| Settling
Posted: 6/6/2008 6:48:04 PM | So a while back I read an article in the Sunday Times and it's been playing on my mind ever since. Here's the link for those interested:
http://women.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/women/relationships/article3883168.ece
But for those who can't be bothered reading the whole thing the general gist is that the writer, Laurie Gottlieb, figures that women are too choosey about men nowadays and it's this fact that leaves lots of women entering their thirties and forties unmarried. She feels that "Marriage isn’t a passion fest; it’s more like a partnership formed to run a small, mundane and often boring not-for-profit business.". Now while making it clear that she has not always felt this way (this view seems to have been somewhat of a revelation to her) she suggests that women should start marrying 'Mr Almost Perfect' or 'Mr 9/10'.
Now there's already been a witty response to this article IN the Times from another lady who wants to know where Mr 9/10 is (because she certainly hasn't been turning down any man she considers a 9/10) but that's not what I want to get into. I want to know what you guys think of Gottlieb's idea.
Are we idealists to believe marriage should be with someone who makes us feel safe, content AND flares our passions?
Do you, especially the older members here, think that perhaps you've had a Mr/Miss 9/10 who you regret letting go of now that the years are ticking on and do you feel that moreso if you're without children? Are we a bit naive to think that marriage is about more than that small, mundane and often boring not-for-profit business?
Being 19 myself I haven't experianced romantic love but I do have visions of the future with a faceless (albiet broad shouldered) chap who blows my mind but is that just an obscure, thankless fantasy?
Clearly, being that we're here, none of us have 'settled' but should we? Or have you just not been given the opportunity?
Let me know what you think! Cheers,
Perri x | |
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Posted: 6/6/2008 6:59:55 PM | I don't know many women in their 30s who just "wound up" single and desperately wanting a fairy tale marriage. Most either had a long-term relationship that ended, a demanding career or bad experiences that made them pull out of the dating game for a while, sometimes a long while.
Though I'm sure Ms. Gottleib was very proud to get 500 words or so printed in the times, no 30 year old woman alive in this century sat around refusing suiters like her life was a Jane Austen novel for 18 years in a row because they were "choosy"; that's just not real life.
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| Settling
Posted: 6/6/2008 7:00:11 PM | | I'm borrowing this from another user (can't remember the thread...) Settling is a sin! Enough said. | |
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Posted: 6/6/2008 7:05:16 PM | No doubt. I can force myself to eat a salad, even though I don't want one, because it's good for me. I can drag myself to the gym for the same reason, even though I don't think it's fun.
But how am I supposed to make conversation with a loser for 20 years in a row, and how is it good for me? If someone can prove that it lowers my chances of cancer, I might ---might-- try it. | |
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Posted: 6/6/2008 8:08:13 PM | *BLINKS*
In what parallel universe is a 9/10 considered a loser? | |
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Posted: 6/6/2008 8:25:54 PM | | i could care less about whether or not women are being to picky. there are so many out there and all for me to taste! | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 5:24:01 AM | I have dated women in their 30's, 40's, and yes, even 50's who were single and never married. Various reasons why. They did not want to settle for a looser, some did not want children, career demands, bad prior relationships, you name it. I myself was working too many hours and never home. Not enough time to date, let alone get to know somone. Now that i switched jobs, i have the time, but i do not have the money. Go figure, eh ?  Although at least i have not run into any women fresh out of prison or a convent after 20 years. But stay tuned, that might be next in line for me.  | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 5:44:12 AM | I agree...The way I see it I had 2 bad ones. A 2/10 and a 5/10. If I could ever get a 9/10 I might be dumb enough to try that whole marriage crap again.
9 would mean teeth and a job right? | |
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| Settling
Posted: 6/7/2008 6:04:42 AM | how would a man feel if he discovered that the woman he built his life around considered him less than what she felt she deserved? that she entered a life with him only because she feared a life alone? how awful for both parties!
it neither serves nor honors nor respects anyone if we decide to spend the rest of our lives with a person who doesn't make our blood roar and our hearts pound.
personally, until i find someone about whom i feel that way, i'll remain single. and i don't really go looking for anyone. i love the way my life has turned out. living alone feels right for me at the moment. someday i may welcome company, but until then, my friends and family more than compensate for what i may miss out on. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 6:21:53 AM | ^^very well said Juniper.
