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 Therightone4unow
Joined: 2/13/2009
Msg: 1
Do you trust government?Page 1 of 2    (1, 2)
I personaly think responsible government would be a good thing. I mean who wouldn't? However it's not about what it should be, it's about what is.

Many ideas sound good on paper, but just won't work bcause people abuse power. I think most forms of government would work so long as the government followed it's own rules. When any government feels above the law, that is when things go down hill.

Now ask yourself this if you feel the US government believes it's above the law or not. I don't think the government wouldn't throw you in front of a bus if they thought it would help them in some small way. I think it's a bad sign of things to come, but I hope I'm wrong.
 Yevgeny
Joined: 3/15/2008
Msg: 2
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 1:44:42 PM
Absolutely, I trust the government...





... to screw up anything they touch. And in my 24 years of working on a variety of government contracts, they have never disappointed me in that respect. And especially not lately, ever since they decided that normal SNAFU situation is not really sufficient, and implemented a bold and courageous scheme to move it to FUBAR.
 cotter
Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 3
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 5:09:02 PM

And in my 24 years of working on a variety of government contracts ...
Hmmm ... apparently doesn't keep you from continuing to work for the government that screws up anything they touch. Is it at least good money? I mean there must be something about it that keeps you going after more?

OT ...
Now ask yourself this if you feel the US government believes it's above the law or not.
I believe the last administration thought and felt and acted like they were above the law. I think many of them should be tried and sent to prison for the rest of their lives ... Gitmo comes to mind.

I think it's a bad sign of things to come, but I hope I'm wrong.
I think the current administration ... while I'm definitely disturbed about all the Zionists currently in top positions ... is going to show us we can basically trust them. I just hope they don't sell out the Palestinians just because it would please certain cabinet or staff members.

I'm impressed that national health care is in the budget. I really didn't think OBAMA would get to that in less than two years.
 Yevgeny
Joined: 3/15/2008
Msg: 4
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 6:09:37 PM

Hmmm ... apparently doesn't keep you from continuing to work for the government that screws up anything they touch. Is it at least good money? I mean there must be something about it that keeps you going after more?


Oh, absolutely good money. And, the nice thing is that there is no real need to do a good job. A few times that we did, it didn't matter anyway, because the system never got used. And, other times when the system turned out well, it didn't matter because they kept changing what they wanted so many times that we ended in good design totally unsuitable for the purpose they ended up with. Why do you think government projects are so always late and over budget?

So, after a while, you just stop caring about doing a good job. What's the point of making a high quality square peg if you know that somewhere along the line you will end up with a round hole?

Now, all the projects that I dealt with have been in planning for many months, in some cases years. They are still badly misdesigned, mismanaged, and the plans change constantly throughout the duration of the project. I don't think I need to tell you what will happen when the same gang that can't handle their usual workload with any degree of organization gets told that they need to push hundreds of percents of extra workload of stimulus spending. It will make the current screw ups seem quaint and tame in comparison. If you think that things are broken now, the new projects will make the current mess look like model of efficiency and performance.

But, hey... no skin of my back. The company I work for will get all kinds of extra work (yes, we already had meetings on that), and we will get rich in the process, on the back of taxpayers of course. Just don't expect any system we design to do anything remotely useful.
 Hawaiianluau
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 5
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 6:16:06 PM
I have friends who work in the very government jobs Obama is dolling out to save our economy.
They laugh every day about the 2 hour paid lunch breaks, sqandered time on the clock and newbies getting put in line for working too hard and making the old timers look bad.
Yep, that should rescue us from ruin alright.
'Course none of it matters to the current admin since they will blame it all on Bush.
Lovely.
 Hawaiianluau
Joined: 11/13/2008
Msg: 6
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 8:58:10 PM
^
In other words ~
I agree with posts 2 and 4.
 sorot
Joined: 10/18/2008
Msg: 7
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 9:59:52 PM

Oh, absolutely good money. And, the nice thing is that there is no real need to do a good job. A few times that we did, it didn't matter anyway, because the system never got used. And, other times when the system turned out well, it didn't matter because they kept changing what they wanted so many times that we ended in good design totally unsuitable for the purpose they ended up with. Why do you think government projects are so always late and over budget?


