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| | Do public schools = Fairy Tales?Page 1 of 2 (1, 2) | I think this goes back to when my baby had to get tested. The Doctor was so intent on not discouraging him , she praised him heavily for a good guess.
Long story short he thought night was a season afterward.
It comes up again now for my oldest and having the physical ability to play a specific instrument. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 4:23:27 PM | lol... I guess it would seem like non English, I will clarify.
(Intelligence testing:One of the questions on my 5 year olds intelligence test was what are the four seasons. My son struggled with the last one and guessed night.
The doctor doing the testing praised him for such a good guess. In speaking to my son later, I found out he was actually convinced his good guess was the correct answer.)
I was told by one instructor, my oldest may have difficulties with the instrument he wants to play beyond first year... due to fused joints in both pinkies.
Another instructor told me that they do not like to discourage kids at all.
I guess my question is more: Are some public school educators overly positive/optimistic with kids?
Leading to unrealistic goals/expectations. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 4:34:50 PM | This was my answer before you changed your question:
I think that people may expect a lot from public schools. People who work in various capacities in schools often feel that they have to be everything to everyone: psychologist, social worker, police person, entertainer, probation officer, and, oh yes, teacher.
Schools are receiving less and less funding these days. The same hold truths for the medical system; however, finally, hospital employees (doctors, nurses and so on) are saying the system is sick. Public education is in a bad state these days, too.
Most people who work in public schools are dedicated and caring and they are also very tired. A lot of people who work in public schools spend their own money buying resources for their students.
If anyone believes that a public school or even a private school can perfectly meet their child's needs, this would be equivalent to believing in a fairy tale. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 4:42:15 PM |
I guess my question is more: Are some public school educators overly positive/optimistic with kids?
Leading to unrealistic goals/expectations.
Yes, it is possible. I think it is more so with young children. High School teachers tend to be more realistic.
However, educators are not in the business of breaking spirits. If someone really wants to do something, it is very hard to say, "You! I dont think so, you are too - - -."
Kids tend to be much harder on themselves than the adults in their lives. I would rather error on the side of being overly optimistic than pessimistic. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 4:44:26 PM | I have the greatest respect for people working in education; especially public schools.
As a parent though, I would rather my child be told the truth... than encouraged to follow his wants. If physically he can not progress past first year with one instrument, I would rather he find a different one that he could excel at (given enough practice and time). | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 4:52:24 PM | There are so many concepts and philosophies now in use in school, mostly encouraging and focusing on the positive. They may be unrealistic however.
In light of how many people have graduated from school with spelling skills well below the set standard, and how many are rather clueless at making change without the cash register telling them how much to give back it, does appear that teachers are not doing their job. We even see people who can't spell worth a hill of beans get a teaching degree. Something is definitely wrong with the education system.
It seems that even if educators are unsuccessful at teaching the required skills to the student, the student is still advanced to the next grade.
Perhaps teachers are rated on a performance quota? If a certain proportion of their students don't achieve a passing grade then the teacher is considered sub-standard. So the kids get advanced without having earned the advance, and the teacher keeps her/his job. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 5:05:56 PM |
Another instructor told me that they do not like to discourage kids at all.
I guess my question is more: Are some public school educators overly positive/optimistic with kids?
Jane ^^^^^ maybe right in less funding etc,,,but that has very little to do with the "tactics" that teachers are being taught and told to use on their students. Of course the majority of parents also have a very heavy effect on what teachers are "allowed" to do.
Many times if a teacher of today "dare" to tell little Johnny that he failed, or is wrong, or heaven forbid,,,,try to discipline him in any way, shape or form,,,you get the majority of parent(s) coming in threating school boards, principals, and/or the teacher. Cause ya know "their" little Johnny can do no wrong. 
I believe there is a "skill" or "art" to teaching or mentoring. There is a way that you can tell a child that he is wrong without discouragement coming into play. Many don't know how to do it,,,or the child is soooooo fragile from his upbringing of parents that they can't even handle the word "NO". Don't believe me????? Watch the odd toddler in a grocery store when a parent happens to tell them "no" when the ask for candy or something. More kids lying on the ground, screaming like freaking lunatics,,,all because these actions "work" on their parent(s). By the time a teacher gets a hold of them the damage is already done.
