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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 8:55:48 PM | Hey there,
I apologize if this is long, but I hope you really, really read this and tell me what you think!!
I know I am on the Off topic category, however I hoped I dont get canned for this. I just wanted to explain my story and I hope you guys can give me suggestions.
I am a college graduate who finished college about 4 months ago, and due to this economy it has been hard to find a job. So, I decided to go back to one of my old summer jobs for the time being which is a camp counselor. In that same area, I was also a fitness attendant for members in the building. Well, as a camp counselor you are supposed to care of the kids, help them out with homework, provide them with games, and teach them new things. We are also supposed to disciplined them by writing them up if they misbehaved and contact their parents about what their child did. Well, there are several kids that I have worked with that are troublesome, they dont listen, and they are disrepectful. We write them up, tell their parents, and a lot of times their parents dont care, and the kid comes back to camp causing more trouble.
One day, as a camp counselor I tried a different discipline, I made one troublesome kid perform a pushup for misbehaving. The next day, I received a warning from my boss due to the kid's mom complaning and I though everything was ok, bc I got warning. However, a couple hours later I get fired because the parent complained again without letting me defend myself. At the same time, I was working at fitness and the same parent saw me talking with some of my old campers and my old boss decided to terminate my membership and I lost two jobs. What is even worse is that I worked for her for three years as a counselor and she said this to me "I saw signs up that Five Guys and Panera Bread are hiring, you should look into that". I am sorry this is long......but what do you think. Ive been job hunting for weeks and now unemployed like 9.7% of Americans. | |
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wudger
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Joined: 12/20/2007
Msg: 2 | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:08:35 PM | OP, what do I think???
Have to first ask what race this child was, because I have NOW long learned that being of color still is a bad thing, and people will take issue simply because of that fact...
I was married last Weds to my sweety of over a year, and never seen or heard insults, but where we went out side of the specific area, I seen racism alive and well...
Further more, it seems that parents are NOT interested in their kids being held accountable for their misdeeds... The kids had to do push ups, how many???
You would be hard pressed to file for racism, unless someone else that was white used the same tech and did NOT get fired... Honestly, that is my guess, and I think these parents need a good throttling...
YES, I see kids my son's age of 13 that misbehave like they own the world... It really shocks me, because I don't pretend to think my son is not capable of being naughty... He is a good kid, but HE ALSO can be a little bugger when given the perfect situation.
I do NOT think you were out of line, but then again I don't like raising my kids like some big nasty brat, that feels entitled to misbehave just because...
I am sorry that happened to you... | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:47:23 PM |
I made one troublesome kid perform a pushup for misbehaving. The next day, I received a warning from my boss due to the kid's mom complaning and I though everything was ok, bc I got warning. However, a couple hours later I get fired because the parent complained again without letting me defend myself.
If you've received no other cautions, it is very abrupt to be terminated after this one warning. What exactly was the parent/boss' objection to the pushup(s)? It doesn't seem like a harsh penalty to me, unless you asked for 300 of them. How old was this child also? Does the company have procedures for dealing with unruly kids, or are you expected to make up your own? If you deviated from a standard policy, that could cause problems, but usually one such problem is not enough to lose your job over.
Your problems exhibit what happens when working with children with overindulgent parents. I think it takes a special kind of person to do this work, as well as the work of a teacher, particularly in a private school. Both of your bosses ended up caving into the parents, which is normally not a wise decision.
I'm also sorry this happened to you. Since you work in fitness, perhaps you can find another position that requires you to work with adults only.
Be well....... | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:49:51 PM | Yea, everyone asked me the race of the mom and child and they are white. I made him do 2 push ups and had him hold for 15 seconds, I was really definite about that. A lot of people say that it is a race issue, maybe it is, maybe its not. I am not the type of person to base things on race. However, if it really is, then its a shame. I would admit this to everyone that is reading this, I shouldnt made him do a push up and the mom has every right to complain, however I talked to my boss to have the parent come in the office (my boss being the mediator) so I can apologize and explain my side, they said nope.
I requested to speak to other people in the administration, she said no, I asked to speak with people who is in higher management, they said no. Basically, I offered every way to at least tell my side of why I did it, they wouldnt allow me to. I had no say in the situation and just let me go. My former boss then suggested that I should work at a burger joint for the time being. It felt like an insult when she told me because I worked for her for three years and didnt offer to help. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:52:09 PM | I think that any place that deals with minors in a professional capacity has very specific rules regarding what "is" and "is not" allowed. Which most likely includes what are acceptable forms of discipline.
