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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:33:29 PM | Keep in mind my age 64, so I've been a little "Old Fashioned".
And a little backround so you can help me. Married 38 years..so, I was new to the wonderful world of dating.
At first I'd meet someone on line, email and then talk on the phone, arrange a date, whooopi! Well, for the first 8-10 dates I'd bring a bouque of flowers (I know, silly) and take them to a nice dinner...in Seattle that's an easy $100. and usually it was a first and last date! Well, talked to a couple guys I know who are dating, and they said are you nuts? Meet for coffee or a drink, no flowers. So, I learned.
I've never been accused of being cheap or frugal, and I'd probably get pissed if I were accused.
Here's the thing. Last week I met this lady for a few drinks and we had some ordurves, about $60., but some of my friends were at another club doing Karaoke. So, I asked her if she'd like to go over there, she said sure, another $40., I didn't feel bad, actually damn good, and I almost thought of it as two dates.
Well, we both had a great time and decided to date again. I asked her if she'd like to come to my house and I'd cook dinner, she said yes, but later got cold feet, and I completely understood that. Said she'd rather meet someplace quiet so she could get to know me better. Sounds logical. But on Friday or Saturday night, not to many quiet places. And she emailed me and said why not meet at a water front restaurant? So, here I was again, dinner was another $100. keep in mind she didn't even flinch when they brought the bill, never offered anything. And I may not have accepted if she had.
At any rate, I'm tired of spending $100. on dinners...even with a second, or possibly third date. Oh, and the date wasn't all that good, said she was tired. I'm probably not going to ask her out again.
So, how do you say something about that without sounding like a cheap skate? | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:37:03 PM | Make your own plans.
Look in your local newspaper or online for inexpensive, interesting things do to.
Sitting outside a museum in the garden is a quiet place.
Strolling the boardwalk and watching the sunset is a nice way to get to know someone.
Seeing a free concert and having coffee afterward is good.
Don't rely on the dinner thing. Get more creative | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:39:01 PM | Hmmm thats a whole of prices, so you spent a fortune and got nothing back.Next time suggest going dutch or you cooking at home.See what she says.Go to McDonnels, they do a great Caesar salad.
You've been had and you know it.Sounds like you hoped for something for your trouble.But she is avoiding it, a user.Get wise and dont spend so much on early dates, you will soon filter out the users. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:40:15 PM | Listen, I am gonna tell you this man to man.
Go halvsies until you're official.
Not only is it not frugal, often times it works against you in the dating world to do EVERYTHING for a girl. Get her flowers, buy her dinner, buy her drinks can actually be a huge turn off for girls thinking that you are a push over and they can get whatever they might want off of you. This is, of course, only initially. As things progress (eg you end up having sex) then you can do whatever is comfortable for you. Early on, though, it can actually be repulsive to women.
So, I suggest, that you start following the following rule. Split the tabs. The only time you should pick up a round is if she agrees to pick up the next one.
You should be there for eachother's company, not as a paid ticket.
Just my opinion. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:42:16 PM | Wow, when she named the place, she should have paid, it was her turn anyway. I mean I have a very low income but if I told a guy where to meet me, I'd make sure it was a place I could afford, because even if he refused to let me pay at least I know I could and should. But if you would not let her pay, then why complain? Next time save the great, expensive dates for someone you really want to woo and take those you are just getting to know better to coffee houses or other places where the price won't dent your wallet. There's is nothing wrong with saying...let's go dutch at the local cafe...if a woman doesn't like that, then why want to date her? But again, if you are going to insist on paying all the time, don't complain about it costing you, that's your choice. Be honest. ask where you could meet that won't cost you an arm & a leg LOL honesty is the best way to find the right person.  | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:45:11 PM | right....
take out the dinner part on your profile for starters..
if she is a genuine person and interested in you then she will gladly go for a coffee or a walk,there is plenty to do if you don't want to spend money,
by a bus ticket and go for a bus ride..yous can natter away while looking at the sights,
and if yous think yous are not for each other just jump off..
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:58:01 PM | she wanted somewhere quiet?
Think a picnic or a walk in the park. A trip to the zoo or a gazillion other ideas for a weekend. Tons of places available to spend time cheaply.
Quit doing expensive dinner dates. You guys sound like you have never had to do this before.
First meets?? A 30 minute or two drink time limit at happy hour. That should give you enough info to know if you want a real date if you really messaged and phoned a bunch first. That meet if it goes well can change into a dinner date!