I've never been married and never wanted to nor had kids..both my choices.
I was in an ltr for 14 years..my choice to leave and 'be single'.
I love being single and am happy with life when I am.
If I go out with someone who doesn't tick the boxes I set for myself then I walk away as it's just a waste of mine and their time..and unfair too (referring to Juniper's post).
I met someone not so long ago..all is going well..the boxes are ticked so far..for both of us..and I know that for sure.
I don't start seeing someone just because I want a relationship...I start seeing someone because I want to get to know them. I stay because I want to stay..not because I'm scared of being single..single is good..as is being with someone who you like.
Marriage makes no odds to me and never has....don't know if I ever would get married..me..I'd want my dad to walk me down the aisle if I ever did want to marry someone..but my dad is long gone...
Settling is a bad idea in my view and I never have and wouldn't ever do it. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 7:05:26 AM | The question is...are you settling with someone who is compatible with your own interests? Life is just as satisfying as it can get...YET..online junkies can't make a commitments to those who they are compatible with.
In my experiences with online relationships..most are online junkies. They tell you a tale of looking for THE ONE. The usual online chats/phone calls/meetings...find you both compatible and find each other capable of ecking out a stable, meaningful relationship...this lasts a year..maybe less for some.
THEN..they become the online dating junkie...fast and furious they spend many hours , eyes glazed as they scan all the members of the opposite sex ...still looking for THE ONE.
They question why they are just settling for the relationship they are in because it's TOO good...TOO predictable..and maybe TOO boring for some. Not satisfied with just COMPATIBILITY. Is this JUST SETTLING?
Or are they looking for drama momma's who like fights/make up sex? Most won't admit to it..but there is a difference...you can't have it both ways..but a whole lot of guys out there want their cake(stable..easy-going relationship) and eat it too(rowdy, drama mommas who have lots of baggage). | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 7:31:48 AM |
Are we a bit naive to think that marriage is about more than that small, mundane and often boring not-for-profit business? No. The generations before us have low expectations about a spouse. My own mother is a good example of this. They only need a 'warm body' lying next to them in bed, not much else. As if their spouses are nothing but a prop, something they have to prove that they are lovable. It's very sad to see. Some people do treat their marriage as a business, this is true.
figures that women are too choosey about men nowadays and it's this fact that leaves lots of women entering their thirties and forties unmarried. Well speaking for myself.....I 'settled' in my first marriage. I won't do that again.
Settling is a sin! Enough said.  Agree 100% | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 7:35:48 AM | I've found that most single women in the 45+ age group have had marriages. many have raised children. Based on the bad experiences they have had they have decided "never again am I going to settle for anyone who doesn't meet all my requirements".
Some women seem to be perfectly happy being single. They don't date and they aren't interested in having a relationship with a man. Several women I know focus all their emotional energy on their children, grandchildren, or pets. Men just aren't worth the trouble.
Other women do want to find a mate and companion. In most cases they are particular about what they are looking for. One of the biggest factors they look for is the magical attraction. The feeling of passion and excitement when you are really drawn to another person. Unfortunately, the men that women find attractive often have negative qualities that make them poor husbands. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 7:46:59 AM | There really is no such thing as a 10, if we go around looking for the perfect person then we will in fact wind up alone living in a house with 30 cats. Everyone has faults, the trick is to find someone that you care about enough to overlook those faults.
If i could find a 9/10 i would be as happy as a pig in slop. That's as close as any of us can ever dream of getting. If meeting a 9/10 is "settling" then we should all be settlers.
Only the truly delusional is looking for 10/10 , not only are the delusional, but they are expecting to fing something they can't possibly bring to the table themselves, that being perfection. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 7:53:11 AM | You raise an interesting point about exactly what "settling" means. Though I would never settle, I've often dated guys who weren't my physical ideal. My first boyfriend, when I was a teenager, is the only guy I ever felt an infatuation with based on looks. Then, of course, after getting that guy, I learned there was more to a relationship, so I look at attractive men, but date the ones who have other things in common with me.