Those rules are there for many reasons...protection of the child (client) and the facility in terms of liability.
If you broke those rules...you exposed them to potential liability and/or litigation.
A person should be especially interested in "raising their stock" as an employee given the state of unemployment. For every person that is not willing to conform to written and/or implied policy...there is a line behind them willing to take the job and conform.
That's the real world.
Edit: It may not only have to do with "what" you had the child do...but in "what" manner you expressed it and "how" the child reported his emotions at the time. Right or wrong...if the child said (honestly or otherwise) that he/she was intimidated or freightened....that becomes a no brainer.
Things like this become very much a "tight rope" for us to walk...that is why there usually is very specific thing you can say or do when dealing with these situations. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:56:21 PM | | The child is about 10 years old. The protocol is that you have a written report on the kid that is misbehaving, and then we contact their parents. However, when we do that, the parents dont do anything and the kid comes back the next day the same way, making my job harder. This kid was written up before as well, because another counselor had to report him. I just thought I can use a different way of disciplining the kid, because I have done timeouts, put him to the side to talk to him, been written up, and even talked to him, and none of those were effective. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 9:59:55 PM | You might have a case for wrongful dismissal.
If it's how you have described it sounds very heavy-handed and based on the whim of a parent. If I were really cynical, this "troublesome" kid probably embellished to somehow make it appear worse than it was.
I don't know what reference to "Five Guys and Panera Bread" means other than a put-down.. in the context of what's stated in msg 3 (racial discrimination)?
If you've received no other cautions, it is very abrupt to be terminated after this one warning. What exactly was the parent/boss' objection to the pushup(s)? It doesn't seem like a harsh penalty to me, unless you asked for 300 of them. How old was this child also? Does the company have procedures for dealing with unruly kids, or are you expected to make up your own? If you deviated from a standard policy, that could cause problems, but usually one such problem is not enough to lose your job over.
I agree but at the same time I don't think the OP using his iniative, even if it did deviate somewhat from policy, is cause for a severe response. It seems out of line with his actions. Standard rules don't always work for kids.
OP, tell your former colleagues to dump all troublesome kids at the boss's door whenever they act up! Let him/her deal with 'em.  | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:00:15 PM | | Hey revilors, you are completely right on what you are saying about the rules dealing with liablility and litigation. However, I was received a warning and then just decided to change their mind and terminate me without at least letting me defend myself. But, what you are saying is true. I have been looking for other jobs and have moved on, but it still hurts me that it end that way. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:05:14 PM | Sorry you lost your job......and your reputation is now tarnished.
as a mom of 3 young kids I see parents coming to their kids rescue without hesitation.... a lot of kids are not accountable for their actions and parents take whatever the kids say as gospel.
many accusations made by kids have resulted in adults being under scrutiny and some even being charged with such things as child abuse.
I would like to hear the other side of the story in this case. There is always two sides..three sides to these things.
I would seek compensation ... written explanation from your ex-employer...some documentation listing why you were fired...so there is no misunderstanding or communication at a later date. Let them spell it out exactly what you did...and why you were let go.
your next employer might contact them and get a whole different story on the phone..with much innuendo... so contact the ex-employer.... dont get confrontational...be sweet as pie an request a written statement from them now why you were let go.
send your request by email so you have a paper trail and documentation.
It will be your ace in the hole if rumours and stories emerge in the future. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:05:16 PM | Hey isnuttinfree,
Yea I felt very insulted when she told me to work at Five Guys and Panera Bread, because I worked for her three years and this was the first time this ever happened. I know their arent jobs out there, but I have a little bit of pride than to work at a Burger Joint or make sandwiches especially after I spent 4 years of Blood, sweat, and tears at Univ. of Tampa to obtain my B.S. Degree. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:30:49 PM | Missed some other posts before I posted. I'd have to say you went overboard asking him to hold for 15 secs.. for a 10 year old. I can't even do it.
So well, if everyone started making up their own rules, problems can occur, as you've discovered.
So they must have thought it serious enough to deny you further channels to state your side of the story. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:31:41 PM | I would say that they did you a favor. You can move on and be done with both these penny-ante, political-correctness outfits and find a real job while your ex-bosses continue to kiss ass.
Keep plugging away. I had one job where we had all sort of unreasonable rules to follow and if there wasn't one, they made it up on the spot. My supervisor had been trying a long time and repeatedly to get into a position elsewhere and became really disgruntled at the agency when he never got the job. One day, he up and fired me for being five minutes late, although I had been driving around for 30 minutes looking for ANY parking space within a mile of the place (Christmas season). He said, "Why don't you go apply at (the agency he couldn't get into)...They're ALWAYS late."
