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| Do you leave when the "all" has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 7:39:22 PM | There’s something that’s always puzzled me. People go on and on about how satisfied they are with their life. They have friends. They enjoy activities. They’re not needy financially. They enjoy a variety of activities. They have a full life but they would like a partner to share those intimate moments with.
Then comes the “must have” list. The partner’s activities, their interests, their job, their political views, their likes and dislikes…..it’s as if the person intends to completely end their former life and associate with only the partner.
My question is if ones life is so great and the only thing missing is someone for intimate moments why all the other “must haves”? I understand wanting the person to be self-supporting and not being on the FBI’s Most Wanted list but I’m talking about interests and activities and personal views. How important is a relationship/companion to someone who already “has it all” when they would rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't “offer it all”?
Is the current thinking that one may as well go after it all because when the "all" ends one simply finds another relationship? | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 7:45:00 PM |
The partner’s activities, their interests, their job, their political views, their likes and dislikes
Here's why these things are important. If you are a homebody you are probably not going to be compatible with someone who wants to go out a lot or someone who camps, hikes and goes cycling. If you like reading or sailing and your partner doesn't like either are you going to never want to do those things together? If someone works days and the other person works nights, that could be a problem. Or a vegetarian could have a problem dating someone that works at meat-packing plant. Someone who is extremely conservative in their political leanings is likely going to have values that are diametrically opposed to someone that is very liberal in their views. Likes and dislikes, if you really enjoy Italian food and your spouse hates it, or have absolutely no interests that are similar or dislike everything the potential partner likes, does that sound like a compatible partner? | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 7:52:10 PM | | Well, if you're really into someone, the likes and dislikes seem to be on the same page. You might even go against your own grain because that person is really "doing it" for you. But when the fire dies down, the likes and dislikes become really important in order to maintain a relationship. You can't even keep a half hearted friendship with someone if you don't have diddly in common. -- But on the same note, you can have a load in common, and if you stop liking each other for whatever reasons, those "in common" likes won't be the glue of forever, that's for sure. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 8:08:47 PM |
My question is if ones life is so great and the only thing missing is someone for intimate moments why all the other “must haves”?
That's a really great question, and a great thread topic.
To answer your question....
I personally don't "require" a heck of a lot from a woman, in terms of mutual interests, or likes and dislikes, nor even to be my "equal" or "similar" in many areas.
I am more than happy for her to simply want me, and to be with me, as much as I want her, and to be with her. Emotionally interdependent.
That's an ideal, though...
Realistically, unless you are fundamentally similar, the potential for areas of serious conflict without resolution, exist.
In my personal experience, the more similar you are, the better. The more likes and dislikes you have in common, the better. The more activities you like to do together, the more you will spend time together having fun, enjoying each other's company and forming close bonds and more opportunities for intimacy.
So, while ideally, I could do without all those things, at this stage in my life, I'm not willing to gamble on the likelihood that I will have as great a relationship with someone who is dissimilar to me.
I'd rather hedge my bets. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 8:37:22 PM |
I personally don't "require" a heck of a lot from a woman, in terms of mutual interests, or likes and dislikes, nor even to be my "equal" or "similar" in many areas.
I don't believe I have huge standards in that area of a man but I spent 14 years in a marriage by myself. I want a man who wants to go to my kids' games, who wants to go with me to my daughter's choral performances.
I have what I consider a fairly full life but I don't just want someone to bang, I want someone to share my life with, all of it, not just the bedroom. I don't need to be attached at the hip but why bother having an intimate relationship if someone is only going to be intimate in one area. I want someone to bump into in my kitchen when fully clothed. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 8:50:56 PM | I think perhaps you are confusing intimate moments with sex.
Intimate moments can consist of many, many things outside of sex. You can't share those if you have nothing in common and don't share the same desires.
I don't want much out of a guy. I don't care about his religion, political views, if he is left or right, how much money he has, etc. I do care that he is a guy worth knowing and spending time with and that he finds me worth knowing and spending time with.
