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Show ALL Forums  > Science/philosophy  > Where are we going?      Home login  
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 BearHeartUK
Joined: 11/15/2007
Msg: 1
Where are we going?Page 1 of 2    (1, 2)
I've just been listening to an old song from the 90's
Del amiti - Nothing Every Happens

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FggdVPLDFMQ

A song about the futility of life I suppose. How we're basically just doing the same things our parents did..... Depressing concept, I know.

It did spawn a thought though.

True, our knowledge base has grown exponentially since our parents day but all this seems to have lead to is more gadgets, labour saving devises and reasons to stay at home.

Are we destined to make life so easy we don't have to get out of bed?
It's been almost 40 years since man first set foot on the moon yet with the retirement of the shuttle next year(or is it 2010?) we seem to be taking a step backwards in the exploration of the final frontier.

So where are we going as a species. Do we have an ultimate objective? Will 'nothing ever happen'?

Philosophical or scientific opinions would be deeply appreciated.
 Baddab25
Joined: 4/28/2007
Msg: 2
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 4:50:30 PM
I think this could be a very interesting thread. I believe that all you have to do is look back to the Romans and get your answer. The Romans based their days around social activities, about leisure. I mean even the word "work" for them was "not-leisure". I think this is the essence of all humans. Deep down inside I believe we are all lazy. We would all rather do something we want to do instead of have to do. Humans right now work so they can supply there basic needs of food water shelter etc, but what is that goal that everyone wants when your 60? It’s to retire, and to do whatever you want and have the security to do it.
Now the Romans only worked about three hours a day, mostly cause of the MASS amounts of slaves they had. Now I’m not condoning slaves, but with technology we are making slaves without emotions. The perfect slave some would say. If we continue to go this way, human beings will be able to be in a permanent retirement, of course watching over the machines. I think we are complacent to let things such as the universe and even our own world do whatever it is going to do so long as we can do whatever it is we wish to do.
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 3
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 7:26:02 PM
I live a very minimal life, and what I do in my leisure time is something I enjoy and something I also do at work.
I guess my leisure time is spent getting better at what I do for a living.
I am a machine, but I'm a happy one.

I think it's possible to be happy while working to support a greater body, than to spend our existence putting all our eggs into a basket that is proven to drop from old age. The basket being our bodies, and the eggs being our personal desires.
 gregorywb
Joined: 5/12/2008
Msg: 4
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 8:59:29 PM
The final frontier lies not in space but in the human mind.
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 5
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 9:57:56 PM
The final frontier lies not in space but in the human mind.


That reminds me of my favourite ending in Deus Ex 2.
The one where humanity obtains a pure virtual democracy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeboqg4t9vs

A lot of players hate that ending. They say it's a bad, bad ending.
 Nexus 6
Joined: 10/18/2007
Msg: 6
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 10:27:58 PM
Change is inevitable. The nature of what that change will be is impossible to predict. However, we can look to past changes to make educated guesses. But, in reality, the only thing we can control is the here and now; make your life the best you can make it.

I believe that human existence is not the ultimate sum of the universe. What becomes of us is less important than the role we play in the universe right now. According to quantum science, time itself is as much an illusion as space is, so does it matter how huge the universe is, how short our lives are, or how small a blip humankind is in the history of the universe? We exist, and that is enough of a miracle for me to celebrate regardless of what the future may hold.
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 7
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 10:42:19 PM
My belief is that humans were destined to become dynamic components in a much larger dynamic organism. Building blocks of incredible diversity in their capabilities.
Technically we already are, but I imagine it's going to get much larger from here.
When I witness a situation where many different people, of many different strengths, are all working together excitingly and seamlessly, it truly makes my heart soar. Even if it's a movie about a bankjob.

I think right now though, many people aren't really pursuing the realization of their contributive strengths, and they aren't gaining the emotional enjoyment utilizing those strengths towards a greater goal can offer. Their happiness is coming from what they can take in to fill that void. And that happiness seems empty sometimes. Empty and fleeting.
 Nexus 6
Joined: 10/18/2007
Msg: 8
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/12/2008 10:53:14 PM

My belief is that humans were destined to become dynamic components in a much larger dynamic organism. Building blocks of incredible diversity in capabilities.
Technically we already are, but I imagine it's going to get much larger from here.

