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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/21/2008 9:54:24 PM |
Yes south08 you are correct...of the four men here who just vented their ignorance and immorality upon this post...two are married (and are here on a dating site) and one even admitted that he was in the porn industry...the other two are johns....that says it all. How pathetic they are.
Pathetic.... I see. Well, in order to solve the problem, you have to have a viable solution. I'll tell you why the problem exists... it's because of who you call the "john's". Let's just take one segment of the john's.....these are men that women tend to not find attractive, even though they are probably good or harmless people. Are you saying that in order to protect the prostitutes, you are willing to be a good samaritan and have sex or a relationship with said john's?
If not, you aren't opening your eyes to the solution. Just like drugs. The only way to relieve the world of drugs is to cure the pain that they numb. The only way to stop prostitution is for unattractive guys to get laid. If regular women aren't willing to fulfill those guy's needs, prostitution isn't going anywhere. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/21/2008 10:26:17 PM | you wrote: I have a friend who has found a solution. He goes to see sex wokers. TELL ME WHO YOUR FRIENDS ARE AND I WILL TELL YOU WHO YOU ARE, I dunno, but you dont help yourself here | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/21/2008 11:34:19 PM | "Pathetic.... I see. Well, in order to solve the problem, you have to have a viable solution. I'll tell you why the problem exists... it's because of who you call the "john's". Let's just take one segment of the john's.....these are men that women tend to not find attractive, even though they are probably good or harmless people. Are you saying that in order to protect the prostitutes, you are willing to be a good samaritan and have sex or a relationship with said john's? "
If not, you aren't opening your eyes to the solution. Just like drugs. The only way to relieve the world of drugs is to cure the pain that they numb. The only way to stop prostitution is for unattractive guys to get laid. If regular women aren't willing to fulfill those guy's needs, prostitution isn't going anywhere."
I agree with most of this but what about all those johns who are are already married? Obviously they were attractive enough to get a woman to marry them. I've paid for sex only once but technically i'm still a john. Women have found me attractive, Keep in mind a lot of guys can't get laid for reasons that have nothing to do with their looks. and prostitute johns aren't always ugly fat balding or Steve Urkel type guys. They really could be anyone. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:18:24 AM |
I agree with most of this but what about all those johns who are are already married? Obviously they were attractive enough to get a woman to marry them. I've paid for sex only once but technically i'm still a john. Women have found me attractive, Keep in mind a lot of guys can't get laid for reasons that have nothing to do with their looks. and prostitute johns aren't always ugly fat balding or Steve Urkel type guys. They really could be anyone.
Like I said, the unattractive guys are only one segment. But like I said, the solutions to the problems aren't going to be what women want to hear. You have to figure out WHY a married man would go to a prostitute and solve it. If his wife doesn't give head and that's what he likes? Well, you have your answer. Either she does it or he goes somewhere else. It may not sound right, but that's bout the only way to get "those" type of john's to stop.
And keep in mind that when I talked about unattractive guys, it's not just a guys looks that would make them unattractive. Maybe the fact that they are nice guys that just aren't very "suave" with women puts women off. Either way, if women aren't willing to give those guys a chance and those guys are horny, they can either step up or just not complain when he gets it handled. It's that simple. People make it complicated. lol | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:26:49 AM | I'm so glad that I read through this entire thread. It has convinced me that there is no other creature in the universe that is more deserving of a catastrophic event than the pieces of crap that inhabit this planet. Bring on the asteroid...we deserve it! | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:29:23 AM |
I'm so glad that I read through this entire thread. It has convinced me that there is no other creature in the universe that is more deserving of a catastrophic event than the pieces of crap that inhabit this planet. Bring on the asteroid...we deserve it!