I don't believe the way we (or least some of ya) are handling our children is doing any good at all. A child NEEDS rules/limitations. They NEED to be told. They NEED to be disciplined. They NEED to rewarded. (both of those last two should be done according to the child's actions,,,,meaning DON'T tell a child he did well,,,,when he actually failed or did NOT so well. Kids are not THAT stupid) As soon as a child understands that he cannot get away with certain things because of the potential of some form of discipline they will act accordingly.(more studying to pass the next time,,,,more effort in a sport you are competing in, less play,,,more WORK) As soon as a child fails,,,and is told he did fail,,,,he will learn very quickly that to actually "succeed" at anything,,,work is usually involved. So he either tries a little harder next time,,,,or he doesn't. He then,,,either passes,,,,or he fails again. After awhile,,, even a child will get a little tired of "failing" and his effort will increase.
Keep patting him on the back when he is failing, or not doing so good,,,,,he won't rise. Nopes,,,he'll fall flat on his face and won't have a clue on how to get back up. Are you,,,as a parent going to be there,,,,forever for him?????? I look around and say,,,yeps a lot of parents still bailing their "children" out at ages over 25 years old.
Maybe if parents went in and gave the teachers/principals a word or two about how YOU want to know when your child is failing, when your child is acting up, causing havoc. Give them the confidence to teach and mentor, instead of trying to tie the teachers hands when little Johnny is being a little shiat in the classroom. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 5:43:15 PM | As a parent though, I would rather my child be told the truth...
What truth is there in this?
"You won't be able to play that instrument" is an opinion, not a fact. People (especially kids) find all kinds of ways to do things, and lots of people play instruments they "can't". There are guitar players without hands. See for yourself:
http://www.future-link.com/
If you let the child try the instrument they love, the worst that's likely to happen is they waste their time on it and never develop musical talent, which they might not have anyway. If you start telling them "you can't do that" the damage can be a whole lot worse than that, and about the best likely outcome is that they'll decide (correctly) you're a negative influence and stop listening to you. In any case, there's no law that says you have to play only one instrument, so no reason not to play the one they love AND look at other things as well.
The things teachers tell kids can have impacts way out of proportion to what they intended. That's why they're trained that they should never say "you're wrong" to a student. (Not that they can't tell them they're wrong, just that they should never use exactly that phrase). I think you should be glad you have a teacher who gets this, and could learn something from this person.
It seems that even if educators are unsuccessful at teaching the required skills to the student, the student is still advanced to the next grade.
However true this might be, it's irrelevant to this example. The teachers who let standards slide are the ones that don't care about what they're doing, not the ones with the positivist philosophy. Some of the same people who will never tell a kid "you can't do that" are also the strictest and most demanding teachers in school. I was one of them once, for a few years. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 5:55:33 PM | ^^^ I went off tangent not looking at the OP's question the correct way. I agree with Traveller on this one. The only time I like to use the word "can't" on a person is when I use it to actually motivate them. If you can tell some people you "can't" do something, they'll go to unreal amounts of work to prove ya wrong.
I don't mind at all being wrong. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 6:09:25 PM | Update: He now has a new to him flute (his instrument of choice)... along with a guitar, an ocarina, a couple of recorders, a harmonica, a trumpet... and he still wants a violin for Christmas; just to have to play around with. 
Edit/Add: MN. I think part of it from my perspective is figuring out which of their whims to give in to, I certainly can not afford them all. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 6:17:30 PM |
I was told by one instructor, my oldest may have difficulties with the instrument he wants to play beyond first year... due to fused joints in both pinkies.
Another instructor told me that they do not like to discourage kids at all.
And why don't we let the child decide for himself where the limits are? Why impose our pessimism on him?
And why is it that there has to be a goal, be really good at something in order to even participate in it? Does enjoyment count? What if the child took lessons for a year, had a blast, learned a bunch of stuff, and then decided to change instruments...pinkies or not!
Reality is what we make it people!
What is more important, his self esteem because he learned and did something he enjoyed or ... preventing him from the enrichment of the experience because WE adults think he might fail or never be a prodigy.
When is he going to learn how to deal with the consequences his own choices... or with disappointment, for that matter.
Give the kids credit ... and healthy choices, and do let them choose!
There is no shame in "failure" because there is no failure... only participation.
Bag the shame. It's a poor companion.
