| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:36:39 PM | You have to understand the main reason for smoking ban in bars and restaurants. It's to protect the workers. They say that if you work in an enclosed area with several people smoking for an eight hour shift, it would be the equivalent of smoking several packs of cigarettes.
I was in the bar business for severals years in New Orleans. After ten years, I developed a pretty nasty cough. They finally banned smoking in bars, and I was actually against it (you know...freedom and all that stuff). It took several months, but the coughing finally ceased. I personally don't mind being around a smoker every now and again, but I wouldn't want to be subjected to it for hours at a time on a daily basis. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:42:48 PM | TJ, we do understand that and on that point even smokers don't find fault with the benefits to others.
As I got off onto the path of "this today, what tomorrow" it does become unclear what facets with which even we smokers agree with your point and what facets we find concerning.
Trust me K-Lo... I can already tell that it's a fine line I'd have to walk while in your establishment. You'd still run to the store to get me a Bud though right? | |
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K-lo
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Joined: 7/31/2006
Msg: 28 | |
| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:54:31 PM | | Itechman - There won't be a store!! But, I'll keep a stash of it locked under the bar . . . in the sacreligious cabinet. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:57:38 PM | I'm getting this "Sometimes I wanna go where everybody knows my name" feeling K-Lo.  | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 12:58:18 PM |
you do realize that people are going to be smoking on the patio don't you. why don't you stay inside in your smoke free environment? Because I want to sit in the sun while enjoying my beer.
You might like to have a beer with your steak, but there are non-drinkers at the restaurant that don't want to see a beer on your table when they eat theirs. Please, having a beer beside someone that doesn’t like beer causes them no ill effects what so ever. Of course people will spout off about drunk drivers and how they cause harm to others when they drive drunk, but that’s not the issue and the only retort they have.
also find it a little ironic that the same people who promote smoking bans, have no problem with $1 draft night, or $5 all you can drink. you can drink 23 beers, but just don't smoke! I know the argument of, drinking 23 beers only hurts the person doing it, until they leave the bar. So you think people that like fresh clean air think it’s ok to drive drunk?It’s not ironic at all because they have nothing to do with each other. But drinking a beer only harms the person drinking the beer. You’re arguing apples and oranges. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 1:05:47 PM |
Please, having a beer beside someone that doesn’t like beer causes them no ill effects what so ever.
Don't you see... I used this example because this has happened. Some consider being offended as an ill-effect and will fight to take away a liberty of yours. And lawmakers can be pressured into taking it away. | |
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K-lo
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Joined: 7/31/2006
Msg: 32 | |
| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 1:13:56 PM |
Some consider being offended as an ill-effect and will fight to take away a liberty of yours. And lawmakers can be pressured into taking it away.
Well, that makes sense. So the banning of trans fats in NY was really because the lawmakers finally got the message that people are offended by fat people. I wonder how they'll solve the epidemic of screaming, bratty, spoiled children. So many more lives to touch with our government's wisdom . . . and such limited time. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 1:39:20 PM | | there is no use. liberals just don't understand freedom of choice. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 7:22:39 PM | I am a non smoker, I totally disagree with smoking bans. I think that businesses should make there own descisions when it comes to the clientel they wish to come to their establishment ( ex. chuckie cheese having a no smoking ban is fine because its their choice )
I live in canada and at least in this province you can't smoke anywhere it seems. I think its stupid to think that you shouldn't be allowed to smke in a night club, or for a restaurant to have a smoking section ( todays vent systems can do wonders to allow non smokers to enjoy their meals without smelling the smoke )
I used to live in lexington ky when they past a non smoking ordinance. when they did that , there was a place called the cigar bar where people go to sample and enjoy cigars while they have a drink: this was a privately own establishment that had been there for a while and because of the ordinance, you were no longer allowed to smoke in a cigar bar ( who in there right mind would go to a cigar bar and expect to have a smoke free environment )
although I'm a nonsmoker, I believe we all have an individual choice of where we go to eat, drink and be merry. You should make those choices based on the type of place it is and wether smoking is allowed ( if it bothers you) The government should not tell privately owned businesses whether you can smoke or not (after all , isn't smoking still legal ), if their clientel decides they don't want smoking, the business will make that decision, if their clientel decide they want to smoke, then they will allow smoking, doesn't mean a non smoker can't come , it just means that there will be smoking in the building
thats an opinion of a non smoker | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 7:35:08 PM | | you and I share the same thoughts sir! couldn't have said it better myself. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 8:30:33 PM | | I'm an x smoker and now very much hate it but I don't think it was government's job to ban smoking eventhough I sure do appreciate it. Not much different than other legal requirements heaped on by do-gooders. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 8:56:10 PM | | Is it really that hard to take your ass outside? | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 8:57:24 PM | Don't you see... I used this example because this has happened. Some consider being offended as an ill-effect and will fight to take away a liberty of yours. And lawmakers can be pressured into taking it away. If enough people band together for a cause (restriction) that then passes a referendum, then I guess I’ll have to live with it. I’m sure there are many dry counties in the States where this type of situation still exists. Your “liberty” to fill my air with your smoke has ended, and I can live with that.
there is no use. liberals just don't understand freedom of choice. Your broad brush is a bit too broad, can't you come up with something better? | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 9:16:19 PM |
Your “liberty” to fill my air with your smoke has ended
Wow, I felt like I was hearing a soliloquy from Spartacus II on that one. Brava!
