| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 7:27:20 AM | Jimi, for what it's worth, I think everyone ought to cut you a break. As a 45 year old who had a terrible upbringing, I can see that you were attempting to sort of address a societal issue in the way men are brought up. If you wanted to avoid being associated with your hypothetical scenario, you should have avoided the use of "I", "we" and "us," as you know.
(Ben may have a point though. You seem to have cut everyone else a little slack except for him. ;^)
As to your original thesis, I personally would have a hard time agreeing with you because my upbringing was exactly opposite. And in fact, I think it turned out somewhat of a detriment here in my adult life. Indeed, I wish my mom HAD done all that stuff for me, but none of it was there. In fact, I honor what she had to do, but my dad was on disability (home all day - and he was able to do fairly nothing). My mom was a full-time RN. I had to do everything for myself. All I understood was that motherhood was a b****. My dad was pretty mean, my mom was pretty stressed out, and she looked to my brother and I for the kind of emotional support a dad is supposed to give.
I WISH I had the kind of mother you describe. I would probably have had a whole lot more realistic view of women from the start. Now I'm 45, and have only just gotten it straightened out. | |
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silken
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Joined: 8/19/2004
Msg: 26 | |
| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 11:59:02 AM | Hi Texasgator, I understand what you mean about our family backgrounds causing us to have distorted views of how relationships/families work... I think a lot of us have come from one parent homes and from all kinds of situations where we did not have the ideal family model.... unfortunately I see a lot of people who let fears from their own past cause them to be really destructive about their relationships. Many times it's simply that we don't know how relationships are supposed to work if we've never really been around one. I know I run into his problem... that and having a problem understanding men because I was not around them growing up.
silken | |
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| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 12:15:16 PM | | jimi77 hey you might be on to something here.I can not find a mate and it may because i am not needy.I cook,clean,wash anything in or outside the home i can do.I think the men who are helpless are the ones finding mates.So i may just try being a helpless slob,i bet i get a bunch of dates then. | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 28 | |
| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 6:03:42 PM | tex my mother was an RN also. but it was not all roses. she had a few nasty boyfriends one that use to like to hit and i being the oldest i was the brunt of that. i will say my dad taught me a lot also about fixing things.
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 29 | |
| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 6:04:48 PM | | air man some women like project guys i belive. i think my mother is like that. | |
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| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 6:11:09 PM | | Yep, a lady I like on POF won't even meet me because she says I am to good. What does that mean anyway? | |
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| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 6:25:30 PM | | Why the hell would someone not meet you because you are too nice. Perhaps she was a bitch, and was worried it would rub off onto you...So be thankfull because she spared you. | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 32 | |
| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 7:17:40 PM | | alarmed do you think it could be that if he is to nice and she lost him it would hurt more? i heard a women say that before. or that if your to nice you can walk all over them? i dont know? i would guess that they are young and want the bad boy. | |
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ben76
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Joined: 6/5/2004
Msg: 33 | |
| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/20/2004 11:16:02 PM | | She probably knows she won't last long with you velocity... Maybe she knows a side of herself that you wouldn't put up with, so rather than start something she knows won't work then she doesn't want to try at all... From my experience, those who say stuff like that usually have some kind of demons, such as a habit of cheating, drugs, drinking, etc... She knows herself well enough and from what she knows about you, she thinks that you won't be cool with however she is... | |
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| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 9/21/2004 4:34:29 AM | | I am a good man, not a doormat, maybe I just want to have her for a week... | |
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silken
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Joined: 8/19/2004
Msg: 35 | |
| Re: helpless men
Posted: 9/21/2004 8:57:41 AM | On the subject of a woman liking a helpless man....
Ok, here's my two cents on this....
I enjoy being *inter*dependent... both bringing something to the table to benefit the other partner (and I like it best when it's something along traditional lines, seems sweeter and more satisfying that way...;)
Now I am VERY unhandy, I cannot put a nail in the wall (believe me, I ruined one wall trying to hang a keyholder.) It's not for lack of effort either, I just am really really BAD at doing that kind of stuff. I am the kind of girl who will spend 2 hours trying to fix something and then end up in tears because I've made it worse... that's me. However, I can cook decently, I can bake, I give a fabulous backrub I've been told and I can do other helpful things that tend to be moreso in the traditionally female arena.
Soooooooooooooo yes, I tend to enjoy being with a guy who may be a little bit lost in the kitchen or not so good at mending a tear in his shirt, etc. but who can fix things/change the oil in the car, etc. Why? Because I know I need his skills and I also feel good when I see that he needs mine. I'm not saying that I am looking for a lazy man who just wants me to do everything for him, but I enjoy cooking for a boyfriend... it brings me pleasure. He can cook sometimes too of course but since I can't fix something for him (other than a torn shirt or a nice meal or such) and I can't build him anything cute for his house, etc. etc. well I enjoy doing my part for him by making him a nice meal or maybe lending a hand at some other task that I might be more skilled in like sewing. :)
Maybe it's just me but when I meet a guy who tells me how self-sufficient he is, what a fabulous cook and housekeeper, etc. ... I mean yes it's admirable but it makes me just a little sad because it feels like I can't really any skills to the table that would really be a benefit to him and like he will be the only one bringing something I need. Don't men get that feeling too when they hear women say how they don't need a man because they can do everything for themselves? Guys doesn't that bother you in some little way to not feel needed by the opposite sex?
silken | |
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| Re: helpless men
Posted: 9/21/2004 1:52:27 PM | Whoo! Cooking, and backrubs? Like what more would a guy want brought to the table?
