| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 3:50:04 PM | "A school in southeast England called an emergency assembly to tell children that a 12-year-old male pupil was having a sex change. The boy arrived for his first term at secondary school wearing a dress and with long hair in ribboned pigtails after his parents changed his name to a female one by deed poll over the summer holidays. However, the boy, who is preparing to undergo hormone treatment and sex change surgery, was immediately taunted by classmates who recognised him from primary school.
As a result, the 1,000-pupil school in south east England decided to call an emergency assembly ordering children to treat him as a girl and use his new name. But parents have reacted angrily after some youngsters were apparently left in tears by the news. They claim that the head teacher should have informed parents of the matter beforehand, so that they could have discussed gender issues with their children.
One mother, whose daughter was a classmate of the boy at primary school, told The Sun: "She [my daughter] told me that the pupil is already a target for bullying. What has really upset the parents is that the school didn't see fit to send us a letter first so we could explain it to children in our own way. Maybe we could have explained sexual politics and encouraged our kids to be more sensitive. They were simply told, 'You may notice one pupil is not present in this assembly – that is because the pupil is now a girl'. The girl, as she now is, will go through hell because of how this has been handled."
It is understood that at primary school, the boy's head teacher insisted that children treat him as a boy, despite his feminine behaviour, which included wearing a bikini for swimming lessons, wearing his hair in pigtails and using riding a pink scooter. However, the secondary school has provided him with a separate lavatory and changing room in its sports hall.
The boy's mother told The Sun: "We are committed to ensuring the very best for our child. We are working with other agencies to ensure our child's welfare is protected."
Source:
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/6204181/Boy-12-is-having-sex-change-school-annouces.html
So, do you think the school was right to make this announcement, or do you think it's political correctness gone amok? Could they have dealt with the situation another way?
How do you think you'd feel if your child said he/she felt "trapped" in his/her own body and wanted a sex change before puberty kicked in? Would you be prepared to face the challenges? | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 3:59:37 PM | I'm not really sure how the school should have handled the situation really. What else could they have done? Should they have just ignored the matter and introduced the child as a new pupil ?
I don't know the details of the case, but it seems to be a very young age for gender reassignment to be carried out.....I'd be concerned whether a 12 yr old was mature enough emotionally to deal with such a huge change.
Was the child an hermaphrodite or was it a full sex change? | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:03:29 PM | | No, the child wasn't a hermaphrodite. Not sure when this happened, but it's in the news now. The boy is on the list for gender reassignment, but until then he is receiving pre-op medical treatment and dressing and living as a girl. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:11:18 PM | I can't quite get over the fact that a 12 year old regardless of gender is actually being allowed to undergo a sex change!
The statement: "We are committed to ensuring the very best for our child. We are working with other agencies to ensure our child's welfare is protected." doesnt seem to make much sense when the parents are allowing this to happen in the first place.
A 12 year old doesnt have the maturity nor the legal rights of an adult and therefore should not be allowed to go through a sex change until they become one.
Preposterous. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:12:42 PM | I think the head teacher at this school should be sacked for calling that emergency assembly
It showed lack of care for this child who will never be able to return to that school again.
From what I've read this family have received threats and now need police protection.
I don't agree with 12 year olds being allowed to have gender reassignment at such a young age.
What the hell is going on in this country when our troops are dying in Afghanistan
through a lack of funding and equipment but we can afford to give a child a sex swap op? | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:42:59 PM | I think an individual in England must be 18 to have the actual operation, but can get hormone therapy long before that.
And if you think 12 is too young to make such a big decision, wait til you hear this! A 9yo primary school boy was allowed to return to school this term as a girl... with the blessing of his teachers and active encouragement of his headmistress, who lets him use the girls loo!
Full story here:
www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/2645444/Now-boy-9-is-a-girl.html | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:52:07 PM | FFS.
It's just wrong on so many levels.
In one aspect it's possible to think, wow, how great is it that the parents and teachers are open minded enough to let these kids go through with these decisions at such a young age.
But my overwhelming feeling is how fooking INSANE are these parents and teachers for letting the CHILDREN who have still to reach puberty go through with these decisions and did they give any consideration to how confusing it would be for the other kids that have to go to school with the tranny kids?............