MN | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 7:04:54 PM | ^ yes. If only they taught violin in elementary school band, we'd all be happier campers!! (they are not as expensive as flutes) lol
It is not at all about wanting him to be a "prodigy", I see excel may have been a poor word choice. It was more about spending a couple hundred dollars so he can play the flute this year. Then possibly having to find him a different instrument for the next school year. (The trumpet and the guitar are from his grandparents)
I hope my youngest will not be wanting something different when he is old enough for band, or I may have to hold a used instrument sale to raise some funds 
I still say that sometimes I feel people working with kids need to be a little more realistic with them. As in the case of the Doctor giving the test to my youngest being so exuberant in her praise that, he thought he had gotten the right answer. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 7:11:24 PM | Teachers are not different in their abilities to perform from other working people. What is different is the fact that they may never know or see their mistakes.
Teachers performance or lack there of is the direct result of what we the society dictates to our elected governments ministries. Worsening the entire scenario is overindulgence in psychology and its applications feeding weaknesses rather than curing them. All of us get caught up in that, teachers, parents and alas the children.
Yes, psychology can help a lot and has provided much insight indeed; it is the misunderstood, misinterpreted, misguided psychology that found its way into mainstream society via media exploitation., or was it lack of anything better to report, that aided the degradation of the education system particularly in the lower grades of public schools. Hence, the reason why many parents choose private education.
The OP asked:
I guess my question is more: Are some public school educators overly positive/optimistic with kids?
Leading to unrealistic goals/expectations.
My first thought would be yes, they are and as others pointed out possibly those who couldn’t care less, they’re just doing their job…
On second thought education of children or adults is a vast and still controversial topic, never mind including more complex children with physical or mental disabilities.
As I mentioned in the spelling and grammar thread any life form is able to learn something and thus can be taught or trained. The outcome of the training/teaching is directly related to time, effort and method input and the brain capacity of the trainee.
While psychology has opened many doors to show some better ways and how to encourage learning and the response of the pupil, it has also lead to educators neglecting or forgetting the simple basics of repetition to accomplish a task. It also allows for an easy way out excuse for many to simply say I’m dyslexic and every one must forgive my spelling. Other people would not know if that is a fact or simply an excuse for laziness or even worse disrespect to others who are competent enough to use a spellchecker…lol
Any person is capable of learning something. Even a disabled person can learn to play an instrument. Certainly the level of accomplishment will be different, ..shesh redundant…To have the learners willingness and interest to learn will certainly provide better results and make the teaching less difficult and more pleasant for all.
To judge a child’s lack of ability may not be very productive, I’m assuming most adults should be capable to deal with the negative aspect, though I’ve been proven wrong on that assumption ..lol. That being said part of a child’s learning should (OK, some will disagree) include the negative of experiencing or being told that they did not perform to a specific level. Simply because in all other things we do in life failure is part of any learning and success. Learning about failure as a child ( IMO) is part of learning to deal with life as an adult. I am sure we all have experienced that at on point in life when we tried to learn things on our own. I think overemphasizing failure or a mistake as being acceptable without correcting it is feeding wrong information into a persons emotions. That does distract from the fact of reality and creates feelings of hurt, which naturally happen with negative experiences. As a result we have a good many people who are highly offended when errors on their part are revealed, the hurt feeling complex.
As much as the next person I too like to be right, it boosts confidence and overall well feeling. The reality is no one ever is right, like it or not.
I don't know if this really helps the OP with her question, but concluding my opinion would be that a careful judgment must be applied, both encouragement and acceptance that some things are not possible, particularly in her child’s situation. Some of that the child may have to learn by their own experience, some may be communicated, a judgment call. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 7:29:30 PM | I forget who said I would rather be told the truth about my child. The thing is no one knows the truth about anyone's child. Judging ability is subjective and abilities change over time. Since judgment is involved, I prefer to be error on the positive side. Who am I to say that you will never be a - - - .?
The other thing is maybe a student just wants to draw or paint for pleasure not to be a Van Gogh.
The other thing is if you cannot say anything positive, perhaps it is best to say nothing.
In the end, kids find their own way. I think it is important to be supportive a long the way.
Issues that relate to promoting students into the next grade have a lot to do with funding and political pressure. It is cheaper to pass everyone. Every time a student fails a subject or a year, it cost tax payers more money.
