dislikes white America the whole concept of Black Liberation Theology is based on the presumption of Whites being racist...do you think someone as "intelligent" as Obama was really unaware of his spritual leaders true feelings, wasn't he involved with Obamas campaign as spiritual advisor or some such?.... | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 8:14:40 PM | And yet I don't see anyone stomping their feet and raising their fists and saying what Mr.McCain says and what his spiritual advisor spews is wrong. How very hypocritical. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 9:00:53 PM | Who is Mr. McCain's spiritual mentor/advisor, Violet? I missed this, I guess. I didn't know McCain had one. Endorsements, yes. All of these professional politicians seem to have nefarious endorsements, but who has McCain been mentored and advised by for the last twenty years who comparatively speaking is obviously half nuts, racist, who passionately hates white America? Do grace us with a name, please.
I think you get my point. Receiving an endorsement from a nutcase is definitely not the same as taking counsel from and being best friends with a radical element who hates white Americans. Barack Obama glows less and less brightly as time wears on. By the time the November election comes around, his mask will have slipped enough that only the truly naive and the gullible will still be believers. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 9:26:43 PM | Again, why is the man that said this considered one of the great figures of the civil right movement - and not a "racist" ?
When we ask Negroes to abide by the law, let us also declare that the white man does not abide by law in the ghettos. Day in and day out he violates welfare laws to deprive the poor of their meager allotments; he flagrantly violates building codes and regulations; his police make a mockery of law; he violates laws on equal employment and education and the provisions of civil services. The slums are the handiwork of a vicious system of the white society; Negroes live in them, but they do not make them, any more than a prisoner makes a prison.
Martin Luther King, Jr., The Trumpet of Conscience, 1967.
You are right, it's not 1967 anymore - but that doesn't mean some people aren't still asking some questions.
To me, during Katrina, I saw a side of America in the POF forums that shocked me. I actually left for a while because had I stayed I would have been probably banned for the language I would have used towards some people here.
I heard people saying things like " well, it's their own fault for living there", or " the lazy idiots should have evacuated" .....
And yet when the California fires started burning rich white people's homes , no one said anything even close to that. They weren't at fault for building in areas that regularly catch fire, nor lazy because they stayed with their property and tried to save it.....
When Katrina happened, I just saw people that needed help - badly. Whatever the reason for their being there, no matter what happened, no matter who or what was to blame for them being there - get them assistance .....NOW.
We can talk about it after they are fed, given water, medical care, and shelter. We can talk about it all day, all night, and all week. We can talk about it for the rest of our lives if you want.
But let's get them help first, and worry about all that later.
And for some reason it didn't happen.
It took what, a week to get people aid ?
In America ?
I wasn't alone feeling like that. In the office I work in, in Canada, people were outraged and shocked. Almost every single person I knew was. We'd come to expect the type of reaction we'd seen on 9/11 , everyone dropping race and everything else just rendering aid quickly.
So can I understand why there's still some anger there, from some people ? Can I understand why some people look around at things that happen and ask themselves questions ? Can I understand why people sometimes see the same things in different ways ?
Yeah, I can. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 9:28:27 PM | Who is Mr. McCain's spiritual mentor/advisor, Violet? I missed this, I guess. I didn't know McCain had one. Endorsements, yes. All of these professional politicians seem to have nefarious endorsements, but who has McCain been mentored and advised by for the last twenty years who comparatively speaking is obviously half nuts, racist, who passionately hates white America? Do grace us with a name, please.
I think you get my point. Receiving an endorsement from a nutcase is definitely not the same as taking counsel from and being best friends with a radical element who hates white Americans. Barack Obama glows less and less brightly as time wears on. By the time the November election comes around, his mask will have slipped enough that only the truly naive and the gullible will still be believers.