As part of the universe in which we exist, you are right; we are a part of a much larger system, and since we exist as part of a whole (the universe) the whole universe could be said to be as intelligent as we are, taking into account all the other forms of intelligence which we already know about and those which we may not know about. Much like cells in our bodies, which have no idea what their greater purpose is, they exist as individual living cells but are a part of a much greater whole. A human brain cell can not form a complete thought, but the DNA from which it is formed is ingenious in itself. Yet without the body, it is meaningless. I believe that we exist within the cosmos in a similar role.

I don't want to derail the thread from its original purpose, so to get back to the topic; I think that whatever becomes of us is not that important, because much like the cells of a human organism, our lives are largely determined by the will of the whole. The universe unfolds with or without our input. It created us by whatever means and for whatever purpose. I believe that we can not help but fulfill our roles, whether we understand them or not! We were created by whatever means with individual will and a mind to think, and a conscience which makes us want to do "good" to one another. So long as we are true to ourselves, we will be at peace with one another and with the universe, no matter what the future may hold.
 Saver1
Joined: 2/1/2008
Msg: 9
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/13/2008 3:05:30 AM
“So where are we going as a species. Do we have an ultimate objective? Will 'nothing ever happen'?”

Wow what a profound question. Here is my take on it

I think our species have become money-orientated/religious, as result:
Our species more likely to see religions as credible source, and that’s not good at all if we want to know the unknown and discover the undiscovered. Religions have fixed opinions, prediction etc, and no one would dare to challenge one of those opinions.

To be a better species we should do few things:
First, eliminate poverty and then make sure the people who have been living in poverty are well armed with the right education and knowledge, because two hands are always better than one.
Second, try to instil the fact that one generation cannot live forever, so there is no need to be obsessed with money etc.
Third, settle to nothing but the truth, and never afraid to ask how, why, what and where – because these four W will help us to go beyond what we know.

Our species are genetically sympathetic toward one another, but unfortunately as we grow cultures, beliefs etc impact how we see/judge things. From my experience I found that educated/intelligent people are more open-minded, see their religion as a matter of identity and therefore shouldn’t dictate how they do things, unlike people with limited education/knowledge. So education and open-minded attitude are what our species need to know the unknown and discover the undiscovered.

Peace/love
Relando
 The Artful Codger
Joined: 2/29/2008
Msg: 10
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/13/2008 7:48:45 AM

Where are we going?

...and what are we doing in this handbasket?
 gee wiz1
Joined: 6/3/2008
Msg: 11
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/13/2008 9:28:08 AM
Ok, where are we going? I think that the detriment of the human condition has been its tendency, especially among the political and economic (multinationals) leaders of the world towards greed, competition and ignorance. Without the fundamental premise of respect for all life these negative human tendencies will flourish with regard only for self, making the rich richer on an individual and global level.
However the true reason for being is happiness for ourselves and others. Not the fleeting happiness derived from the acquisition of fame or a fast car, or even a smile from a stranger but the kind of happiness that welcomes problems – because they inspire growth, celebrates difference and comes from the heart.

Picking up on that point about our knowledge system growing – knowledge without wisdom is worthless – we need to use our compassion first and foremost.

We all, individually need to make a difference ………..happiness derives from what we actually do today.
 yna6
Joined: 1/21/2007
Msg: 12
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/13/2008 7:22:19 PM
Down the stupid path...that's where most are heading. So...there's your answer.