I agree with Ms F. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 8:08:25 PM |
Renting instruments when they are young is often a wiser choice than buying outright, depending on the cost of the instrument. You only spend a small amount of what purchasing would cost, and can switch over to another at any time.
yes and no. Here is what I learned when looking into it:
Renting a flute for one full year would cost about $260, if he gave it back at the end of the year that is money spent and nothing owned. Renting to own would cost more than buying outright in the end due to processing fees/interest. Sight and Sound here has a buy back program even on their used instruments... so I buy it out right, if he decides it is not for him they buy it back less the approximate rental fees I would have paid. They also have an awesome service/repair policy for any instruments purchased there. I think if he keeps it long enough and then stopped playing, the best thing would be to put an ad up somewhere and sell it privately though. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 9:50:19 PM | [Quote] Let them do what they choose while they are young that makes them happy in an artistic/creative/sports/team sense
Totally disagree!!!! Vigorously!
That is what used to be called anti authoritarian educations. The result still sit in out jails and mental institutions!
Your Terry Fox example id way off target.
t he greatest thing you can give your child is the belief they can achieve anything.
that is true, it is the way the child realizes the differences of what is an achievement according to the world they live in and what is just an innocent child’s will. Obviously some adults don’t even know that
Whatever you may say as a proud mom, one thing I am certain of your child must have had a lot of input, nothing wrong with that. But please don’t let people believe you raised the latest Jesus or virgin Mary who did everything by themselves. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/20/2009 10:01:58 PM | So happy to see so many people posting opinions similar to mine, in line with Traveller's.
I akin it to my oldest grandson who was born with significant development disabilities. I can remember asking the many specialists and therapists as he was followed through his years if he would ever walk. Although they would not commit to yes or no answers, you could often read in their expressions and well versed answers what they believed. Of course, there were many things that we wondered, especially in those first years.
If we were to adopt the belief of some of those people, we may not have encouraged (I tend to think that we would have done so) his growth as much as we did, or we may have accepted and become complacent with the lack of development.
Suffice it to say, yes he is still dealing with developmental delays, he can walk, he can run, he can swim, he can navigate a computer amazingly, he cannot speak but can certainly communicate. There is no end to what he may achieve and we keep ourselves open to any twist or turn that may come up.
A child may overcome many physical barriers and still play an instrument like a master. Beethoven composed music and he was deaf!!
I say open up all the doors, keep the options on the table.
The only failure in life is failing to try!!
I am sure that your virtuoso will bring many a tear to your eye while you enjoy his accomplishments!! | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 8:17:40 AM |
[Quote] Let them do what they choose while they are young that makes them happy in an artistic/creative/sports/team sense
Totally disagree!!!! Vigorously!
That is what used to be called anti authoritarian educations. The result still sit in out jails and mental institutions!
Mountain lion, I find your comment offensive. I respectfully suggest that you are wrong in this case and quite honestly, I'm surprised at your close-minded attitude. Education has absolutely nothing to do with those who end up in mental institutions, but someone else has already addressed this point.
"Success" can be achieved in many ways and is a very subjective word. I can only relate to my own personal experience with my son. School was a nightmare for him. In Grade 2, he was diagnosed with severe learning disabilities. Though well-meaning, the only thing school ever managed to "teach" him was how "stupid" he was. At the beginning of Grade 3, I pulled him out of school to homeschool him.......he never did go back. I persevered with teaching him to read, but mostly I followed the homeschooling theory of letting the child choose his subjects.
I still remember in Grade 2, he was always getting in trouble, because he refused to follow the "rules". When his teacher would give him an assignment to write a story and then illustrate it, he would spend all his time drawing elaborately detailed pictures (which told the story), but he never could put a single word down. Skip forward 15 years........he will graduate from The Art Institute of Vancouver next month. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 9:11:13 AM |
Btw, you are perpetuating the stigma that people get mental illness from some lack in their upbringing...shame on you.
Sorry luve, you misinterpreted, went off tangent...lol... and perhaps my fault leaving things too open assuming a deeper understanding what I tried to point out.
To clarify the:The result still sit in out jails and mental institutions!
Was intended to refer to those" fallen children" who end up in the crime and drug scene (due to lack of adaptability learned) whereby the drug was the physical cause of the mental damage suffered.