I do want it all. My all is not everyones all. When I find my all I can't imagine that the all will end. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 9:19:37 PM |
(Msg 2) Here's why these things are important. If you are a homebody you are probably not going to be compatible with someone who wants to go out a lot or someone who camps, hikes and goes cycling.
But here's the thing. If you have a full life and your partner had a full life before he met you he probably went camping alone or with friends. If he goes camping four or five weekends during the summer does it matter? On those weekends you can do what you did before you met him.
If you like reading or sailing and your partner doesn't like either are you going to never want to do those things together?
Usually there is a way to compromise. For example, let's say you like to read and your partner likes to swim. You can bring a chair to the beach and read while he swims. Or let's say your partner likes to ski. You can read in the club house and meet up after skiing. Two people can usually find some activities they enjoy if they enjoy each other's company.
As for values one can get a pretty good idea from a couple of emails, with questions. While a person strictly opposed to drug use is not going to tolerate a pot smoker if neither smoke but one feels pot should be legalized and the other doesn't what does it matter? (I've been hearing news about Arnold Schwarzenegger wanting to legalize it.)
Having some activities/interests in common is certainly necessary. Maybe it's just the way I interpret people's profiles but it appears they demand a lot from a partner considering they don't seem to miss not having a partner. That's what I find strange.
(Msg 7) I don't want much out of a guy. I don't care about his religion, political views, if he is left or right, how much money he has, etc. I do care that he is a guy worth knowing and spending time with and that he finds me worth knowing and spending time with.
I read your profile. Like PackageDeal's both profiles are neither demanding nor do they come across as if you don't care if a man is in your life or not. I seem to be attracting the good gals tonight. 
On that note I'm off to bed. Thanks for the input.  | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 9:28:48 PM |
Then comes the “must have” list. The partner’s activities, their interests, their job, their political views, their likes and dislikes…..it’s as if the person intends to completely end their former life and associate with only the partner.
Ummm, no. I entertain the idea that if his interests, views, likes/dislikes are different than mine, I can try new things and/or learn something. If they are the same, we can enjoy some of those things together. I have absolutely NO interest in becoming joined at the hip with someone and my current life certainly won't cease to exist should I be lucky enough to meet someone and become 1/2 of a couple. I'm not looking for someone to complete me, I'm already complete. And if "he" wishes to continue to have a life without me (i.e.: friends, family, activities, etc.) wonderful ~ I'd expect nothing less. JMO  | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 9:43:13 PM | I think perhaps you are confusing intimate moments with sex.
Who exactly in this thread has confused intimate moments with sex?
Intimate moments can consist of many, many things outside of sex. You can't share those if you have nothing in common and don't share the same desires.
I agree with the first part, but disagree with the second part.
I don't want much out of a guy. I don't care about his religion, political views, if he is left or right, how much money he has, etc. I do care that he is a guy worth knowing and spending time with and that he finds me worth knowing and spending time with.
This does not dovetail with your previous statements... | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/17/2009 10:14:08 PM | It simply makes sense that a couple share similar energy when it comes to interests, because it helps to understand as an example when one partner has to work longer hours if the other partner doesn't expect the person to be home every evening by six for dinner. Think of professions where odd hours are the norm.
If you are needy and feel you need to have your partner home every night then it may not work for you. Someone who loves playing golf, tennis, may not do well with someone who is bitter when they spend two days per week playing golf with buddies. Having similar philosophies helps prevent many a disagreement or even fights.
And someone who have the material parts of their life together , will see someone who is more in tune with their way of life as frosting on the cake.
~Beth~ | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/18/2009 6:10:07 AM | OK Dave~...let's try this a different way. Last summer I was dating a girl who was cute, fit and demonstrated reasonable confidence. She listed herself as an occassional smoker (I typically don't date smokers at all) and had what she considered to be a nice, mid-level, stress-normal type of job. Claimed to love the outdoors, baseball (son had played for 11 years), etc., etc.. 2nd date sex and it was great...OK...this has promise.
