| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 6:41:49 PM | | This is to get the views and experiences of different people at different colleges. Some people think tech degrees are a waste of time because it goes out of date so fast, while others think better of people with them. There are thousands of colleges in the US with hundreds of different programs. Some are going to get met with one reaction or another, whether undergrad or graduate. Did you do a campus or online program? Tell us about it and if it has helped you any. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 7:57:04 PM | | I think the problem is that tech degrees are somewhat new, and there's no real consensus on what they actually prove you know. Even now, you can't really get a degree in Information Technology from the local university... at least the last time I checked. It's geared more towards either programming or management, and don't get me started on the fiasco of certifications. I got an electronics degree from ITT back in 1995, and while I learned a great deal there, it was only because I chose to do so. You could literally show up, do a minimum of work, and receive a degree eight quarters later. And to this day, the knowledge I gained from there has had very little to do with my profession. I don't know of any reputable schools (ones that aren't at least sneered at by HR departments) that offer degrees in IT. The best curriculum at the moment may be a combination of traditional college, some very specific certs, and actual experience. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 8:15:10 PM |
This is to get the views and experiences of different people at different colleges. Some people think tech degrees are a waste of time because it goes out of date so fast, while others think better of people with them. There are thousands of colleges in the US with hundreds of different programs. Some are going to get met with one reaction or another, whether undergrad or graduate. Did you do a campus or online program? Tell us about it and if it has helped you any.
Any degree, achieved through a community college, trade school, or university will go out of date really fast if you don't keep up with the advancements in your field.
Many people fail to realize that education does not stop once they have that piece of paper in their hand, nor does it automatically secure you a job. You constantly have to stay in the know in order to advance your career. For Information Technology, this means certifications.
I have my AS in Computer Networking Systems from ITT Tech and right out the door, IT jobs were plentiful but hard to come by due to a lack of work experience, certifications, etc... Getting my foot in the door was the hardest part. As of now, I have more work experience, certifications, and have a great job supporting the corporate and retail staff of a major retail company.
The Information Technology industry is constantly fluctuating between:
Work Experience > Degree
Degree Degree < Work Experience
etc.. etc.. etc..
It never stops, and usually every 6 months you see a strong change in one direction or another.
On top of that, the actual manager that needs the person in their department IS NOT USUALLY the one who even looks at the resume. A lot of places rely on the HR manager to do the interviews / hiring process, going off of what that manager has told them they need. This puts many people at a disadvantage because they tend to 'tech up' their resumes, and a lot of times the hiring manager has no idea what "Installed frame relay ports in cisco backbone routers" means and since they don't know what it means, they sometimes tend to pass up that resume even though it might be the perfect person for the job.
That being said, I have NEVER received bad feedback on what college I've gone to from a professional standpoint.
I've watched during interviews, the reactions, and there was no difference one way or another as to it being good or bad. Most of them seemed rather happy that I took the time to further my education and that I continue to do so, everyday. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 8:19:46 PM | Would a "Double Bachelor's of Mathematics with majors in Computer Science and Combinatorics & Optimization" count as a technology degree? I did graduate with that from the University of Waterloo in 1997 so an on-line degree back then would probably have gone through AOL, Prodigy or Compuserve rather than an on-line school as the web was a mere toddler when I started in 1993 at the 'loo.
The degree helped me a great deal in many ways, some through indirect skill improvement, some by providing connections, and last but not least, helping me socialize in the world a bit. | |
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- don
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Joined: 4/23/2009
Msg: 5 | |
| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 9:39:50 PM |
This is to get the views and experiences of different people at different colleges. Some people think tech degrees are a waste of time because it goes out of date so fast, while others think better of people with them. There are thousands of colleges in the US with hundreds of different programs. Some are going to get met with one reaction or another, whether undergrad or graduate. Did you do a campus or online program? Tell us about it and if it has helped you any.
Tech Degrees give (or are suppose to give) you a good foundation which imo is one of the most valuable things you can learn since everything builds off of that. You also get up-to-date on current tech and get a taste of the latest & future tech.
If you get a good education, I don't think it matters what others think because your skills will speak for themselves.
I researched a bunch of tech schools before choosing the one I currently go to and they all appeared to have different strengths & weaknesses, so I chose the one that best suited what I wanted to do. I have an Associates in Computer Network Technology now and I'm currently working on a dual B.S. in Computer Network Technology and Network Security (Coleman University). Another benefit of going to a tech school is the free/low-cost software... I have licenses for a ton of expensive software including MS Visio, Access, Office, XP Pro, Vista Business, 2k3 Ent Svr, 2k4 ISA Svr, 2k5 SQL Svr, 2k3 Exchange Svr, 2k8 Ent Svr, 2k8 SQL Svr, VMware WS, ESX/vSphere, etc..... and it cost me less than $100 (the cost of burning the cd/dvds) So, I'm not sure all schools do the software thing but that was a huge benefit and something you may want to ask about when checking out schools.