But keep your first meets SHORT and CHEAP.
But even after that the dates dont have to be $100 a pop. Be creative and pick fun things out to do together. I have picked a gal up early on Saturday morning and ran around to garage sales and flea markets and we went to the grocery store together and bought stuff to make for dinner. I love those kind because its how we will spend our lives together. A normal Saturday not a night on the town at an expensive restaurant.
Trust me I can have as much fun laughing and joking together pushing a shopping cart at walmart with the right gal then blowing $200 on a fancy evening with someone else.
Focus on doing less expensive and more normal activities getting to know them. I love a drive in the country etc as it gives a lot of time to talk.
Best of luck
Cowboy | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 12:59:19 PM | lets say that you're enjoying an active dating life at the moment, if you go on a $100 date say twice week, that adds up to be quite a large chunk of the money you work darmn hard for. and what are you getting out of it? watching her feed her belly?
Dont get me wrong, I'm not a cheap skate either. I try to limit my first dates to be under about $30. Have you ever tried just taking her to a park and throwing a frisbee. maybe bring a picnic lunch. she will be telling her friends about how romantic it all was all the while you still have plenty of money left over.
There are women out there who are serial daters, these are the same women who have moved on from scoring free drinks at bars to getting guys to buy them expensive dinners on dates.
Also, whats with the flowers? has she earnt them yet? Also, many women may feel that you're trying to buy your way into her pants with all this spendature.
oh and cooking at your place, AWESOME idea. women love a man who can cook. a little candle light, a glass of red. dude, the evening writes its self.
Just remember, the first date is all about getting to know her, seeing if you have a connection, something more than just physical animal attraction. do you really think feeding her belly is the best way for this?
Another idea for a first date, you could take her grocery shopping, yes, you heard me, grocery shopping. get the stuff you actually need, but also you could start buying stuff that you're going to cook that night, or if she's into cooking you could sugest a bit of an iron chef battle in your kitchen. buy all the stuff, then back to your place, and take it from there.
seriously, try to save your money on these women until they actually deserve it. and by deserve it, they show that they are into you, perhaps she becomes a full time girlfriend or wife, or even if she just becomes a friend (well even then you should be going dutch) dont think that buying them dinner, flowers etc will allow you access to their pants. unfortunately its not going to happen (also isnt that a form of prostitution? ladies? thoughts?)
I have a mate who is really sneeky when it comes to this, what he does is tells her that he is taking her to a super expensive restaurant, ones with valet parking and all that other jazz. now she is going to be telling her girlfriends about how you're taking her to this fancy expensive place, she probably wont eat all day. as she knows she's going to be getting lots of really good food into her. all on your bill. now the trick my mate reckons is to visit your local burger joint before hand, spend a couple of dollars on burgers and enjoy them. then pick up your woman, take her to the expensive restaurant, and only order yourself a salad, or just an entre, as you're not that hungry any more. now an intersting thing will happen... almost all women will not eat more than a man on a first date. i think its out of politness or not wanting to make a pig out ofherself, Look, I'm not condoning this, but its something that my mate does. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:03:14 PM | Hmmm, don't call her. If you can't do that then simply mention plans of things you are going to do like go to the museum, go for some coffee - some stress free activity and do not invite her along or ask her what her plans are then make a fast decision on following through and inviting or now. I wouldn't based on her previous actions. You are subtiy forcing your preferences and follow through on those activities. It's great to pamper a lady, I love doing it! But she comes across and demanding and also unnappreciative. She is giving you nothing of herself. She seems selfish. I am guessing she spends a lot of her time on those dates talking about herself or complaining. You're better off alone! Best of luck!
***Whistles 'When I'm 64"**** | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:04:10 PM |
Go halvsies until you're official.
I agree and when your official even more so. I make as much or more than most men I date and I understand the cost of going out all the time. I like going out so I will ALWAYS share in the cost. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:12:04 PM | I just wanted to say, I've never had a $100 dinner date LOL I can't imagine, what do you wear, does the dress have to cost as much as the dinner, what do you eat, two people, for that much money? I guess I'm cheap but give me an expensive date meaning Chili's or Outback and a movie. I wouldn't even want to eat anywhere where my half of a meal was 50.00, what a waste, and I know I don't have the clothes or the desire for something like that. If I can't wear jeans and sandals, I don't want to go!