But then some weeks went by. I find out she won't even look in the direction of fish/seafood ever (somewhat limits cooking options). Smoking goes up from 2-3 per day to a pack a day...and after each one she has to go run brush her teeth...arghhhhhh. Sex was great, but in total darkness, she had body image issues. She got her "dream job" including "write your own job description" and put herself into stress overload. Whenever we'd be at home or in the car and I'd pause to check the ball game scores or stop to watch and listen for a few, I got the eye rolls and the "Must We?"'s. And being outside was fine, as long as the sun wasn't to bright, it wasn't too windy, etc., etc..
She's a really good person, and I can definitely see her being right for somebody, but what I got told going in didn't stack up to the reality of day-to-day living. And the more I tried to discuss these things with her the worse it got. When she smoked she would go to the corner of the garage. When her job got stupid, she cowered and refused to deal with the issues. She wanted to eat almost the exact same thing every night. Showers together never happened. Anything other than very soft music or the sound of her turning pages in a book was an intrusion. Did I change? Nope! Did she change? Can't say. What I can say is that people are always who they project themselves to be...and it's that initial time...that first few dates and the first few weeks where you need to sort through this stuff very quickly or find yourself become attached to a person and their family (Oh yeah, that too) very quickly to the point where throwing yourself back into the pond becomes very tough.
 <== We do all want the same things...we just want them differently. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 3:18:25 AM |
They have a full life but they would like a partner to share those intimate moments with.
Yes, and chances are they will want to have those little moments doing the things they enjoy doing, with someone who is also there to enjoy the same activity. Cant have an intimate moment camping with someone who is afraid to sleep outside!
Having common interests is very important to me. After the lust stage settles down, Id like to be able to enjoy a deeper freindship built on common interests/experiences. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 5:05:33 AM | We all represent something in our profiles--- a particular proposition. Once the glint or season of fascination with the other wanes we quickly drill down to the humdrum and mundane aspects of our lives: day-to-day reality. And this is where our lives are lived.
I think most of us place high value on our time away from work, as it’s really outside of work that we relax and find time to build our relationships---all of them. So when it comes to competing viewpoints as to how that time gets spent and where that time is invested in, within the context of a relationship, value is often attached and must be defended in some instances.
Couples, who look at things from a similar viewpoint, don’t have to agree on everything, but they will understand individual choices much better if they can share in and agree on a ‘big picture’ perspective.
For example, I value ‘healthy living’ and most of what that entails. On a personal level that perspective drives much of how I spend my time, what I eat, to some extent how I spend and what I spend money on, the level of fitness I maintain, some of my interests, some of the people I hang around with, the places and things I like to do on weekends, among many other things. On an even wider note, it represents a deeper interest that can also drive me politically to support choices that back my values on this; it drives my level of engagement in how I act and respond within the context of ' community'.
I’m open to whatever type of person comes into my life as a partner but I really do look for commonality in understanding and similarity in intensity on this perspective without being a fanatic about it. So being different from me in this context could mean a wide range of things from activities to interests and more; what being different won't mean is that they won't understand my perspective---and that's important to me. JMO
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 8:23:05 AM | | You don't get involved with a person for what they have or don't have. Some people raise the bar so high that they miss out on alot of things. No one is perfect and how do you know that you can't interest someone into trying something that you like to do? Granted, you don't want anyone that is the focus of a manhunt led by the FBI. But if you are compatible with someone and want to share your 'world' with them, why not offer them a chance to experience the excitement that you feel for your activities and interests or what you like and dislike to get a general feel of what the person is really like? | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 8:29:49 AM | | There are 24 hours in a day. What the hell do you talk about or do together if you are not compatible in many areas? No normal person expects to find a perfect twin, but you have to be of like nature. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 8:38:56 AM | I'm more with Dave on this one (what a shocker, I know).
I don't have to have all the exact same things in common with someone, but they have to understand and support my life and vice versa. If we both have full lives when meeting and a couple things in common (and the rest aren't dealbreakers to who we are as people) then I don't see why it can't work.
Then again I don't feel someone has to be with me all the time, or has to do things I like he hates, and the opposite applies. My relationships are more like we both have days we do our own thing and throw a couple days in there where we do things together - not necessarily the same things, but in the same space...