So I did. And I scored in the top 2% and got the job, paying twice what he was making.
After a couple of months, I went back to the store and he asked me what I was doing now. When I told him, he about had a stroke. I thanked him for the timely firing and wished him good luck for the next time he fails the exam. What goes around comes around. That parent you had to deal with? Chances are, once her brat comes of age, he's going to cause her all manner of heartache and loss...those will be her just desserts for trying to palm her brat off on your previous workplace. The fitness place? They'll continue to kowtow to a-holes like her and will likely go out of business within 5 years.
Good luck to you! Find a place that can use what you have to offer and don't settle for any more of these kiss-butt places. With your background, have you considered going into private training for folks who are really trying to get their kids into decent shape?Use both of these as a learning experience for when you get into supervisory positions. Maybe one of your ex-bosses will even end up working for you...kharma. I've had that happen, too.
Hey! So are you able to collect unemployment now or what, since they fired you? I sure would.
Missed some other posts before I posted. I'd have to say you went overboard asking him to hold for 15 secs.. for a 10 year old.
When I was 10 years old, I was doing 250 pushups at a time and holding 5 seconds for the last 100. I was also swimming laps for 60-90 minutes nonstop. MANY kids these days are soft as pudding and if someone doesn't shape them up, they'll be dropping dead before they're 40. But that's Darwinism for you.
Two pushups? 30 seconds total? Cakewalk. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 10:56:32 PM | Pass this on as life experience. People, (EVEN I), have been terminated for something that was not my fault. A job is a job. Remember... As my daddy use to say.... "I was looking for a job when I found this one." Tell the jacka__es, "Thanks for the paycheck! Now give me mine now!" (In Texas there use to be a law that you could require your payment NOW!)
But really man. Shake it off. Tell them to smell your a$$ as you walk out the door! For that's the last thing they will see as you go! | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:05:59 PM |
Good luck to you! Find a place that can use what you have to offer and don't settle for any more of these kiss-butt places. With your background, have you considered going into private training for folks who are really trying to get their kids into decent shape?Use both of these as a learning experience for when you get into supervisory positions. Maybe one of your ex-bosses will even end up working for you...kharma. I've had that happen, too.
<img src=http://www.plentyoffish.com/smiles/icon_201.gif border=0> Just what I was thinking.
Brush it off, don't give this any more energy than it deserves. Sounds like a wishy washy place to work anyway when the only disciplinary action at your disposal is writing letters to parents with their ears painted on. Some, not all parents send their kids to camp because they're completely overwhelmed themselves at the monsters they've created, and they need a little break...
Be grateful you're out of that environment.
Now quit whining and go find yourself a position that's worthy of you and your hard earned education.
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:12:54 PM | I would say ... you were wronged. Learn from this ...and move on ...
The world is ... what it is .......
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:13:15 PM | Your decision to abandon the protocol, replacing that discipline with your own, was a mistake in terms of the parameters of your job. You acted outside the established rules. When it comes to kids and parents, companies that have responsibilities for kids will tend to value highly the trust of the parents. The push-ups were not torture, of course, but in a sense that stepping beyond your designated authority represents a breech of trust You may know what you would and wouldn't do, but having shown you will grant yourself unapproved authority to impose your own judgment in this area you become an unknown quantity or loose canon. It's enough for them to know that they can't know what you might decide to do. That's the larger issue so whether it was push-ups or walking the plank is only the form it happened to take.
Just as you made a mistake in assigning a punishment outside the rules, they made one in how they went about firing you. Their main concern was not to fire you in a best manner, but just to fire you, and perhaps they were as unprepared to go about it well as you were to go about disciplining the kid the best way.
This might be something to shrug off rather than nurse a sense of injustice. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:15:56 PM |
When I was 10 years old, I was doing 250 pushups at a time and holding 5 seconds for the last 100. I was also swimming laps for 60-90 minutes nonstop. MANY kids these days are soft as pudding and if someone doesn't shape them up, they'll be dropping dead before they're 40. But that's Darwinism for you.
Two pushups? 30 seconds total? Cakewalk.
You must have been superkid lol. You're probably right in a way. I'm just a big ole softie. When it comes to our kids, us parents can be very protective...too much so. I dunno, it depends on that kids's physical capability. The OP also said he was really definite about it. That could have affected the kid emotionally.. intimidated/frightened as another poster said.. or shocked.
