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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 7:58:41 PM |
Obama has 90% of the black vote because he is half black AND he champions their cause. You were claiming that blacks vote solely along racial lines. In any case, I'm not under the delusion that anyone will ever convince you of anything that goes against your preexisting notions. I just don't think outright BS should receive tacit approval.
Okeydokey...we know that Obama will get 90% of the black vote and champion their cause.
Will it be fair that McCain should get 90% of the white vote and champion their cause?
Fair is fair... right? | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 8:10:30 PM | The black vote is usually 70% or so Democrate for a white candidate, its very natural that they would vote an additional 20% for a black man, just as Catholics came out to support Kennedy.
These people are a minority, 12% of the population, why wouldnt they want to see a black President in their lifetimes? | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 8:12:44 PM | | Hehe... all's fair in love and war, eh? So, out of curiosity, what is the cause of the white person insofar as it doesn't also pertain to black people (or any other race, for that matter)? | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 8:24:55 PM | I knew it! I was waiting to pounce... just knew what flyguy would ask.  Knew it would be flyguy. I love it when I'm correct. Am I arrogant or what. 
The white cause is the same as the black. Ironic isn't it. The qualifier you put (insofar as it doesn't also pertain to...etc. etc.) is THE qualifier. You can't negate it without dissing the entire premise. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 8:35:18 PM | Glad to be of service! So, the white cause is the same as the black? I find it peculiar that many white people tend to believe that, yet so many black people have trouble getting on board with that notion. Try turning it around: the black cause is the same as the white cause.
Can you say that without feeling just a wee bit out of touch? | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 8:49:09 PM |
Can you say that without feeling just a wee bit out of touch?
Nope.. not even the weeest bit out of touch.
My very best friend ever was a dude (we were in our 20s... he passed in a fire later in life). We were stationed in Germany at the same time. He was half black/half white and we use to have discussions on what nonsense the races go through when it all comes back to square one/ground zero... that it's race driven. Period. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 9:05:22 PM | Yep, that sounds good on the very surface, but it neglects the cold hard facts of history. If a people were never treated poorly for so long solely on basis of their race, then they would have no reason to believe that their particular race might be a disadvantage in society.
The US has come a very long way, but it still has problems regarding race. Pretending they don't exist won't make them go away sooner. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 9:17:13 PM | Every single Nation on Earth has problems with race. Several.. more so than the US.
Two wrongs does not make a right. Enough time has passed that the Wrights of this Country, the KKKs, etc. etc. should be shunned and the people of all races should turn their backs on them so they don't receive the 'attention' they crave.
If anything.. the blacks should be waging war on Africa and the decendents of their ancestors who bartered/sold them to the whites and other races..to begin with.
Here's a stat for ya. The Caucasian birth rate has drastically decreased while the African American has increased and there are many more Blacks on Welfare... because they cannot support the amount of children they produce.
Now, add into the mix of us all here and the Mexicans and African Americans have a much stronger dislike for each other than either have for Caucasians. Those two ethnics are in competition, much more against each other now, for the 'quotas' and the welfare hand outs.
That's the truth... right or wrong.. it's the hard cold facts.
And, people need to really read Wright's belief platform and Obama's book. They really really do prior to even thinking of who they will vote for President. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 10:08:24 PM |
Now, add into the mix of us all here and the Mexicans and African Americans have a much stronger dislike for each other than either have for Caucasians. Those two ethnics are in competition, much more against each other now, for the 'quotas' and the welfare hand outs.
That's the truth... right or wrong.. it's the hard cold facts.
Really? You have facts, written, documented facts to back that up? | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 10:42:54 PM |
Really? You have facts, written, documented facts to back that up?
Actually, it's common knowledge...especially for those who work/have worked in any type of career which has access to various ethnic groups... especially social work..
