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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/4/2008 10:04:14 PM | Carter was actually the LAST honest president the US had.
That's right, my friend who is from Iran will tell you that religious minorities have protected status, and that NORMAL Iranians respect religious diversity. | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/4/2008 10:29:05 PM | **how do you explain the protected status of the jews, christians and other religious minorities in Iran and their gauranteed seats in the Iranian parliment?**
Not all religious minorities-try being a Baha'i in Iran:
On February 28, 2008, U.S. Rep. Mark Kirk (IL - 10th district) introduced a resolution in the House of Representatives condemning the persecution of the Baha’is in Iran. H. RES. 1008 is the tenth congressional resolution since 1982 on the Baha’is in Iran.
It has also been sponsored by Reps. Robert Andrews (NJ - 1st district), Joe Wilson (SC - 2nd district), Robert Wexler (FL - 19th district), Frank Wolf (VA - 10th district), Eric Cantor (VA - 7th district) and Michael McNulty (NY - 21st district).
The congressional resolution (download PDF version) condemns the Government of Iran for its state-sponsored persecution of Baha’is; calls on the Government of Iran to immediately cease activities aimed at the repression of the Iranian Baha’i community; and continues to hold the Government of Iran responsible for upholding all the rights of its nationals, including members of the Baha’i community.
The resolution also condemns the Government of Iran’s continued imprisonment of individuals without due process and a fair trial; calls on the Government of Iran to immediately release 3 Baha’is: Ms. Raha Sabet, Mr. Sasan Taqva, and Ms. Haleh Roohi; and calls on the Government of Iran and the Iranian Parliament to reject a draft Islamic penal code, which violates Iran’s commitments under the International Covenants on Human Rights. | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/4/2008 10:40:39 PM | Apparently she's looking to pick a fight with China too- the way she's talking tough about outsourcing of American jobs and critical defense techology to them- only what she doesn't talk about was that it was her husband who made all that possible back in the 90s- trading away our security. Shady deals verging on treason. Could it be now from putting her finger to the political winds and finding that lots of people are angry over jobs lost to China as well as anxiety over that nation's growing military might- that Hillary has found a perfect boogyman?- and also a way to cover her husband's tracks by starting a war. Then China will be an enemy and anything they might reveal about the Clintons can just be shrugged off as propaganda lies. Wagging the dog once more!
As for Iran- I think Israel can take care of itself. We might not have to do anything because the Israelis will vaporize Tehran if they ever pull something like that.
JF | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/4/2008 10:54:13 PM | We have the power to obliterate. That's why it's called the nuclear deterrent...
Furthermore, it would require an if/then scenario for Iran to get nuked: IF Iran attacks Israel, they run the risk massive retaliation.
What would we otherwise do: deliver a hearty breakfast to Iran's troops so that they can effectively destroy Israel?
In a world where I ABSOLUTELY must choose who survives I'm gonna go with Israel. That's not politics--that's just good sense. | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/4/2008 11:55:01 PM |
how do you explain the protected status of the jews, christians and other religious minorities in Iran and their gauranteed seats in the Iranian parliment?
