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| | construction workPage 1 of 2 (1, 2) | i am seriously thinking of changing careers. i know all my friends are freaking, but i have my reasons. i hear so many women expressing their sincere desire to become a nurse, but i have been there - done that. i am a very good nurse, but, after 15 years, i realized to move up in the field requires more sacrifice and headaches than it is worth.
before i was a nurse, i was thinking of going into the safety field. there are many plants in my area currently being constructed.my ex says that it is beneath me and i will be disrespected and viewed as a piece of "meat" - i changed his word there.
i carry myself in a very respectful manner and plan to be well educated prior to entering the field. i believe if i am respectful of others, they will respect me back. am i being too naive? | |
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Posted: 8/8/2008 9:45:45 PM | | In my neck of the woods, there are a lot of women in the construction industry. Safety personnel/ coordinators, truck drivers, equipment operators, service rigs, you name it. No one that I know disrespects them. In fact, we encourage it. | |
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Posted: 8/8/2008 10:27:21 PM | I was a construction electrician for 13 years and the first journeywoman in my local. I worked union commercial/industrial. I've been out of the trade for 17 years but I keep in touch with both women and men in construction.
Yes, you are naive. It's a rough environment. Be prepared for that. However, you are not necessarily viewed as a piece of "meat." There's a reason construction workers have a reputation for being rough and crude. They are. They also can be perfectly nice. People vary, but the environment is harsh, both physically and psychologically. It's hot in the summer, cold in the winter, dirty, very physical, and sometimes dangerous. You don't get sensitive, intellectual folks working in an environment like that. You get folks who are tough.
Even though women have made inroads and things have gotten better, women are still a small minority. You will work primarily with men who are not the most sophisticated people on the planet. More important than treating people with respect (which you should do) is how much fortitude do you have? Can you walk, day after day, into an environment of crude, rough guys and work with them? They aren't just that way with women, they are that way with each other. As one of my female carpenter friends once said, "Even if I were a man I wouldn't fit in here."
It is not easy work but it pays well. I'm proud of the years I spent in construction. I keep my union membership up just in case I decide to go back. As for the work being "beneath" you - what honest work is beneath anyone? I don't buy that. I'm proud of my skills and some of the jobs I worked on. I got to install some very beautiful lighting in a historic building and wire a neonatal intensive care unit. In fact, a guy who email me off POF recently said his grandbaby spent some time in that very same NICU. There's nothing inferior about having a trade and doing an honest day's work.
If you think you can work hard and survive in a physically and psychologically harsh environment, go for it. If not . . . may try seeing a job counselor and find something that will suit you well. Good luck. And don't listen to your ex. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 12:04:38 AM | to echo what aewen said, there is something you have to realise about people in this and similar lines of work. Yes women are allowed and in some cases encouraged to join, however the men in the line of work will NOT change for you, especially if it's a union job. They will continue to be as crude and unapolagetic as before. You may think it's because you are there, but it's because that's how it has always been.
This past winter we had an outage where we hired on 1500 welders to change out major pieces of equipment. the areas where they worked were so brutally crass, some of us expected we'd see hookers trolling around  If you really don't mind seeing a bunch of guys telling the sickest jokes imaginable, doing some of the crassest, most base things you can think of then by all means, go to it. Just don't say you were not warned | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 12:46:09 AM | | I did framing for a while. Take it from me... construction work sucks. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 5:00:18 AM | thanks for all the advise. i will take everything into consideration. amazing how similar some of the situations resemble nursing - even the hooker thing (nurses trying to hook doctors - haha) god that was a bad one - but true. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 8:53:34 AM | | Go with your interests and your passion. You can't live your life for other people. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 9:29:16 AM | Fishgauthier - I definitely recommend doing what you feel you must.
Ironically, I was also in the nursing field - paid my way through college and university by doing landscaping in the summer/fall and construction in the winter/spring.
If you're doing safety-related work, that might be, from a societical viewpoint, more accepted (re: female nurse, occupational nurse, stereotype of the care-giver, etc.) vs. manual labour. With that said, a few perspectives from my own experience:
- construction industry is dominated by men, many of whom have no imagination when it comes to articulating their thoughts (re: f-bomb every 3rd word). There's a lot of ignorance at times, depending on whom you work with. But these guys are also some of the hardest working people, and many times go out of their way to help others. It's a tough job and it requires tough people.