I don't do a lot of links..or copy and pastes... because too much on the internet is 'biased'..I was just going to tell you to disprove my 'opinion' or discuss it with your 'opinion'..... But.. figured I'd provide the two links below. Neither has an agenda...to my knowledge.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-op-hernandez7jan07,0,2489.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail
http://www.kidsdata.org/topictables.jsp?t=17&i=2&ra=3_132 | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/18/2008 11:06:55 PM | One link voiced an opinion, not fact.
And the other stated that more Hispanics had children per 1000 than blacks. Not that they were on welfare more than anyone or getting anything more than anyone else. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 4:16:16 AM | To this whole race thing.
I find it rather laughable that people still seem to criticize race relations in this country. For all our problems and past history, no nation on earth has done as good a job as integrating so many disparate races, religions, and cultures as America. All I have to do is look at my high school graduation class and see names like Jablowski, Simon, Schoenhorst, Garcia, Hansen, Knusalla, Borg, Montgomery, O'Donnell, Rousseau, Papadopoulos, etc -- a veritable UN -- to know our success isn't theory, but fact. There were Protestants, Catholics, Presbyterians, Jews, Baptists, Hindus...you name it. I'm half Mexican, half Welsh-Irish Catholic. When you see so many other nations riven by intense ethnic and religious strife or racially protective and homogeneous, please remember that. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 8:58:41 PM | Perhaps. But I would submit that one would not find such admirable integration when he looks at the lower rungs of our socioeconomic structure. When he looks at our crappiest schools; our most destitute, derelict, neglected and intentionally "forgotten" and squalid living conditions; our poorest-paid workers (or even our most well-paid, prestigious workers; the management, executive, and board positions they hold; the better schools; and the comfortable, pristine neighborhoods they inhabit, socialize and "golf" in) he would find considerably LESS "good a job" of integrating the races.
Yes ...  "laughable," indeed. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 9:31:48 PM | And Jedi Girl ...
Please allow me to give FlyGuy a chance to rest and maybe grab a glass of water.
and there are many more Blacks on Welfare ...
Many more Blacks than "what" -- Whites? (That would be incorrect)
Than there were ten/twenty years earlier? (Possibly)
But let's talk about those "welfare" freeloaders that seem to incense so many Whites in this country. Let's talk about the undereducated mothers out there who -- admittedly -- screwed something up in their lives to leave them in that place where they are actually "getting" $1000/month to live, feed, and clothe their children off of. Those freeloaders who are living in despicable conditions -- with rodents, roaches and other vermin running amok, eating through their loaves of bread and running rampant throughout their refrigerators and across their floors countertops. Let's talk about those lazy, shiftless fukks who will likely never get the adequate education that those complaining about them take for granted and get, as a matter of due course, simply because of where their parents lived when they started kindergarten. What ever will we DO with those contemptuous **stards, dragging down on our wallets and always looking for a handout? Twelve thousand dollars a year to live off of because the government that was designed to serve them screwed them over so early in life that they didn't know -- or were too young and immature to realize and appreciate -- how badly they were getting screwed! FOR SHAW!!! Yeah, let's go and indict THEM!!!  You can't have MY twelve grand, dammit!!! 
And ... at the same time let's refuse to discuss the "CORPORATE WELFARE" that our government has made so commonplace. Giving OBSCENE sums of money -- from the U.S. Treasury, of course -- to companies which are ALREADY raking in the dough from us and spending it lavishly!
In 2006, we GAVE over 40 Million Dollars to Exxon -- ALONE, despite their (then) record year of profits. They doubled the price of gas, effectively anally gang-banging all of us (even those not driving gas-powered vehicles, because the prices of everything else went up as a consequence). And that was the same year that Exxon had enough of our dollars laying around the place -- EVEN WITHOUT the welfare check we gave it -- to ...
Exxon Paid Its Ex-Chairman $686 million
Posted on Apr 14, 2006
Exxon's ex-chairman Lee R. Raymond
As gas prices soar across the nation, Exxon’s board paid its recently-retired chairman, Lee R. Raymond, over $686 million since 1993--with $400 million of that coming in his final year with the company.
