| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 2:10:15 PM | | Does anyone know how easy (or not) it is for someone to claim "Undue Hardship" in order to get their child support payments lowered? I've done lots of web research on it and it sounds difficult to do (in theory). Anyone have any experience with this or knowledge about this? | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 5:10:28 PM | | perhaps you'd have more luck posting this in the parenting threads?? | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 5:52:56 PM | | You're a teacher, For you to claim undue hardship you have to somehow show that you wages were lowered for some reason. One can't just claim they are having a hard time. You child support is set based on your wages, If your wages have not changed, Then it's next to Impossible to have your child support lowered. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 9:07:53 PM | Are you talking about you or your ex???
You might need to clarify that point. One thing I know is that there is a child involved so if more money is needed, someone will have to get out there and get a second job. Children don't disappear or have less needs because the parents can't provide. Lower payments means less money to care for the child, that should be enough incentive for someone to get out there and earn what it takes to keep the child above the poverty line. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 9:10:51 PM |
Are you talking about you or your ex???
You might need to clarify that point.
Maybe, she is asking for a friend and why does the op need to clarify? Does it make a difference? | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 10:00:03 PM | Xavery,
it depends who has custody of the child and bears the responsibility of providing for the child if the other parent can't help with the finances due to " undue hardship".
This is not a simple question as there is so much about the situation unknown to us and I for one don't pretend to be well versed in legal matters. So as stated above in my original post, if we don't know who is asking then it's hard to discuss this topic.
I'm not psychic. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 10:53:40 PM | As I understand the question is
Does anyone know how easy (or not) it is for someone to claim "Undue Hardship" in order to get their child support payments lowered?
Regardless of who the custodial parent is, the process would be the same.
And while I do not have an answer to the actual question, I can share knowledge of someone who tried to make the same claim.
He had been placed on disability from work, and requested that his payments be decreased as they exceeded his disability wage. The answer from them was that he needed to get another job in order to make his payments.
Long story short, because he couldn't work, he couldn't make the payments, and they put him in jail for 6 months.
During his time in jail, they continued to add up missed payments, with interest to the amount he owed.
He now faces more jail time for not being able to make his child support payments while in prison, and as a result of going to prison has lost disability benefits.
Hopefully that at least sets an expectation level for you. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 11:01:57 PM | ^^ wow that's some story,.......
they continued to add up missed payments, with interest to the amount he owed.
SOME people ( no names mentioned of course) don't even make payments or extremely irregular at that,... AND, when FMP gets involved no INTEREST was/is added.
One thing I do know OP is that IF the person not paying or shorting the other some day chooses to claim bankruptcy,..... "secured debts" don't go away they are still accountable for that,..... someday. Child support is one such "secured debt". Good luck to whomever you are asking for. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 11:11:48 PM | I really dont get the put in jail thingy for not paying child support
I had a supreme court order and my ex didn't pay for the last 15 years
when we went back to court , which he initiated with a lawyer he paid for
he got all the retro back payments dismissed and new payments to nil based on his wages (zero income) - the judge said a percentage of his wages reported would be about $50 for two children tops per month
he never got sent to jail for not paying - he got a good lawyer and got it all erased based on his income (all cash income except for the minimum amount claimed)
so it really really boggles my mind when people say they got sent to jail
apparently because I always worked and held a job - I was penalized and got no support
where is he worked off and on and for cash most of the time, he got a break for having very little income reported
so i guess that's how you do it, you go back to court and show them your lack of income and you get off , you get your debt written off - and your children get to barely make it on their owns with the other spouse.....shakes head | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 11:25:27 PM | A good lawyer can very easily make problems go away for people.
He, unfortunately could not afford a good one at the time.
Funny you should mention them as he is appealing his first sentence based on the fact that he had poor representation. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/16/2008 11:58:50 PM | Your child support is set based on your wages, If your wages have not changed, Then it's next to Impossible to have your child support lowered.
Very true, but I have seen the courts consider financial hardship due to medical expenses, having dependants from a different relationship, and sometimes even travel costs to exercise access if one of the parents has relocated. Also if the paying parent has the child for more than a certain percentage of the time, the courts will take that into consideration and lower the payments accordingly.
Best advice is 'get a lawyer'. I could have saved myself a lot of grief and money, if I'd done that a lot sooner.
Here's just one of many links that might answer some of your questions.
http://www.candivorce.ca/child.htm
Good luck.
apparently because I always worked and held a job - I was penalized and got no support
I've never heard of the custodial parent's income being considered when calculating child support. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/18/2008 3:13:35 AM | He had been placed on disability from work, and requested that his payments be decreased as they exceeded his disability wage. The answer from them was that he needed to get another job in order to make his payments.
Long story short, because he couldn't work, he couldn't make the payments, and they put him in jail for 6 months.
During his time in jail, they continued to add up missed payments, with interest to the amount he owed.