Well.... I don't think that just because most women are extremely picky beyond belief means that they are pieces of crap and that we need to be hit by an asteroid. It just simply means they have high standards and the guys that don't fit will have to go elsewhere. Don't be so cynical.  | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:32:45 AM | | Put it this way, women are stupid and so are men. We try to impose ridiculous standards on one another, but unfortunately it seems that women seem to overwhelm the supposed truth with their incessant whining. In the end, it is all BS. I could care less, but I'd love to see all of the idiots shut their stupid mouths forever. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:35:09 AM | You have to figure out WHY a married man would go to a prostitute and solve it. If his wife doesn't give head and that's what he likes? Well, you have your answer.
I heard a prostitute in a talk show once, when a woman confronted her: "If you did a good job, I wouldn't have one". | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:43:47 AM | | Not sure who you are talking about here, but just because I defend prostitution, mainly because we have much more important things to spend tax dollars on rather then busting them, does not mean I am a "John." I am not, so save your labeling for someone else. Some of you folks are getting a little insulting here. I also believe that any woman, or man for that matter, has the right to do anything they want with their own body. Legalized and regulated prostitution would be one hell of a lot better than the situation we have now. No matter how much you dislike prostitution or feel threatened by it, it is never going to go away. Never, ever! Instead of pouring our tax dollars down a black hole trying to stop it, it is much better to regulate it and see that it is done safely. If the truth be known, I have one hell of a lot more respect for a prostitute than I have for a used car salesman or a repo man. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 3:53:09 AM | Reading the post referencing the Richmond Police, is like reading a very bad crime novel. While prostitution is a crime, the thing that prostitutes are charged with is Soliciting; usually a very low grade misdemeanor.
If the truth were to be known, the fines paid by the prostitutes arrested do not begin to pay for the cost of their being arrested, housed, and prosecuted. The paying of a "Bounty" to any Police Officer for every prostitute arrested is the equivalent of a quota system, and is against Federal Law in the United States.
The assaults referenced in this post are just what they are called in the original post, assaults. An assault of any kind, upon anyone, by a Police Officer, is not only a Felony, but also a Civil Rights Violation, under Section 1983, Title 52 (I think) of the United States Code. The trading of sexual favors, in order to look the other way, is also a Felony, and a Civil Rights Violation, under the same statute, previously cited.
While prostitution may be here to stay, as it has been here for eons, there is no reason why those plying the trade should be abused. Just my thoughts on the matter. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 9:57:53 AM | "I heard a prostitute in a talk show once, when a woman confronted her: "If you did a good job, I wouldn't have one".
Exactly, ladies you don't want to give up sex willingly that's fine but don't expect him to suck it up and take it. If he can't get it from you he will go somewhere else.
I know plenty of women I wouldnt pay to have sex with but I would certainly pay them to go away and never see them again.
"While prostitution may be here to stay, as it has been here for eons, there is no reason why those plying the trade should be abused. Just my thoughts on the matter"
All the more reason to legalize it, control it, and regulate it and the ones who actually want to be there can do it safely without legal reprocussions and the ones who don't can leave. Nobody should be abused in any profession. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 11:05:03 AM |
.two are married (and are here on a dating site) and one even admitted that he was in the porn industry...the other two are johns....that says it all. How pathetic they are.
I usually blow off someone mentioning the fact that I'm married and on a dating site ,but when it comes from someone else who is still legally married and publicly looking,it really comes across as hypocritical.For the record,just as my profile states,unlike Circe,I'm NOT looking for anyone.I'm here mainly for the forums and I remained on dating sites even after marriage because I've tried other forums on different sites and they don't see near this much traffic.Besides one of the cool things about being on a dating forum and NOT looking for anyone,is that I'm not here to impress anyone.I can say what I truly believe.
I'm pathetic because I began my career as a cameraman for porn loop films in the 70's? OK fine,but that "pathetic" gig landed me over 5000 dollars in a 6 week period(in 1977,adjust for inflation) and to date is the only gig I have ever worked where I got paid more than the on camera talent did.It also landed me my first "legit" film job after high school.So while most aspiring cameramen were sweeping floors or flipping burgers while saving their pennies for film school,I was actually making decent money behind a camera AND afterward,I landed a full time editing job at the lab that processed the porn film.BTW,if any of the on camera talent that I worked with back then were drug addicts or abused,you would never know it and they certainly weren't forced or coerced into performing AND if they truly hated what they were doing,they really should've been in Hollywood,because their acting was Oscar winning quality if that were the case.