- women can be a favorite topic of discussion whilst working (imagination insert here). You may have to prove your ability before those you work with see you as an equal worker vs. some chick who's worrying if she'll break a nail, or got the job because she blew the foreman. Sad, but true.
- there is a hierarchy, unfortunately. Certain trades feel they are "better" and above others, with the majority of architechs living their belief they are demi-gods.
- many do look down upon those who do blue collar type work. This truly is sad. I, and my workmates, have been disdained many times by others. When I would tell people that I'm working through my education, they'd try to convince me to get out "that type of work and get a respectful job".
Depending on what you're going to do, it can (and will!) be rewarding as long as you have an open mind and a thick skin. I have much more respect for construction and trade workers than I do for almost any other field.
Good luck! | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 10:55:14 AM | I am curious if you have multiple personalities or something
based on your main picture! lol
The construction industry is filled with many not so swift people!
Depending on what you would do, the days can be long, boring,
dirty and hazardous!
The nursing business is full of politics and BS!
The choice should obviously be yours. I wouldn't view a women
differently working at either! | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 12:34:20 PM | | once again, thanks y'all. point well taken on all accounts. it is sooooo refreshing to read multiple points of view. as far as the multiple personalities plastic (may i call you that?)- my 3 older brothers are watching baby sister all the time. haha. seriously, another good point. i think i fixed that. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 2:24:31 PM | | Enviromental safety is a growing field, working civil service I find that there are many women in the field. I'd suggest seeing what the state / military has to offer. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 3:10:00 PM | | There are different types of construction work. Myself, i am in a government type. We have good hours, benefits, and safety is a must. I would say if you want a good stable job, go for it. Just make sure you are in shape, and can deal with the nasty weather. I have had a few 1:00 am call outs. | |
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tbm55
| | Joined: 5/24/2008
Msg: 13 | |
| construction work
Posted: 8/9/2008 3:46:13 PM | | I have been in the building trades for 40 years. I now work as a commercial superintendent. DO NOT GO THERE. we resent you. You have no business on the jobsite. You need to find a job where you can be a woman. Can you lift, while the guys wont laugh. I have seen this before. always ends up in workmans comp. I'm not kidding. Guys do heavy labor, women use their heads. Lets keep it that way. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 5:27:21 PM | You'll be working with roughnecks and guys who weren't smart/motivated enough to go to college for the most part. How do you think you'll be treated?
They might be nice guys, but most of the guys I know who work in those fields have serious doubts about whether or not a woman can handle it, and there will be some who won't give you respect no matter what. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 5:56:05 PM | You'll be working with roughnecks and guys who weren't smart/motivated enough to go to college for the most part.
Oh, I see you have a bachelors degree, and your a cable installer??? LMAO
Some of us guys that you say weren't smart/motivated enough for college (as you like to put it) make a hell of alot more money than most who did go to college. We chose our carreers because we like to work with our hands. We don't have the college loans to pay off either.
Funny how people look down on the construction workers, calling us roughnecks and such...........happens all the time, yet we are the ones who build them thier cushy little homes that they enjoy so much. Did you know some of us do have class.
Did you realize that it takes alot of smarts to construct a building?? When was the last time you framed, wired, plumbed , built a home or even worked on a 30 story high rise or otherwise? Try it if it you think it doesn't take an education? Local codes, city codes, ordinances, reading blue prints (every trades) etc........
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Sorry about the rant, back on topic.......... OP, If construction is what you chose to persue, I say go for it. As others have mentioned, it is a tough job. All sorts of conditions to deal with such as, weather, lifting, climbing, to many to mention. Not to mention that I hope you can tolerate the jokes, pranks, and language used on the jobsite.
I've been in construction all my life since I was seventeen. Twenty years as a union electrician. (for the above poster, that also includes five years of schooling, hmmm college credits also! Go figure. :-P ) I enjoy it and working with my hands. I also admire women who take on a trade and can handle the job and conditions. | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 6:20:28 PM | heavy lifting you say? just lifted my daddy 235 pounds off the floor by myself. i already fell for one joke - i asked a friend if it would be ok for me to use my nickname "fish" if i worked at a construction site/plant. he said, "they are going to give you a nickname." i thought, "oh how cool!" he said, "they are going to call you f****** b****."  | |
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Posted: 8/9/2008 7:17:02 PM | | I agree. I am always employed. I see college educated guys filling out unemployment forms just like everyone else at times. If a woman can do a job like mine, go for it. You ain't going to get rich, but you will have a paycheck. | |
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Posted: 8/10/2008 8:20:21 AM |
You'll be working with roughnecks and guys who weren't smart/motivated enough to go to college for the most part.