I prefer hands-on training and 'live' classes to online classes.
Good Luck, hope this helps.
edit:adding
If you are getting into networking, UNIX/Linux Training is extremely useful. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/27/2009 10:29:12 PM | To add the OP's question, how sure were you more experienced computer majors of yourselves as you were working towards your degrees?
I've only taken 3 or 4 degree specific computer science courses and so far I'm really not sure if this line of work is how I want to pay the bills in the future.... | |
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- don
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Joined: 4/23/2009
Msg: 7 | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/28/2009 4:22:44 PM | | I think I'm pretty sure its what I want to do. I already can build and upgrade PC's and set up home networks so I figure why not expand on that and take it to a corporate level. In going thru the lists of degrees offered, I didnt see anything else I felt as ready to do. I definitely know I do not want to do programming/software engineering, but there's a "systems engineering" class in my program and I have a feeling I might have to do a few bits for that one (maybe some VB, front ends, or something). Basically its going to be "how to rig it to get it to work :-) " . lol. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/28/2009 5:05:05 PM | Over this side of the pond the job market is in flux.
There is a shortage of IT Professionals with the right certs and quals, companies put up an advert saying they want an IT Pro with X,Y,X certs/quals but then 70% of the time they dont need to be at that level to do the job.
Best advice I can give on my past working experience is find the job you want to do, see what they want, and go for that course.
Ive seen so weird ads in my time, an ad looking for an MCSA... when I got the SP an MCSE with a full CCNA would have been more suited...
They seemed surprised when I wasnt interested... I told them it was about the money and the conversation stopped there!
Thats fine, they havent a clue what they really need, most places dont, most dont even need a full time onsite IT Pro, jobland is in flux!
Tailor your courses to fit your work, dont try and tailor your work to fit the course you have done, because you might find they ask for a programmer and they really mean a network designer or server admin! | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 1:36:45 PM | I've been in the IT field for 21 years, and have been working as a UNIX Security Engineer at a huge International corporation for the last 3 years... I also lack a degree.... So from my perspective... a degree in the IT industry isn't a requirement for success as a technology worker
Most of the people that I know in the IT field don't have a computer science degree... Now I do have a cousin that graduated from MIT with a computer science degree... lol... But that's a different story... Of the people I've worked with that do have a degree, most have emphasized some sort of business degree to assist their ambitions to break into management.
Of the people I do know that have degrees in computer science... most have been from traditional 'brick & mortar' colleges, but I know a couple that have gotten degrees from on-line educators like University of Phoenix.... And I can't say there have been any noticeable differences between their careers that I can see.
A college degree is good if your trying to start a career in the IT field, but as technology advances, it means less due to newer standards... At that point Certifications pick up where a higher education levels off. They are a way for IT works to show employers that they have kept up with the changes out there.... Certifications are also a good way for someone to break into the IT field
Depending on someones ambitions.... I would recommend doing a little research to figure out what part of IT interests them (Administration vs Developer)... If Administration interests them.... Then breaking into the IT industry is a bit easier as Certifications are an inexpensive and quick way to show an employer you have at least some entry level skills | |
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- don
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Joined: 4/23/2009
Msg: 11 | |
| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 2:49:08 PM | Thanks bodisha1,
If you don't mind me asking, what areas new trends in IT that would help in getting a position or working as a Systems/Network Administrator?
I'm curious what certifications/training you think might give someone a head start in Network/Systems Administration...are UNIX/Linux Certs/Training high in demand and I would really like to hear your thoughts on Virtualization, I hear a lot of great things about it and it seems like the next big thing, just curious to hear what you think about it. | |
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- don
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Joined: 4/23/2009
Msg: 12 | |
| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 2:52:12 PM | Thanks bodisha1,
If you don't mind me asking, what areas/new trends in IT would be helpful to know for getting a position or working as a Systems/Network Administrator?