I don't consider this settling, just maturing. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 8:44:21 AM | settle for less = tedious, humdrum, boring, dreary, lacklustre, routine, monotonous, dull....
again???
i think not!
only 10/10 is good enough for me. i wouldn't give less and i won't accept less.
edit....
Only the truly delusional is looking for 10/10 , not only are the delusional, but they are expecting to fing something they can't possibly bring to the table themselves, that being perfection i'm not delusional, i'm prepared to make space for less than perfect, that will all be built into the 10/10. i'm not looking for "perfect", i'm looking for "perfect for me" | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:01:33 AM | The word "settling" as it pertains to relationships has such a negative connotation that I'm not fond of using it. I prefer compromising. After all isn't that what a successful relationship is? a little give and take. Sure we all have our deal breakers, most likely due to past experiences but nobody is perfect, a little compromise goes a long ways. Now where is my 9/10?  | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:26:28 AM | "I'm prepared to make space for less than perfect"
Why would you feel you need "To make space for less than perfect" That makes it sound like you are doing them some kind of huge favor. And if you're expecting to build up to a 10/10 then you truly are delusional. It's never going to happen, the best we can hope for is to be so comfortable with someone that we can overlook the negatives.
I see people alone and on pof for years and years still looking for perfection. You ask them why, the answer is always the same old tired cliche "I don't want to settle" But what they really mean is "I am looking for a 10 even if i am only a 5" . Most of us are just not realistic in our expectation while looking for a partner. If you come back to reality that's not "settling" that's just making the correct adjustment. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:32:19 AM | | I agree with Wildman...I would make the adjustment for his moderate 5ish if he were only local. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:35:18 AM |
Why would you feel you need "To make space for less than perfect" That makes it sound like you are doing them some kind of huge favor. And if you're expecting to build up to a 10/10 then you truly are delusional. It's never going to happen, the best we can hope for is to be so comfortable with someone that we can overlook the negatives.
I see people alone and on pof for years and years still looking for perfection. You ask them why, the answer is always the same old tired cliche "I don't want to settle" But what they really mean is "I am looking for a 10 even if i am only a 5" . Most of us are just not realistic in our expectation while looking for a partner. If you come back to reality that's not "settling" that's just making the correct adjustment.
i think i did state that im not looking for "perfect", im looking for "perfect for me".... that is, 10 out of 10 for me, which will be something entirely different for you. im not delusional, i'm perfectly realistic in my expectations, they will be adjusted as and when necessary, but i will not be getting into a relationship just for the sake of it, which is my interpretation of "settling". some of us actually like being single, why would i give that up for just any old thing? | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:57:22 AM | I think she's right; women are way too choosy; they are obsessed with getting a guy that wows their friends, makes their parents jump for joy, and makes everyone envious when they walk down the street. Get real.
There is one girl on this site; I think she's "the cutest" or something that has 35 things that she needs in a man. These lists are incredible.
I met a girl once that we were thinking of dating. She said she had 20 thing on her "list" that someone needed to be for her to love them. She said I had met those points. That ticked me off like I didn't have a choice or something.
I told her that it was sad and that I couldn't really date her. She was shocked; I told her I had 18 points and that she only met 15 of them.
Healthy people are more worried about being a whole person and what they have to offer. Selfish people worry mostly about what they can get from someone and their own needs. | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 11:09:52 AM | There are major points and minor points you that everyone probably considers.
some Major points might be:
1. Do you share the same values/family background.
2. Emotionally/Intellectually a match
3. Do you feel physically attracted.
Beyond that I'm not sure if a small idiosyncroncy should really matter, or whether the person isnt the smoothest on a date . Most people naturally open up and become easier to talk to once you get to know them.
If you're looking for the 100% match agaisnt your list the only people who will be able to fill that are probably players (tells you what you want to hear, acts the way you want a guy to act).
