| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 9:34:16 AM | Im recently new to the single parent thing, i was in a relationship up until last December when me and my partener if 14 years split. We have 3 children (all girls) aged 11, 3 and 2.
I have taken abit of stick on here from ladies that havent red my profile right or not at all, they then see or i tell them i have kids and they disappear or give me abit of abuse. That is fine until i took my children out to the swimming pool for the first time alone! I was told i wasnt allowed in as there had to be two adults and was asked to leave the building. The children were in tears and i was nearly in tears myself because as i asked the manager to listen to reason the said he would call the police!
I have no one else i can ask to attend with me and truthfully who would be comfertable with someone elses children in that situation. So to sum it up as a single parent i have to pay council rates but im banned from using the leisure centre with my kids.
And before someon says "its a health and safty rule" If a rule excludes a whole part of society from doing a simple leisure activity, shouldnt they have something in place for that part of society .
Just wondering if anyone eles has had this sort of embarrissing hurtful thing happen to them | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 9:39:15 AM | OK, confused. They did not want to allow you to take your girls because you would be unable to accompany the younger girls to the bathroom?
Do they not allow women to go alone with young boys?
Did they show you a written rule that prohibits single parents from attending a swimming pool?
It is discrimination, it depends on how far you are willing to go to make sure your daughters have the same opportunities as other people. Years ago, people weren't allowed to use such facilities because of their skin color. People suffered and worked long and hard to change things. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 9:44:17 AM | | No they would even let me in the building! They have family changing rooms so that wouldn't have been an issue. They said there was a chance i would let them run away and drown! I wouldnt let either out of my arms let alone sight, and we would only be in the toddles pool anyway. My 11 year old is great with them and i tried to get them to understand that she would be there too. The manager wouldn't listen to reason and told me in front of a line of parents and children that if i didn't leave he would ring the police! | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 9:58:33 AM | You need to call them and ask to see their policy in writing that prohibits single parents from using the facility. If they do not have one, explain what happened and find out what you need to do if there is a problem in the future. If they continue to act stupid, find a soliciter that will sue them on a contingency basis because there is no doubt that you would win such a case even if there were written rules to this effect. It is a clear case of discrimination.
I think if they pulled that crap on a woman the whole place would have gone ballistic. I am sorry that none of the parents standing in line said anything on your behalf. Maybe you should call John Quinones from ABC and see if this scenario would be good for his new reality program that seeks to find whether people intervene or watch injustice when they encounter it. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 10:05:15 AM | OP is has nothing to to with being a single parent. One adult may NOT effectivly in the eyes of management supervise 2 little kids in a swimming pool. It could be your baby-sitter who would bring 3 kids to a swimming pool and still be turned away.
I bet their policy has somthing about proper adult supervision. But many wouldn't find 1 adult per 3 kids sufficient.
When I was 5 two of my buddies of the same age decided to go fishing. We all ended up in a forzen lake when the ice broke. Trust me, one adult was not enough to help us. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 10:22:09 AM | | OP, I've never heard of any type of policy such as this. Do they enforce the same rules with single mothers? Most swimming facilities have life guards on duty at all times. This just doesn't make any sense. I agree with another poster. Ask to see their policy in writing. Otherwise, go to a different pool if they truly have this. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 10:33:23 AM | Boy, I'd be in bad shape if that rule was in effect back when my ex and I split. My kids were 3 to 9 years old and I had four. The YMCA never turned us away nor did the summer pool we belonged to.
Go back without the kids and ask them to see the rule in writing. Then calmly explain how this discriminates against single parents. If they get any kind of of funding from the local, state or federal level, they should not be able to do this.
I could see where if there had been some kind of incident where your particular kids had been unruly and you had been asked to leave. I've seen kids misbahave with 2 parents there. Both of my younger kids were lifeguards, we've been involved with swimming forever, I was an assistant coach and I've never heard of this type of rule. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 10:34:04 AM | | My friend and I used to take all six of our kids to the public pool. They have life guards. That's three kids a parent and never a word was spoken, but then again, we are moms.... | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 11:58:21 AM | Our swimming pools have a rule of 3 kids per adult, children under the age of 7 must be within arms reach at all times. Our 2 7 yr old kids can go pretty much wherever they want in the pool without us. There has never been an issue of the 4 or 5 of us sharing a family change room.
I agree with phoning them and asking for a copy of their 'rules and guidelines' in writing. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 12:08:34 PM | Unbelievable. It's not like you had an entourage of 15 1st graders with you....good grief. I'm sorry that happened to you, and in front of the children as well. Tsk Tsk.
I would definitely have been calling them to the carpet!
