| CHANGING PEOPLE
Posted: 6/1/2008 8:08:44 AM | Why is it that men don't want anyone to try to "change" them (and rightly so), but they believe that they can "change" women -- and especially at our ages.....I don't get it! Is it an "alpha male"/"macho" kind of thing?
And who would even want to be with someone who was "pretending" to be what that individual wanted him or her to be? Doesn't that seem like a "prescription for misery"?
I welcome any insights anyone has to share. Peace | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:23:05 AM | You can't change personality...your full pocket of your identification...(perhaps only by psychotherapy)... | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:33:44 AM | | I so agree, ankkka....I think therein lies my frustration.....I get annoyed with people who try to change ME, because I cannot comprehend that they do not understand that I would never attempt to change THEM, because it is an impossible task......my grandfather always said, "get who and what you want, because no one and no thing needs to be made miserable by you or your attempts to fix what you perceive is "broken." | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:43:13 AM | I have a friend... she changes for every man she has had. She also rushes into it. She just feels she 'needs' a man. Sad.
Needless to say, she's unable to keep up the facade... and she's been married twice and lived with two men also, all in under 4 years.
I think there is always a little bit of 'changing' that naturally occurs when you put two people together. After all, you're no longer alone with only yourself to think of.
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:49:10 AM | Men marry women hoping they will never change...
Women marry men planning to change them
Both end up sorely dissapointed.
If the guy is not the way you want him when you find him....
HE'S NOT THE ONE YOU WANT.
Yes it is that simple. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 8:58:01 AM | Well...even you are with somebody...you always think...
I know women...who seems to be content...even they are always under man's directions...but in strong...loving relationships... | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 9:29:15 AM | OP, I don't want to change a woman any more than I want her to change me. However, in order for a relationship to evolve and work, there occasionally has to be some sort of compromise, in which one person might participate in some sort of activity/hobby that the other person is not so crazy about. It shows your partner that you are willing to sacrifice a little to make the other partner happy.
Why do you think men want to change women more than women want to change men?? There are plenty of control freaks in both sexes!! To think that men want to do this any more than women is ridiculous!! | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 9:53:51 AM | Why is it that men don't want anyone to try to "change" them ( and rightly so), but believe that they can "change" women -- and especially at our ages....I don't get it! Is it an "alpha male"/"macho" kind of thing?
Beats me OP ??? I also don't know what it's all about either but you might be onto something, in regards to the alpha male/macho thing. Some men don't want their lives interrupted. I'm sure some women don't either. At our age, maybe we've just become set in our ways.
Of course I can only offer an opinion from my own personal experience. I've come to the conclusion that there's a definite double standard in this age group of men.
Most men that I've either communicated with or met expected me to drop everything in my life, to meld into their lifestyle, move to their city, leave my friends and family and fit into their schedule. They, of course were not willing to make any changes to their life.
Then, you've got the other kind of man who emails for months, is anxious to meet only to tell you afterwards that you're the wrong nationality and from the wrong country. DUH? Something he knew all along? So, why did he bother me? I have my suspicions but I won't go into it on this thread.
I've come to the conclusion, that it's best to date a man in my city. And, to my own self, be true.
That being said, good luck to any man, who expects me to roll over and fetch his slippers.
If that statement means I may never have another date, then so be it.
I'm looking for a man who feels secure and confident in his man-hood. One who doesn't need to display alpha male tendencies, in order to feel like a man. A man who knows what he wants from a relationship and is willing to share a lifestyle, so that both of us are happy.
So far, I'm having a helluva time finding him. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 11:35:37 AM |
Why is it that men don't want anyone to try to "change" them (and rightly so), but they believe that they can "change" women -- and especially at our ages.....I don't get it! Is it an "alpha male"/"macho" kind of thing?
thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!!.
one of my closest friends has tried for years to get me to change my political views ~ as if ~ lol! he pouts about it, yells, carries on etc. he should know by now that i refuse to support the same politics he does. then ~ same person ~ wants me to do certain things with my vehicle. and has the same reaction when i decide to do something different. i love him dearly, but he can't get it through his head that i actually can think for myself.
in some ways it amuses me, and i just laugh at it. but it can get downright aggravating when he wants me to find a jeep part on ebay and install it myself to save $13.00. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 11:52:16 AM | I learned from experience, it is impossible to change a person, no matter how long you are with them, but like one of the other posters said it is good to compromise, in a evolving relationship, which I agree with completely.
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Posted: 6/1/2008 12:23:24 PM | This is an excellent thread. All good and tactful contributions.
Please vote to keep this thread!
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Posted: 6/1/2008 12:32:55 PM | I'm not so sure that men our age always want to change us, but it seems they want to "fix us". Ok, I've heard enough that men are problem solvers. If a man is wanting to fix something, then I suggest a trip to Home Depot  It really is simple, middle aged women want to be listened to, not fixed, not changed. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 1:23:26 PM | ^^^ Rather to my surprise, I have found that men in fixing mode can hear and relate to the following message: "Shhhh..... I don't want you to fix this problem, I just want you to listen. I know men like to fix things, but that's not what I want from you right now. Please?"
Try it. You might find it works. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 2:12:31 PM | The last guy I dated once asked me in an exasperated tone "What is it that you want?"
I answered most sincerely "A man who accepts me for who I am".
I am not adverse to trying new things or to improving my outlook, my health, or my demeanor, but fundamentally I am who I am and I want the man I am with to love that person, not the person I could be if only I would_____ | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 2:19:29 PM | Well I have a rather sexist take on this. It has been my experience with some women that they complain about something and then sit back and wait for a man to fix it. I am pretty handy with a variety of tools, but sometimes I think it is the lady that needs fixing, not whatever device is being operated. Like one acquaintance that complained about a noisy car but it took four quarts of oil to come up above the 'add oil' mark.
