| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 8:23:12 AM | To add to yours & pants comments ....
Having helped some people in their needs to talk this out so that they dont take their lives & ultimately leave their nearest & dearest to deal with the aftermath...
The problem is that if they dont recognise their own situation &want help it will happen
the individual that commits suicide is said to be a coward for taking their own life................Just think about that from your own view point(EVERYONE)..............
could you be a coward &take your own life.... MORE like have you got the BRASS CAHOONAS to do it!!!!!!!It is a sad situation that goes on & for mark he can now be at PEACE from the torments that drove him to give up the promising future (because his life died with his Fiancee) | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 9:59:43 AM | Must be great being perfect like some on here.
We all have our faults and let he/she without sin cast the first stone.
We do indeed, but how does our "sin" relate to their "sin" exactly?
I'm certainly not claiming to be perfect in any way whatsoever, far from it. But what does that actually matter - if we have done bad things at points in our lives as well, does that somehow make the people involved in this less of a pair of junkies who basically brought about their own deaths?
But still, I know some people on here are (or have been) avid drug users themselves so are probably keen to downplay it, each to their own.
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 10:14:46 AM | I've never been a user of drugs, i've never felt the desire to. Too high on life ;)
Do we know for certain these people were junkies? - i've no idea as i rarely read the papers. And we know the papers are not the most reliable sources for factual and objective portrayals.
Yes they brought about their own deaths, but c'mon - where is your heart? Do you not feel for that fella at all? Can you imagine his loss and what he went through?
The very fact that someone needs to take drugs, shows their is a need for something. That they are unhappy. That is the crux of it. I don't condemn people who take drugs i just wonder what is missing from their lives to search for that artificial high.
There are times in our lives when the strongest of us will err and the wisest of us will fail. It is called being human. My heart goes out to that fella and his and the girl's family. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 12:31:35 PM | I don't care if Mark had a drug problem or not. I don't think it matters, the fact is that this man lost the love of his life and simply could not go on living without her.
A very sad situation and I am not a religeous but if there is any sort of god or justice then these 2 people will be together again, maybe a little bit of comfort for the families left behind.
I read the story online and in a few newspapers today it genuinely brought a tear to my eye.
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 2:31:16 PM | | sign of the times every ones on the gear nowdays once he went missing ithink every one knew he/d top his self lost his bird lost his job couldnt live with out her took the easy way out very sad my heart goes out to there families | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 2:38:43 PM | | I certainly dont think 'topping yourself' is the easy way out...... yes its the family who deal with the pain of the deceased, but what about his pain ? Or doesnt that matter ? | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 3:00:44 PM |
sign of the times every ones on the gear nowdays
Speak for yourself not everyone!
It appears that Mark Speight hung himself, he didn't OD on drugs. Is there any evidence that he was a regular drug user? Suicide is not the easy way out or a cowardly act; it is the last desperate act of a fellow human being. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 3:01:22 PM | does anyone know why she topped herself?? everyones going on about the pain he has been through since she topped herseldf and he lost her but im just wondering do we know why she did it?? is he perhaps not grief ridden but feeling guilty or perhaps ashamed?? she obviously didnt want to be with him or felt she he wasnt able to help her with whatever ordeal she was going through and didnt love him enough to want to live for him
i dont know why she commited suicide and dont recall ever reading why but i would imagine without being there first hand in the very close circle of friends or family we are all making wild assumptions | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 3:02:02 PM | I think it takes a lot of guts/courage to end your life..................
None of us really will know what depths poor Mark sunk to...........how black the world seemed to him.............yeah we have all felt down................but just how far down do you have to go to even get to the stage of thinking it is the way out of all the pain............................
.....................let alone actually doing or trying it.............
R.I.P Mark | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 3:38:29 PM | It aint as far down as you think.....
Mark's girlfriend didn't kill herself she died accidently after a drug session. Official verdict was death by misadventure. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/14/2008 11:21:41 PM | The more I read about this case, the sadder it becomes .... Mark must have really thought he couldn't go on.