Just out of curiosity, this "two adults" rule.......have you ever been to the pool in the middle of a weekday? Have there been Mom's there taking their pre-school aged children swimming?? Seems unlikely to me that there are ALWAYS two willing and able adults required to take children swimming. It would make for a pretty empty pool where "I" live! | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 12:21:24 PM | It has NOTHING to do with being a single parent or being discriminated gainst. You pool has a policy of one adult per child is the child is uinder a certain age. We have a pool with that same rule as well, although not every pool in the world has these policies. Change pools, but don't cry about being discriminated against as a single parent, one of which you have been for 19 days. Someone does not threaten to call the police unless the situation is escalating, so in honesty you shoudl admit you were not acting within reason. You have a whole lot to learn about being a single parent....and the first rule is stop blaming everythign that happens in your life because you are one. A sample of this rule looks like the followingn (directly means one adult one child, indirectly means :
Children 9 years and younger must always be escorted and directly supervised by an adult or responsible person over 18 years of age.
*** Children who pass the swim test must present and a leave a Swim Card at the front desk upon entering and pick it up upon leaving the facility.
*** Children who are 10-17 years and older and have passed the swim test, may use the pool without an adult as long as they present their Swim Card upon entering the facility.
***NOTE: All non-swimmers must be accompanied and directly supervised, within arms reach, of an adult at all times while within the facility | |
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WindF
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Joined: 1/8/2009
Msg: 12 | |
| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 2:05:15 PM | | I don't think I have ever heard of something like that happening in America,as long as there is one person over 18 accompanying children they let you go in.It sounds like discrimination to me. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 2:18:59 PM |
OP is has nothing to to with being a single parent. One adult may NOT effectivly in the eyes of management supervise 2 little kids in a swimming pool. It could be your baby-sitter who would bring 3 kids to a swimming pool and still be turned away.
I bet their policy has somthing about proper adult supervision. But many wouldn't find 1 adult per 3 kids sufficient.
That might seem logical, but I'm betting it was BS. I'm in the US, but as a single mother, I've taken my two boys to our local pool hundreds of times - from the time my younger son was an infant through now and *never* had anyone even question my ability to properly supervise and care for my children.
I have a sick feeling this was merely a case of discrimination against a single father. She saw a single dad and assumed that he was unable to care for his children. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 2:37:02 PM | Its a sad statement on society but here in the UK its sometimes because single men are tacitly suspected of being potential paedophiles using the pool to select and groom victims :-( Hence the apparently extreme measure of calling the police - not because you should not be there, but because you are being suspected of being a child abuser. If you point out you are their father that just further damns you because you are assumed to be using the "respectability" of being a father as a cover. This doesn't happen to women, just to men, and simply because we are men. Try taking your camera to photograph your own children at a swimming gala... well, actually don't as in all probability you'd be turned away, and no it has nothing to do with copyright!
That said, its never happened to me thankfully. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 3:03:36 PM | On checking the rules of our local pools they say this:
Main pools : One adult can be responsible for 2 children aged 4 to 7 years old or 1 child under 4 years old. Small pools : One adult can be responsible for 3 children aged 4 to 7 years old or 2 children under 8 where 1 or more is under 4 years old.
8 and overs need no supervision at all and can go in in their own right. Even under these rules you'd need two adults for the main pool, but you would be allowed into the small, shallow/learner pool. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 4:44:40 PM | I have come across this a lot being a single dad.
On one occasion when my daughter was still in nappies I was refused the key to the 'mother's and baby' changing room in my local shopping centre. I was told to 'Go and get the childs mother and she could have the key'. No matter how many times I explained to this obtuce and abrupt woman, that the childs mother was not around any more, it made no difference. I never got the key off her. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 6:55:32 PM | Re-raise that's atrocious. It's nice to see around this area....baby changing tables in the men's room as well as the women's...........
ETA: I would have taken the baby and changed her on the woman's desk....... | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 7:03:37 PM | Seriously, there is nothing "atrocious" or discriminatory about it. Despite the OP's protest, it really does sound like a health and safety issue. 2 children under the age of 4 plus a third and only one adult to supervise. Does not seem unreasonable at all that a swimming pool might decide that is an unsafe ratio; particularly in light of the number of young children that drown in swimming pools each year.
Of course it is not discriminatory against single parents. It is a blanket rule to protect children. Anyone turning up with that ratio would be turned away. And a single parent with only 2 children or perhaps 3 children all able to swim and over the age of 12 may well have been allowed in.
If a rule excludes a whole part of society from doing a simple leisure activity
But that is simply not the case. Not all single parents are excluded, not even all adults on their own with 3+ children are excluded persumably. It is unfortunate you are so isolated that you don't have a single person you could take with you and the kids. But sometimes thats the way it goes.
Sorry, but there is really no issue here or any discrimination. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 7:39:59 PM | That sure is frustrating! Had it happen to me, once in the wave pool and they insisted that the children were at arms length even with life jackets on, two arms length and the guards would speak up and get ready to reprimand me. Fun! And they told me the rules after I paid admission. Then again, every couple of years some poor child drowns in that pool, it seems, so i can understand that the guards are anxious.