Its funny that women can screen for all these things online, but still reject the small % of men who even fill these basic requirements (because some phd student doesn't know how to write emails), I wonder how much more successful you can be when just randomly meeting someone in a bar/club.
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:29:40 PM | Oh how true ''''''mark!
the old unfaithful criteria list!...and yes while theyre ticking off those boxes...and Verbalizing it!....ld have told her she really only got 4 ticks on yours.
lsnt it bizaar!....lm an open book...(heres the BUT!) we would ALLLLL be lying if we tried to pretend that taking someone into our personal space,means it has to be unconditional.
lts considered "judgemental"...if you meet a man,who used to be a house burglar and smooth conman,for half his life..."but has changed now".Believe ME,youre taking on his past!!...fact.lt affects "your" future.
l do make an adult,rational DECISION..about people l get to talk to or meet.l dont have to freakout about it,l just decide theyre not right for me!
l agree with you on the "selfish people"...lts such a fine balance.
Would l date the DR over the garbage collecter guy???...you bet your life l would !!
if he was the one who wasnt arrogant,or concieted,....and l love who "l "am when lm with him...because thats his nature too that presses my buttons,making me free to be me.:)....hes real...hes just so easy to talk to,understanding ..etc
Straight down the line...straight shooting man.....yep! ld be with the garbo man,and if his life wasnt quiet up to scratch on my so called" list of acceptable standards"..or his money managing skills were a bit on the slide...ld be there to help him out as his friend /lover as well....lts the INSIDE of the man that lm trying to get close to...and actions of a person speak VOLUMES compared to words!
Genuine people SHINE....fakes are so cloudy in nature,expression etc,evassive,cant get straight answers out of them.
No mature person over 30...would even UTTER the words "my list"...or tell anyone they have one!(as in the lady in the posting)seeee cute doesnt mean smart!:)
Heres a tip as well...anyone still living their lives to please their parents,are just not grown up yet:)
ld never ever think that way...its crazy!
Usually due to ALSO what the parents are going to be giving them!...or being dominated by any other adult in their lives...is not grown up.
lve had meetings with people who mostly miss handle their adult lives...time people took inventory of who they are...and what their own real beliefs are (not conditioned by childhood,culture,external infilling over time etc)
Having my first daughter really brought that home to me!...WHO AM L REALLY???
How do l want to be as a mother,person...etc.
Why do l have a head full of ideals??...that havent really been my own!
What do l want to teach this little person lm holding????....all of that stuff.
What a rewarding time its been.....l dont have a list,lm just me...but my criteria nowa days is more of emotional welbeing with another partner....period:)
How we can accentuate each others lives??!..based on understanding,patience,communication,positivity,and giving...and how he loves me.This has a bounce back to you reaction.lts an automatic thing.
l dont even find it hard to be the one to instigate...the reaction to that can be the deciding factor in the relationship.
Find that kind of balance....and youre SET! | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 9:40:33 PM | Nobody should have to settle.
However, as you pointed out there are older people then 19 on here. And, as time passes I can state that a good man, who treats me well, is handy around the house and has great communication with me, even though the sex isn't the greatest (that can be worked on) is a keeper.
You have LOTS of time ahead of you thus cool down and date some. You don't have to be married by the age of 20. As a matter of fact I don't recommend marriage until you're 30 these days as most people are getting into their careers in their 20's. That is necessary time to discover who you are, what you want and how you will get there.
Stop looking and your dream girl just might be in front of you! | |
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Posted: 6/7/2008 10:06:46 PM | Imagine finding out one day that the person you thought truly wanted to spend the rest of their life with you was just "settling" for you. What a horrible thought! I would never want that done to me and I certainly wouldn't do that to someone else. It's really the most selfish thing I can think of.
There's no stopping certain nosy friends or family members from thinking you could have done better. But isn't it the most important thing to look over at the one you're with and know exactly why you're together? The man of my dreams isn't necessarily the man of everybody else's.
Now, I don't know if my opinion might change in another 10 to 20 years if I'm still single, but I'd like to think I'll have lived a long life and be able to say I treated everyone with the love and respect they deserved - And if I no longer loved or respected them, I let them go find someone who would. | |
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