The problem these days is that we also live in a litigious society, I think it must be the worst in the US.
When I was a kid, I was forced to participate by a phys ed teacher, his demeanor and attitude to me in front of other classmates made me very uncomfortable. I hadn't done anything wrong, I just felt embarrassed, wanted to opt out of an activity. Honestly, I think back and wish I had reported him for his intimidating manner.
I'm not comparing this to the OP's case, I can see how he thought he had justification. I'm just describing what can happen.
Good Luck in your future endeavours OP. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:21:34 PM | You said it was a camp. What is the income level of the parents involved? Is it an exclusive place to be attending?
That might explain a few things if it is: the racism, the entitlement attitude, and perhaps even donors who contribute large sums to keep the place running.
Once someone's family is a big money donor at any institution they can do whatever they please and no level of management will go against them. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/13/2009 11:55:50 PM | i think it sucks but that is the burden of working with children. parents are fickle creatures man.
you can however talk to the labor board about unlawful termination and see what your rights are. you should have received the warning first and IF it happened again.. then they could fire you.
but who would want to work for a crap boss that would tell you that!?
you could turn her in for harassment for that last comment alone. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/14/2009 12:05:00 AM | Im sorry to hear about your lack of a job ..op..
I suggest .. that you do ask your ex employer.. for a written refference..
in regards to the fitness job...
and then ask gently.. for a reference for the 3 years in the other job..
why 2 seperate?... cause surely.. your time/experience in the fitness job..
wasn't affected by the incident in the other job..
Im hoping if.... worded right.. you will at least get a good refference..
And op... Why.. not enquire at different gymns... fitness industry type jobs..
you never know if someone is looking for a personal trainer or needs help.. or a holiday.. from being a personal trainer..
get your resume...... including your...degree etc up to scratch..
and go out there get it...
I wish you the best.. ...
and remember when 1 door closes.. your forced.. to move forward...
peace | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/14/2009 12:19:28 AM | | I've been accused of racism more than once by black parents in the inner city for attempting to discipline their children. Several mothers told me in front of their children that they didn't have to listen to me. So guess what? I didn't try and teach them anything. Racism nowadays is when you do something some of another race doesn't like. I always tell parents that if I was racist then I wouldn't try and discipline the child at all, I'd just let him/her do as they please. And then I do. See, there are too many children and parents who care and want help to waste precious energy on those who don't. I don't stress about it or get mad. Those parents are creating monsters and will pay dearly for it later. With the economy the way it is those families are in for a big shock. I'm so over those people. | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/14/2009 12:23:43 AM | I just seen this....
When I was 10 years old, I was doing 250 pushups at a time and holding 5 seconds for the last 100. I was also swimming laps for 60-90 minutes nonstop. MANY kids these days are soft as pudding and if someone doesn't shape them up, they'll be dropping dead before they're 40. But that's Darwinism for you.
Two pushups? 30 seconds total? Cakewalk
Um... When I was a kid I had to walk 10 miles to and from school every day, UPHILL BOTH WAYS in the SNOW!
Oh, BTW.. I grew up in Texas! | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/14/2009 2:44:39 AM | I think your old boss was/is an ass. Sounds like the parent of the mis -behaving child had a wild hair up her wahoo. Not much you can do to defen yourself when you don't get the opportunity. However your state labor board might be able to help out with your firing and see if you were fired unduly or wrongly. Your state may or may not be a right to work, right to fire state but I'm sure there are still certain basic labor laws that must be followed when employees are being fired/terminated/let go/downsized or any other kind of euphemism.
Her crack remark of Five Guys and Panera Bread could of been followed up with "maybe I could contact my local tv station that has a staff of problem solvers and maybe they could come out and interview you about your lack of following labor practices, I hear they could use a good story...... | |
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| This is how I lost my job folks, what do you think?
Posted: 9/14/2009 2:59:12 AM | I think you were out of line and deserved stern disciplinary action up to and including dismissal of you position.
You took it upon yourself to discipline a child that you had no right to... as a parent, I'm the sole disciplinary figure for my children. I absolutely insist on the school contacting me prior to meting out a punishment to ensure that it follows my standards.
If a teacher or principal administered discipline to my child in a manner that set them out from the crowd, I would be livid and yes, I would complain to the high heavens. Then if I was told that a verbal reprimand was the only ramification, I would clearly explain how dissatisified with the system I am...
Bottom line... you were wrong and I don't think that the dismissal was wrongful. | |
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