Just....wow. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 4:54:14 PM | I must admit that I haven't really read the story before, although I read a very short version of it on Yahoo news.
Personally I dont think a sex change op should have been performed on a 12 year old, unless the kid was a hermaphrodite. The kid may feel something is wrong, but I still think it should have been left a few more years. I mean, hormones are all over the place at that age, and perhaps a better 'treatment' would have been hormone therapy - but not opposite sex hormones.
As the article I read pointed out, there were kids at the school who knew the kid before the sex change.... and we all know how nasty and cruel kids can be. I think that kid is going to suffer a great deal. And in that case, perhaps the school felt it necessary to say something rather than let the kids tell each other.
However, if the kid had gone to an entirely different school where no-one knew him/her, then I would recommend the school not say anything. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 5:07:08 PM | Maybe its the only way britain can get future medals in the olympics?
agrees with others on how early the age is, what if they are gay? Or just a t.v?
bit off topic, but always wondered why so many trans-sexuals go into a gay relationship after the op, kind of defeats the object imho. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/18/2009 6:17:09 PM | | I think it’s insane; not the school announcing it (although that is insane) but the fact that a 12 year old is having a sex change. I do consider the whole process rather abhorrent, especially the surgical procedures and the obvious deceit (changing birth certificate, etc.). I’m quite aware however, that I’m thinking with a brain that developed during the 1970’s ;). Perhaps things are different today and anything goes? | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 12:45:07 AM | Somewhere along the line it seems to me there has been a breakdown in communication between the school, the child and the parents.
A teacher in a school near here undertook a sex-change - letters were sent home at the end of the summer term and thus parents had time to talk over the matter with their children before the start of the new term in September when she underwent the change in identity.
It had to be dealt with in an emergency assembly? Did the school ask the parents or the child for advice on how they wanted it to become known in the school? Did they talk to any medical advisor from their local education authority on the best way to introduce the whole subject of gender dysmorphism (I think that's what it's properly called)? It's almost as if they tried to sweep it all under the carpet and when that didn't work they hoped the furore would happen and the child would be moved from the school so they didn't have to deal with it... (I am an out-and-out cynic at times!)
I do think it's right that the school deals with it in some way and doesn't just ignore it, but an emergency assembly and a blunt announcement? It has to be wrong in my view.
And to some other posters - I think if a 12 year old is mature enough to be able to verbalise their feelings about their body and their self-identity in a way that is consistent and enduring to doctors, psychologists, family, then they are mature enough to undergo the chemical interventions that will put them on course to be able to live the rest of their life as the person they know they really are. For a boy to girl change, I would think it would be better to start before puberty so the male changes that cannot be dealt with, like the Adam's apple and the deep voice, don't develop.
I have seen a couple of TV programmes about youngsters who are undergoing gender reassignment. I always feel so sorry for the parents (and the grandparents, for some of whom this must be a real trauma because of their cultural up-bringing) and neither programme spoke about whether there was any true counselling for them - because they surely must undergo a real period of grief, saying goodbye to the child they have brought up so far but having to deal with their new child's joy in being able to be the person they have always known themself to be at the same time. Having to deal with this school's behaviour as well must be so hard for them. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 1:04:53 AM | What an awful story! I have no issues with gender reassignement surgery when it is performed to adults who have gone through all the stages of preparation and have proven their determination but for children? I wonder how much the parents had to do with this kid behaving like a girl because I have heard loads of stories of mothers dressing up their little boys as girls and treating them as girls because they actually wanted to have a girl and that leaves the child confused and frustrated to the point they can develop antisocial behaviour.
As for the school, the parent's point of view makes sense. I would also have prefered to talk about gender issues with my child before she got exposed to them at school.
But back to M>F or F>M surgeries: have you ever met anyone who's had one?