Oh, I'm sorry. Black Americans aren't allowed to show hate or voice dissent? They're not allowed to voice their dislike of how America is run? How they have been treated? Even though I do not agree with anything Mr.Wright has to say in his hate, he has every right to say, yell it, and shout it as loud as he wants. That's his right. And, you cannot tell me there aren't good ol' boys and woman in our government and in this country who do not make disparaging, racist remarks about blacks or anyone else of any nationality. Heck, you've regaled us with some of your very own about Mr.Obama throughout various threads in this very forum, Southernlass. I dare you to say you haven't and I can go back in several and find many quotes to post here for your viewing pleasure. I do believe him. I do believe his words.
here lets post some names of some oh so wonderful men who have many that listen to them and what they spew on a daily basis about Muslims and other nationalities or backgrounds...
Pat Roberts Tony Perkins Jerry Falwell John Hagee (and these men profess to be Christian. what a joke and an embarrassment to God and those who truly believe his message, one of loving your brother, your neighbor as you would yourself. I see you doing that so wonderfully, too, Southernlass. ) /sarcasm/ I can keep going... | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 9:48:39 PM | Violet, the above is really out there.
I have every right as a citizen of this country to demand and insist upon an examination of a presidential candidate's religious background when that background may or may not be connected to a radical element that we are currently at war with. I have the right to know this information, Violet, whether you approve or not. This does not make me a racist. If you think it does, you are sadly mistaken but I am not going to continue to belabor your erroneous perception of this fact anymore.
I understand you are angry and I know you're upset. Barack Obama and Rev. Wright have the free speech amendment rights and privileges to speak out about anything they want to in this nation. Our wonderful military brought them that right. That right, however, does not mean that either are the appropriate people to move into the White House and begin to run this great nation.
I have some basic concerns in this ongoing debate over who will become the most powerful person in the free world. I want that person to be well tutored, non-racist, caring for all races and interested in the betterment of all equally, very well experienced, with sound judgment, capable of protecting us if it becomes necessary in terms of the military, but not someone who desires or is regularly in favor of war as a first solution. I would prefer this person also have sound morals and be somewhat traditional (religiously speaking) because that is what I personally relate and ascribe to, and it is my right to desire this.
I see Barack Obama as a wonderful idealist who is capable of some of the above, but certainly not all. As I've said countless times before, there are too many questions marks surrounding his judgment and experience. This latest drama with his pastor shows me that his judgment is definitely in question and only affirms my doubts in his ability to lead this nation well. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 10:05:56 PM |
I have every right as a citizen of this country to demand and insist upon an examination of a presidential candidate's religious background when that background may or may not be connected to a radical element that we are currently at war with. I have the right to know this information, Violet, whether you approve or not. This does not make me a racist. If you think it does, you are sadly mistaken but I am not going to continue to belabor your erroneous perception of this fact anymore.
Really out there? And when have I ever said you didn't have the right to question his background? What makes you a racist are the remarks you've strewn about in several of the political threads alluding to Barack's heritage (or lack of, as he has stated MANY times), as well as the color of his skin. I'm not the only person on this forum to make comments on your views on this.
I understand you are angry and I know you're upset. Barack Obama and Rev. Wright have the free speech ammendment rights and privileges to speak out about anything they want to in this nation. Our wonderful military brought them that right. That right, however, does not mean that either are the appropriate people to move into the White House and begin to run this great nation. Please don't begin to tell me how I am or how I feel. You know nothing of the sort.
I have some basic concerns in this ongoing debate over who will become the most powerful person in the free world. I want that person to be well tutored, non-racist, caring for all races and interested in the betterment of all equally, very well experienced, with sound judgment, capable of protecting us if it becomes necessary in terms of the military, but not someone who desires or is regularly in favor of war as a first solution. I would prefer this person also have sound morals and be somewhat traditional (religiously speaking) because that is what I personally relate and ascribe to, and it is my right to desire this. Funny, this describes Mr.Obama quite nicely. Have you seen him ever, ever say anything racist? Have you ever heard him say anything racist? I highly doubt it. He's voice concerns about his growing up in his books. That's it. He's very well educated, he's experienced, has good judgement in his work with our government, and has and IS definitely been about the betterment of this country and all the citizens in it. His morals are above reproach(Can you say this about the others running against him?? ( heck no.) , and he's very traditional, especially his religion. Or perhaps being a Christian isn't traditional anymore?