A "fabulous" nostalgic memories came to my mind while me working for US government more than a decade ago not here, but back in my country, I mean in US embassy . . . . . //// No much work, just keep "in touch with people" and you are fine //// expensive trips and receptions //// getting compensated for bunch of staff such as those for "meeting with people", buying nonsense stuff for the office ////// and yes, forgot, , my boss was paying about $3,500 a month for "renting" a house, while the same houses were only like $400-$500 bucks.

Life was good, not like me now in USA working my azzzzz hard to run my business, putting hours in Saturday and Sun, finishing sometimes 10-11 pm, paying for mistakes of "employees" who don't give a (&*%(%, since they think they make money for me, while , , , , APR 15th is almost here, a huge portion of this money is going to support the lifestyle of "government" "special people" oh, I didn't know that only government people are special, I didn't feel special while working for US government while driving the car 80 MPH on city streets and no policeman stopping me, they had the delusion as if I was special, now I see the real "special".
 cpfstock
Joined: 11/7/2005
Msg: 8
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 10:17:02 PM
I'd say Terence Corcoran of the Financial Post has it about right. He said,
" The AIG bonus firestorm is a diversion from real issues , but it puts the ghastly political classes who make U. S. law on display for what they are: ageing self-serving demagogues who have spent decades warping the U. S. political system for their own ends. We see the system up close, law-making that is riddled with slap-dash, incompetence and gamesmanship."
He writes futher, "The presidency of Barack Obama has set out on a course that has no precedent in U. S. history. " And adds, "Reform of health care, environmental policy, education, energy, banking, regulation -- every nook and cranny of the U. S. economy has been put on alert for major change. Expansion of government spending, plunging the U. S. into unprecedented deficits, is without parallel. In economic policy, through regulation and control of energy output, financial services and monetary expansion, the U. S. government has embarked on a fundamental reshaping of America. It is designed, in short, to bring on the end of America."

It would seem a Canadian has a better grasp of the politcal situation in American than at least 52% of Americans have.
 Therightone4unow
Joined: 2/13/2009
Msg: 9
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 10:49:15 PM
Currently every man woman and child are in Debt for an additional $36,130.97 above any other bill we have. Now if we came up with a plan to pay this off independently, the government would still continue to spend, spend, spend.

I feel the government want's us to serve it, and not the other way around. This is true whether they have an (R) or a (D) after their names. I'm powerless to do a damn thing about it. I'm made to feel like a child who is not allowed to even spectate on decisions that will effect the rest of my life.
 southernlass
Joined: 5/2/2006
Msg: 10
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/25/2009 11:35:54 PM
No, I don't trust government.

And I don't think we've seen anything yet.
 EarlzP
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 11
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/27/2009 6:32:43 AM
We are the government, if we do not like the way our country is being run we have a legal way and also a responsibility to change it.

After watching President Obama mobilize the people and defeat two strong candidates it should be obvious that we can elect the person we want to represent us, I think we are the problem we would rather moan,groan and whine then put the time in to change the direction we are going in

Just take a look at the lack of interest here at this site their are many members and only a handful that even want to exchange ideas, some where at some point it became politically incorrect to talk about politics and religion, we have a self imposed ban on our most important freedom the freedom of speech
 Romantic Heretic
Joined: 10/24/2007
Msg: 12
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/27/2009 12:40:50 PM
Do I trust government?

No more than I trust the business community.

Same type of people in both sectors. And those people are us.
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 13
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/27/2009 12:59:24 PM
The reason there isn't much interest in this area of the forum is the owner has done everything but eliminate it altogether. Unless you know it exists, you cannot see it from the forums home page.

I think your statement romanticizes our government a little bit. Unless you get a large amount of likeminded people to give "our" government any lip service at all, those in charge are doing what best serves their purpose, then they throw us a bone or two. The legal and responsible way of removing anyone from government (I am assuming you mean either voting or impeaching) is not something that is easily done. In the case of voting, 2-4 years is a long time to change things you disagree with and a lot of damage can be done in that amount of time. And I would say that at least 48% percent of the people in the U.S. aren't very happy with the latest administration (and the number grows almost daily).