You are too defensive looking out of your own window and not within the broader concept of the topic, perhaps you did not read my thoughts on the prior post. Nevertheless, I appreciate you pointing out what I had failed to make clear. Thank you as well for clearing my assuming that the master of wit and sarcasm becomes defensive when someone disagrees or questions. I forgot, any parent who raises(d) their own children is proud and readily defensive when the results of parenting are drawn into question, including me.
As mentioned before, there are many different ways to teaching children or adults and this can only be addressed here in a broader sense unless we identify one small and very specific aspect.
Some approaches are time proven, others are based on theories or belief predicting an outcome. Either method used may require circumstance related individual adjustment.
Considering the best of intentions and effort are put forth the outcome in either case is unknown as we are only (can) anticipating a result. Aside from parental input the result is subjected to other outside influences and the child's very own genetic makeup.
Since humans are incredibly adaptable and resilient creatures that also include much more instinctive and genetically predetermined responses than we may know or can anticipate anything may be possible as a result of such individual growing up while learning. There have been many models of possible scenarios developed to look at, none of which can guarantee a result, but only suggest a higher likelihood of what it may be.
My opinion is based on a more conservative structured/regimented approach, simply because I reason that an infant starts only with " open building blocks" of information and needs to experience, for the lack of better words, the evolutionary process of failure and success to make adaptations by learned experience; developing reason=intelligence (?). That experience is a more effective teaching instrument than offering too many choices (which may origin in a brief thought of the child excited and bare of any previous experience), which then need constant adaptation and monitoring to get the result both parent and/or child want and anticipate.
Again oversimplified extreme the: "don't touch the stove it'll hurt" is less effective than the experience of touching and feeling the pain.
The opposite of that may be forbidding something and eventually (curiosity , spite) when free to try the child will and MAY experience the advice given was wrong. Suffice to say the child may not be able at that point to determine the entire spectrum of the result or why something was forbidden. (not that all forbidden by parent/educator is right...lol)
In that sense ms fartsalot you are right, the child can make choices and no argument on that.
It is the parent though who should(?) determine or prevent specific experiences adjusted to the degree of maturity (age of child), in short setting direction. At least this is based on our species natural historic development.
Certain behavioral choices made (and allowed) by a child from infant stage onward and consistent on part of the child will certainly lack the aspect of adaptation to the social structure the later adult will be exposed to. Subsequently the anti-authoritarian approach has caused many young adults to fail. (as per my previous reference)
True enough you may argue the opposite of too regimented/dictatorial can produce the same result. No denial of that here!
I can only share with you my personal experience, what I have learned and what I can logically deduct to make sense, biased that may be.
I have adhered to and believe to have been mostly correct with "my " more regimented approach permitting choices gradually and in accordance to the child's stage of development (age). That included everything from dictating, positive and negative input allowing choices or not. And no, it wasn't always properly balanced, but the best I could reason. And no, I won't take to announcing how great they are or that they've become what I wanted them to be, they are not! They are however young adults who know the difference between right and wrong and how to stand their ground according to the social structure they must live in and the way in which society will view (judge) them for whatever they may achieve. IMO that is enough for them to figure out the rest of a life.
Without a doubt and given all the curve balls my kids had to deal with, including me, they were very lucky to have turned out the way they are, all I did was nudge them along.
Apology to the OP for getting a bit off track, but I did attempt to make reference to input given to children in general as well. Hope there is something useful provided, however hidden it may be... | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 10:26:44 AM | It is interesting how some parents, teachers, relatives, friends and so on take credit for a child's success. When is a child fails, some of us tend to the shift the blame.
However, at a certain point, I think we have to recognize that young people are responsible for their own mistakes and failures.
I think we guide, facilitate, nurture and encourage children but it is important to recognize that they are autonomous beings.
It is really important to help children and teens see how their behavior impacts on themselves and others. After all, we want them to take responsibility for their actions both good and bad. We need to empower them and help them understand that there actions matter and make a difference.
Everyone wants to take credit for the "stars" success. My niece is an elite athlete and she has been very fortunate in that many people have been supportive but she has also worked incredibly hard. Her success imo has been the collision between many people and her own innate gifts and drive.
It takes an entire village to raise a child. Sweet Jane | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 11:17:02 AM | I guess my question is more: Are some public school educators overly positive/optimistic with kids?