A compensation payout like that got N.Y. Stock Exchange Chairman Richard Grasso sued.
NY Times:
For Leading Exxon to Its Riches, $144,573 a Day
By JAD MOUAWAD
For 13 years as chairman and chief executive, Lee R. Raymond propelled Exxon, the successor to John D. Rockefeller’s Standard Oil Trust, to the pinnacle of the oil world.
Under Mr. Raymond, the company’s market value increased fourfold to $375 billion, overtaking BP as the largest oil company and General Electric as the largest American corporation. Net income soared from $4.8 billion in 1992 to last year’s record-setting $36.13 billion ...
[full article here (and elsewhere): http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/20060414_exxon_ex_chairman_686_million/]
Yeah ... it REALLY makes sense to go after that welfare recipient and the presidential candidate whose PRIMARY MANTRA is that he wants to end these types of corporate handouts.
"Obama's buddy accused America of still being racist in some respects! Therefore, we can't let Obama become president!!! Somebody GET that guy!!!"  | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 10:30:06 PM | You can make up all the excuses you want to for.....the lazy. Note, I've always qualified the ones I have a problem with. The lazy ones who learned to manipulate the system. They are NO better than the corporate bigwigs who take large chunks of a company's profits.
To delve even farther... some of those corporate profits are at the expense of the average middle class taxpayor. Some... however, ALL of the Welfare is out of our taxes. So, you tell me which is worse.
And, don't even try the excuse...poor them... with all those kids. Birth Control. Birth Control. Birth Control. Have as many as you can afford to .. via working. Period. And, as for jobs.. there are plenty out there. Fast food, grocery stores, etc. etc. These freeloaders don't want to demean themselves by taking those jobs. You're preaching to the wrong person here. I worked two jobs... supported my sons and put myself through college. Wasn't easy..but, I wasn't above taking waitress jobs during that period to accomplish it.
Entitlement times are done. Over.. if they want continue funding for what happened to their ancestors..then, go to Africa and get it out of them... they were sold by their own. And, yes, I'm talking the African Americans. Hell bells... My great grandfather was full blood American Indian and I have no problem with the Whites. Because we are ALL Americans.
I have zero tolerance for KKKers. I have zero tolerance for people like Wright. I have zero tolerance for Mexicans/Middle Easterners, etc. who refuse to learn English to live here.
AND... I firmly believe this election will not be voting for the lessor of two evils... a vote for McCain is not a vote for perfection... a polished/sinless man... but, it IS a vote for Bipartisanship and that's what I'm for in the Election of 2008. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 10:57:58 PM | Vyp, Obama himself said he can think of no other country where his story could even be "dreamed" of.
You're confusing utopia with hope. Nothing's guaranteed in life, certainly not a good job and material happiness. Heck, I could lose my job tomorrow and struggle just to make ends meet? People on the "bottom rungs", as you put it, always have had the "opportunity" to pull themselves up from poverty and hopelessness. But it wouldn't be easy, quick, or painless. As been proven over and over again in this country, with hard work and monumental perseverance there's always "hope" to better oneself.
What I see in inner city Detroit, which I’m sure is duplicated in other cities, is kids never finishing 7th or 8th grade, let alone high school, having babies way too early, and living in a culture awash in drugs and violence. Some is the fault of the breakdown of city government and the simple economic reality of suburban flight over decades that left cities a shell of their former glory. But most is a mindset of not taking responsibility for one’s own actions and accepting a terrible reality without the will to change it. Poverty has been with us since the dawn of civilization and will be with us long after we leave. If you believe in some way America should “guarantee” economic happiness, what’s your answer? More welfare state politics and government handouts? That’s never worked in the long run and is a huge reason people get dependant on government to “take care of them” instead of fostering independent drive and initiative.