http://newsocietyjournal.com/2008/01/29/iran-jewish-life-under-islamic-rule/
Overnight, the 1979 Islamic Revolution overturned all the societal gains made by the Jewish community under the Shah. In the first few years after the Revolution, dozens of Jews were executed. [27] Habib Elghanian was the wealthiest Jewish philanthropist in Iran where he funded Hebrew schools across the country. Elghanian, who had introduced plastic to Iran, was accused of being a Zionist traitor, or to be more specific, he was charged with “friendship with the enemies of God, warring with God and His emissaries, and economic imperialism.” [28] He was hanged in 1979. Although Ayatollah Khomeini issued a fatwa ordering that all Jews be treated well, [29] and that Iranian Jews should be distinguished from Zionist agents, the record shows otherwise. The supposed equality of Jews and Muslims and the rhetorical dis-tinction between Jew and Zionist soon became a political joke. Jews reverted to the status of dhimmi. Khomeini reinstituted the jizya and declared that if Muslims had obeyed the divine ordinances, “a handful of Jews would not have dared to occupy our land.” [30] During the year of the Revolution alone, numerous Jews were killed for “causing economic corruption in Iran.” [31] Any person who had a connection with the Shah or had “too much wealth,” was handed a death sentence. [32] Most of those who fled left their wealth behind to be appropriated by the Islamic regime. These discriminatory practices all continue to this day. All workers in public sectors have to be screened for Islamic credentials. [33] “Blood money,” the payment given by the family of a murderer to the family of the victim, once again became customary in Iran after the Revolution, and the amount of financial compensation a Jew can receive from a Muslim in the case of a relative’s murder or death is equal to one-eighth the amount that is paid if the victim is a Muslim. [34] Further-more, Jews face obstacles in bringing civil suits to trial, are barred from high-level government posts, and are faced with insuperable delays in service delivery. Iranian courts refuse to accept testimony from Jews and, unsurprisingly, murderers of Jews have never been brought to justice. [35] Parallels have been drawn between the state of Iranian Jewry and the state of German Jewry in the 1930s. [36] The Jewish population’s decline in Iran strongly reflects the new anti-Semitic fervor stirred up by the Revolution. [37] The Jewish population is estimated to have declined from 150,000 at mid-century to 30,000 in the decades following the Revolution. Current estimates range from as low as 10,000 to as high as 35-40,000. Both the U.S. and Israel have recognized the dangerous state of Jewish life in Iran. Immediately following the Revolution, the Iranian government confiscated all Jewish passports and would not allow more than one member of a Jewish family to travel abroad. [38] Although these laws no longer exist, the regime keeps a close watch on the Jewish community, their travels, and their ex-tended family, especially in the U.S. and Israel. After the Revolution, Iran severed all relations with Israel and de-clared Israel an enemy of Islam. Iranian Jews learned the hard way to renounce any connection to Israel or Zionism in public. [39] “You can be Jewish and not associate yourself with Israel,” says Sarah Hay, a 21-year old computer engineer student from Tehran. [40] Jews are unable to telephone or send mail to relatives in Israel, let alone visit. Jews who have corresponded with family in Israel have been executed or jailed for “spying for Israel.” [41] In 1999, 11 Jews were convicted on this charge. One boy was only thirteen years old. “Virtually every Iranian Jew has relatives in Israel. To regard normal family connections of Jews with Israel a crime makes a mockery of pledges in the Islamic Republic constitution that Jews will be accorded full rights as a recognized religious minority,” another Iranian woman says. [42] In March 2006, fifteen Iranian Jewish folk dancers visited Russia. When the Russian Jewish community brought out a cake decorated with the Israeli flag to celebrate the occasion, the Iranian Jews would only eat from the section of the cake that did not bear the Israeli flag. [43] Even abroad, they feared the possible repression of their government. As Haroon Yashaie states, “supporting Israel is absolutely out of the question.” [44] The Jewish community, once the most affluent in Iran, now consists mostly of people who are too old or too poor to leave. [45] Given the potential repercussions of speaking out against the Islamic regime, the substance of interviews with Iranian Jews must be viewed skeptically.
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/5/2008 7:46:09 AM | So let's look at Iranian Jews, shall we MF ?
Iranian Jews
Judaism is one of the oldest religions practiced in Iran and dates back to the late biblical times. The biblical books of Isaiah, Daniel, Ezra, Nehemiah, Chronicles, and Esther contain references to the life and experiences of Jews in Iran.
Today, the largest groups of Jews from Persia are found in Israel, which in 1993 was home to 75,000 people, including second-generation Israelis. and the United States, which is home to a community of some 45,000 people, of first-generation only - especially in the Los Angeles area and Great Neck, New York.
By various estimates, 10,800 Jews remain in Iran, mostly in Tehran, Isfahan, and Shiraz. BBC reported Yazd is home to ten Jewish families, six of them related by marriage, however some estimate the number is much higher. Historically, Jews maintained a presence in many more Iranian cities.