I met a guy when I first came to England and he was oh! so manly and sexy and then he tells me in the car drive home that he feels like a woman and wants to become a woman. Imagine my shock! I thought 'he is putting it on because he doesn't want me to fancy him' but sure enough this guy went through all the preps including counselling and living as a 24/7 female, working, etc. and then had his surgery. He is now a gorgeous female and the strange thing is the deep masculine voice has turned into a soft female voice so much that people do not believe me when I say he used to be male. | |
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sjxx
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Joined: 8/27/2009
Msg: 13 | |
| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 1:08:36 AM | | No one in Britain can have gender reassignment until they are 18 so you can all stop saying you cant believe a 12 year old is being allowed to change sex. He isnt. He is receiving counselling and therapy for when he IS old enough. He is very brave to go back to school as a girl considering all the bullying and name calling that he will now endure. His parents must be going through hell but good for them if they can support their child in this, so many transexuals are estranged from their families. I remember when I was studying psychology reading an article about this subject and it claimed that when a transexuals brain was looked at in postmortem they always appeared to be the brain of the opposite sex. I have no idea how they came to that conclusion before anyone asks me to elaborate. Sorry purely anecdotal. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 3:01:12 AM |
I have not read or heard any reports of this case at all yet.
But one thing I am sure of is that it is not down to just parents and teachers deciding the gender of this kid.
If you think that is the case then you obviously do not even proccess your thoughts very clearly before commenting or read previous comments for any other input.
You do realise the hypocrisy in that you claim not to have read any of the reports of this case yet, but yet you still feel able to judge me on a personal level for the comments I have made after I actually read the reports? Maybe you should actually go and read the articles and then get back to me if you want me to take you seriously.
And to some other posters - I think if a 12 year old is mature enough to be able to verbalise their feelings about their body and their self-identity in a way that is consistent and enduring to doctors, psychologists, family, then they are mature enough to undergo the chemical interventions that will put them on course to be able to live the rest of their life as the person they know they really are. For a boy to girl change, I would think it would be better to start before puberty so the male changes that cannot be dealt with, like the Adam's apple and the deep voice, don't develop.
So at 12, a person isn't allowed to drive a car, drink alcohol, vote, get a tattoo or even have sex legally..............but yet it's ok for them to start undergoing the changes that will allow them to have a sex change. No. Christ, you don't get to take practice driving lessons before you turn 17 so you are prepared to take the test....
Aesthetically it may very well make sense to undergo hormonal changes prior to puberty but thats still jumping past the fact that they still don't have the life experience and maturity to be able to make such a massive decision at such a young age and I hope the doctors don't allow the hormone treatment to start until he is 18 also.
No one in Britain can have gender reassignment until they are 18 so you can all stop saying you cant believe a 12 year old is being allowed to change sex. He isnt. He is receiving counselling and therapy for when he IS old enough.
Just because the kid isnt going out tomorrow for the operation, the fundamental fact remains that a 12 year old is in fact being allowed to have a sex change and I still think that even going through counselling and therapy before being 18 is putting the cart before the horse. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 3:38:08 AM | I am swinging both ways with this one (no pun intended)
On the one hand , this child has OBVIOUSLY already spent his 12 years protesting about his gender and although it may be news to everybody else , it isnt news to him or his family. Therefore to continue making him live with "the wrong gender" untill he is 18 is just prolonging the innevitable. Getting the wheels in motion now means that by 18 he is already on his way to being a she , and already accepted with thiose he will now end his school years with, and hopefully starting the transition now wil bode him well for his future.
On the other side of the coin , I too in all honesty find it incredulous to think a child knows himeslf enough at this age to start such a mentally and physically drastic life change like this.
As always , untill we are walking in the shoes of these people we never have a full and realistic take on their lives and the decisions made . | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 3:50:48 AM | Just the following observations:
(1) No one is allowed any surgery until they are 18, so it has already been sensationalised.
(2) None of you have ever met this child and do not know them in the slightest. Whilst I would agree for most cases it would be wrong to be even considering reassignment at that age, there are ALWAYS exceptional people who know their own minds at a young age.
Case in point:
The girl who at 13 wants to sail around the world. A task almost every 13 year old on the planet would not be suited to. But who is anyone to say she can't if she has the skills and the backing of her parents?
I also remember at school I knew my own mind VERY well, and whilst I obeyed most rules, I would not be told to do things I knew I did not like.........by anyone. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 3:55:20 AM |
I remember when I was studying psychology reading an article about this subject and it claimed that when a transexuals brain was looked at in postmortem they always appeared to be the brain of the opposite sex. I have no idea how they came to that conclusion before anyone asks me to elaborate. Sorry purely anecdotal.
Actually not anecdotal. I just did a search and it seems to be pretty much correct. Female brain, male body. You live and learn....!