And I'm curious to know what certifications/training you think might give someone a head start in Network/Systems Administration...are UNIX/Linux Certs/Training high in demand and I would really like to hear your thoughts on Virtualization, I hear a lot of great things about it and it seems like the next big thing, just curious to hear what you think about it. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 7:56:52 PM | | I've got a degree from Notre Dame and have been working in the industry for 20 years. I'd recommend people think twice, maybe 3 x before choosing a career in IT. Things were great heading into the year 2000. Since then, salaries have dropped precipitously, companies have slashed IT spending, and tons of formerly lucrative jobs have moved overseas to India and elsewhere. I'm having a hard time finding a decent job and keeping it because companies are always striving to cut costs, and hiring a cheaper, younger, less-trained employee is one way that companies can save money. Also here in BFE, there's not that much respect for people in the IT field, and a lot of companies would prefer to just keep their Windows 95/Windows XP systems running and not invest in infrastructure (wiring, servers, faster internet service) because they don't value IT and the benefits it can bring a business; this short-sightedness means that they see IT as an expense, not a way to improve the methods of doing business which could make the company more profitable/responsive to customer needs/more competitive. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 8:20:50 PM | A whole generation of baby boomers is going to be retiring in 10-15 years, and that should be right about when I have reached an advanced level if I am going by my timeline. (2 yrs in school and 5-8 years experience).
The message I'm getting is it will be important to get some qualifications in addition to a degree. So I plan on getting A+ and N+ while I'm in school. Now if I could just scramble up some $$$ for those exams..........
Also I live in the Dallas area and IT is pretty popular here. And in 10 years I"ll be moving to the Boston area and the attitude is pretty much the same up there. You have a valid point, but I also think that it very much depends on the local market you're in. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 9:34:33 PM | If you don't mind me asking, what areas/new trends in IT would be helpful to know for getting a position or working as a Systems/Network Administrator?
And I'm curious to know what certifications/training you think might give someone a head start in Network/Systems Administration...are UNIX/Linux Certs/Training high in demand
Well... To say your interested in Network/Systems administration isn't really enough in my opinion... I'd suggest you narrow it down a bit and focus on that... Now My emphasis is Security... there are a ton of security compliance required these days... HIPPA... PCI... just to name two... And more and more medium, to large corporations are requiring IT people with security related skills.... plus it's not that difficult to get into the Security part of the industry if your motivated and know what your doing
But to get specific.... For an entry level person... the MCSE from Microsoft is pretty much a must have... Any entry level job you'd be qualified for would most certainly require Microsoft skills.... After that.... Red Hat Linux is extremely popular... so the Red Hat certs would probably be the second one I'd suggest you pursue.... Also, any security cert's could do nothing but help... Security+... CEH (Certified Ethical Hacker) are the big two.... the CISSP is huge these days too... but I personally don't put much stock into it.... Cisco's CCNA would be extremely helpful....
Also... There are Red Hat, and Cisco security certifications available... So what I would suggest... get your MCSE... Your Red Hat & Cisco cert's... that should be enough to land an entry level job somewhere... After that... I'd recommend the Security certs and specialize
Anyway... feel free to ask what ever you want... I'll try to give you the best answer I can
Rocketroller
'd recommend people think twice, maybe 3 x before choosing a career in IT. Things were great heading into the year 2000. Since then, salaries have dropped precipitously
This is true up to a point in my opinion.... After 2000/2001.... Things did dry up pretty bad till about 2003-2004... and salaries aren't quite what there use to be... while I might not be making the sort of income I was around 2001-2002... I'm still making the kind of income I was towards the end of the 90's-early 2000... which is still pretty damn good for a guy with only a high school education | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 10:37:38 PM |
A whole generation of baby boomers is going to be retiring in 10-15 years, and that should be right about when I have reached an advanced level if I am going by my timeline. (2 yrs in school and 5-8 years experience).
You're right about the baby boomers & IT.... I'm mid 40's and I'm on the younger side of who works there... Literally... The youngest guy in our department is 29.... After the dot com bust & all the outsourcing talk... A lot of people going into college lost their interest in IT because they perceived it as a dying American industry.... and that is leaving a huge gap in the work force
I don't necessarily agree with your time-line though. Especially if you were to get an MCSE within 6 months and started working (IT has held up fairly well in the struggling economy)... Someone should be expected to be reaching a senior level admin skill set roughly between 3-5 years.... Most definitely before 7 years
And yes... the market your in makes a huge difference in how much opportunity is available... Houston... Boston... New York... Chicago... LA... San Fran.... Even N.C. are all great areas to be living in for job opportunities | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/29/2009 11:32:14 PM | MCSE takes ages (SEVERAL months) and is very expensive, and is generally only mandated/preferred for advanced level jobs. Overqualified for "entry" level. (MCSE for a help desk representative, for example, is bordering on the ridiculous) MCP might be a good door-opener though along with a couple of CompTIA's. But this thread is more about college degrees, so let's try to stay on topic.