Iran supports by far the largest Jewish population of any Muslim country.
There are also smaller communities in Western Europe, Australia, and Canada. A number of groups of Jews of Iran have split off since ancient times. They are now recognized as separate communities, such as the Bukharan Jews and Mountain Jews.
In the midst of tensions between the U.S and Iran and between Iran and Israel, Jewish-Iranian Americans and Israelis offered money to the remaining Jews in Iran in order to help them relocate to California and/or Israel. In August 2007, the Iranian Jews in Iran responded by saying they "resent such transparent political enticements."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranians_(citizens_of_Iran)
U.S. State Department
The Government promoted and condoned anti-Semitism in state-media and hosted a Holocaust denial conference during the reporting period. However, with some exceptions, there was little government restriction of, or interference with, Jewish religious practice. Nevertheless, education of Jewish children has become more difficult in recent years. The Government reportedly allowed Hebrew instruction, recognizing that it was necessary for Jewish religious practice. However, it limited the distribution of Hebrew texts, in practice making it difficult to teach the language. Moreover, the Government required that in conformity with the schedule of other schools, several Jewish schools must remain open on Saturdays, which violates Jewish law.
Jewish citizens are permitted to obtain passports and travel outside the country. In contrast with past reporting years, Jewish groups reported that Iranian Jews are now issued the multiple-exit permits issued to other citizens, and other travel restrictions have eased. Jewish groups outside the country reported unsuccessful government attempts to interfere in the elections of the Jewish Central Committee (JCC), which appoints the head of the Jewish community in the country. The groups also reported that the Jewish community's newspaper, Ofogh-e-Bina, stopped publication, reportedly due largely to government pressure on the previous chair of the JCC.
http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2007/90210.htm
Again....
However, with some exceptions, there was little government restriction of, or interference with, Jewish religious practice.
Jewish citizens are permitted to obtain passports and travel outside the country. In contrast with past reporting years, Jewish groups reported that Iranian Jews are now issued the multiple-exit permits issued to other citizens, and other travel restrictions have eased.
and from the same release :
Although the Constitution gives Christians, Jews, and Zoroastrians the status of "protected" religious minorities, in practice non-Shi'a Muslims face substantial societal discrimination, and government actions continued to support elements of society who create a threatening atmosphere for some religious minorities.
- Ibid
That's right, Sunni Muslims face some of the same restrictions and problems - and they share the same religion.
Non-Shi'a religious leaders reported abuse, including detentions and torture of Sunni clerics, as well as other widespread restrictions on their ability to practice their faith. They also reported bans on Sunni teachings in public schools and Sunni religious literature. Residents of provinces with large Sunni populations, including Kurdistan, Khuzestan, and Sistan-va-Baluchestan, reported discrimination and lack of resources, but it was difficult to determine what was ethnic-based discrimination and what was religious-based.
- Ibid
There is a Jewish Iranian parliamentarian- Maurice Motamed.
Now I'm certainly not claiming that life is great there, but much of that tension might have something directly to do with the Israeli government's constant attack on the Iranian people. That might explain some of the problems.
Again, even Sunni Muslims share this fate.
Now, compare this with how Saudi Arabia treats Jews.......
Proselytizing by non-Muslims, including the distribution of non-Muslim religious materials such as Bibles, is illegal. Muslims or non-Muslims wearing religious symbols of any kind in public risk confrontation with the Mutawwa'in. Under the auspices of the Ministry of Islamic Affairs, approximately 50 so-called "Call and Guidance" centers employing approximately 500 persons work to convert foreigners to Islam. Some non-Muslim foreigners convert to Islam during their stay in the country. According to official reports, 942 foreign workers converted to Islam in the past year. The press often carries articles about such conversions, including testimonials. The press as well as government officials publicized the conversion of the Italian Ambassador to Saudi Arabia in late 2001.