I would also disagree that Obama beat two strong candidates. I think the republican party knew they were destined to lose thanks to GW and they ran a very poor campaign (or just a campaign of desperation or a campaign of not giving a damn). Even so, the fact that popular vote was so close should tell you that if the other party should get their act together and run someone with strong ideas in the next election, or if Obama continues to divide, polarize, go back on his campaign promises, and make poor decisions as he has thus far, I think you will see a quick return to the GOP. The future is hard to predict.

As far as trusting government goes--yes and no.
I trust them to take my money and do things I don't want them to do with it. Is that a good trust or a bad trust? No matter-it's still trust.

Do I trust them to do what is right for the country? No. But I trust they will do what is in their best interest.

So maybe the initial question and topic of this thread needs more elaboration.
 ZenBeth
Joined: 2/23/2009
Msg: 14
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/27/2009 4:04:37 PM
As it was designed by the Founding Fathers, it was a great idea. But we got away from the one person one vote long ago. Now its one corporation or union group that gets the elected folks attention. Grease their hand and wink and they do what the monied folks say.

Never mind that the folks on the plane that went down in PA on 9/11, died to prevent the terrorists from plowing into the Capital where all those loser Congress/Senate members were.

Alas, I wonder if the Constitutionalists who want the government to be as the Founding Father invisioned will finally get so mad that we get a new Revolution....
 Romantic Heretic
Joined: 10/24/2007
Msg: 15
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/27/2009 6:01:17 PM
I'm expecting that.

What the Constitutionalists forget is that the Founding Fathers were extraordinary individuals with great learning, wisdom and vision.

The current crop of Constitutionalists, what I've seen of them, not so much.

They'd be more like the Taliban than Washington, Jefferson, et al.
 Wookie50
Joined: 4/9/2006
Msg: 16
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 3:59:30 AM
As others pointed out the government is us and what we agree to. It's not some faceless enemy we dredge up when it's politically convenient. Interestingly, the people who gave us warrantless wiretapping and and detainment without charges are back to worrying about the government overstepping its bounds.
 allegiant_one
Joined: 6/3/2008
Msg: 17
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 6:15:29 AM
As others pointed out the government is us and what we agree to.


Long ago, I've agreed to the notion that "everyone" deserves a Bail-out and not just the Rich. Afterall, the Party of the "little guy" (Democrats) promised me one.

So, I've decided to take "action" which I couldn't do under the previous Administration.

First, I quit my job. The Party of the "little guy" promised to take care of me. So, I set up a lounge chair in my front yard with my sun glasses and tanning lotion in tow. A big cold glass of Iced Tea waits for me next to my chair. You may ask what I'm doing?

I'm waiting for the mail. Lots of gifts are comin to me and I'm just so giddy!

You see, after I quit my job, I sent in my mortgage papers to the Tresaury expecting it to be paid in full. I'm waiting for my deed stamped "paid in full" to come in the mail. Boy, I can't wait!

But that's not all I did.

I sent in a request for a new car. I'm expecting it to be delivered to me any day now, so I don't want to miss it. Green is my favorite color, so I put in my request for an "American made" Chevy Volt in Green. I have my extention cord "at the ready" to plug it in as soon as it gets here. Gee...I'm so excited!

I can't tell you all how excited I am! But there's more!

I don't have to worry about my Medical Insurance anymore! Nor do I worry anymore about paying for my utility bills, food, appliances, home furnishings or transportation (in case my Chevy Volt is in the shop for repairs). Heck, they even repair my house, if I need it. This is Great! Everything is FREE FREE FREE! Halleujah! They even send me a check so I have some "spending money". too! Whoo! Whoo!

My neighbors think I'm crazy, but I tell them not to worry. I just hand them Political flyers from the Party of the "little guy" and tell em they can have this too if they just vote for them. I also tell em that "We" are the Government and "We" can give ourselves ANYTHING we want! Isn't this Wonderful? Isn't this Grand?