The things that I really require someone to share with me are lifestyle related, or moral or overall outlook on life. But if he fishes, for instance, and I don't - then he has friends for that, and I have things I can do that he's not real big on during days he's off doing his thing.
I also believe if one person is a homebody and the other likes to be out, that it works fine if that's one of the times you don't hang out and go off and do your own thing. One can go out and one can stay home, and both can enjoy it without having to entertain someone else who doesn't like that activity. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 9:00:20 AM | My ex husband and I had nothing in common with each other.. Yes we were attracted to each other but after years of being together I realized I married the wrong man.The attraction isnt as important as how well you get along with each other.. I dont even know how i stayed married for 12 years. I was so unhappy.. They say opposites attract. I dont beleive that at all.. You have to have things in common.. not everything, but you've got to share some of the same interests or it wont work.. one of you will want to do something and the other wont.. then you start looking for people who want to do those things with you.. friends, family.. whatever... and you drift apart and start fighting alot... my marriage ended because of this and other more serious issues... he was also an alcoholic.. which i thought would change after we got married... i was young and naive...
OP: before you get into a relationship thats going to end because the "all" ends, try starting a relationship that wont end by finding someone who has similar interests as you to avoid a breakup/divorce, especially when children are involved..
dont think things will change when you get married... you're not going to change a person or think they will like what you like... they might try for a while but it wears off.... | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 9:02:56 AM | "Is the current thinking that one may as well go after it all because when the "all" ends one simply finds another relationship?"
Seems that way, which is why I don't bother anymore. I personally don't expect the world from someone, but keeping up that "all" seems a lot of pressure to live under from where I'm sitting when that all is such a lengthy and all-inclusive list of strict and high demands. Life holds no guarantees for anyone; you never know what a day may bring. I'd rather be single, happy, and knowing where I stand than in a pressure-filled "personal relationship" with someone where that relationship is little more than a business deal with all the clauses against me. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 9:06:12 AM | Well, Dave, if your life is so full and so good, why even bother with a partner? Or, just find someone who's happy with occasional FWB-type benefits. Or even find a fvck buddy.
If you actually want a relationship, then yes, you do need all those things on the comprehensive list, because the relationship will become the dominant focus of your life, and the other friends and activities will become secondary. If you want to keep those other people and activities as major parts of your life, your new relationship partner is going to have to be a part of at least some of them, so had better share those interests and attitudes and values. It's called "compatibility"! | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 9:07:36 AM |
My question is if ones life is so great and the only thing missing is someone for intimate moments why all the other “must haves”? I understand wanting the person to be self-supporting and not being on the FBI’s Most Wanted list but I’m talking about interests and activities and personal views.
So...what are the "intimate moments", Dave~??? I mean...is dinner together an intimate moment? What about taking a walk? Shopping? Is a movie date an intimate moment? Is working together to help a child through a difficult time an intimate moment?
You wrote this as if intimate moments were about sex (at least that's the impression you gave me) and not emotional or intellectual intimate moments. In truth, I think intimate moments is another way of saying "When I need someone"...for example...if you narrowly avoid a major car accident, who's the first person you think of calling? Or if you got some major kudos or a nice bonus/recognition, who do you want to share that with? And most people have far more of these 2 and 5 and 20 minute needs for emotional or intellectual intimacy than just getting hot and sweaty and getting your O over with before rolling over and falling asleep.
How important is a relationship/companion to someone who already “has it all” when they would rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't “offer it all”?
Is the current thinking that one may as well go after it all because when the "all" ends one simply finds another relationship?
The all you describe is a red-herring...but of course you knew that when you wrote this post. The all is basically the point in which the preponderance of the evidence tells you this is no longer the relationship you want to be in. As in my post above...if she had kept to 2-3 cigarettes a day, I'd wager we'd have been together longer. How much? I don't know, but that accounted for some percentage of the overall dissatisfaction. Ditto her poor body image...cute girl but stuck in a world of drab browns and olives and grays because she was afraid to draw attention to herself, so even though she looked great in reds and yellows and greens and blues, it was a major confrontation to get her to even consider it...and she doesn't need that stress any more than I needed to give it).