We went to quieter pools and the rules were more relaxed, but it was still hard to comply with the "at arms length" rule (without life jacket) and I was always happy when the guards were male, they were generally easier going about the whole thing. How is that for gender bashing?
All I can say is hang in there, they do grow up and it will get easier. At what age does a teenager count to provide childcare during swimming? Maybe hire a babysitter to come along with you for the swim so you all get to relax a bit? | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/19/2009 10:34:31 PM |
When I was 5 two of my buddies of the same age decided to go fishing. We all ended up in a forzen lake when the ice broke. Trust me, one adult was not enough to help us.
jmo but... I think there is a slight difference between a frozen lake where the ice breaks and a kiddie pool in a rec center.
I've been a single mom since my youngest was 2 mos. While I've never tried to take them to a rec center on my own, we used to go to the wading pool in our complex all the time. At the time my kids were 2, 4, and 6. I NEVER had an issue with being able to supervise them all at the same time. You sit right there with them and watch them, you don't sit several feet away in one of the lounge chairs, you don't read a book. You watch them.
As for the person that said that people don't say they're going to call the police unless there's a reason. Please! Managers threaten that often as a bluff. Most people don't want the police involved and will back down, doesn't matter if they were acting in a manner that requires police or not. It's an easy and effective way to get rid of someone you no longer want to deal with.
OP - I'm really sorry this happened to you. At the very least I would just call and check how you can get a copy of their policies. You don't need to tell them why you want them, just simply call and ask for them. If there is nothing stating an adult:child ratio, then have that with you if you try to go again. Or just go to another pool if you can (and check before hand what their rules for supervision are) | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/20/2009 1:33:49 AM | I'm so glad I live in Australia. I've never noticed anything like that here. I mean, you pay to go to a public pool that has life guards etc that are paid to do a job (keep an eye on the swimmers) what more do they want from you. The toddler wading pools are shallow and safe. A lot of 3 year olds in Australia can swim anyway and having your 11 year old to also help should be sufficient. Geez, I know 5 year olds that can swim better than I can, well almost.
I would have phoned the manager and complained about the employee's attitude towards the swimming center customers and pointed out that he acted in this was in front of all their other customers. But hey, I can't say much as I don't know the full story. All I know is I am glad people where I live aren't like that.
Being a single parent is what you make of it, don't let a few negative experiences get you down, there is always plenty of other things to do or other swim centers that are more accommodating. I'm sure if you ignore the negative posts and take notice of the positive ones you'll find a solution..
Amore,
You come across as very negative and bitter.
So what, he's been a single dad for 19 days as you say. He was merely putting an experience out there, you don't have to give the guy grief over that. Secondly, where was he blaming everything on being a single parent? Why do you have to accuse him of behaviour that you have no idea of whether he did or did not do. He never mentioned the word discrimination, you did, and a few other people suggested that he had been discriminated against..He put his story out there and then asked if anyone else had experienced the same or similar.. Negative people interpret things as negative. Smile, it won't hurt you. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/20/2009 1:41:14 AM | | I can understand that you are upset. It would give me a slow burn. However, you can always hire a baby sitter to go swimming with you and your girls or, better yet, find other things to do. Girls love to go swimming but even more they want your attention. Take them on a picnic and play games and they will be just as happy. | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/20/2009 1:53:18 AM | Nothing like that up here in canada.
I regularily take a handful of toddlers to the pool.
My son is a proficient little swimmer, his girlfriend isnt.
The lifeguards know us by name we are there so much.
I would be filing a formal complaint for discimination.
Some people really are that stupid to believe the things they do.
ie. we have a section of pool called a lazy river. you have to have kids in life preserver if they are under 5.
So the f*cked up oriental parents just tell the lifeguard their 3 yr olds are 6 yrs old to avoid making them wear life preservers. They refuse to follow the standard policy of wearing plastic covers over the diapers. Grrrrrrrrr
But OP hang in there | |
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| Never thought single parents had it so bad.
Posted: 1/20/2009 3:01:17 AM | Thanks for the response and support. For the people with question's, or that are using the term "HEALTH AND SAFETY" (which i think is destroying the fabric of a friendly society) i will set things stright.
I was not rude in anyway, because i dared to say the rule was flawed the receptionist said i was being aggressive. This has already crept into hospital's and airport's, you make even the slightest objecting noise and your either arrested or thrown out. This means you can never complain.
I pay my rate's which in turn pay for all council building's, should i get a refund or should they do something about the large part of the community they leave out.
Every mid week primary schools with one teacher for upto 20 children are admitted. Why is that safer?
Dont forget this rule also affects 2 parent families with more than 2 children!
And finally, no one looks after my childrens health and saftey better than me, i have never negleted them or been in any trouble. The last people i would ever trust with my family is local government.
The B.B.C has picked up on the story, i will keep everyone informed. There isnt just one issue here, the way it was handled was bad and i was give no alternative. | |
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