Finally! sigh....no more worries. All you got to do is "Trust" the Government!
 Wookie50
Joined: 4/9/2006
Msg: 18
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 7:47:33 AM
Well that was kind of a dumb move. The stimulus plan is about jobs, not free stuff. We got a little tired of the deregulation and outsourcing that the "individualists" assured us would create jobs so we came up with a new plan.
 allegiant_one
Joined: 6/3/2008
Msg: 19
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 8:49:49 AM
The stimulus plan is about jobs, not free stuff. We got a little tired of the deregulation and outsourcing that the "individualists" assured us would create jobs so we came up with a new plan.


Well....I'll be....a "new" plan....

Shucks! And I thought I was goin to git a Bail-out! (maybe Ise not rich enuff to git one) Oh well....Ise best put on my Sunday "clothes" and hit the pavement.

What kind of jobs is the Government creatin? Ise know they can create "money" out of thin air! Should Ise go atop of a high mountain, where the air is thin, and wait for the Government to "rain down" a job on me? Geez...Ise a hopin its a good one!

Ise know that Hillary promised 200,000 "new" jobs in New York State when she was Senator, but theys didn't come through. Maybe the mountains ain't high enuff here in New York.


We got a little tired


Who be "We"? Cuz Ise only "Trustin" in the Government!


outsourcing


Yeah. Ise was wonderin about that. Why did Bubba sign NAFTA to send those there jobs away? Ise thought he be FOR the "little guy", like me?
 Dovelett
Joined: 12/10/2007
Msg: 20
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 5:58:19 PM
Hell No

Can't wait to see whom they blame now. They love to spend money OUR MONEY

The TAXPAYERS. If you have a government job good for you1 ....they make excellent money with PAID benefits.. Oh please do not let me not forget

This president is spending more money -not checking NOR listening to the facts.OR MAYBE HE IS..hmmm.. anyhow, asking others to sign a package of over 1000 pages and never read it...DUGH !! HE spends more on TV air time and flies around like a kid who got his first bit of real money....

When he keeps referring to he inhertied this..I want to vomit. Did he think what might happen in the next four years or what problems might come up? Who will he blame it on then. His buddies in Fannie May and Freddie Mac and AIG well says it all...

Just enjoy the front yard cause others will be joining you... Can't blame ya

Do I trust the government HELL NO...
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 21
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/30/2009 6:49:35 PM

As others pointed out the government is us and what we agree to.


No, actually right now the government is what about 52% of you want--the other 48% are watching our country go down the toliet.


It's not some faceless enemy we dredge up when it's politically convenient.


Nope not anymore. To those who create jobs and pay the most taxes in this country, the biggest enemy is right behind the telepromter (or um um umming when he's not).


Interestingly, the people who gave us warrantless wiretapping and and detainment without charges are back to worrying about the government overstepping its bounds.


Yeah, by allowing iteself the power to grab up businesses it sees fit and then taking them over without any rhyme or reason. How many people do you think are going to start businesses in this climate? Few would be my guess.

Warrantless wiretapping? If you are doing nothing wrong why does it matter? Anyone who wants can listen in on my conversations--only those with something to hide have any reason to worry about that. And those detained were detained for a reason. We'll probably find out that reason as soon as Gitmo closes and they are all set free.
 Wookie50
Joined: 4/9/2006
Msg: 22
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/31/2009 4:25:41 AM

No, actually right now the government is what about 52% of you want--the other 48% are watching our country go down the toliet.


Just imagine how you would feel if your candidate won and the Supreme Court took it away.


Nope not anymore. To those who create jobs and pay the most taxes in this country, the biggest enemy is right behind the telepromter (or um um umming when he's not).


Unfortunately they are creating jobs in China. Maybe if Obama practices he can match the oratory genius of GWB.


Yeah, by allowing iteself the power to grab up businesses it sees fit and then taking them over without any rhyme or reason. How many people do you think are going to start businesses in this climate? Few would be my guess.


Yep, the mere fact the mismanaged businesses are collapsing and taking down the world economy is no reason for the big bad federal government to get involved.


Warrantless wiretapping? If you are doing nothing wrong why does it matter?