If total fairness and perfection is what you’re seeking, about anything, you'll be constantly disappointed. Of that I'm sure.  | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 11:05:53 PM | Even among those relative few who have "learned to manipulate the system," the fruits of their manipulations are collectively FAR less consequential (not even CLOSE) to the fruits of those who have learned to manipulate Congress and use the U.S. Treasury -- i.e., our taxes -- to their benefit to the tune of Hundreds of Millions -- if not Billions -- annually.
So, to answer your question of which is worse -- corporate welfare. Hands down.
Irrespective of your arguments on how some welfare recipients are having more children to get larger checks, the simple fact remains that NONE of them are getting enough to get out of the shiit hole ghettos they live in, nor will any of them be found living in your neighborhood or doing better than you will with your two jobs. CERTAINLY none of them will be getting a check from our tax dollars, yet going to play golf at Hilton Head.
So you've got "zero tolerance" for the dripping faucet in your kitchen, while your basement is getting flooded off its foundation with nary a protesting yelp out of you! 
With respect to American lie of Africans selling off Africans, do you REALLY think it makes ANY credible sense that a man (an alien-looking man, really) would come to your homeland -- armed with superior weaponry -- and you'd just sell off your children to him??! Would YOU do that? If so, I'd submit that you are in the human minority. And, if not, what on EARTH makes you really believe that anyone else would?
Or is it that you just believe everything your government tells you, no matter how implausible it seems?
You say that you weren't above taking waitressing jobs. You DO realize that the VAST MAJORITY of lowest-income service positions are help by those same African-Americans and Mexican-Americans that are so lazy and shiftless, right? Check out your fast-food restaurants, housekeeping staffs, migrant and "daily" workers, etc. and see what you find.
Now don't get me wrong ... I don't have a problem with Whites either, as I agree that we are all (now) Americans. But at the same time, I recognize and concede that America sometimes has and continues to play the role of "villain" at home and abroad. And if you think that Senator McCain is sinless, you really ARE underinformed. The last sinless man anyone knew of was crucified for his beliefs. And, with Senator McCain's positions in lockstep with the current administration, I find it nothing short of LAUGH ABLE that you can seriously try to advance the argument that he carries the guidon of bipartisanship. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/19/2008 11:36:41 PM | Motown,
While I respect you and your opinions greatly -- and typically find your opinions very insightful -- I would argue here that that "opportunity" that you argue has always there for the less-fortunate to "pull themselves up" is really much more elusive and difficult to "recognize" -- let alone "seize" -- than you can really understand unless you have been there.
When you look at inner-city Detroit -- from the outside -- you are already equipped with tools, life experience, and a vantage that enables you to see a great deal more than those who are "in the forest" are equipped to be able to do.
When you were but a eight-year-old lad learning material in the third grade, that those kids in the city are struggling to learn in their own 7th and 8th-grade courses, you had role models around (relatives, friends, neighbors, etc.) who themselves had the education, foresight and life experience to stress the importance of your education. They attended PTA meetings. You went to well-lit schools, with doors on the bathroom stalls, equipped with toilet tissue, respectable resources, competent and caring teachers, etc. and a vast array of other disparate resources that inured to countless benefits of importance that you simply could not conceive of at the tender young age of eight. Still, there were people around you who knew life's ropes and started preparing you for success even before you realized the need for preparation.
The thirteen-year-old kid, who has been less well-educated for his 8 or 9 years of schooling, than you have for your own three years of schooling, and who is situated in an ocean of destitution and despair with no direction or guidance on what to do or how to go about improving the quality of his own life, is at a nearly insurmountable comparative disadvantage to you -- and he does not even realize that such is the case until it is too late in his life to make much of a difference.