As to suicide being the easy way out. I really can't imagine the courage it must have taken to hang himself like that.. I'd be worried about screwing it up and being left crippled for the rest of my life...
My younger brother attempted suicide a number of years ago due to ongoing health problems but didn't have the strength to carry it through (his words not mine) ..
I hope wherever he is now, he is at peace and as always my thoughts go out to both families involved... | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:20:57 AM |
I really can't imagine the courage it must have taken to hang himself like that..
I'm not sure courage is the right word nor cowardly when describing suicide. Its certainly desperation & more often than not is triggered or acted out when not of sound mind. I don't see how its possible to intentionally take your own life in this mans situation, unless suffering from an imbalance in his brain Its difficult to be exact , but on the face of it he was relatively young, wealthy, physically fit and had a succesfull career as a TV presenter. But without having been in his mind we can only guess as to what drove him to end his own life. Guilt, loss,broken heart who knows.
Again, I'm not sure if this man had children, parents,family, friends, people who loved and cared about him. If, as seems likely, he did, then they are the ones to suffer and left to reason why. So whether its cowardly/courageous to kill yourself, I don't know. Its open to debate and matter of opinion I guess. IMHO suicide [ in the vast majority of cases] is the most selfish of crimes when leaving loved ones behind to pick up the pieces. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:40:19 AM | OP I think you used the right words there" find peace".
Imagine the pain and fear he must have felt. Some people can recover from pain/fear like that, some cant.
The only way and sometimes the only thought that is left are" If only I was dead, I would no longer have to feel or be scared".
What makes me sad is the fact, that he did not think that there was anybody in his life that could make a difference .
He chose to die alone in a remote part of a train station, amongst a sea of strangers.
His choice of the place speaks volumes.
RIP | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 2:05:56 AM |
could you be a coward &take your own life...MORE like have you got the BRASS CAHOONAS to do it!
Agree.
I've lost count how many times this has come up on the forums - & my opinion never wavers - nor my my exasperation of some peoples beliefs.
Why is it, so many people will sympathise with Euthanasia - & they don't deem that as a selfish or cowardly way out of living? Is it really so difficult to understand that just because you can't empathise with mental agony it doesn't make it any less painful than physical for the sufferer? That their quality of life & prognosis can be just as dire?
Suicide? Oh no. It doesn't matter what the circumstances are - it's cowardly & selfish & what about the people they left behind.
Well I for one wouldn't wish to bring back the people who I've known who took there lives - let them carry on endlessly suffering immense pain & anguish - just so I don't have to grieve? THAT to me is selfish.
Alot of people use drugs as a crutch - to self medicate to blot pain away. Soon as it's illicit drugs though - again- the empathy goes out the window.
Remember - the vast majority of use are drug users, & of the most dangerous kind - alchohol & cigarettes. If someone you loved died of cancer through smoking, would you be so pious & judgemental as to how selfish & cowardly they were? Smoking is choosing a probable slow suicide in essence isn't it? Are all people who die of cirrhosis due to alchohol abuse 'selfish cowards'? Or do you afford them some sympathy - because they were 'ill'. Yet - someone who was so mentally ill to take their life - it's different?
Do you know what hurts the loved ones of people who took their lives?
People's lack of compassion shown towards their deceased loved one & hearing them called a coward.Think about that.
RIP Mark & partner. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 5:18:20 AM | IMO Life is for the brave and those who continue to fight their demons/addictions/losses etc have my upmost respect.
Ultimately drugs indirectly took this couples lives ,although verdicts of misadventure and hanging , would they still be here today had they not have picked up a drug ?..............probably yes !!
Their deaths are not a loss , they carried the ultimate message to those who are still actively drug abusing .......................drugs kill !!
If their dying has saved one addicts life or kicked someone into reality then this seemingly waste of young lives would not have been in vain !!
"For those who fight for it , life has a flavour the sheltered will never know "!!