A 100.00 for one date, that's just insane! | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:21:53 PM | I see a little more clarity is needed. First, I've been on 20-30 dates now. So, the flowers ceased at 8-10. Second I've done the picnic thing, went for walks, coffee, a couple drinks, etc. But it's a little to cold in Seattle for that now (picnics). I appreciate all the responses and please keep them comming. But I'm still looking for the verbiage?
You know like "well, I'd like to get to know you better too, but lets keep it simple and not so expensive...maybe dutch treat". How does that come across? | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:24:09 PM | While I am sure (not through experience) that there are scores of women out there that are just going out for a free meal, I am equally sure that there are (definitely through experience) many men who are quite offended and very insistent that they pick up the bill.
Until you are actually dating I would suggest going dutch. The tricky part of that is to make sure you are clear about it being dutch long before the date. I really hate the break down at the end of the date.
I always go on a new date with the funds to pay my share of it but you men need to realize that we women aren't mind readers. We don't know which camp you fall into until you let us know. The times I have asked before a date usually has the guy saying that dutch sounds great but then on the actual date he insists on paying. I have also had guys tell me that they would prefer to pay for the date but then when the waitress asks they ask for separate checks. While I could take that to mean that their interest level in me dropped off during the date it conflicts with the fact that they almost always ask for a second date which I tend to not be inclined to want to repeat because they put me into an awkward position because what if I hadn't come prepared with enough cash to pay my share?
The best solution is to avoid high end spending during the getting to know you phase, as others have suggested. This allows you to get to know someone, never have to bring up the idea of dutch and lets you avoid spending a crap load of money even if you can afford it. While it's great to ask a prospective date what they would like to do in general, come up with a game plan that offers a couple of different yet inexpensive options. Sharing some quiet time getting to know each other can be done at a park. Personally I like more active kinds of dates... putt putt, playing pool, going the walking trail by the river, walking around a museum. Check the local events in the paper as there is almost always something going on that is either going to be free or fairly inexpensive. Sitting down to dinner can be a bit boring and routine to those that have been dating more than a minute so going outside of the typical box will make a better impression and let the other know you don't plan on being just another first date that goes nowhere. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:25:30 PM | I would just say, how about meeting for drinks/coffee/cola, dutch treat, and leave it at that. When you say, let's keep it simple, not so expensive, it opens too many doors...like well other women got more from him but I'm his idea of a cheap date, etc., just leave it at dutch treat and let it go from there. No reason to invite debate on why you don't want to pay.
And by the way, not all women what a challenge, ugh!, some of us just want comfortable. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:27:59 PM | Lonesomerick, there in lies the problem, Its okay to be a gentleman, but you have to realize that some people will take advantage of you
First thing is , Never meet someone for dinner on the first meeting, don't confuse first meeting with a date, there are serial daters out there who just meet for the free dinners.
Second, never take someone to dinner on the first date after the first meeting, a first date should be fun, not saying dinner isn't fun , but fun as in doing something exciting.
Dinners should be when you're actually dating, not trying to get to know someone, sounds like the woman in question wants to keep treating her to dinner. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:35:23 PM | I'd suggest that you say you'd like to keep the first meet simple and short. At no time would I suggest a dinner.
Btw, when meeting someone for the first time, I like to arrange time on the weekends-- usually in the afternoon between lunch and dinner. We meet and walk around our downtown tourist area...browsing and stopping in for fudge, coffee, samosas, ice-cream or whatever. The walking gives you constant changing scenery, fodder for discussion, and an opportunity to see what common interests you have as you make decisions about what places to go into; further, it can be as active as you both want it to be and doesn't oblige either for lunch or dinner.
I also like Sunday morning breakfasts--fabulous--sometimes decadent, but always affordable. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 1:59:44 PM |
And I may not have accepted if she had.
You had me until you said that. I can understand your complaint if she had not offered, but for you to complain and say that you probably would have refused puts a different spin on it.
You put the "standards" into effect by the first date. You easily dropped over $100 without blinking an eye--why would she think you would object to the second place she suggested? And remember, you can always just say "no." If your date proposes a restaurant and you know it is pricey, suggest another place.
Are you not going to ask her out because of the price of the date or because it wasn't very good?
So, how do you say something about that without sounding like a cheap skate?
Make it "split the check" on the first date, and discuss it beforehand. If you don't bring it up, then don't complain. Many women are accustomed to men paying. I usually offer and see how strongly men react; if they insist, they can pay--if not, I will pay for my dinner. Having said that, I will choose an inexpensive restaurant because I am a poor teacher.