There are a wide variety of very complex reasons why most of the vast majority of those born in inner-city Detroit (and the scores of other shiitholes like it) never make it out; and why the vast majority those fortunate enough to be born to those who are equipped and can afford to raise their children elsewhere continue to do better in life for themselves and their progeny. And I can assure you that it has VERY little to do with an unwillingness of those inside to pull themselves up.
For those of us on the outside, it really IS virtually impossible to conceptualize without having been there oneself.
I am not trying to suggest that "total fairness" or "perfection" is what I am seeking. I am merely suggesting that we CAN do a lot more than what we currently ARE doing and that, perhaps more importantly, we should really dispel with the farcical implication that we ARE being "fair," and that the difference between those who exist in squalid despair and those who have a real shot at living a decent middle-class life is something as simple as "hard work and perseverance."
That, my friend, is a popular and widely-held misconception. Of that, I am sure. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/20/2008 5:03:40 AM | I also deeply respect your views, Vyp.
Obviously, there are no definitive answers to questions of poverty and injustice. There will always be the unfortunate few that will slip through the cracks and be condemned to live a life of misery, no matter what is done. My point is there are no magic bullets out there. The best government can do is remove as many of the barriers to finding meaningful employment and achieving a satisfied life as possible. To me that means "less" government interference and regulation, not more. Overall responsibility for happiness lies within individuals themselves. No society can guarantee, mandate, or artificially bestow success (however it's defined) for every citizen.
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/20/2008 6:31:41 PM | Obviously, there are no definitive answers to questions of poverty and injustice. There will always be the unfortunate few that will slip through the cracks and be condemned to live a life of misery, no matter what is done.
Very true. But I would submit that when the problem is not with "the unfortunate few" but, rather, with a significant population (like "inner-city Detroit," for example), then perhaps we there may be some merit to the idea of examining exactly what it is that the government is -- or is NOT -- doing, or doing very well.
The entire argument behind "laissez faire" only holds validity -- and anything even APPROACHING fairness -- where all members of the society under examination start off more or less equally-resourced.
I think it is pretty damn wrong, unfair, and indefensible to create a capitalist society; equip some members with: (1)wealth; (2) solid educations; (3) strong schools to continue to educate their progeny; and (4)a Rolodex stuffed with useful contacts empowered to help them reach their goals -- and then to equip the uneducated or grossly undereducated others with poor schools, leaving them ill-equipped to improve their own lots in life (or that of their progeny) and, constructively/effectively, precluding their access to the resources necessary for those masses to strive measurably towards The American Dream. But to do so and then say "government stay out and let the best men win" I think is absurd, in its most kind characterization.
Overall responsibility for happiness lies within individuals themselves. No society can guarantee, mandate, or artificially bestow success ...
Again. Another very true point. But American political history is RIFE with illustrations of how government has assisted certain groups and individuals to gain financial success and unfair competitive advantage which, in a capitalist society, is the best starting point for any other form of success. That is why I know what inner-city Detroit looks like; you know what inner-city Philadelphia looks like; and we both know what inner-city Dallas, Greensboro, St. Louis, Gary and every other place like them look like without the need of a personal visit.
The "meaningful employment" that you alluded to remains the key. But that will never come about without access to comparable educational resources, preferably substantially IDENTICAL educational resources. We tried that a while back with busing, but America didn't take to well to that idea. So we've effectively gone back to a "separate, but equal" educational format which, as the evidence of those inner-cities show, is a complete failure.
Fixing (or at least truly trying to fix) that issue will require a massive financial infusion, alongside some thought leadership by some of our nations foremost thinkers. Thus far, however, our government has shirked its responsibilities to its citizenry in that area, choosing instead to bestow those financial resources to its more well-heeled corporate titans -- in the form of varying types of corporate welfare, and to its well-heeled individual citizens in the form of capital gains tax cuts and other financial gifts.