Leading to unrealistic goals/expectations.
In some cases yes. It is the powerful that influence the direction to the masses. Tis the lone individuals that beat against the grain that truly create the change and are also the same ones who have written great books leading the direction of education. In my days of university it would have been John Holt and his philosophy and Drykers with his ideas on discipline.
My two son are very different from each other. My oldest acquires a role as an Honour student and a class Valedictorian. Enters university at age 17. This came about with many struggles a well as victories on his part. Many visits to his schools were inevitable from having cups and staplers thrown at him by his teachers - there was always difficulties with power struggles between himself and his teachers. In spite of being extremely rebellious at home and school he succeeded.
My experience has been the opposite with my youngest who was tested a couple of times after I insisted at the end of grade 9- my intent was to fit in some academic courses for grade 10. I was initially told by the high school he would be an ideal candidate for a Cooperative Education Program and started creating education plans with him around this idea. He was on a non-academic program and they thought it would be fitting he learn a trade while still registered in the school system. At the time he would have just turned 16 and going into grade 10 in the fall. I wanted him to graduate with a dogwood diploma – knowing full well that he could upgrade on his academics once he was clear on what he wanted to pursue in post-secondary. Having a meeting with the First Nations Principal, High School Principal, three school counsellors, Special Education Teacher (assessment testing) and a couple of other teachers, all agreed he would better fit the cooperative work education program.
We moved to Vancouver that fall and he started grade 10 here. His high school counsellor said here that he would have to go into the alternate school for grade 11. He said the latter without regard to his ability in the coming term. I told him what I encountered in the previous school and ask what his reasons were to state my son will not fulfill requirements of grade 11. His response was, “well, he looks older because of his height”. Some parents my not feel safe because of his size”. My son stood 6’ at 16…6’1” upon graduation. Quite a handsome young man…I often thought of creating a portfolio and sending it off for modelling…hehehe. Kidding aside, my son also is not boastful or assuming in any way; he appears quite shy with a very soft nature about him and very masculine with things he loves including sports. After a few visits to the school here…there were several boys that were tall and lanky and noticed they also graduated with my son in their 12 th year…. My son developed a real rapport with his teachers and very well liked by everyone here. I am so amazed by him even today. I am thankful of his education here and his teachers (counsellor aside).
I think as a parent you are the person that knows your sons capabilities and motivation best. The keys are within your knowledge as a parent. Your investment into your child all those years are real….if his heart wants to play a certain instrument, let him. He will learn so much from his successes as much as his failures. The coping skills shown through your support will be what gives him that fighting spirit in the end as well as his own assessment of what works for him.
Teachers are coaches….professionally trained. Most don’t have the same life experiences you have. Take recommendations with a grain of salt including assessments. There are so many pros and cons to educational assessments. If you think your child does not fit the norm….those assessments will not be fitting to him. It is wise as a parent to question everything - research – and make sure you come in armed with information to question decisions recommended on behalf of your child.
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 11:19:59 AM | It takes an entire village to raise a child.
I really wish more people thought that way. It seems in today's world not everyone still believes in this, or at least they do not want others to correct or speak ill of their kids.
(I think Walt's pointed some of this out in his first response.)
The other thing is a lack of respect/compassion for others. Today if you happened across a teen defacing public property and said something directly to them, you do not know what type of reaction you will get. Some kids today are just as likely to verbally or physically abuse you for saying something; than to feel guilt or shame for their inappropriate behaviour.
This goes right back to my thoughts on teachers being overly optimistic (yes Jane I think maybe it is more so in the lower grades too)... are they afraid to say anything that might be construed as negative? Is that why they praise effort so exuberantly instead of saying something like 'well that was a very good guess but the correct answer is actually ___"
~~~~~~~~
ML1, I am not sure where you are going with your argument either. As a parent I agree that kids be allowed to make some of their own choices but, I would like those choices to involve things that are within my means, values, etc... I would not let one of my kids join something like the KKK just because he has decided he would like to see what it is all about. | |
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| Do public schools = Fairy Tales?
Posted: 8/21/2009 12:19:59 PM |
In my days of university it would have been John Holt and his philosophy and Drykers with his ideas on discipline.
Correction: Rudolf Dreikurs
I didn’t honor the man by misspelling his name...sorry! | |
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