I hope you're right with the 3-5 yr thing, I sure hope I'm doing that by then. But these days, companies are very slow to upgrade/promote people and increase salaries. | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/30/2009 10:46:13 AM | My degree is similar to jbking's - Honors BMath with Major in Computer Science and Minor in Combinatorics and Optimization from U of Waterloo.
I graduated back in 1982! .... so, I am senior in relation to you young tech puppies! 
I am now teaching as I have transitioned out of the IT field ....
But, they still have me teaching some computer courses, although I really want and enjoy teaching Math! ... the subject everyone likes ..... not!
But, I still draw from my technology knowledge and experience.
The IT field has gone through many changes.
I now view it as an established mature industry.
I was in the field at a time that I call the infancey of IT.
IT people were in great demand!
.. but unfortunatley since this was the case, there were many unskilled IT people in the field!  ... like all industries .... supply and demand is the key!
As was already noted after the Y2K upgrades, the industry slowed right down.
But then hopefully the number of the unskilled IT workers have been reduced.
There still are IT jobs out there, but as already has been stated, like in any industry especially with the recession we are going through, the companies want the biggest bang for their buck! The middle level jobs are most in demand. They want you to have some experience, but they don't want to pay you much.
I know many high paid IT managers out of jobs and can't get a job.
They did not keep themselves current, and they still expect that high pay.
This isn't going to happen, unless you truly are worth the money you want to be paid.
You migh say that the industry has adjusted itself to where it will stay ..... since it is now a mature and established industry. Gone are those inflated salaries in the IT fileld!
My addition to this thread is that if one is serious about working hard and having a good IT job, then get the best education you can. The key IT companies will look at this ... the ones who are actually creating the software and hardware for the industry.
If you simply want to support IT systems and networks, then this is not so important.
You will always need to continue to work on certifications.
Since I have been out of the field for a few years, the others here who are still working in it know better which certifications are the ones to concentrate on depending on your interests.
When I left IT for my teaching job ..... if I had stayed in it, I would have concentrated my focus on Database management and systems security in management roles, since that is where I was at that time. Proper Project Management certifications was the direction I would have gone as well. Certifications were the way to go at that time, as it still is. These areas are still the areas with opportunities with great challenges to make the job exciting. As networks continue to grow and the world becomes more interconnected through the internet, security becomes more and more important and challenging!
As also has been noted, You will continue to learn in the IT field.
Technology is changing more and more quickly.
To stay abreast of this you need to keep on top of the changes.
As a teacher, I just attended a three day conference on technology for teachers, since I am a teacher who wants to stay afront with the technology in my teaching ...... with the frustratoins of limited funds in our education system for the latest technology, but we still must stay abreast of technology to use the best that we can at the time.
As an example, many boards (the one I am in included) still do not allow students nor teachers to connect to their networks with their laptops. I feel that they must work on getting the required security worked out, so that this can begin to happen.
Then they will not have to require as many computers at school, since more and more people are getting their own laptops. It is smart decisions like this that are lacking in many places!
One reason why I still encourage university education as opposed to college (in Canada at any rate. In the US, you call most of your institutions colleges ... the I suggest the reputable technolgoy colleges) for people who are truly serious about getting a good IT job, is that you learn a lot of theory and problelm solving in university. You don't need to learn what I call the "syntax" of the technologies. If you learn the theories behind the technologies and learn to problem solve, then you will learn the syntax on your own very easily. It's knowing how the infrastructures work that is important to understanding the whole picture.
If you truly want to be highly skilled then don't take shortcuts just to get your certification paper.
Concentrate on becoming the best that you can from the best that is available.
I like to see more skilled IT people, rather than unskilled ones!  .... and believe me, there are still many unskilled IT people out there ..... it is evident when you call for support for almost anything .... I have been out of the field for many years now, and there are many support people who follow their scripts who really do not understand what they are doing! | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/30/2009 5:58:26 PM | I regularly hire for IT positions and what holds back most people up is basic works skills, for example spelling and following simple instructions. The degree it's self is for you to use and it is only as good as you make it.
Ironically I am one of the worse spellers in the word. | |
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- don
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Joined: 4/23/2009
Msg: 20 | |
| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/31/2009 3:11:43 AM |
But this thread is more about college degrees, so let's try to stay on topic.
I apologize for hijacking your thread
-&-
Thank you bodisha1, your posts were very helpful. Looks like I'm on the right track and it's really good to hear coming from an experienced Systems Administrator currently in the industry. Thanks again! | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 8/31/2009 3:49:31 AM | I would strongly encourage anyone considering a career in I.T. in the USA to think twice.