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"Regardless of sexual orientation, men had almost twice as many somatostatin neurons as women (P < 0.006). The number of neurons in the BSTc of male-to-female transsexuals was similar to that of the females (P = 0.83). In contrast, the neuron number of a female-to-male transsexual was found to be in the male range. Hormone treatment or sex hormone level variations in adulthood did not seem to have influenced BSTc neuron numbers. The present findings of somatostatin neuronal sex differences in the BSTc and its sex reversal in the transsexual brain clearly support the paradigm that in transsexuals sexual differentiation of the brain and genitals may go into opposite directions and point to a neurobiological basis of gender identity disorder." | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 4:01:38 AM | I did a google search to find more information on this story and actually came across the following articles.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-432094/Girl-14-boy-12.html
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/girl-12-wins-sex-change/story-e6frf7jo-1111116434870
These are different cases, one in germany where the boy actually underwent the whole procedure at the age of 12 and the other is a case of a 12 year old girl who wants to be a boy
I think the school could have issued letters to the parents in this case but this lad has made a very difficult choice with the backing of his family and medical professionals. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 4:25:55 AM | And for what can and cannot be done in the UK and how it is regarded in the NHS:
http://www.gires.org.uk/assets/DOH-Assets/pdf/doh-children-and-adolescents.pdf
Any medication would be to stop puberty but not increase any feminisation so that if the child was not happy living as a female then the normal puberty - albeit delayed - may be allowed to continue. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 5:02:59 AM |
(1) No one is allowed any surgery until they are 18, so it has already been sensationalised.
Maybe in relation to the actual sex change the news sources have elaborated a bit for their headlines, nothing new there. But what about everything else involved? A young boy being allowed to go to school as a girl and being allowed to use the girls toilets etc and how poorly the school dealt with it in general and the effect it has on all the other children? I don't think its sensationalism in that sense at all.
(2) None of you have ever met this child and do not know them in the slightest. Whilst I would agree for most cases it would be wrong to be even considering reassignment at that age, there are ALWAYS exceptional people who know their own minds at a young age.
So why isn't the age you are allowed to drink, have sex, get a tattoo, vote, get married and a whole host of other things that are deemed inappropriate for people of a certain age to do taken on an individual case by case basis?
And for what can and cannot be done in the UK and how it is regarded in the NHS:
http://www.gires.org.uk/assets/DOH-Assets/pdf/doh-children-and-adolescents.pdf
Any medication would be to stop puberty but not increase any feminisation so that if the child was not happy living as a female then the normal puberty - albeit delayed - may be allowed to continue.
That's an interesting read but even then I'm still on the fence about whether it's ok to suspend a childs puberty. That's a very difficult one. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 5:14:28 AM |
So, do you think the school was right to make this announcement
Yes.
The other pupils have a right to know the gender of anyone that they might be sharing the changing-rooms with.
Obviously, the boy had no problem with his condition, as he wouldn't have turned up dressed as he did.
It does seem a shame that he decided so young that he wanted to be a girl, but hey..... | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 5:51:52 AM |
So, do you think the school was right to make this announcement, or do you think it's political correctness gone amok? Could they have dealt with the situation another way?
I think the announcement was a bad idea and must have come as a shock. It would have been better to have written to all the parents at the beginning of the summer holidays so they get a chance to talk it through with their children.
How do you think you'd feel if your child said he/she felt "trapped" in his/her own body and wanted a sex change before puberty kicked in? Would you be prepared to face the challenges?
I can't really answer that as he's grown up now and he's never shown any inclination towards wanting a sex change! I'd imagine I would have felt very torn between trying to persuade him not to and encouraging his desires. | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 6:05:14 AM |
Is it a case of him making a decision on his sexuality or is it case of him excepting what his sexuality is and the only decision he has made is to let the world know about it?
Unless he was forced into it, the decision to turn into a girl appears to be his.
Besides, his sexuality has little to do with his gender..... | |
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| Was the school right to announce a 12yo student's sex change?
Posted: 9/19/2009 2:44:36 PM | I personally know two people who changed their sex and they did it in their 20s to 30s, one is quite happy becoming the opposite sex, the other I think is a bit lost between sexes and I think she regrets it.
I think it is far to early for a 12 year old child to make a decision about their sex change. | |
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