Anyway, meeting a new lady and rubbing our rough edges together makes clear pretty quickly whether we can get along as we are. I am changing myself all the time and don't have much interest in a lady who is not doing the same. If we are in a relationship her feedback will tell me what I might want to attend to and maybe mine will do the same for her. But for me, that is where it stops. If I find myself thinking she needs to change to make me happy, then I need to step back and look at what I am doing. If I find her asking me to change to please her very often, I'll be looking for the door I came in. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 2:52:16 PM | Chocolatebrowne,
I’m sure I’m probably a little unique in my perspective. I was married for 30 yrs. The first 20 years were wonderful but the last 10 yrs were very difficult. So difficult in fact that most of my time was focused on trying to help my wife & hold my family together. In the process I sort of lost myself somewhere along the way. When my divorce became final I realized that I really didn’t know myself any more. I had set my own interests & needs aside for so long … when I looked in the mirror I saw a stranger looking back. So for the 2 yrs flowing my divorce I focused on addressing some personal issues and rediscovering who I was.
I found single life very uncomfortable … probably natural after being in a 35+ yr relationship. My divorce also coincided with my children leaving home so for the first time I truly felt alone. I began dating again … at first out of desperation. I was desperate for companionship. Without even knowing it when I went out on a date I found myself doing everything I could to be what my date wanted. I did this without even realizing it … at least at first. When I finally realized what I was doing … I stopped dating for awhile. I was obvious to me that I simply wasn’t ready. Since then my focus has been on trying to find a comfort zone with my new single life and coming to accept that I may not find someone special to begin a new relationship with.
So to address your question … I am at a point in my life where I am open to trying new things and experiencing new adventures. It’s not because I’m trying to please another person but because I’m on a journey to rediscover who I am. I’ve come a long way over the past couple of years in dealing with the loneliness & desperation. I still doubt that I will ever find the contentment & happiness I experienced during the first 20 yrs of my marriage until I find someone to share my life with. However, that doesn’t mean I’m miserable because I’m single & alone. It just means I work a little bit harder at enjoying every day.
I do agree with you that anyone who pretends to be a certain way in order to make another person happy is destined to be unhappy in the long run. In addiction the hardest lesson I ever had to learn was that you can never change another person … even if your intentions are honorable & in the other person’s best interest.
Great Topic!
Gary | |
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| CHANGING PEOPLE
Posted: 6/1/2008 3:17:37 PM |
Why is it that men don't want anyone to try to "change" them (and rightly so), but they believe that they can "change" women -- and especially at our ages.....I don't get it! Is it an "alpha male"/"macho" kind of thing?
Why is it that women don't want anyone to try to "change" them (and rightly so), but they believe that they can "change" men -- and especially at our ages.....I don't get it! Is it an "alpha female"/"feminist" kind of thing?
And who would even want to be with someone who was "pretending" to be what that individual wanted him or her to be? Doesn't that seem like a "prescription for misery"?
I welcome any insights anyone has to share. Peace | |
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| CHANGING PEOPLE
Posted: 6/1/2008 4:35:01 PM | mackevinized...
Who's going to change you...if you won't want? | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 5:11:19 PM | Now I think I am right but I could be wrong.. but I think sometimes we romantacize someone and we build them up in our mind and because we are so fond of them we think we know them. Then when they begin to take on behavior outside our little box it upsets us when all along we just didn't know them that well.
Rather than accept it as being new information about the person I think sometimes we try to quelch it.. we try to change them so they fit into the box again. For some reason maybe we are uncomfortable with the unknown. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 5:33:08 PM | | Lordy I have enough trouble fixing myself, trying to change someone is way beyond my capabilities or desire. I just take people as they are and hope they will return the favour. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:00:28 PM | I was in two long term relationships that covered a span of 19 years. My attitude back then, as is now, revolved on making things work as one without losing our autonomy as an individual. I was never arrogant enough to think a person must change to suit my liking. I never dated these women with the intentions of changing the personality/person I fell in love with. I still feel the same way. Unfortunately, these women I chose felt differently about change - it was a one-way street. In both cases, they were who they wanted to be and when they thought I was the one who will change to suit their needs (misgivings) I walked out on both of them (1995, 2001 respectively). I changed... but there was a limit as to the amount of change I would permit.
However, contrary to the OP's understanding, I find many women have become more independant, more assertive and more self-centred in their own wants, wishes and desires. To camoflage their own behaviour they blame men for wanting to change them. The bottom line is, you never do change unless you want to (for good reasons and/or for bad reasons).
Society, in general, has become very selfish... I don't buy into the excuse that men are trying to change women. I'm of the opinion, some women/men don't want to change for the sake of the relationship - the relationship must revolve around them. Many profiles share such a sentiment. "That's who I am and you're not going to change me... but I'll change you." is not a very mature way to approach a relationship - for either gender. In fact, I wouldn't call that a relationship. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:08:12 PM | | I never expected to change anyone.....but I do expect growth................. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 6:59:46 PM | | Part of loving someone is loving them for who they are, not who you would like them to be. You can't expect or demand change, if you do I don't think you really love that person, not for who they truly are. | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 7:09:24 PM | Way true gp.
I find myself repeating this phrase often: You can't change others, you can only change yourself.
Everybody sing along! | |
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Posted: 6/1/2008 7:50:52 PM | How many psychotherapists does it take to change a lightbulb?
Only one.... but the lightbulb has to really want to change. | |
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