No, I am not seeking a "magic bullet"; although I would appreciate seeing my country give a more serious effort addressing the obvious ills, which source and so unfairly plague the ethnically homogeneous masses of its underclass. Or ... at the very least ... shoot and kill once and for all that patently spurious notion that those who are at the bottom are there because they don't work hard to improve their lots in life. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/21/2008 7:05:26 AM |
With respect to American lie of Africans selling off Africans I am not really sure about the purpose of your post but here are some examples of things that happen in Africa involving only Africans..."Slavery existed in some of Africa’s earliest organized societies. More than 3,500 years ago, ancient Egyptians raided neighboring societies for slaves, and the buying and selling of slaves were regular activities in cities along the Nile River""In Africa, as in many places around the world, early slavery likely resulted from warring groups taking captives. Such captives were of little use, and often some bother, when kept close to their homes because of the ease of escape. Therefore, they were often sold and transported to more distant places."
more recently-"The report, which covers 53 African nations, says children are the biggest victims in what is a very complex phenomenon.
It describes how they are forced into slavery, recruited as child soldiers or sold into prostitution. ""Much of this trade in children often has the tacit collaboration of the victims' own families where it is seen not so much as criminal activity but as a way for a large family to boost its poor income."
Some other things going on in Africa involving only Africans...
"The 1994 genocide in Rwanda resulted in the systematic massacre of 800,000 Tutsis and moderate Hutus in less than 100 days,The largest war in modern African history, it directly involved eight African nations, as well as about 25 armed groups. By 2008 the war and its aftermath had killed 5.4 million people, mostly from disease and starvation."
"A total of 4.7 million people have died as a direct result of the
Democratic Republic of Congo's civil war in the past four and a half
years, according to a report released today by the International
Rescue Committee, a leading aid agency."
"Marauding rebels are massacring and eating pygmies in the dense forests of north-east Congo, according to UN officials who are investigating allegations of cannibalism in Ituri province, where fighting between several rebel groups has displaced about 150,000 people in the past month." | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/21/2008 9:26:14 AM |
You can make up all the excuses you want to for.....the lazy.
I don't think that disadvantaged=lazy
Some... however, ALL of the Welfare is out of our taxes. So, you tell me which is worse.
Hmm... welfare for the rich... or welfare for the poor... hmmm...
The sad fact is that welfare for the rich gives politicians handsome financial returns... not so much with welfare for the poor.
Birth Control. Birth Control. Birth Control.
Education. Education. Education. It is harder to get than birth control.
If there is a magic bullet, it is education. Sadly, some disadvantaged groups see education as some sort of sellout to "The Man," such is their anger and hopelessness over being disadvantaged. Equally as sad is the well-known fact that schools in poor areas are not as good as those in richer areas.
Education begets education. So does a lack thereof.
Poverty begets poverty. Wealth begets wealth.
And so the cycle continues. Some are fond of pointing out the very few who manage to break the cycle in extreme fashion. I've also heard of people losing over 80 lbs on the Nutrisystem Weight Loss Program.
Yay! All is well. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/21/2008 9:42:37 AM | Well hellzzbells flyguy... now I have to come over here and point out what I've stated on other threads. Buttt, that's AOK... cause I like the attention. (kidding... well.. kinda)..I'm not totally egotistical... just 90%
Allow me to explain what I've written elsewhere on here recently.
I am against ALL unnecessary/wasteful entitlement... from the top (corp. pork) to the ones who abuse welfare.
People need to take responsibility for themselves. Period. If even ONE person who is not born into wealth... which actually is more like 80% of the population... can manage to make their way.. earn their way... this tells me the Opportunities are there for the taking. Just a matter of how much effort one wants to put forth.
All is NOT well... however... All is NOT bad or overwhelming either... not by a long shot. | |
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| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/21/2008 11:09:43 AM |
we should really dispel with the farcical implication that we ARE being "fair," and that the difference between those who exist in squalid despair and those who have a real shot at living a decent middle-class life is something as simple as "hard work and perseverance."
What a knee jerk, uninformed and condescending statement.