This might be off topic, but I also have something to say about cooking dinner for a man. If we go out and we split the check (which I don't mind!), he isn't going to get a home-cooked meal. When I cook dinner, I usually go all out, including dessert--not to mention the time I spend in the kitchen. Bringing a bottle of wine as a contribution is not equal to the money and time spent in preparing a good dinner.
Preparing dinner is a good tit for tat for men who insist on paying for eating out. Or, as the OP suggested, when he cooks dinner.
I used to date a man who took me out to dinner about once a week, then he would come spend the night and I would cook. I soon figured out not only was I spending more money on the food I prepared for him, he took some home for a couple more meals AND got breakfast the next day.
For him, it was a deal! The last straw was when we went to the movies and he had forgotten his debit card. I should have bought my ticket and left him standing.
Before you men get defensive--this is not the norm for most guys. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:08:40 PM | well, I'd like to get to know you better too, but lets keep it simple and not so expensive...maybe dutch treat
That would turn me off completely. I don't want to discuss money on a date. If you ask a person out you pay. But you also get to choose where. Do you always spend $100 when you go out with a friend? I doubt it. But if you call and invite her then you are expected to bear the expense. Your lady friend suggesting an expensive restaurant then watching you pay the check was wrong.
Try museums, historic places, winery tours, afternoon at a bookstore and coffee, local theatre groups, lectures, college dance troops, not all great dates involve dropping $100 bucks. Successful dates are all about connection, conversation and having fun. One of the best 'dates' I ever had involved a round trip on the Staten Island Ferry, about $3.00 each. We had an ice cream and watched the seagulls. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:12:15 PM | Tell her you plan on spending quality time, with a nice lady, not your whole pay.
If she runs, don't follow. Better to find out right from the get go. Too many gold diggers out there. Male and Female. We are in a recession. Tell her you're just
practicing for when it worsens. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:13:07 PM | I always like to meet for coffee first. And I always try to be there first and have my coffee,reading a paper because that is something I do enjoy alone or with someone.I explain to the gentleman that is why I was aready there.
First meeting's are awkward,this way its very little money invested on both sides,and you can take as long or short a time that's confortable. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:13:49 PM | Don't request Dutch. There's something cheap about it.
Don't do coffee. Too much like a sterile interview.
And a dinner date for a first outing is over the top and too much out of your pocket.
I think the ideal first outing should involve an activity or interest that affords conversation and it shouldn't cost much. Be creative. Meet at a bookstore. A mall. A zoo. A flea market. Public park for a stroll. It all depends on what your mutual interests are.
Dinner dates are special outings and shouldn't be expected as the norm. | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:18:17 PM | So you're talking about one woman here and really, I'd use her behaviour as a guide to her character. That's her character -- not the character of all women.
Part of it is down to you: you never gave her the impressions that the money meant anything to you, you suggested/accepted the activities and you further suggest that you may not even have accepted if she had offered to pay. Why not? Trying to project an image?
Meet for coffee instead. Talk. Talk about roles, talk about money talk about who pays. You never know, you might get to know the values and character of the person you're sitting across the table from.
Some women always expect "the man" to pay for everything. They are one type. Interestingly there are always plenty of men who think little enough of themselves that they will allow themselves to be sold the idea that their wallet is what makes them worthy.
There is another type of woman, but are you the type of man who could feel worthy of love without your wallet? | |
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| Ok Guys and Girls, need a little help with verbiage!
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:20:45 PM | ~OP~ I not only respect your way of meeting, I applaud that you still value chivalry.  I don't know when dating became such a nightmare or when it got so complicated, but it's our reality I'm afraid. I personally do NOT meet/greet. If I don't know enough about him to warrant a "date" ~ I don't go. This whole financial issue is a plague for us all. The way I do it? If he invites, he pays. If I invite, I'll gladly pay. I do make the "arrangements" a topic of conversation prior to venturing into the real world. If there are no agreements, it's awkward and strange (in my mind.) In all of the years I've done this ~ my money has never been accepted on a first date. If there was a 2nd, I mad(k)e it a point to let him know I'd be paying in advance. That usually keeps the weirdness to a minimum. How do you bring this up? Straight up. I don't think you should leave something of this nature to imagination. If you are frenzy-dating (as it appears you might be) then you'll have more of an issue because you probably don't know a whole lot about the other person ~ take a little more time and be a little selective in who you choose to actually take somewhere that money might be involved. JMO  | |
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