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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 6:06:09 AM |
Only the BNP type eejits.
Shockingly enough the BNP support citizenship for Ghurkas.
I must say just because the younger generation won't understand isn't enough of a reason to not do something. In fact, that could be a 'teachable moment'. An opportunity to use them as an example of British values, I mean if foreigners can adopt those values and see the merit of something your historical tradition created then doesn't it stand to reason that the native population should too? | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 6:15:35 AM |
In particular, the younger generations who do not understand or appreciate what they did for us will only look upon them as being the sponging immigrants that are so often welcomed into our country by the government.
I kind of object to that. I know full well how much each member state sacrificed, and some are still sacrificing. Look at the likes of Canada, became terribly indebted because it followed the monarchy into a war which had nothing to do with Canada. Over a million Canadian servicemen gave their lives in World wars 1 and 2.
I'm sorry but anyone who's willing to go to war, and die to protect the civil liberties we've come to take for granted, is as worthy of being a British Citizen than anyone born in this country, if not more so. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 6:30:42 AM | I'm not saying they are not worthy of being British Citizens, I guess what I'm trying to say is that we're not worthy of having them as British Citizens.
It's difficult to explain, but to be honest, the way Britain is at the moment, I wouldn't wish it on these brave people who risked everything for us.
I don't even want to be in Britain! So why on earth would I encourage these heroes to be? | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 6:35:38 AM | a very large proportion of the World's population would swap with you in a heartbeat. So if ya fancy a swap there will be billions of takers.
What is it with people who moan about this country? One had a right moan the other day, about the Weather, like anyone can do owt about it, utter tool.
We'll soon be the United Kingdom of Moaners, it's a cracking country, yes we have problems, as does every other country in the world. But don't moan if you don't vote.
vvv I never said you didn't now did I. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 6:51:04 AM | Well it looks as though we're going to have to agree to disagree.
However I would like to point out that I have voted every time since I was able to and I plan to vote until I am not longer able to do so and therefore I have every right to have the occasional moan off! | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 7:23:29 AM | So they live here now? Where did they live previous to the war, and at what point did they decide to travel from their home to come over and live here? Our country can't be all that bad if they decided to live here instead of their own country.
It is my understanding, that the government have completely lost track/count of the amount of people that now live in our country, due to illegal immigrants coming over. So as a way to do a head count, they are offering anyone who can prove that they have lived here for the last 10 years, free UK citizenship. If that is true, then the ghurkas that have been here all this time should qualify too.
May I also use this opportunity to say to all those people who keep reeling out the whole 'the rules are the rules and the law is the law' line in other threads.. The law is a complete ass and **** the law, use some common sense instead.. sometimes the law needs a big one fingered salute. The law that says Gurkas cannot be UK citizens whilst immigrants from all over the world from as little as 10 years ago can be, in my eyes, is some sort of personal insult directly aimed at the Ghurkas for some unknown reason.  | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 8:24:39 AM | Some people have blamed labour for this.........the Ghurkas have been part of the army through three different parties over 200 years.
They do now receive the same pay as regular army, and yes, should be granted full citizenship. I do think it's a little demeaning that we hold this 'lottery' to let a select few people from a very poor country, serve in our army. But while we do, if they fight for our liberty, they should enjoy it's fruits. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 8:36:37 AM | | Yeah definitely, its basically the British Foreign Legion haha. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 9:08:27 AM | It may all come to an end soon as the Maoist Government recently elected by the Nepalese People has pledged to end this connection with the former Imperialist Power (altthough when they sit down and do their sums,they may change their minds)
There are many Ghurka families settled now in Aldershot where I live and they are a credit to the Town | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 12:47:57 PM | | Namaste! I am very pleasantly surprised that we nearly all agree on this matter. I believe there's an online petition for this somewhere, for anyone that might be interested in voicing their opinion. I signed a paper one at the weekend. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/29/2008 4:22:04 PM | The Gurkhas : a nation who live the ideals that Great Britain can now only aspire to. Our greatest allie who asks for little in return. The British Government should be ashamed at the shoddy treatment of these people, there are thousands of less deserving cases who are receiving Uk citizenship status over these countrymen. Yet the question should be asked if the nation was to go to war how many of the new UK citizens would take up arms in the defence of their new country? Then ask how many Gurkhas would be there. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/30/2008 10:38:12 AM |
The British Indian Army during World War II was the largest volunteer army the world has known with long martial traditions going back to the advent of the British in the subcontinent, even earlier. First raised as door keepers and trained bands to guard factories of early merchants, it grew into the army of John Company Bahadur, and subsequently grew into Presidency armies of Bengal, Madras and Bombay in 1795, after the fall of French Pondicherry in 1793. After 1857, the Crown abolished these Presidency Armies and took over their control and reorganisation. For almost 90 years thereafter, after various reorganisations, the British Indian Army distinguished itself in many wars, campaigns, expeditions in India, Asia, Africa, and Europe under the British flag.