The Government requires noncitizen residents to carry a Saudi residence permit (Iqama) for identification in place of their passports.[7] Among other information, these contain a religious designation for "Muslim" or "non-Muslim." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Status_of_religious_freedom_in_Saudi_Arabia
So who is the great ally of the USA, and who is is the Great Satan ? | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/30/2008 10:36:26 AM | | so iran might get a few nukes in 3-5 years, israel has around 150-200 nukes, suspect iran will be wiped off the map without any help from america, then welcome to WW3 as all the arabs attack israel and they all nuke each other.... | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 5/30/2008 1:08:04 PM | I think Iran is much worry about nothing (as far as the US directly is concerned at least). More smoke and mirrors BS which would keep the bull market on petroleum running strong and the defense industry bloated and happy. Any real issues, for instance if Israel feels it seriously faces an existential threat from the Persians, IMO should be dealt with directly by Israel. They bombed Saddam Hussein's nuclear reactor (or early attempt at one or whatever that was) back in '81, did they not? They receive upwards of 3 billion dollars a year and military aid from US.
Why should the US have to enter yet another (this time Totally -- T capitalized on purpose-- ill advised war and occupation scenario) just to deal with this threat to Israel? I'm sorry, but, Israel is not, despite what some AIPAC lobbyists may wish, a 51st state. It's not even a protectorate or an associated state. It's an independent nation, people, w/a totally different culture, and so on. Clearly they have the resources to deal with this on their own. If they choose to do so, I would stay out of it, if I were in charge that is. Unless Iranian agents actually bomb something within the US, or take American hostages again , or what have you, it's none of America's business. Whatever happened to striking only if or when stricken first ?? And please don't cite 9/11 in relation to that; if we were going to strike the ones who struck on that day it should have been Saudi Arabia if anyone -- but instead their king is still hand-holding bosom buddies with the US president.
From the article, America the Fearful Giant, by Newsweek's Fareed Zakaria,
"Since 2001, Washington, with bipartisan support, has invaded two countries and dispatched troops around the world, from Somalia to the Philippines, to fight Islamic militants. It has ramped up defense spending by $187 billion—more than the combined military budgets of China, Russia, India and Britain. It has created a Department of Homeland Security that now spends more than $40 billion a year. How then would Giuliani go on the offensive? Invade a couple more countries?
To recover its place in the world, the United States should first recover its confidence. It remains the world's only superpower, the only big country with a total portfolio of military, economic and political dominance. Most major states are either well disposed toward it or, at worst, neutral. The challenges America confronts come from small, faceless terrorist organizations and a few rogue nations. This is not to minimize the challenges. Today's asymmetries of power mean that small groups can do big damage. But it is to put things in perspective. When President Bush speaks of Iran's nuclear program as the road to World War III, one wonders if he has noticed that Iran's total GDP is just one sixty-eighth that of the United States, or that its military spending is less than 1 percent of the Pentagon's..." | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 6/21/2008 8:41:53 PM | | Well, lots and lots of political rhetoric richocheting off the POF walls so I will throw mine in also. There is a KISS principle that seems to work well in most situations (keep it simple, stupid). Seems rather simple to connect the dots about Iran, nukes, lunatic leaders, and ruthless barbaric religious terrorists. First, the President of Iran has repeatedly denounced all Jews, has denied the Holocaust ever happened , and has mimicked Hitler in numerous ways. Second, Iran continues to arm the insurgents in Iraq including Al Quida. Third, Osama bin Laden has attempted for years to lay his murderous hands on nuclear material and nuclear weapons with the intent of smuggling the same into the USA and destroying a populated area. Now,,,simply connect the dots,,,if Iran produces a nuclear weapon they are likely to supply it to Al Quida who will deploy it to kill as many defenseless civilians as possible. Therefore it is imperative that Iran not be allowed to produce such a weapon. | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 6/21/2008 10:30:06 PM | xcen, do you know what you are talking about?
That's quite a big assumption.
Iran wants a nuclear weapon Al-Queda wants a nuclear weapon Iran supports terrorists Al-Queda are terrorists Therefore .........