I see Barack Obama as a wonderful idealist who is capable of some of the above, but certainly not all. As I've said countless times before, there are too many questions marks surrounding his judgment and experience. This latest drama with his pastor shows me that his judgment is definitely in question and only affirms my doubts in his ability to lead this nation well. I'm sorry, but I need you to tell me how free and clear the other running mates are with regards to having sound judgement, being involved in scandal, and the oh so great morals they have. Will you please? | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 10:19:54 PM |
That right, however, does not mean that either are the appropriate people to move into the White House and begin to run this great nation.
Unless I missed a meeting, Wright isn't going to be moving into the White House.
The issue of other politicians, and the company they keep , is relevant to the topic.
n 2005, Haggard was listed by Time magazine as one of the top 25 most influential evangelicals in America. Haggard is a firm supporter of President George W. Bush, and is sometimes credited with rallying evangelicals behind Bush during the 2004 election.Author Jeff Sharlet reported in 2005 that Haggard "talks to… Bush or his advisers every Monday" and stated at that time that "no pastor in America holds more sway over the political direction of evangelicalism." In a June 2005 Wall Street Journal article, "Ted Haggard, the head of the 30-million strong National Association of Evangelicals, joked that the only disagreement between himself and the leader of the Western world is automotive: Mr. Bush drives a Ford pickup, whereas he prefers a Chevy."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard
Does this mean Bush is gay, too ?
Rev. Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church has some pretty interesting connection with the right wing - and no one ever brought that one up.
Jun 21, 2004 | You probably imagine your congressman hard at work in the Capitol debating legislation, making laws -- you know, governing. But your newspaper probably didn't tell you that one night in March, members of Congress hosted a crowning ritual for an ex-convict and multibillionaire who dressed up in maroon robes and declared himself the Second Coming.
On March 23, the Dirksen Senate Office Building was the scene of a coronation ceremony for Rev. Sun Myung Moon, owner of the conservative Washington Times newspaper and UPI wire service, who was given a bejeweled crown by Rep. Danny K. Davis, D-Ill. Afterward, Moon told his bipartisan audience of Washington power players he would save everyone on Earth as he had saved the souls of Hitler and Stalin -- the murderous dictators had been born again through him, he said. In a vision, Moon said the reformed Hitler and Stalin vouched for him, calling him "none other than humanity's Savior, Messiah, Returning Lord and True Parent."
A flier for the event claimed an impressive who's-who of organizers, including Republicans Sen. Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, Rep. Roscoe Bartlett of Maryland and Charlie Black, a top Republican strategist. Democrats were named, too, like Rep. Harold Ford of Tennessee, who, incidentally, claims to have not even heard of the event.
http://dir.salon.com/story/news/feature/2004/06/21/moon/index.html
Members of Congress assisting at the event included Sen. Mark Dayton, Minnesota Democrat, Reps. Roscoe G. Bartlett of Maryland, Christopher B. Cannon of Utah and Curt Weldon of Pennsylvania, all Republicans, and Democratic Reps. Danny K. Davis of Illinois, Harold E Ford Jr. of Tennessee and Sanford D. Bishop Jr. of Georgia."
http://www.politics1.com/blog-0604a.htm#crown2
How come no one said a single word about how strange that story is ? | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 10:47:32 PM | To be honest, I heard some of the Revs. sermon there and thought to myself, "right on!". We have done HORRIBLE THINGS!
The singular thing I take most offense at is: "the atom bombs on Japan SAVED LIVES". What a crock! Japan was negotiating surrender, we were bombing Tokyo at will ....we incinerated CIVILIANS to show the world we had the most powerful bombs in the world and would use them....to establish ourselves as the superpower emerging from WWII.
The myth we propagate is: atom bombs SAVE lines. Man, that just gets my goat.
He said a lot of things that were TRUE, in my book. | |
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timj82
| Joined: 11/16/2007 Msg: 38 | |
| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/15/2008 11:42:02 PM | WSJ: Obama's church may be breaking IRS rules
interesting article
http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/politics/blog/2008/03/wsj_obamas_church_may_be_break.html | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 12:25:25 AM |
Who is Mr. McCain's spiritual mentor/advisor, Violet? I missed this, I guess. I didn't know McCain had one. Here's one....