Miss the point, that's fine. I was entertained with the drama. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/15/2008 11:39:37 PM |
Is it really that hard to take your ass outside?
Actually it would be a lot more democratic and capitalistic to allow freedom to go ahead and allow new bars to be built to cater to the human rights of smokers and all non smokers can then party down in their active locales.
Anybody see anything infringing on their rights there? Course not. It's not about health or human rights, it the continual encroachment on control of the social species. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 7:44:12 AM |
Your “liberty” to fill my air with your smoke has ended
wow, does this person live in some sort of fantasy liberal world? first of all, smoking hasn't been banned worldwide genius. also, the air isn't "yours". | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 8:05:06 AM | Yeah J-Marq but didn't he inspire you to go fight some Redcoats or something like he did me? I had a tear in my eye as I stood from my chair and applauded when I read that.
It's great that a non-smoker can take such pride that someone else lost what can be perceived a liberty, but let's say he has a beloved family pet and tomorrow the police and animal control show up at his door to tell him that there is now an ordinance forbidding ownership of the pet at his home and they have to take it away. Will the sentiment of discriminatory liberty be consistent then?
Here's how I heard it described by the "regulars" at a bar once. They have gone to the bar 2, 3, or 5 evenings a week for 10 years and smoked with their buddies. Then the guy that comes in maybe once a month or every other month walking through the place like Liberace in too tight pants complains belligerently about the smoke. Why the hell did he even come in there then? Basically, in their view Liberace is violating THEIR air. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 8:17:51 AM | I don't think bans should be legislated. Leave it up to businesses to make those decisions for their own establishments. They will usually make the right decisions for their customers.
I have a hard time respecting smokers, and the habit is one of the dumbest things you can do in life. Fortunately, most smokers make some effort not to smoke in mixed company and will refrain from smoking in non-smokers' homes. I'm still willing to meet them halfway. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 8:18:29 AM | | it's what I call a liberal agenda. they start with smoking. then they go after trans fats. then the go after saturated fats. then the go after non organic foods. it will not stop. this is the beginning. the government has WAY too much power. WAY TOO MUCH. all the social political issues are a direct result of too much government. this is what really confuses me about liberals. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 9:00:34 AM | These bans are a bit overdone. Yes you or I have the right to choose to not be exposed to something and sometimes that choice will mean NOT going somewhere rather than insisting everyone change to agree with us.
It should be upto the owner of the establishment with enforcement by actual cops coupled with large fines for the few rude individuals that will insist on lighting up in a non-smoking by owners choice establishment. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 9:04:56 AM |
and the habit is one of the dumbest things you can do in life.
One of? I'm a smoker and I will agree we can substitute in place of "one of the" with "THE".
I'm working on it. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 10:22:14 AM | Seems to me everytime a law is passed a freedom is lost. A free country governed by lawmakers is something of a contradiction in terms. People are like porcupines in cold weather trying to stay close to keep warm and the squeeky wheel gets the oil.
What ever happened to settling our own differences and why is it that people tend to view government as some sort of surrogate parent ? Everybody suffers when a freedom is lost and in the end we'll all have a chip on our shoulders for one reason or another. It's not just the current persecution of smokers or a business owner unable to make the rules for the establishment they've worked to create, it's everyone because the process of enacting legislation resulting from a group of people complaining about some aspect of behavior they find offensive isn't limited to smoking, if you think about it everyone at some point does something that pisses others off so what's next or who's next on the chopping block. I could lay odds that if 'dipping' caught on or became more common there would soon be a law against it and as far as drinking a beer is concerned a patronage of AA folks might find that offensive and should they find enough influence with lawmakers then miss or mister beer on the patio might be forced to forego that pleasure. Once smoking becomes a criminal act then perhaps the next cluster of folks to be persecuted will be the obese, seeds are already being planted for that as the public looks at the cost of healthcare insurance. Whatever happened to the idea of settling our own differences without having to run to mommy or daddy for help ? At least there's one business I know of that stood up and won the right of self determination having patrons order in english. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 11:24:19 AM |
Miss the point, that's fine Nah, I just don't think it's valid. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 11:26:50 AM | | this coming from the person who claims that they own the air. | |
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| smoking bans
Posted: 4/16/2008 11:31:57 AM | | Maybe the next President can appoint him Secretary of the Atmosphere. | |
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