(AA Soldier) | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 6:47:46 AM | I'd like to whole heartedly with Lily, Message 41
And I think people should try to be a little less judgemental about the deaths of these two people. One never knows the full details unless one is involved. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 6:49:59 AM | it is sad to see such wasted life, in my faith it is a prohibition to kill your self, i go out three nights weekly dancing all the night, and the amount of people asking me what’s am on, huh, i tell them am on salt, water and orange joice they can not believe me, yet they go to the gym and drink water only..
may be we need more spiritual education that we do not own our life in realty and that by taking our life we are taking few life’s with us, from bereavement to our family and friends to communities, some how there should be a skill task, psychology, awareness, or counselling weekly meet ups to entertainment sectors
Looking at smoking, drinking, drugs, problems and wondering are we a troubled nation spiritually, materially? Or is this affecting few individuals? | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 7:37:40 AM | I agree with Lily about the judgements on illegal drug users. How many more are addicted to legal and prescription drugs? We don't have a go at them in such a heartless way.
As for having no sympathy because they can afford their addiction, WTF!! So because, for whatever reason, you end up with some sort of dependency or addiction, the presence of a healthy bank balance makes you a worse addict than the guy on the council estate stealing from his neighbours to fund his habit just baffles me.
At the end of the day those that take drugs and often those that commit suicide are in such a dark lonely place it doesn't matter who is around them or what is being said, life sucks for them and there is nothing anyone can do about it unless they want the help.
Selfish it may be to commit suicide but after many years pondering on the subject due to my own loss, I now think that although there was a thought for those left behind, the person in despair honestly believes the people they are leaving behind are better off without them and that them not being here anymore is better that them sticking around being a burden.
Still selfish? I'm not so sure it's as easy as that. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 8:10:13 AM | | I really feel for his mother, im seeing the agony that my own sister is going through and know that this is as good as it gets for her no matter how old they are they are still the the child you gave birth to and must always feel that you could have done more to prevent it happening. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 10:38:25 AM | Lily you make some very good and valid points that are both thought provoking and worth looking at in depth [get me , the analytic critic, lol]
Why is it, so many people will sympathise with Euthanasia - & they don't deem that as a selfish or cowardly way out of living? Is it really so difficult to understand that just because you can't empathise with mental agony it doesn't make it any less painful than physical for the sufferer? That their quality of life & prognosis can be just as dire?
I'm not entirely convinced the two are comparable. Sure the outcome is the same but to that point they are not the same thing.I would agree and argue the case for euthanasia and a persons right to choose whether to live or die. How could you as a human being not have empathy, feel compassion for a fellow human being suffering in pain daily with no hope of ever recovering. IE: a terminal illness . We don't let dogs or any living animal suffer unnecessary pain[ or those of us who have a heart don't anyway] A horse will be shot, a dog put to sleep for instance.
Suicide is totally different in that most cases there wont be a terminal illness that pushed them to take their own life. It will be a mental illness , imbalance of the brain
that compels them to feel there is no solution to their predicament other than to take their own lives.I have total empathy for anyone feeling suicidal . The saddest thing about it all is the pointlessness and waste of a young mans life that could and did to an extent achieve what most people will not if they live to a ripe old age.
Mental illness can often be cured with time, medication, support network and change in circumstances. Schizophrenia for example can be controlled with the right drugs and the sufferer can live a perfectly " normal life " Clinical depression is not terminal and can be treated and overcome given the right help. Somebody who's at the suicidal stage is not in my opinion thinking as they would normally, therefore not responsible for their actions. No right minded individual would aid and abet Mark Speight in killing himself as they would somebody dying a painful and slow death riddled by cancer for example.You can kill/ murder a person and be absolved of the crime if it is proved that they were suffering from insanity at the time. They are deemed not responsible for their actions.
Its difficult for people to remember or acknowledge that the person who took their own life wasn't the person that they knew or would recognise. Thats why people often react with disbelief on hearing of somebody they knew well being capable of suicide.