And yet that argument seems to go away when it comes to background checks on gun sales or IRS audits.
 EarlzP
Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 23
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/31/2009 6:09:51 AM

My neighbors think I'm crazy, but I tell them not to worry. I just hand them Political flyers from the Party of the "little guy" and tell em they can have this too if they just vote for them. I also tell em that "We" are the Government and "We" can give ourselves ANYTHING we want! Isn't this Wonderful? Isn't this Grand?

Finally! sigh....no more worries. All you got to do is "Trust" the Government!


Here's the bottom line if the previous administration had paid attention to what was happening on the home front they would still be in power, they did not instead of creating jobs they created wars.

" We the People are the government and we elected the candidate who we felt would do the best job for our suffering economy" it does not matter if the margin of victory was only 1% that's the way a democratic country is set up.

If we learned any thing from the previous administration then we should find it hard to totally trust our elected officials and the party they belong to should not matter, for the most part I trust the decisions that are being made to turn our economy around
 Ready4SomethingFun
Joined: 3/17/2008
Msg: 24
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Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/31/2009 2:11:53 PM
Just imagine how you would feel if your candidate won and the Supreme Court took it away.


About like I do since ACORN stole this one for Obama.


Unfortunately they are creating jobs in China. Maybe if Obama practices he can match the oratory genius of GWB.


Creating jobs in China because the left wing ecco-kooks and others have made it too expensive to do business here in this country. Obama is on the fast track to matching Bush's flubb ratio very quickly. Let's not count the uh uh uh's when the First Telepromter is not in present--he'd be surpased already.


Yep, the mere fact the mismanaged businesses are collapsing and taking down the world economy is no reason for the big bad federal government to get involved.


And the biggest mismanaged company--the government itself--that can't even run schools without costing millions more than it should--should keep their noses out of the private sector. Unless the private sector is actually dumb enough to ask them to step in.


And yet that argument seems to go away when it comes to background checks on gun sales or IRS audits.


Not from me it doesn't. At least the gun slaes aspect. What does a background check have to do with an IRS audit? Certainly doesn't disqualify from a cabinet position in the Obama administration does it? He's up to 3 tax cheats as of last count, including (I'd laugh if it wasn't so pathetic) the guy he put in charge of our countries finaces.
 allegiant_one
Joined: 6/3/2008
Msg: 25
Do you trust government?
Posted: 3/31/2009 3:23:30 PM
Here's the bottom line if the previous administration had paid attention to what was happening on the home front they would still be in power, they did not instead of creating jobs they created wars.


It's kind of hard to "create" jobs when the previous Administration ("Bubba" Clinton) signed most of our jobs "away" with NAFTA, even though Bush did succeed in creating jobs after the economy took a "hit" from 9/11 through TAX CUTS.

As for the war, Bush was in office for "only" 8 MONTHS when 9/11 happened. Can we then assume that "Bubba" was not only responsible for signing our jobs "away" with NAFTA, but he also is responsible for the Terrorists attacking us on 9/11 with his Foreign Policies? Seems like you "conveniently" forgot about THOSE 8 YEARS. Aye?

BTW...Did you vote for "Bubba"?


" We the People are the government and we elected the candidate who we felt would do the best job for our suffering economy" it does not matter if the margin of victory was only 1% that's the way a democratic country is set up.


"You" the People elected this person into office. Don't put any of this on me! I disagreed with Obama's Liberal Socialist Agenda and his Radical policies as a Candidate...and I still disagree with them as a President. I'm entitled to dissent as an American. Am I not?


If we learned any thing from the previous administration then we should find it hard to totally trust our elected officials and the party they belong to should not matter, for the most part I trust the decisions that are being made to turn our economy around


I would agree with you, if Obama wasn't so forthright with what he "said" he would do to the Country if he became President. He PROMISED "massive spending" and expansion of Government....and guess what....we got it.

You are entitled to your opinions, just so long as you are fair. You seem to have NO problem attacking GW Bush "without analyzing" his "PREVIOUS" Administration under "Bubba" ....... or even the circumstances (9/11) which led us into war. Perhaps if you did, then "Bubba", at least, might get a "small" mention???
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