100 years ago my immigrant minority Mediterranean grandfather came here with borrowed money, took passage in the belly of a cargo ship, arrived in the US, and worked to support himself.
He was not rich nor even middle class - he was poor. He and other minority immigrants worked alongside blacks in coal mines, glass houses, steel mills, etc. and same as the blacks, were restricted to hold only certain menial jobs in these establishments. He had no advantage. He was segregated, same as any black was 100 years ago.
Once self supportive, he sent for his wife, and during the next 40+ years worked this very same job he was segregated to, built his life, and raised his children in America without anyones help.
These immigrants were self supportive and prospering by the 2nd generation. Barely 30 years after landing here they were contributing to society, all while being typecast, labeled, and segregated otherwise. Despite living in a white Anglo controlled society, they used what tools were available in order to attain what they wanted, and they for the most part, succeeded.
I see how it is no different today to succeed than it was 100 years ago for ANYBODY. If anything, it seems easier since those racial and ethnic barriers have been mostly dissolved. If you or your descendents are STILL living off the government, I can find no other explanantion other than it being your own fault due to your own behaviour, blaming your upbringing for expecting your own personal saviour to come to your aid.
When I see nearly 30% of my meager paycheque go to taxation, then see multitudes of ungrateful recipients of assistance, of which whom I am unwittingly their personal saviour, their only job being that of birthing multitudes of children, take advantage of me, I cannot help but think back to my grandparents. Why didn't they just go on welfare?? | |
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NERO1
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Joined: 3/8/2008
Msg: 625 | |
| Mr.Wright (Move On)
Posted: 5/21/2008 12:18:48 PM | ^^ Well one key reason they didn't go on welfare was because (if you are an American) there was no such thing 100 yrs ago, not until the Great Depression yrs. It was an FDR innovation. Borrowing, as they really did, several key ideas (as had Woodrow Wilson's admin before them) from socialist thinking, they enacted welfare, Social Security, etc. Great legacies. So they came here, the immigrants 100 yrs ago, for "freedom and a better life" -- yes, freedom (at that time at least) to starve to death if you couldn't pull it together, and / or work in those mines (or wherever you said) until you most likely died of a heart attack at a young age. Could have just about done the same thing back in or around the paese, more than likely.
Though our ancestors were not generally .... appreciated, I suppose .... more so in certain parts of the country than others (the mass lynching of southern Italian immigrants in Louisiana for instance in the late 19th century) ...... there still was not an organized systematized discrimination set up against them as there was for the black Americans (who ironically had been here much much longer, even at that time). Was an Italian stopped from drinking at a water fountain if parched on a hot day, told he couldn't use the same bathroom, eat at the same lunch counter, etc ?? No, he wasn't. The law was against blacks, not lightly tan or olive colored peoples.
As I said, they weren't well-liked (I'm sure in places perhaps still are not), but there wasn't any active gov't measure that might qualify as an official ethnic or racial exclusion until at least 1924 with the anti-immigration act -- specifically aimed at curbing further influxes of Italians and other southern Europeans, even eastern Europeans as well. This was the "immigration crisis" of the time, and there were Lou Dobbs'es of the time who were just as concerned (and vocal) about doing something about it. By the time my dad and his parents arrived here, the act had been removed (very late 50's, early 60's) , but still it had only been relatively recently removed even at that time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_Act_of_1924
But still, they were able to (our Italian families that is) advance here due to the fact that they were not targeted for anywhere near the kind of socio-economic exclusion that black Americans were (read the book, "Working Towards Whiteness" by David Roediger, for example....a very good sociological book explaining in detail exactly why this was the case). In later years, were Italians ever subject to real estate "blockbusting"? Or redlining , or mortgage discrimination? No, to the contrary. They were usually the ones doing at least some of the (so-called) "white ethnic flight" from their original neighborhoods as soon as any of the black Americans began moving anywhere into the area.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redlining | |
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