My Aunties husband [my uncle ] is to me a perfect example. Up until about 6 months before his death he was the most easy- going , happy, fun person you could ever wish to meet. The last person you would imagine could take his own life. He got into a deep, dark depression and within months was unrecognisable from the man everybody knew and loved. My Auntie went to the shop one morning to return half an hour later to find him dead hanging from the door.
He left behind four children and 3 or 4 grandchildren who adored him. After the initial shock and disbelief , anger sets in and its difficult to feel anything but angry with what he did. His funeral was the worst day Ive ever experienced including my mothers and closer family members than my Uncle Paddy was. I didn't know what to say to my cousins and couldn't get my head around the circumstances and manner he chose to kill himself. Its a fact that children who have a parent that's committed suicide suffer with guilt and are burdened, show negative reactions and are damaged long term.
So its understandable that those left to pick up the pieces can take years to forgive and understand what to them is selfish & senseless . They look for answers but the person that can give those answers is no longer.
A lot of people use drugs as a crutch - to self medicate to blot pain away. Soon as it's illicit drugs though - again- the empathy goes out the window.
Remember - the vast majority of use are drug users, & of the most dangerous kind - alchohol & cigarettes. If someone you loved died of cancer through smoking, would you be so pious & judgemental as to how selfish & cowardly they were? Smoking is choosing a probable slow suicide in essence isn't it? Are all people who die of cirrhosis due to alchohol abuse 'selfish cowards'? Or do you afford them some sympathy - because they were 'ill'. Yet - someone who was so mentally ill to take their life - it's different?
That's true you make a good point. There's a lot of hypocrisy where drugs are concerned. You get the cocaine user looking down their nose [ pardon the pun] at a Heroin Addict. When basically they are both misusing Class A drugs for the same purpose IE: getting high. Same as the successful, rich, executive businessman will think nothing of consuming a bottle of expensive Brandy every night.Then feel justified in pontificating and acting like a paragon of virtue in condemning a pot smoker who enjoys a couple of joints in his own home before going to bed. Double standards pervade , go unchallenged and are accepted in our society on every level.
Sorry for being so long-winded. I thought I'd conquered this problem lol.... | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 11:44:59 AM |
Mental illness can often be cured with time
Mental illness can not be cured, just the symptoms treated and controlled . | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 11:54:48 AM | mental illness or depression?
Depression can certainly be cured.
Once the chemical inbalance of the brain is put right with the correct medication then the depression will diminish.I would presume that what this poor man was suffering with was severe depression brought on by grief.He was in a place where he thought he could not cope.Its a terrible shame but with the correct treatment/counselling he could have been helped. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:17:18 PM | depression is a mental illness... therefore can be treated, hence the chemical imbalance corrected, not cured.
Treatment, therapy, drugs, counselling all will help to keep the illness under control and managed but never cure it.
It is a shame and sad he didnt seek help, but some are too far into the depression to see another way out other than being free from their own mental torture and unfortunately ending their own lives to be free. | |
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| Mark Speight found dead
Posted: 4/15/2008 3:19:10 PM |
Lily you make some very good and valid points that are both thought provoking and worth looking at in depth
Thanks - I like to twist people's melon  
Back to being serious ...
Suicide is totally different in that most cases there wont be a terminal illness that pushed them to take their own life. It will be a mental illness , imbalance of the brain
The mental illness caused them to terminate their life ... therefore it is a terminal illness, simply not a physical one 
that compels them to feel there is no solution to their predicament other than to take their own lives
Exactly, part of the illness is believing there isn't any other solution other than death to alleviate the pain they are in...the pain could be caused by depression, or paranoia that they are under constant persecution/in danger etc - to the point they don't trust medical intervention but neither can face living any longer. It's a living hell - tortured day & night.
The problem with people not being able to relate or empathise to a disordered mind ... is because they try to make sense of it with a 'sane' mind - & without insight. Imagine trying to describe physical pain to someone who doesn't feel any. How? | |
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