Outside of your fantasy, any actual evidence? | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 6/21/2008 10:44:14 PM |
Al-Queda wants a nuclear weapon
Portents of A Nuclear Al-Qaeda
By David Ignatius Thursday, October 18, 2007; A25
Rolf Mowatt-Larssen is paid to think about the unthinkable. As the Energy Department's director of intelligence, he's responsible for gathering information about the threat that a terrorist group will attack America with a nuclear weapon.
With his shock of white hair and piercing eyes, Mowatt-Larssen looks like a man who has seen a ghost. And when you listen to a version of the briefing he has been giving recently to President Bush and other top officials, you begin to understand why. He is convinced that al-Qaeda is trying to acquire a nuclear bomb that will leave the ultimate terrorist signature -- a mushroom cloud.
We've all had enough fear-mongering to last a lifetime. Indeed, we have become so frightened of terrorism since Sept. 11, 2001, that we have begun doing the terrorists' job for them by undermining the legal framework of our democracy. And truly, I wish I could dismiss Mowatt-Larssen's analysis as the work of an overwrought former CIA officer with too many years in the trenches.
But it's worth listening to his warnings -- not because they induce more numbing paralysis but because they might stir sensible people to take actions that could detect and stop an attack. That's why his boss, Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman, is encouraging him to speak out. Mowatt-Larssen doesn't want to anguish later that he didn't sound the alarm in time.
Mowatt-Larssen has been gathering this evidence since a few weeks after Sept. 11, when then-CIA Director George Tenet asked him to create a new branch on weapons of mass destruction in the agency's counterterrorism center. He helped Tenet prepare the chapter on al-Qaeda's nuclear efforts that appears in Tenet's memoir, " At the Center of the Storm." Now that the uproar over Tenet's mistaken "slam dunk" assessment of the Iraqi threat has died down, it's worth rereading this account. It provides a chilling, public record of al-Qaeda's nuclear ambitions.
Mowatt-Larssen argues that for nearly a decade before Sept. 11, al-Qaeda was seeking to acquire weapons of mass destruction. As early as 1993, Osama bin Laden offered $1.5 million to buy uranium for a nuclear device, according to testimony presented in federal court in February 2001. When the al-Qaeda leader was asked in 1998 if he had nuclear or chemical weapons, he responded: "Acquiring weapons for the defense of Muslims is a religious duty. If I have indeed acquired these weapons, then I thank God for enabling me to do so."
Even as al-Qaeda was preparing to fly its airplane bombs into buildings, the group was also trying to acquire nuclear and biological capabilities. In August 2001, bin Laden and his deputy, Ayman al-Zawahiri, met around a campfire with Pakistani scientists from a group called Umma Tameer-E-Nau to discuss how al-Qaeda could build a nuclear device. Al-Qaeda also had an aggressive anthrax program that was discovered in December 2001 after bin Laden was driven from his haven in Afghanistan.
Al-Qaeda proclaimed a religious rationale to justify the WMD attacks it was planning. In June 2002, a Kuwaiti-born cleric named Suleiman Abu Ghaith posted a statement on the Internet saying that "al-Qaeda has the right to kill 4 million Americans" in retaliation for U.S. attacks against Muslims. And in May 2003, at the same time Saudi operatives of al-Qaeda were trying to buy three Russian nuclear bombs, a cleric named Nasir al-Fahd issued a fatwa titled "A Treatise on the Legal Status of Using Weapons of Mass Destruction Against Infidels." Interrogations of al-Qaeda operatives confirmed that the planning was serious. Al-Qaeda didn't yet have the materials for a WMD attack, but it wanted them.
Most chilling of all was Zawahiri's decision in March 2003 to cancel a cyanide attack in the New York subway system. He told the plotters to stand down because "we have something better in mind." What did that mean? More than four years later, we still don't know.
After 2004, the WMD trail went cold, according to Mowatt-Larssen. Many intelligence analysts have concluded that al-Qaeda doesn't have nuclear capability today. Mowatt-Larssen argues that a more honest answer is: We don't know.