When we have a lot of technology at our fingertips, what do we waste it on? Entertainment. We want to be entertained. How many have heard the whiny kid saying "I'm bored", or the date that says "I bore easily."? Not enough "entertainment" for them.
If my parents had been raised with a playstation or some such thing, I'd never have learned the whole concept of fishing, gardening, etc, etc. Things I did with my parents probably would not have happened.
Sure...we've come a long ways in a few short years. We will go further...as soon as those who "get bored" are forced to get out of the way. They don't want to wait the months it takes to set up or explore a new area, such as Mars...they want it all, they want it now, even of they did not earn it. Steal it, demand it from someone else, as long as they get it. Music, the latest cell phone, the new tech TV or sound system...doesn't matter...as long as THEY get it, and get it NOW.
Fortunatly there is a core group of people who actually DO work at thigns to produce not only change, but further steps for mankind. Often their work is misconstrued as "evil" or "not right". Example, politicians that feel war is the solution to a long term problem. So many of those childish enough NOT to believe that all else was done before making war chant and rave about how peaceful they want to be. Take their toys away...and they are out in the streets rioting.
Start paying for it, by demanding that your elected officials support the space program. Go to their rallies, and ask their stance...if they are "nay sayers" or come out with "wehave enough problems here on earth to look after", make sure they know YOU won't be voting for them because of their "limited vision" of the future.
You'll be surprised by how many politicians will be backtracking on that stance.
Also, space is good for the economy, for families, and for technological development. Without it, a lot of jobs go into the crapper...but with it expanded and made more important, more big pay jobs, better economy for all. Also, it makes war less affordable...which is a small bonus that few mention.
 Vancer
Joined: 10/29/2006
Msg: 13
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/13/2008 10:40:00 PM
yna6, I think the most fulfilling forms of entertainment are the ones that make us better at our strengths which we use to contribute back to the things that support us.
For me it's my job and the community. My entertainment usually comes from learning and practicing skills I normally use towards both my job and relationships with the community.
I live a meager life compared to my friends/family/co-workers, yet I am somehow more content.
My greatest weakness though is that I don't share myself enough with them and show them how content they can also be.
 daynadaze
Joined: 2/11/2008
Msg: 14
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/14/2008 9:56:39 PM
Why would we ever make life so easy that we'd never get out of bed? What would that technology but and what would it's purpose be? It makes no sense. Wouldn't we more likely build technology so that we'd love to get out bed and enjoy life? Do you really think it was a bigger joy to get up out of bed and do back-breaking work form dawn to dusk all by hand and die very young and nothing to show for all your work but a few turnips boiling in some dirty water?
 x_file
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 15
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/15/2008 8:30:04 AM


So where are we going as a species. Do we have an ultimate objective? Will 'nothing ever happen'?


I've been thinking about this quesiton. Actually I've been thinking about a set of more specific questions. Here they are:

1. What do elites, rich, and those in power, have in mind for the near future?

Answer: More war, and reduction of population. War is money. War reduces population, and quickly at that. Two birds with one stone!

2. If one looks at history and assumes things from the past will continue to happen in the future, what can one say about the future?

Answer: More of the same, but worse - wars, wars, wars. Bigger and bloodier.

3. Where should we be going? In other words, what's the best path for man to follow given man's nature or human nature?

Answer: Don't know. Human nature is hard to pin down, and therefore the path is hard to pin down.

4. What should we do in the near future?

Answer: Stop doing what we are doing now. If we know we're doing something wrong, the first thing to do is stop doing it.
 Last not Least
Joined: 10/27/2007
Msg: 16
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/15/2008 9:41:25 AM
Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. That is the definition of the human race. Don't look so hard into the future to see where we are headed, look backwards.
 Powervamp
Joined: 5/30/2008
Msg: 17
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/15/2008 4:21:19 PM
That reminds me of my favourite ending in Deus Ex 2.
The one where humanity obtains a pure virtual democracy.


Well thanks...I know now not to finsh the game. You just saved quite a few hours of my life, that I otherwise would have never got back.

Wow what a depressing ending! Being forced to share ones mind is a form of rape, and I think would cause far more problems than people think. If some hot chick walks by...How can you undress her in the back of your mind without getting your face slaped?

OP...It is in the path of least resistance to travel is the same path our forfathers took. Sure the path is often better lit and better paved, so your children will often do the same.

It's interesting that the great people, I mean the real geniuses often don't have children. At the very least, we don't hear about them. They give this gift of knowlage to us that should unite us all, yet this gift often comes with a curse that can destroy.

I guess in the end, when your on your death bed looking back at your life. Will you be able to say, " I was happy and would do it all over again"? Can you find happiness in the simple things? Did you find happiness in over comming problems in your life?