On February 26, McCain appeared at a campaign rally in Cincinnati with the Reverend Rod Parsley of the World Harvest Church of Columbus, a supersize Pentecostal institution that features a 5,200-seat sanctuary, a television studio (where Parsley tapes a weekly show), and a 122,000-square-foot Ministry Activity Center. That day, a week before the Ohio primary, Parsley praised the Republican presidential front-runner as a "strong, true, consistent conservative." The endorsement was important for McCain, who at the time was trying to put an end to the lingering challenge from former Arkansas governor Mike Huckabee, a favorite among Christian evangelicals. A politically influential figure in Ohio, Parsley could also play a key role in McCain's effort to win this bellwether state in the general election. McCain, with Parsley by his side at the Cincinnati rally, called the evangelical minister a "spiritual guide." http://www.motherjones.com/washington_dispatch/2008/03/john-mccain-rod-parsley-spiritual-guide.html He hates everything BUT "white America".
It certainly appears McCain sought his endorsement and called him a spiritual guide for purely political reasons.
Which begs the question....Is McCain's religion political power?
Did Obama seek the endorsement of Mr. Wright?
Is Mr. Wright an active campainer for Obama?
You are right, it's not 1967 anymore.... Yeah, right you are....it's the words that have changed....attitudes still linger....
I saw a side of America in the POF forums that shocked me. It hasn't left.... | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 1:58:18 AM | Violet sky said:
Really out there? And when have I ever said you didn't have the right to question his background? What makes you a racist are the remarks you've strewn about in several of the political threads alluding to Barack's heritage (or lack of, as he has stated MANY times), as well as the color of his skin. I'm not the only person on this forum to make comments on your views on this.
Again, Violet, whenever any individual questions Barack Obama's documented Muslim heritage, you and some of the others scream "Racist! Racist!" And that's fine. You just keep right on trying to deflect from the reality of whatever we cite, which is reputable and researched, and what is now on this Utube for all to witness.
But for you to have the audacity to claim that I am prejudiced over the color of Senator Obama's skin goes too far and I take offense to it. You cannot find a quote where I state I am prejudiced against African American people because I am not and have made no such remarks ever. Now I cannot control how you choose to interpret my words and I'm not going to bother to defend myself again over your obsessive need to call me a racist, so say what you will in the future and if it breaks the POF rules I'll promptly report you. Again, I believe you do this only to deflect from the obvious, which is that your candidate is fading fast and is being revealed for the person he really is. His judgment is unsound and his ties to those who could harm are palpable.
Barack Obama has been taught to be racist for the last twenty years as he sat under the tutelage of a man he considers a family member, Rev. Wright. The man baptized his children, married he and his wife, and Barack heard sermon after sermon of what is on that UTube. Barack denies this, claiming he was unaware that his pastor is racist and was capable of saying "God D-mn America!" along with the rest of the tripe he spouted, etc...
Senator Barack Obama is a liar and I believe this too will come out soon enough. It won't matter to you though, or to those who are so caught up in the groupie-like frenzy of wanting to believe in this guy no matter what. You all must have your hero, even at a potential tremendous cost to our nation. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 3:31:42 AM | So it is not ok for Obama to have known this man for 20 years, but it is ok for McCain to appear in public and get hearty pats on the back from Parsley and Hagee...because McCain has not been in cahoots with them for that long?
I have seen on this thread and on another one the phrase "birds of a feather flock together". This should apply to both Obama and McCain if you're concerned with these spiritual leaders and who they hang out with. I don't care if McCain just met Parsley yesterday, if he agrees with everything Parsley says, I think McCain is wrong....making sense? But as someone pointed out, this is a great crutch for the people who were against Obama from the beginning...now they have something they can finally put their finger on and justify to themselves why they are not voting for him.
Message above, you said in another thread that you have this (and I quote) "unfounded and illogical fear" of Obama. I suggested to you there that you get his book The Audacity of Hope as it was suggested reading for anyone who has any questions about Obama. That thread got derailed so I don't even know if you saw that post, but I still hope you look into it. Because in another post you referenced his "documented Muslim heritage". He attended a Muslim school in a third world country for maybe 2 years...but then went on to attend a Catholic school in another location--also third world, because those were the best educational opportunites available to him. His mother was doing her best as a parent to get him a good education, and it has served him well. I would have done the same thing.