Whatever you think of prostitution,when you say,"Prostitution is wrong because sex should be X.......therefore it needs to be illegal" or say something similar about porn for the same reasons,then you are saying that one form of sexuality fits every human being.You are saying that the government DOES have the right to dictate our sexuality to us and that the authorities have every right to dictate what we can and can't do in the privacy of our homes and hotel rooms.It's a slippery slope and one I'm not willing to go down.I will always err on the side of personal freedom.Circe and her ilk look to err on the side of totalitarianism. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 12:07:53 PM |
Most have led lives of horrific abuse, and it is a tragedy. And men who support them financially are perpetuating it. If all of you knew these women, and heard their stories, you would not be so cavalier about the subject. The damage these women have endured is more obvious with street walkers. With escorts, it is more subtle. Though they may appear healthier on the outside, they are just as damaged inside. They have zero self-worth.
My mom,who was a very moralistic southern Baptist used to say."Blaming circumstances for what you do is like blaming a mirror for what you look like."You want to put blame on anything?Blame societies ridiculous,outdated double standards and social games that have hung on for causing people to feel this way and that about a simple biological function. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:39:49 PM | If it were merely about "a simple biological function," I seriously doubt that there would have been much thought given to prostitution. However, it's not merely about "a simple biological function."
Prostitution, in and of itself, seemingly does no harm to society. However, along with prostitution, comes gambling, drug trafficking, loan sharking, extortion, illegal weapons trading, human trafficking, and a host of other things that are mala in se (inherently bad) things, that societies have deemed criminal activities.
Logic dictates that the best way to illeviate a host of problems is to find the root cause, and eliminate it. Thus prostitution brings a host of inherently bad things with it, so, prostitution must be eliminated in order to elimate the things that follow it. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:47:34 PM | Part of a problem I see in this forum is that folks aren't talking merely about the wisdom versus foolishness of being with a person in exchange for money, or about the root causes of male alienation, or how to use science to find answers to our social problems. A lot of it is moralizing, and doomsaying. Let's resolve to take a more libertarian attitude, which is the one that pays the most respect to folks like me who aren't opposed to paying directly for sex (e.g., circumventing the dinners and the shopping to curry favour with a young lady). Remember, you can't judge a person until you've walked a mile in their shoes. And, who among us is fit to judge? Why don't you worry about your sphere, and I'll worry about mine.
"There has been only one Christian and he died on the cross." - Friedrich Nietzsche | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 3:12:57 PM |
Logic dictates that the best way to illeviate a host of problems is to find the root cause, and eliminate it. Thus prostitution brings a host of inherently bad things with it, so, prostitution must be eliminated in order to elimate the things that follow it.
It would be nice if you went back all the way, instead of being one stop short.
Find the root cause for prostitution, ergo, find what unattended needs men have, and meet them so they won't need to go to prostitutes. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 4:41:53 PM | Prostitution, in and of itself, seemingly does no harm to society. However, along with prostitution, comes gambling, drug trafficking, loan sharking, extortion, illegal weapons trading, human trafficking, and a host of other things that are mala in se (inherently bad) things, that societies have deemed criminal activities.
Logic dictates that the best way to illeviate (edit: sic) a host of problems is to find the root cause, and eliminate it. Thus prostitution brings a host of inherently bad things with it, so, prostitution must be eliminated in order to elimate the things that follow it.
It's not prostitution that needs to be eliminated (as if) to eliminate the hurtful things that follow. True logic dictates that it's the CRIMINALIZATION of prostitution that needs to be eliminated. Even then, obviously, there are going to be rightfully criminal aspects to it (underage, for example, or human trafficking), but those are separate issues.