I have been with my company for over 10 years and we now have our "Global Development" initiative underway. This is in conjunction with the "Knowledge Transfer" process.
It's the stereotypical nightmare where you train someone from India to do your job while management feeds you various lines of BS to keep moral up.
IMO I.T. in this country is on borrowed time, much like manufacturing in the 80's, even if there are jobs available you will be competing on a global scale so salaries will suffer.
Play guitar, collect tattoos, join a band and hit the road.
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 9/1/2009 9:28:10 AM | | Honestly, in the IT field, unless your looking at a management position, certs and hands on training (boot camp) will do you more than a degree. (Most certs expire in just a year or 2, or require an add-on to stay current and even if the cert is good for a couple of years, normally to recertify is just a small part of your original test you took,With IT field being as big as it is, you really what to look into and think about exactly what you want to do as not all certs really carry over to all positions. (Example, if I am looking for someone to configure routers and switches, talk to the telco about provisioning my pipe, look at traffic shaping on my router,as well as maybe configure a FRAC T1, the last person I will ask is a MCSE. and that is just a small example). bodisha1 really has some good info as far as what you asked. I have a few degrees, but compared to my technical certs I have, most employers look over the fact I have a degree and look at my certs and hands on experience. As far as what field may be the best/most open right now, any UNIX or LINUX based admin position, and network and infastructure security are the biggest booming. And to show there are not enough "good" people in the infastructure securtity right now ( and there are still many parts to that field), how many times in the last 6 months have you heard about network breaches and peoples personal data had been compromised????? The POST about companies wanting to stay on old technology like Windows 98 and XP, that is very small town living responses there, no offense trying to be made, but real companies with data and infastructure are not going to have EOL (end of life) systems on their network and the ones that do, are some of the ones you hear about security breaches....Just a thought | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 9/4/2009 4:10:13 PM | Here's the thing... As a previous poster eluded to, the industry is in flux. I'm a media design guru that self supports my required hardware. It's much faster than waiting on the tech to arrive, and it's a lot easier to get the upgrade parts when all they have to do is leave them on my desk.
With economics at the forefront of every Manager's mind, it's more about the width of your toolbox vs. the depth of one skill. If you want to work for a large corp like EDS or SAP then you can comfortably pick a skill area and with persistance get a job. If you want to be the only person handling a small to medium business, you'll need to be savvy in everything from purchasing to app support.
In my situation, it's a 13,000+ govt. WAN and Microsoft rules the day. They employ specialists in all areas; however, they're .net only tool users. I've pissed quite a few people off suggesting that we consider saving by using open source apps like Sun's OpenOffice instead of paying the lease on Microcrap.
I think the future belongs to the open minded businesses that will use linux, PHP and other OpenSource options instead of paying homage to MicroGeeks annually.
Large corps will continue to outsource to the major players like EDS, but as another poster noted, most small to mid-size operations will outsource locally (i.e. Geek Squad).
If you want to be on the app side and sit at a desk, I recommend becoming a network security freak and database designer. Outside of those two areas, you'll be facing an ever- evolving battle with downsizing and those minimum wage mobile geeks.
So if you're set on the bricks-and-mortar path, grab a business major with a minor in comp-science. You'll get up the ladder in the corp world faster if you can understand the owner's concerns and breakdown your recommendations in to layman's terms. Of all the computer gurus I've known, simple social skills keeps them down more than anything else. Unless your degree is from MIT or the like, it won't really matter to the HR director. You'll be interviewed by company staff in the industry. If you can walk, talk and back it up, you'll be fine.
All that to say, be the best at what you love to do and the rest will be syntax.
sourceforge.net rules | |
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| Where is your technology degree from? What kind of reaction is it met with?
Posted: 9/4/2009 8:30:06 PM | Whether IT is growing or contracting depends on the industry. I work in the transportation sector in the telecom corner of IT and our work load is not letting up. In fact, within the next several years our company will need to install equipment in something like 25,000 locations by 2015 to comply with federal mandates. It all depends on what you want to do.
As for the degree. I don't think it matters so long as it's from an accredited institution. What matters more is the continuing education you'll pursue as your career advances. Over the past four years the company has seen to it that I and other techs have received A+ certification and BICSI Technician certification. A+ is a lifetime deal (or at least it is for me) but BICSI requires proof of approved continuing education to renew the certification. More certification is likely in my future.
The work I do is varied, from installing a standby generator, to installing vehicle two-way radios, to installing microwave transmission equipment to running network cabling to configuring and installing a wireless point-to-point link to just a plain old telephone, my job is rarely the same thing two days in a row and for that I'm thankful. | |
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