He now faces more jail time for not being able to make his child support payments while in prison, and as a result of going to prison has lost disability benefits.
Nope. That's a simplified Story with missing Data, such as Assets he was not willing to part with or other Income, such as the $ 500 plus Income one can make per Month on Disability.
If you have Medical Proof you cannot earn, or have been unable to earn Money because of a Disability to sustain Support Payments, the Law requires that to be taken into Consideration.
No Judge will ever throw anyone in Jail who honestly has no Means to to pay the required Child Support.
Is this Rumor? Do you have Link, and I'll show you the Holes in the Story.
he never got sent to jail for not paying - he got a good lawyer and got it all erased based on his income (all cash income except for the minimum amount claimed)
As prescribed by Law.
you go back to court and show them your lack of income and you get off , you get your debt written off
Its a retroactive Order based on your Income, Assets or Means to service the Debt. Only an actual Dispute where an incorrect Order was previously made can be set aside by another Judge. I am sure you were frustrated having to carry the Burden yourself, but if he simply has no Means, or is able to convince the Court that he cannot meet the Payments, I see little Point incarcerating anyone at Taxpayer's Expense. Its a hopeless Cause trying to squeeze Blood out of a Rock. They only Thing served putting him behind Bars may be your Satisfaction.
For you to claim undue hardship you have to somehow show that you wages were lowered for some reason. One can't just claim they are having a hard time. You child support is set based on your wages, If your wages have not changed, Then it's next to Impossible to have your child support lowered.
Any Number of extenuating Circumstances can affect that, such as a previous Court Order being appealed claiming it failed to take into Considerations valid Expenses.
Your Health supersedes Alimony or Child Support Payments.
Should some medical or other necessary Expense come into Existence not covered by any Insurances which is vital to the Survival & Living of a Child Support Payee, an Application for Review can be filed with the Courts to have the Liability/Debt lowered.
Loss of Income would also be an accepted Plea.
This however would best be left for Advice from legal Council.
Unless the OP wishes to post additional Information she wishes to base her Case/Claim of "Undue Hardship" on, there is not much more I can say at this Point. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/18/2008 3:55:06 PM | Its a hopeless Cause trying to squeeze Blood out of a Rock. They only Thing served putting him behind Bars may be your Satisfaction.
^^ your right, I am glad to hear your comments, as no one would believe me before,
there was no point in me taking him back to court and paying 1500 or more to convince the court that he lied on his income - it would serve no purpose - it would not gain me any monies for him to go to jail and I surely would never put my children's Daddy in jail because of money, they deserve and are entitled to have both of us in their lives & to know both parents , not the financial stuff./crap ... so I carried on for another 15 years - I raised them, I paid for all matters to do with the children 100%...he is there Daddy and still is and without the criminal record or being in Jail, what would be the point ? ...they love him and still do | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/21/2008 7:36:35 PM | Thanks everyone for your comments. Please keep them coming!
Pantherrr, FMEP actually does charge interest. FMEP can also charge an administration fee if the payor is in arrears which is paid to the provincial gov't. I know, because my ex had to pay both. The admin. fee was $400!
For those interested, it's my ex who is trying to claim undue hardship, even though he makes over $80 000/yr., and lives for free with his parents. He doesn't even pay for food and his mother irons his shirts! | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/21/2008 7:47:02 PM | | perhaps it's selective then....guess I'll believe it WHEN I see it. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/21/2008 7:56:30 PM | | Op here is the thing with Undue Hardship, Your ex must make a very compelling case in court to even have any kind of chance of pulling it off. If his situation is as you described, Then you really have nothing to worry about, As long as you can back up your contention with evidence. He has to bring in evidence to support his case, It's up to you to counteract that. Don't just go in saying thing, Bring evidence that supports your case. | |
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| Undue Hardship
Posted: 8/21/2008 11:36:34 PM | Hi pip....
might be interesting to get some mediation....I know at one time in British Columbia it was free...... this just shows the court you are taking all the alternatives possible in not wasting the courts time.....:) If he says no.....doesn't look good on him. Develops your trail of evidence too.....
reason being is you are trying to make things work between you and the father -keeping the peace -all in the best interest of your child.....of course you can use this as a means of 'positioning' too..... find out what is really up....
at times it is best to keep the peace......free.....and maybe you might come to some common ground....give and take....you do this he does this......
If this doesn't work....you can request a judicial case conference where a judge will look at both statements and bring you both together and see if an order can be put in place to solve the problem......the judge will lay it out on the line to both of you..... or say..nothing can be resolved and you will both have your day in court of which the lawyers are going to be the winners..... If he says no to this? Again, develops your trail of evidence...
Anyway.....there are so many factors....age of the child to special needs etc.....
Wishing you the best.....please keep the best interest of the child in focus....as this will be disrupting him/her too......
O:)
PS.... if your going to seek a lawyer....make sure you have everything prepared ahead of time -be organized.... how to do this is probably on the internet too.... | |
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