I held back relating my own anecdotal experience on this thread, because unlike some, I'm aware that my experiences are completely formed from this, and are NOT a definative statement, but here goes:
Decades ago, I came to know a street prostitute and a few of her co-workers. She was the sister of a friend, and quite a few times I was in a livingroom with these women as they prepared for a night on the prowl. Not horrible people, but not great ones, either. Certainly not the "victims of society" that a lot of lefty, social-activists like to envision. In fact, one of the women had been the focus of a local TV "documentary," complete with tearful "confessions" of her abused history (all admitedly false, in her real-life circle) and hand-wringing analysis by "experts" and journalists. How they laughed at those TV segments!
They had MUCH more respect for their honest "dates" - some of whom they found slightly physically repulsive, granted, but some of whom (the better looking and entertaining and generous ones) whom they actually enjoyed and liked - than the "sucker" social workers and odd bleeding-heart cop who ALSO gave them gifts and sympathy, much to their amusement.
These women made a "career" choice because they weren't overly bright, and were basically lazy and also inate users. They didn't want to or were incapable of other work (they LIKED sleeping late and watching daytime TV and getting good bucks at night for having sex), and most were also low-level thieves (shoplifters). Yes, some of them shared their income with their "pimps," but they also used and "held out" on those men (and in a couple of cases women). The "pimps" served the purpose of protecting them from total freaks and other sex-workers, but it was actually a lucrative deal - considering the situation - for everybody, and these women, in the safety of our little circle, also laughed at the PRETEND power they ALLOWED the pimps to believe they had.
Again, this does NOT apply to the segment of wounded, damaged (specifically underaged) girls and boys in the sex trade. But, believe it or not, many of the adult workers in the sex industry are not only NOT "victims," but they're sneering at and using those who believe they are.
Lots of people are being PLAYED on this issue.
Furthermore, I never met any high-end sex workers. I assume they're a smarter, safer, more attractive, less dishonest version of the few women I knew.
Finally, I personally would have more respect for someone who had occasional (safe) sex with a high-end sex-worker than a chump who buys dinner after dinner for "good girls" and never gets laid. THAT'S pathetic. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 4:53:12 PM | You know, prostitutes are people too........i am sure when they were kids they didnt say, when I grow up I want to be a prostitute...........
I am sure most of these women, were sexually abused and mistreated for so many years, that the only thing that can make them feel worthwhile is to ply the only thing they have been used for for years.........
Take a look at all the skanks and whores at the bar......who take home strange men for a few drinks or for a party..........
I am not sure which is worse......giving it away for free or charging..........another thing........if there were no JOHNS there would be no prostitution...........
people say that prostitutes are diseased and dirty......well you know what, it is the men that carry the disease to them........the same men that are married and are supposed family men.........take a look around. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 5:16:42 PM | "I am not sure which is worse......giving it away for free or charging..........another thing........if there were no JOHNS there would be no prostitution..........."
Until women start giving up sex willingly to any man (and I'm not saying that they should) prostitution will always thrive. Unless you plan on castrating the entire male gender, don't expect it to ever die. There will always be people who pay for sex and there will always be people looking to capitalize on that. It's human nature. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 6:13:49 PM | You know, prostitutes are people too
We know that. It's the bleeding heart, do-gooders who see them as braindead non-people uncapable of making their own choices.
You may have noticed those of us who deal with prostitutes are not the ones who make insulting remarks about them.
I am not sure which is worse......giving it away for free or charging..........another thing........if there were no JOHNS there would be no prostitution...........
And if every man had his sexual needs satisfied, there wouldn't be johns. So what's first, the egg or the chicken?
people say that prostitutes are diseased and dirty....
Change that to "bleeding hearts" instead of people. Honest johns don't think like that. | |
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| Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 6:16:40 PM | I could never go to a prostitue for sex, I would feel my pride meant so little to me if I did.