^^ That some nice self-appointed upper echelon thinking, and perhaps the main reason many don't want to enter the field - for fear of being stereotyped and labeled.
Just a thought ... perhaps many "unintelligent" and "non-motivated" trades didn't have the opportunity, financing, family support, et cetera to pursue higher education?
Many enjoy what they do with no aspirations to attend university, but many others found themselves on the wrong end of that economic divide. If you've a family to support (as many of my friends did), they've no choice.
... and there will be some who won't give you respect no matter what.
^^ This is common in society and in every field. | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 12:11:51 PM |
I have been in the building trades for 40 years. I now work as a commercial superintendent. DO NOT GO THERE. we resent you. You have no business on the jobsite. You need to find a job where you can be a woman. Can you lift, while the guys wont laugh. I have seen this before. always ends up in workmans comp. I'm not kidding. Guys do heavy labor, women use their heads. Lets keep it that way.
This is what I'm talking about. This is an example of what you'll put up with every day. Can you? If you can, and you love doing physical work, go for it. If not, get into something else.
I naively thought that if I was competent and capable, that I would be accepted by my coworkers. Unfortunately, some of them are so narrowminded that no matter how good a job you do, they will not accept you. One of my stewards once said to me, "You're a good mechanic but you don't belong here." My ability to do the job was irrelevant to him. He didn't want me there no matter what and did what he could to make my life miserable.
That is not an excuse not to do it, but you did ask if you were naive to think that you'd be respected if you treated others with respect. SOME people will respect you if you are good at your job and that number of people has increased over the years. Others, like tbm55 has clearly expressed, will resent you no matter what. You have to accept that and live with it.
Every single female apprentice I knew (including myself) had experiences where they'd send us to do something by ourselves that they would never send one of the guys to do by themselves. Since we didn't know any better and assumed it was something we had to do, we always found a way to do it. When we did that, it just p*ssed them off even more because, not only were we doing what was expected of us, we were succeeding at doing *more* than what was expected of them! These guys' sense of their masculinity is tied up with needing to think they can do something a woman can't and it seriously disturbs them when they have to rearrange their concept. They don't like us getting in on their boys' club. Well, too bad for them.
Guys would try to scare me with things like, "What are you going to do when you have to run 4 inch rigid?" (That's a very heavy pipe - 110/lbs to a 10 foot length - that 90% of electricians never touch.) Of course, there was no way I could answer that. Years later, I got to run 5 inch rigid - a size of pipe that is *really* rare - and I had a great partner and we had a great time installing it. We still brag about it and he says I'm one of the best partners he ever had.
Don't let other people's small minds keep you from doing what you want to do. But don't be naive, either. | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 12:34:51 PM |
Funny how people look down on the construction workers, calling us roughnecks and such...........happens all the time, yet we are the ones who build them thier cushy little homes that they enjoy so much. Did you know some of us do have class.
I'm curious. You seem to have a problem with the building trades being known for having lots of roughnecks in them, yet, I can't think of any other type of employment with so many muscular, crude, loud, arrogant, annoying, chauvinistic and insensitive people in it. Can you?
Although, there is one good thing about people in the building trades. - They ALWAYS know how to either do household repair/jobs, or where to find someone good to do it for them. | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 2:16:54 PM | Soooo many things wrong with this whole thread.... no idea where to start.... I guess I should start with what the OP was actually talking about.
To put it bluntly, DON'T DO IT!!! There's a pile of reasons why but let me give you a few of my own (I've framed for 2 years and am now in the local carpenters union):
- Most "white-hat" women on job sites are totally disrespected, NOT because they're a woman, but because they have ZERO on the job experience and they come on to our sites and try to tell us how we should be doing our jobs! (this doesn't just apply to women, but any ministry official or stupid engineer who's way too proud of his stamp)
-I realize that you mentioned a position in the safety department, but what right do you have to talk about safety on a job site that you've never actually had to work on?