Al Sharpton is considered by many to be racist. If it were Al endorsing or consorting with Obama, we'd probably figure it was just Al wanting to be political and sway the black vote. He's been a figure in politics and religion for quite a while now, and we probably would not have thought much of that at all. This guy (Wright) and his message are new and foreign to us. Shock value is taking over. I am not willing to give Wright the power to sway my vote.
**edit** And let's not forget, Obama is half white. How racist can he really be? Most multicultural people are the most tolerant people you'll ever meet. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 6:26:34 AM | And let's not forget, Obama is half white. How racist can he really be? Most multicultural people are the most tolerant people you'll ever meet. Many biracial people embrace one side of their heritage and ignore the other side completely. If Obama did not hold the same or similar views to Dr Wright he could have easily changed churches. The mission statement of TUCC mentions nothing about White America or the White Community and it states that they have a loyalty to Africa..so how can you use Obamas being biracial to excuse his beliefs? | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 6:37:09 AM |
so how can you use Obamas being biracial to excuse his beliefs?
Because I firmly believe him when he says they are not his beliefs.
If you want to get a truly objective opionion on something, you must read both sides. I have, have you? Try Obama.com | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 6:46:07 AM | | I agree research is important in forming ones opinion. To me it is more relevant how and where he chose to worship when he was not concerned with public perception as opposed to what is written about it now that it has become an issue. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 6:48:08 AM | I am willing to bet that most of his other choices for a church would have the same message being delivered if not moreso. more so? What can be worse than a Pastor shouting out that America should be blown off the face of the world? Your generalization of hate spewing Southside of Chicago's churches is what's wrong. I'm sure there are churches in that area that preach the "word of God" and not politics. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 7:01:31 AM | What can be worse than a Pastor shouting out that America should be blown off the face of the world?
I don't know...maybe this?
It was the disobedience and rebellion of the Jews, God's chosen people, to their covenantal responsibility to serve only the one true God, Jehovah, that gave rise to the opposition and persecution that they experienced beginning in Canaan and continuing to this very day... Their own rebellion had birthed the seed of anti-Semitism that would arise and bring destruction to them for centuries to come.... it rises from the judgment of God upon his rebellious chosen people. Hagee talking about Jews.
Or this?
On the September 18, 2006, edition of National Public Radio's Fresh Air, Hagee stated that Hurricane Katrina was an act of God, punishing New Orleans for "a level of sin that was offensive to God". He specifically referred to a "homosexual parade" that was held on the date the hurricane struck and that this was proof "of the judgment of God against the city of New Orleans" [1] , even though the Southern Decadence parade was scheduled for the following week and the primary gay neighborhoods, the French Quarter and the Marigny, were spared the flooding and destruction. Another reason for God's wrath, Hagee claims, was the Bush administration's pressure on Israel to abandon settlements and the land associated with them. Therefore, God took American land in a tit for tat exchange during Hurricane Katrina
Or perhaps calling for the destruction of the "false religion" of Islam? | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 7:21:54 AM | Again, what's the base difference between these two statements ?
The bombs in Vietnam explode at home; they destroy the hopes and possibilities for a decent America.
Martin Luther King, Jr., Where Do We Go from Here: Chaos or Community?, 1967.
"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye. We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and the black South Africans, and now we are indignant. Because the stuff we have done overseas has now been brought back into our own front yard. America's chickens are coming home to roost.
Rev. Jeremiah Wright
One is taught in history classes, the other now seen as a racial remark.
Martin Luther King was essentially all about black people (in a very real sense) and not white people. The issues he spoke about were universal ones, but his focus was on how they related to blacks living in American society.
The only difference is that 9/11 is far more of a sensitive issue to speak of, even compared to Vietnam then. The only difference is that MLK used a slightly less direct, and far more polished , approach to getting his point across.