You only get sex from a prostitute, you dont have the company or friendship you get with a proper relationship.
If a prostitute stops one woman being raped then they are worthwhile.
I think it should be made legal so long as the prostitutes follow health and safety guidelines. | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 6:50:32 PM |
it's not merely about "a simple biological function."
Sure it is.The urge to merge with multiple mates in the male of most species is programmed into our DNA,if it weren't,our species would've died out.However our social customs at this particular point in human history demand monagamy,therefore these urges are sought in "outlaw" means.Hence the concept of prostitution.
Prostitution, in and of itself, seemingly does no harm to society
Correct.It has flourished in ancient cultures and has not only been tolerated by successful cultures (Egypt,Greece,Rome)but legally allowed for and even encouraged.
However, along with prostitution, comes gambling, drug trafficking, loan sharking, extortion, illegal weapons trading, human trafficking, and a host of other things that are mala in se (inherently bad) things, that societies have deemed criminal activities.
Curious to know how you connect prostitution with gambling and loan sharking.Unless perhaps you're specifically referring to organized crime,see my next point.
Logic dictates that the best way to illeviate a host of problems is to find the root cause, and eliminate it. Thus prostitution brings a host of inherently bad things with it, so, prostitution must be eliminated in order to elimate the things that follow it.
The flaw in your logic is that you're only considering the subject(prostitution) and the "connected" activities(crime).You don't take into account the relationship between subject and activity.
First off,prostitution will never and can never be eliminated,unless somehow you eliminate the demand.If it could be eliminated,I think some of the Islamic republics in the Middle East would've been able to do it.Yet it existed even under Taliban ruled Afghanastan.
Prostitution is illegal,therefore anyone engaging in the act becomes a criminal.You take away the prohibition and you take away the criminality.
When was the last time you heard of someone dying from drinking bathtub gin?Getting killed in a shootout with a rival liquor salesman?Getting mugged because they had to go to a speakeasy in a seedy side of town to get thier liquor? | |
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| Re: Are prostitutes the solution?
Posted: 2/22/2008 7:10:42 PM | It's not prostitution that needs to be eliminated (as if) to eliminate the hurtful things that follow. True logic dictates that it's the CRIMINALIZATION of prostitution that needs to be eliminated
It's quite obvious.One only has to look at places where it's legal and regulated.As for morality,what's the big deal?You want to teach your kids that it's evil ?Fine, no one's stopping you,alcohol is legal,does everyone accept alcohol consumption to be morally OK?Just ask any good Baptist in Jacksonville,Florida if drinking is morally acceptible.
These women made a "career" choice because they weren't overly bright, and were basically lazy and also inate users. They didn't want to or were incapable of other work (they LIKED sleeping late and watching daytime TV and getting good bucks at night for having sex), and most were also low-level thieves (shoplifters).
That's been my experience too with these types of women.
But, believe it or not, many of the adult workers in the sex industry are not only NOT "victims," but they're sneering at and using those who believe they are.
Lots of people are being PLAYED on this issue.
Ditto.Been there,done that.I knew this girl that ran an escort service.Told me some wild tale that happened to her about being gang raped at age 9 by black men( to try and justify her own racism) that also supposedly murderd her mom.She even knew enough about local historical events in an attempt to give her story credibility.However,being a newsman with almost 30 years in the business,I know how to do research and who to talk to.Total BS and it was corrobarted as BS by some of her family members who knew her mom and knew her to be alive and well.
This is not meant in any way to belittle the people in the sex industry who were abused and exploited.It's just like everything else.there are alot of scammers who try to play on people's sympathy.
Finally, I personally would have more respect for someone who had occasional (safe) sex with a high-end sex-worker than a chump who buys dinner after dinner for "good girls" and never gets laid. THAT'S pathetic.
Or the pathetic married loser that only gets sex from his wife around pay day.I actually knew a co worker who admitted to this.You are brilliant,Dawn! | |
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