Perhaps the better word/concept is "Tipping Point"...IOW, at what point do the behaviors accumulate to a point where your heart goes from the "In Love" state to the "I like her" state and finally to the "I'd rather not spend time with her" state. We know the rabid "In Love" state is difficult to maintain past the infatuation stage. And we know the "I Like Her" is always at risk because of...
...(a) disagreements, fights, etc.
...(b) family/work/lifestyle diffferences
...(c) competing interests...whether it be another woman, a hobby, work, etc....IOW, for a time it draws you in.
And the "I Like Her" state isn't that far from the "Tipping Point" where the like turns to "Ehhhh, not so much anymore". But that's definitely not the "ALL"...I believe for any of us.
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 9:35:51 AM |
People go on and on about how satisfied they are with their life.
And some people lie more than everyone else. Some lie more to themselves than others, some lie to others more than themselves.
it’s as if the person intends to completely end their former life and associate with only the partner.
Some (maybe most?) people are flexible with their "must have's" list. (Unless you are speaking of one specific individual in your post).
To them it may not be an "absolutely must have" so much as "must have some of these, but it's more of a way to communicate what is important to me because I don't want to make a list of 'must not have's' because then I would be seen as negative, plus it's a way to potentially weed out what I see as the type of people that keep contacting me and I feel guilty for either shooting them down immediately or not replying at all" list.
My question is if ones life is so great and the only thing missing is someone for intimate moments why all the other “must haves”?
Because they might not know how it reads, or experts at online profile making, or are reacting to what all of their last failed relationships didn't have.
Because they want to list things which will keep people from contacting them by reading it as a must have list.
Because some are really narcissistic and are looking for the exact female/male version of themselves.
Because some people don't want a partner, but to fulfill an ideal which ultimately means they are looking to use someone as an extension of themselves and/or to validate their rationalized beliefs/feelings of themselves and other people.
How important is a relationship/companion to someone who already “has it all” when they would rather be alone than be with someone who doesn't “offer it all”?
You would have to directly ask them. After getting to know them to compare the answer to their behavior and personality to see if they were telling you a truth.
Is the current thinking that one may as well go after it all because when the "all" ends one simply finds another relationship?
Huh? If they actually got the "all" why would it end?
Or are you just starting to figure out that some people don't really want relationships, but tell themselves they do? And this behavior is prevalent on the internet? That these type of people are drawn to a method (online dating that is highly impersonal, and keeps a safety wall between people, and offers a menu?
They idealize something unrealistically or via a solipsistic focus (such as certain behaviors or how a relationship is "supposed" to be).
Anything that doesn't immediately fulfill that they then sabotage it by looking at the other persons "faults" and inability to live up to the one sided ideal. By not being able to fulfill the impossible one sided ideal.
So it becomes the other person's fault for not living up to impossible standards.
Therefore the person forming the relationship ideal doesn't have to take responsibility, or make a real commitment, communicate, or actively be deeply involved but can tell themselves they were, or tried, and/or that there are no good ones left. Displacing the problem onto others maintaining self image, identity, consistency, and mental health. | |
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| Do you leave when the all has gone?
Posted: 5/19/2009 10:01:16 AM | Getting to know someone takes time.
And I've found that even with time....past experience..... I might not really know them or who they really are.
In the relationship, I hope to have, there would be some alone/away from each other, time.
Being close does not mean either one of us have to be hanging out each others nose.
As long as the desire is to be together as a couple, is there.
I do not wish to smother or be smothered.
I appreciate seeing political views along with personal missions.....so I can, right away, dodge those bullets.
Just because we have some interests that are different, doesn't mean we are not meant to be together...how boring if we were alike.
I don't care for flea markets....but can go occassionally.
A steady dose........ 
Or if the most active thing or hobby is sitting on a prorch swing...I move on.
I wonder why there are so many men, who are young (in their 40's and 50's), are retired?
ceecee
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