Both directly tie American foreign policy to destruction at home - in the end.  | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 9:16:37 AM |
I have every right as a citizen of this country to demand and insist upon an examination of a presidential candidate's religious background when that background may or may not be connected to a radical element that we are currently at war with. I have the right to know this information, Violet, whether you approve or not. This does not make me a racist. If you think it does, you are sadly mistaken but I am not going to continue to belabor your erroneous perception of this fact anymore. You have the right to find out the information if you want to know, but you do not have the right to force the government to look into it and decide if the candidate is 'allowed' to run for president based on religious affiliations - It says so in the constitution.
You may want a person who is all of those things to be the next president, but unfortunately I think you're being a bit of an idealist there. Our current president started a war for no apparent reason (well, that part's a little contested yet, but whatever). The one before that had some moral issues. Our legal system is being abused so large corporations can extort money from people just because they may have downloaded a song or two. Companies are sueing each other for millions in a fight over who invented what first - and some of the 'inventions' are so obvious, or the lawsuit is so long after the second company went pulic that it's just ridiculous. What makes you think that a president, even if he (she) was a perfect person would really be able to do much to clean up this country? I think that some problems can be solved, but it doesn't matter a who lot who wins. Washington is so messed up now, can anyone put it back together in one piece? | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 10:15:28 AM | Your generalization of hate spewing Southside of Chicago's churches is what's wrong. I'm sure there are churches in that area that preach the "word of God" and not politics.
You are right. However, I did not mean they would be spouting off hatred. Perhaps if you had asked what I meant instead of critizing where I live and what you thought I said you might have gotten me to expand on that. What I actually meant, was that most of those churches are probably community and civic minded and do preach some sermons with a racial message...the message that speaks to them by reminding them of their history. And when I say that, I refer to the piece of Wright's speech that says Clinton does not know what it feels like to be called bad names and passed up by taxis. I stand by my assumption that they are black churches in majority. Have you ever been in a south side church? Or do you just not like my point of view and want to cut that down?
**edit** and yeah....I'm such a hate spewer. | |
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| Mr.Wright Posted: 3/16/2008 10:38:58 AM |
Again, Violet, whenever any individual questions Barack Obama's documented Muslim heritage, you and some of the others scream "Racist! Racist!" And that's fine. You just keep right on trying to deflect from the reality of whatever we cite, which is reputable and researched, and what is now on this Utube for all to witness. So even though Barack has stated himself many times he is not Muslim, you're taking Youtube's word for it? LMAO
But for you to have the audacity to claim that I am prejudiced over the color of Senator Obama's skin goes too far and I take offense to it. You cannot find a quote where I state I am prejudiced against African American people because I am not and have made no such remarks ever. Now I cannot control how you choose to interpret my words and I'm not going to bother to defend myself again over your obsessive need to call me a racist, so say what you will in the future and if it breaks the POF rules I'll promptly report you. Again, I believe you do this only to deflect from the obvious, which is that your candidate is fading fast and is being revealed for the person he really is. His judgment is unsound and his ties to those who could harm are palpable. You do just that. And you keep on doing that deflecting.
Barack Obama has been taught to be racist for the last twenty years as he sat under the tutelage of a man he considers a family member, Rev. Wright. The man baptized his children, married he and his wife, and Barack heard sermon after sermon of what is on that UTube. Barack denies this, claiming he was unaware that his pastor is racist and was capable of saying "God D-mn America!" along with the rest of the tripe he spouted, etc... That is where you are wrong. He said he wasn't there for many of these sermons. Get your facts straight. AND He also said PUBLICLY he doesn't agree with Mr.Wright's views on these sermons. He does share a deep belief in God with the Reverend. Again, get your facts straight. I still haven't seen you reply once to my remarks about McCain, Mrs.Clinton, and all the shady goings on both of them have had, not to mention the morals with which they work by. How's that for deflecting yet again, Southernlass?? Hmm?? You keep that good ol focus on Mr.Barack. He must really scare you.
Senator Barack Obama is a liar and I believe this too will come out soon enough. It won't matter to you though, or to those who are so caught up in the groupie-like frenzy of wanting to believe in this guy no matter what. You all must have your hero, even at a potential tremendous cost to our nation.
McCain, Mrs.Clinton also fit your bill of what YOU call a lair. And you have yet to address any of that. Have a nice day  | |
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