The interesting thing about human kind, is we are the happiness when solving puzzles of one kind or another. If a person isn't trying to solve a puzzle (problem), and is going down the path of least resistance, they will be unhappy. Just going through the motions is unfufilling in the end.
 sam-spade
Joined: 12/2/2007
Msg: 18
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/15/2008 5:53:23 PM
Unless we have a giant leap in propulsion technology, we're not going anywhere. Not even Mars.
 Lynsteph74
Joined: 12/1/2005
Msg: 19
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/18/2008 8:06:15 PM
I don't know about you, but my grandmother was born in 1924...and I grew up listening to her talk about working ALL DAY scrubbing the kitchen and helping with the laundry (this entailed a washboard, mind you...or hanging clothes on the line to dry...or the old-fashioned kind of iron that was heated on the stove, and EVERYthing was ironed) to earn 25cents....after which she would take the bus downtown with her girlfriend, walk around there, buy a bottle of Coke, try on lipstick, and ride a bus home....in the summer.....when there was no airconditioning.....and they probably walked a couple of miles altogether...and it usually gets in the 100s here in the summer, and it is a very humid, sticky heat, we aren't "GreenCountry" for nothing, LOL.

Now, I clean my kitchen with Fantasic, so I probably use less elbow grease, then, I rest, cause I am tired. I put my clothes in the washer, then move them to the dryer, then dump them on the couch to be hung and folded and put away. I usually do most of the putting away in one day. I don't iron. I own one, sure, but, well, Downy makes this great wrinkle-release spray stuff, and if you get 'em out fast enough, you don't have to use that, even, LOL. Then, I usually use my microwave oven to assist with dinner preparations, and voila, dinner is served. I make many things from scratch, but am not above using a boxed cake or cornbread mix, or store-bought, canned or frozen vegetables. Everything Mema made was from scratch, period....from the gravy to the biscuits to the cake to the cookies. She thought I wasted money by buying my chicken already cut-up! (it is about 67cents more expensive per bird, last time I checked, I think I can afford it) Heck, I am proud if the canned frosting looks pretty on the box-mix cake, LOL.

BUT, after my day's labor, if I look at it....I am WAY too pooped to think about taking a walk, for a soda, in the summer heat, for FUN!!! Besides, I don't have the time, ER is coming on in a few minutes.
 Paumanok
Joined: 6/15/2008
Msg: 20
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/20/2008 4:30:39 AM
We have an appointment with an asteroid the size of Texas. It's come-as-you-are.
 peacful1
Joined: 3/31/2008
Msg: 21
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/20/2008 6:54:14 AM
i think there's more in the way of "technology" to come first, it seems to b leading--the way.
it's.....slow, but sure!!


 Last not Least
Joined: 10/27/2007
Msg: 22
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History
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/21/2008 10:18:02 AM
That is fine if technology can save us. I doubt it though.
 ghostwalker3952
Joined: 6/17/2008
Msg: 23
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/21/2008 10:17:42 PM
Scientific response - We have NEVER set foot on the moon. NO vehicle is capable of surviving the Van Allen Radiation Belt that exists between us and the moon. The occupants of a shuttle would fry!

Philosophical response - History doesn't repeat itself. The truth is that people never change.
The Mayans and the Celtic cultures had just as many luxuries as we do.
Where did they go as a species? To the grave.

Zenist Response - Live in the moment, be productive with your life and then die with honor.

My response - Sorry, we aren't going anywhere as a species. And one's ultimate objective would be to live in the moment, be productive and die with honor.

And remember...Those who "can", do...and...those who can't, "teach".
 x_file
Joined: 6/25/2006
Msg: 24
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/22/2008 6:07:59 AM


NO vehicle is capable of surviving the Van Allen Radiation Belt that exists between us and the moon.


Satellites do. Missions to Mars vehicles have made it.
 Lucky_Me
Joined: 5/15/2005
Msg: 25
Where are we going?
Posted: 6/22/2008 6:37:53 AM

Unless we have a giant leap in propulsion technology, we're not going anywhere. Not even Mars.


Relax, the technology will come.

As to where we are going? I think only time will reveal that answer.
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