Personally I also enjoyed fixing stuff. Sometimes it can be funny though.. Like once I went to make a cup of coffie.. My ex advise me I had to plug the coffie maker into another electrical outlet... Well, the other outlet was dead too. So, while Im bust trying to figure where the breaker is and what triped it she kept advising me to carry the coffie maker to the other side of the kitchen where the outlet worked. After a few minutes I discoered an electrical can opener with the copper showing in the wire siting in a puddle of water near a sink of dishes. (it shorted and triped the ground fault braker on the outlet thus taking out the other outlet that was wired in series with it).. What was funny is that neither her or the teens bothered to fix the problem... they would just except the fact it was broken and carry things back and forth the kitchen. :) - Yep, sure makes a man feel needed. Even when nobody asks. | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 37 | |
| Re: helpless men
Posted: 9/21/2004 2:07:24 PM | | silken I couldent agree with you more. and i think that is the way is should be. not that one is stronger or weaker but that it is a team and they show eachother there love by doing what gave them gifts to do. and i agree that if your not needed or contributing to the realtionship it feels out of balance. I don't want a women that can do it all. i Love doing things for her and it makes me feel good and needed. imagin playing a sport and them knowing they have everything coverd and don't really need you. I think i would lose intrest and leave. i would not be a part of the team setting on the side lines i want to be part of the fight. good post silken | |
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silken
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Joined: 8/19/2004
Msg: 38 | |
| Re: helpless men
Posted: 9/22/2004 6:32:03 AM | Thanks Jimi. That's how I feel. Like I said once before in another thread, I do believe in the 'original design' of relationships and find they offer the most satisfaction. ;)
And yes Jammer, cooking and backrubs. I find those 2 things men seem to enjoy and appreciate and I can do them! ;) I had one boyfriend who was really not very good at cooking or laundry and he worked all day in a tool and die shop so he certainly had a sore back and enjoyed a good back massage at the end of the day. When he and I were dating I would typically cook him dinner and then pack his lunch for him... not because he asked me to but because it gave me pleasure. I got a kick out of him telling me how the other guys at work were getting jealous becasue he was showing up at work all decked out with these nice lunches (I'd usually make him lunch from the supper's leftovers so sometimes it would be steak and potatoes, etc.) while the other guys at work were having bologna sandwiches and such. ;) hehe I have to say sometimes it drove me to want to make even nicer lunches just to hear the 'report' when he got home about the looks and comments he got from the other guys. ;) hehe I used to help him out once in awhile too by doing his laundry when he was working long hours. It actually felt nice to be able to do something like that for him so that he didn't have to worry about it after doing a long shift. Besides, washing and putting his clothes away was kind of like 'playing house' and I got a kick out of it once in awhile. ;)
Now before anybody screams 'doormat' or something because I was doing this stuff, it was my choice to do it, he wasn't asking me to and in return he was the one who was there when I needed something put together (you know when you buy a piece of furniture or something and it has to be assembled...) or if I needed the vaccuum fixed, etc. He also would drive me different places if I didn't feel like driving, would take me out for dinner, etc. He didn't complain about doing handy things for me so I don't see why I would complain for taking care of the food for him or doing a load of laundry once in awhile. And besides, once in awhile if I didn't feel like cooking I would just tell him so and we would either eat out, pick up something ready-made at the deli or he would cook -- he didn't complain if I didn't want to cook.
Just one note on this... make sure you appreciate your partner when they are doing things to take care of you and do things to take care of them too. Usually when people complain it's because they feel they aren't being appreciated or that their efforts are not being reciprocated. I find this often happens when a relationship is on the downswing. It eventually happened between him and I before we broke up.
silken
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| Sisters are doing it to themselves
Posted: 7/11/2009 5:06:36 PM | Oh, you hit right on one of the biggest complaints I have against others of my own gender. I have heard the same woman both complain about how she "has to" do the housework because of a husband who won't, or can't, and describe how she "had to" get up at 5:00 to iron her teenage son's clothes (while the pre-teen daughter is already ironing her own).
Set up. | |
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| Sisters are doing it to themselves
Posted: 7/11/2009 5:21:02 PM | This thread has been brought back from 2004.
My dear grandfather was a bachelor/widower, all the years I knew him as a kid. He always said, "no one has the right to expect anyone to cook for or clean up after them." It kind of stuck with me. I sons, ages 19 and 20 have been cooking and cleaning since they were small, well the cooking came later, but they have done their own laundry since they were 12 years old. They like to cook different things, experiment in the kitchen. Some girl is going to be lucky to get either of them. They have been raised to respect all people, not just women.
They started when they were 4 and 5 years old with a can of scrubbing bubbles in the bathroom. They could spray and wipe all they wanted. It is like shaving cream. The rest is history. | |
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| It's a set up.
Posted: 7/11/2009 5:32:50 PM | I always felt that way, so was a bit of a hard a$$ in some peoples opinion on my male child.
By 8 he washed clothes and could at least cook in the crock pot.
He cleaned house and played baseball.
Could check the transmission fluid in the car and iron a shirt.
Fast forward to 16 or 17.
As if I never showed him a thing.
Stop blaming Mom because you don't want to do something you know damm
well how to do. | |
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| Re: It's a set up.
Posted: 7/11/2009 5:44:24 PM | | This is the exact reason why I give my sons chores. My mother spoilt my brothers rotten, and I swore I would never make the same mistake. | |
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