The Political Scene in 1939-1940
Since the British Indian Army was a voluntary army, it would be pertinent to briefly recall the political scene in India. When the Second World War broke out in September 1939 and Viceroy Linlithgow announced that India was at war, there were two main political parties in India - the Indian National Congress, led by Mr Gandhi and the All India Muslim League headed by Mr. Jinnah. in 1940 when Great Britain braced herself to face a German invasion and General Weygand told Churchill that BritainÕs neck would be wrung like a chicken in 15 days, Mr Gandhi published an Òopen letterÓ to every BritainÓ Òurging cessation of hostilitiesÓ. He said:
ÒNo cause, however just can warrant the indiscriminate slaughter that is going on minute to minute ... I do not want Britain to be defeated, nor do I want her to be victorious in a trial of brute strength ... I want you to fight Nazism without arms ... I want you to lay down the arms you have as being useless for saving you or humanity. You will invite Herr Hitler and Signor Mussolini to take what they want of the countries you call your possessions. Let them take possession of your beautiful island with your many beautiful buildings. You will give all these, but neither your souls nor your minds. If these gentlemen choose to occupy your homes, you will vacate them. If they do not give you free passage out, you will allow yourself, man, woman and child to be slaughtered, but you will refuse to owe allegiance to them ... I am telling His Excellency the Viceroy that my services are at the disposal of His MajestyÕs Government, should they consider them of any practical use in enhancing my appeal....1
On the other hand the sympathies of the All India Muslim League were clearly on the side of the Allies as against the Axis powers.2 Mr. Jinnah had even said that if Britain lost, the Muslims were likely to suffer.3 L.S. Amery, Secretary of State for India in a confidential press briefing emphasized the fact that Òto a large extent IndiaÕs fighting war effort was dependent on Muslim effortÓ4. Churchill emphasized that the British Òmust not on any account break with the Muslims who represented a hundred million people and represented the main army elements on which the British must rely for the immediate fightingÓ5.
The ArmyÕs Expansion
The Indian Army expanded from about 189,000 in October 1939 to 2,500,000 by 1945. In 1939 there were 78 infantry battalions, 20 Gurkha battalions, 18 Cavalry units. The officer strength was 3,000 British; 1,115 Indian. By 1945 these were about 34,500 British, 15,740 Indian officers, of all classes.
The Army took part in campaigns in France, East Africa, North Africa, Syria, Tunisia, Malaya, Burma, Greece, Sicily and Italy. During the war it was organised under one Army Group, four armies, seven Indian Corps, four Armoured Divisions, one Air Borne Division, and twenty three Infantry Divisions. Some of these were lost in Malaya-Singapore, a few re-organised as Lines of Communication Commands in Middle East.
Even before September 1939 troops of the Indian Army were on station duty in Egypt, Palestine, Iraq, Aden, the Gulf, Burma, Malaya and Hong Kong. The first and only units of the Indian Army that took part in the war in France were four animal transport companies of Royal Indian Army Service Corps with the British Expeditionary Force in 1940. While the personnel were evacuated, the gallant horses and mules were undoubtedly given resident status in France were four animal transport companies of Royal Indian Army Service Corps with the British Expeditionary Force in 1940. While the personnel were evacuated the gallant horses and mules were undoubtedly given resident status in France.
The 14th Army in Burma was the single largest army in the world. Its battle front of 700 miles was approximately as long as the Russian front against Germany 6.
The Indian Army suffered the following casualties upto August 1945:
a. Killed - 24,338 b. Wounded - 64,354 c. Missing - 11,754 d. POW - 79,489 --------------- Total: 179,935
WriterÕs Note: (In addition approximately 62,507 from b.c.d, above died). 160,000 of the total casualties are commemorated in war cemeteries in fifty countries extending from the Pacific Islands to UK, according to Commonwealth War Graves Commission.
The Indian Army won 31 Victoria Crosses and out of a total of 27 Victoria Crosses awarded for the Burma campaign 20 were personnel of the Indian Army. The total gallantry awards were 4028.8 Four Victoria Crosses were awarded to soldiers and units of present day Pakistan. For V.C. citation of Sepoy Ali Haider see Annexure A.
Composition of the Army - 1940-1947
Annexure B shows the composition of the British Indian Army. It will be noticed that the percentage of Muslims decreased after 1 January 1942 not because of paucity of volunteer recruits but because of Government of India policy, as the demand for Pakistan built up 1940 onwards. But these figures do not represent Muslim races of present day Pakistan only. On the eve of World War II almost 34,000 Punjabi Muslims were in the army (29 per cent) and during World War-II over 380,000 joined (about 14% of the total). No other class came close to these figures: Sikhs: 116,000, Gurkhas: 109,000, Muslims of other classes from UP, Deccan, Madras, Bengal, NWFP, etc 274,000, were recruited during 1939-1945. Muslims as a whole constituted a quarter of the Indian Army as of 1947 9....
Just so we know.............. | |
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| the ghurkas Posted: 4/30/2008 11:51:48 AM | ^^^^^^^^^^^
Yes but if you remember........Poland was attacked and thats why Britain went to war with Germany.The Polish came over here to fight to liberate their own country and I believe we are talking maybe a few hundred only.In the RAF, I mean but the Poles do not have a 200 year plus history of fighting for Britain as the Gurkhas do? No they don't .The Gurkhas are still in our Army and took part with us in every major conflict since.............do you see a Polish segment of our Army ?
I don't think Nepal was attacked by Germany as Poland was and thats the Gurkhas homeland btw .
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| the ghurkas Posted: 5/1/2008 5:38:57 AM | | YES YES YES give them citezenship, they fought and were loyal to this country | |
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