-I haven't seen your picture but if you're mildly attractive then YES you will be stared at by a lot of guys like a piece of meat. But think about it from the other side... as a carpenter I basically ONLY work with other men, there's no women on the sites, so when you finally see a woman on site if she's half decent then everybody wants to sit and stare. Plus, a lot of guys on commercial sites are from out of town away from their wives and girlfriends and they're horny as hell... go figure...
So that sorta takes care of the OP...
Now...
Plastic Sturgeon wrote:
The construction industry is filled with many not so swift people!
Depending on what you would do, the days can be long, boring,
dirty and hazardous!
LOL!!!! That's an incredibly ignorant thing for you to say, I seriously can't believe your opinion of people in construction. Do you think ANYTHING you use on a daily basis would work if the people who built it were stupid??? Granted, there are some dummies out there who still wear a tool belt, but guess what, those are the guys who are stuck lugging materials all day and don't actually get to do any real work. Most people in the trades are very competent people who are very good at their jobs.
And if you says the days can be long and boring then I'd have to ask if you've ever put in a hard days worth of work in your entire life??? When you work hard, the day goes by fast and you're rarely bored because you're always doing something. Yes it's dirty and hazardous, but that's what showers and PPE are for... the ones who get hurt are usually the careless ones who didn't protect themselves in the first place.
SomeStrangeMan wrote:
I'm curious. You seem to have a problem with the building trades being known for having lots of roughnecks in them, yet, I can't think of any other type of employment with so many muscular, crude, loud, arrogant, annoying, chauvinistic and insensitive people in it. Can you?
Although, there is one good thing about people in the building trades. - They ALWAYS know how to either do household repair/jobs, or where to find someone good to do it for them.
WTF?!?!? How in the hell can you make a generalization like that? So we're all crude, loud, arrogant, annoying, chauvinistic, and insensitive huh? Guess I should go ahead and throw that on to the end of my profile now huh? Have you never met a tradesman in your life? Or do you just call the cheapest guy in town to fix your roof and get ripped off? Seriously that's one horrific statement to make, try not to be so ignorant of reality in the future. Try meeting and shaking hands with an actual tradesman and try holding your opinion afterwards.
There's crooks in every trade and walk of life so don't try to demonize the whole lot because of your own bad experiences.
Oh.. and there's definitely more than one good thing about us... | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 3:31:31 PM |
WTF?!?!? How in the hell can you make a generalization like that? So we're all crude, loud, arrogant, annoying, chauvinistic, and insensitive huh? Guess I should go ahead and throw that on to the end of my profile now huh? Have you never met a tradesman in your life? Or do you just call the cheapest guy in town to fix your roof and get ripped off? Seriously that's one horrific statement to make, try not to be so ignorant of reality in the future. Try meeting and shaking hands with an actual tradesman and try holding your opinion afterwards. I didn't say all.
I said theres more of them in construction work than any other type of work I have come across.
I have three tradesmen in my immediate family, and I have done work in the construction trade for a while.
You also ignored the question I posed. Can you name a type of employment with more muscular, crude, loud, arrogant, annoying, chauvinistic and insensitive people in it? | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 3:51:39 PM | yeah... most professional sports...
there, happy?
I still think your generalization is way off base though and half of them make no sense anyways. Loud? all tradesmen are loud for some reason? give me a break! Annoying? well... that was clever. Muscular? what, you jealous of a body gained from manual labor? Insensitive? sorry if you don't like someone giving you a straight up opinion instead of trying to spare your feelings.
And if you say you've worked in the construction trade for a while and have tradesmen in your family then you of all people should know damn well that most guys act differently on the job than they do at home. I mean job sites are basically just a war of testosterone anyways so you gotta be a little rougher and grittier at work than you would be at home. | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 5:06:01 PM | | I have a female welder in my shop. Whenever she has to lift a heavy peice of steel, my guys trip over themselves to help her, not because she's a girl, but because she is very well respected! The one female firefighter I worked with was always welcome to join me on the hose line for an interior attack. Did these women have to work harder to make it in a "manly" profession? probably, but because of that they are both at the top of their game, and earned the respect they deserve. | |
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Posted: 8/15/2008 7:55:39 PM | There is one detail everyone has missed,
Ever used a Tupperware toilet in august, behind 100 or so men ???
Give that some thought.... | |
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