Iran wants a nuclear weapon
Sunday, June 22, 2008 N.Y Time's Pakistani metallurgist and the father of Pakistan’s nuclear weapons program. In Pakistan, Dr. Khan is considered a national hero despite his admission in 2004 that he said he sold nuclear technology to several countries. To the United States and nuclear investigators around the world, he is a rogue scientist who has failed to reveal the true extent of the dangers posed by the shadowy network he created.
In 2003, the seizure of a shipment of equipment for uranium enrichment bound for Libya set of a chain of led Libya to publicly disclose its illegal nuclear program and cooperate with international investigators. As evidence mounted that the cargo had come from Pakistan, Dr. Khan shocked the world with a tearful confession on state-run television. He made a detailed confession in which he admitted that during the previous 15 years he had provided Iran, North Korea and Libya with the designs and technology to produce the fuel for nuclear weapons. He was pardoned because of his national stature, but under an arrangement with Mr. Musharraf he was placed under house arrest indefinitely.
But four years after his confession, international inspectors and Western officials confronted a new mystery, this time over who may have received blueprints for a sophisticated and compact nuclear weapon found on his network’s computers.
After 9-11 do you seriously believe that Al qaeda would not use a nuke? | |
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| Hillary Threatens to Obliterate Iran Posted: 6/21/2008 10:52:29 PM | Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) Nuclear Weapons A.Q. Khan & Iran
A.Q. Khan & Iran Khan's proliferation activities help explain the close resemblance borne by Iran's nuclear centrifuge techonology to that of Pakistan.
Following Iran's disclosure of uranium enrichment research and subsequent inspections, the central role of Pakistan in Iran's nuclear programme was unearthed. This was compounded by Iran turning over to the IAEA a complete history of its nuclear program including a listing of middlemen and scientists linked to Pakistan and A.Q. Khan.
Evidence uncovered by inspectors showed that Pakistan and Iran agreed around 1987 to a deal whereby a Pakistani centrifuge design was provided to Iran to resolve the latter's previous unsuccessful attempts to master uranium enrichment technology. The transfer of nuclear technology began in 1989, though Khan is said to have claimed to have discontinued the sale two years later. The IAEA, though, reportedly has evidence that Pakistani assistance continued as late as 1996. At that time, the countries' differing policies in dealing with the Taliban regime in Afghanistan soured their relations, though it has been claimed the Pakistanin assistance continued nonetheless.
According to confessions by A.Q. Khan and aides of his to Pakistani invesitgators reportedly implicated among others, Gen. Mirza Aslam Beg, the commander of Pakistan's army from 1988-1991, and that any nuclear technology shared with Iran had been approved by him. These charges were denied by him. Pakistani did discover evidence that Beg had been informed by Khan of the transfer to Iran in early 1991 of outdated hardware, though it has been claimed that A.Q. Khan had led him to believe that the material would not allow Iran to prdocuede enriched uranium. Conflicting this assertion is Kahn who is said to have admitted that Gen. Beg had approved the technology transfer.
A.Q. Khan has claimed that equipment and drawing shipped to Iran were supplied as a result of pressure from the late Gen. Imtiaz during his tenure as defense advisor to Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto from December 1988 to August 1990 . Khan has also admitted to meeting Iranian scientists in Karachi at the request of Dr. Niazi, a close Bhutto aide. In return for the help, Iran transferred millions of dollars to foreign bank accounts, with some money funnelled through the Bank of Credit and Commerce International. That bank collapsed in 1991.
Some of the centrifuges examined also appeared to have been used outside Iran to enrich uranium, while components of some centrifuges appeared to have come directly from Pakistan. Though some of the machines Iran had bought did not work properly, Iran reportedly still managed to effect significant improvements on Pakistani equipment designs. Despite the design similarities, Iran has nonetheless denied having received them from Pakistan.
Faced with disclosure, Khan reportedly contacted Iranian officials to not only urge them to destroy some of their facilities but also to pretend that the Pakistanis who had assisted them had died.
In early March 2005, Pakistan acknowledged A. Q. Khan had provided centrifuges to Iran, though it denied having had any knowledge of the transactions.
source global Security.Org | |
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