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 Author Thread: Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
 EarlzP

Joined: 12/9/2007
Msg: 1
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 7:36:40 PM
Inspite of the millions of dollars that the health care industry poured into defeating health care reform it looks good for Health Care Reform that contains a Public Option.

President Obama and the democrats have all but delivered on their campaign promise to bring health care reform to the people, the tides of public opinion have turned with the majority of americans now wanting not only health care reform but wanting it with a public option.

It's a shame that not one republican has listened to the people that elected them, this should have never been a partisan issue

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091028/pl_nm/us_usa_healthcare_option


By Tim Gaynor Tim Gaynor – Wed Oct 28, 3:55 pm ET
PHOENIX (Reuters) – Including a government-run insurance option in a U.S. healthcare bill has split lawmakers in the Democrat-controlled U.S. Congress, but support for it remains broad on the streets of U.S. cities, voters and pollsters say.

On Monday, Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid included a "public" option in the Senate's bill as the best way to lower costs and create competition.

"When you have no competition, the prices keep going up and up ... the public option is going to force them to change, to bring down their prices -- hopefully," said Phoenix mobile home salesman Bill Zaffer, 61, who backed the measure.

Opponents argue that a public option would hurt competition because the government program would have a cost advantage by virtue of a huge member base, but supporters of the public option say there is no real competition without it.

Inclusion of a public option has become one of the most contentious issues in the debate on healthcare reform -- President Barack Obama's top domestic priority, which seeks to cut costs, improve care and regulate insurers.

Democrats said Reid was still short of the 60 votes needed to overcome procedural hurdles and pass a bill with a public option. Republicans are against the measure, which they say amounts to a government takeover of healthcare which would hurt the private insurance industry.

But several polls in recent weeks show support for the option running at between 50 and 61 percent among Americans. Among backers is yoga instructor Suzanne Brownlow, from Atlanta.

"It's almost impossible to get insurance. A public option would present me with an opportunity," said Brownlow, 48, who has repeatedly been denied coverage since having a seizure eight years ago, and has been without coverage for year.

In Los Angeles, meanwhile, attorney Gary Minevich, 33, who is among some 46 million people in the United States without coverage, said he supported "nationalized" health care.

"I haven't had health care in like seven years and I think that if he had passed this a long time ago I'd have been able to see a doctor," he said.

But Broc Tooher, 20, was among a minority of Americans who dislike a government-run insurance option, which he felt would impose uniformity.

"Insurance should be provided on what you want, and not just all be the same," said Tooher, an operating room assistant in Scottsdale, Ariz. "I think it's a bad idea."

GUT RESPONSE

A USA Today/Gallup poll released last week found 50 percent backed a public option and 46 percent opposed it, while a CNN poll found 61 percent supported an insurance option administered by the government and 38 percent opposed.

While the numbers vary, researchers said they are representative of backing for a government insurance option among Americans. Underlying the support are such factors as difficulty obtaining coverage and the cost of medical care.

"You're essentially getting a gut level response to what is a very complex issue, but I think it represents the public view," said Carroll Doherty of the Pew Research Center for the People & the Press.

"You see it across a lot of polls with different wording, that there is support for this approach."

Nevertheless, one Pew poll last month found that 67 percent of respondents found the healthcare debate difficult to understand -- a complaint common among Americans struggling to make sense of the four lengthy, jargon-ridden versions of healthcare legislation currently in Congress.

"I definitely need more information and I need to have it in a form we can understand," said Theresa Frombes, a 51-year-old occupational therapist from Illinois, who was "for some (of the bill) but not all of it."

In Phoenix, part-time potter Tim Denne, meanwhile, said he had difficulty reaching an informed view on the healthcare legislation, the Senate version of which alone runs to more than 1,500 pages.

"You could get a doctorate in just studying that bill ... it's that thick," he said indicating the breadth of a phone book with his thumb and index finger as he stood at a filling station.

"People can say whether they support it or not, but they can't really be in a firm or valid opinion," he added.

(Additional reporting by Dan Whitcomb in Los Angeles, Carey Gillam in Kansas City; editing by Cynthia Osterman)


Nov 2010 will mark the end of more of the senate republicans
 Tokie-Oh!-Roze

Joined: 8/13/2009
Msg: 2
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 8:03:49 PM
Here are a few news links that would beg to differ with this Reuters News link:

Note they are from some pretty “Main Stream” or even “Liberal Sources.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32206998/ns/politics-white_house/

MSNBC

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/09/01/opinion/polls/main5280373.shtml

CBS News

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/nyt-poll-69-worry-about-obama-care

New York Times


Reuters News is a UK based source: so maybe not the best source of American social/political issues.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reuters_News


Right now, Congress has been battling over the Health Care Reform issue. The problem both house and Senate have in passing their versions have NOT been due so much to “Republican Gridlock” but the fact that they can’t even get support from enough Democrats to pass the bills.

http://www.cbsnews.com/2718-250_162-209.html


The reason the Blue Dog (Dems), Republicans don’t want to pass the bill is fear of not being re-elected by their own constituencies if they do.


http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/august_2009/voters_say_they_know_health_care_bill_better_than_congress


BTW: Rasmussen is an independent non-partisan polling source.
 Acoustic-Blues

Joined: 7/19/2008
Msg: 3
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 8:17:26 PM
This health care reform Obama has tried to ramrod through = epic failure
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 4
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 8:18:50 PM

Nov 2010 will mark the end of more of the senate republicans.
Let's hope so. I see now that Bayh is also about to join Lieberman on siding with the Republicans.

I've said it before and will say it again in here ... we need to take away all of Congress' benefits until this bill gets passed. How long do ya think it would take?

They are all sitting pretty with their wonderful benefits, and apparently just don't care that more than 122 Americans die every single day because they do not have health benefits.

Take away Congress' benefits and see how they like walking around with no medical coverage even if they stub their damned toe!!!!
 Acoustic-Blues

Joined: 7/19/2008
Msg: 5
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 8:21:49 PM
and apparently just don't care that more than 122 Americans die every single day because they do not have health benefits.

More people than that die every day and they do have health care
 Tokie-Oh!-Roze

Joined: 8/13/2009
Msg: 6
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 8:51:35 PM
122 Americans die every single day because they do not have health benefits.


Cotter, what is your source for this infomation? I have heard this reported, too, and have googled, but couldn't find any statistical basis for it.

I only found links to some kids on Facebook and Craig's list, and also some far left blogs. But these aren't credible sources of facts, nor are they collectors of data.

Also, please remember that health care BENEFITS are insurance, and not actual health care.

If someone is in a life threatening situation hospitals cannot refuse to treat them in the US.
 pirateheaven

Joined: 5/11/2008
Msg: 7
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/28/2009 11:05:02 PM
Remember you heard it here. The current bill will never pass.
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 8
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 6:08:35 AM

Cotter, what is your source for this infomation? I have heard this reported, too, and have googled, but couldn't find any statistical basis for it.
I originally heard it on the news and then googled "45000 die each year".

http://principledprofit.com/good-business-blog/physicians-45000-americans-die-each-year-for-lack-of-health-insurance/2009/09/19/
Physicians: 45,000 Americans Die Each Year for Lack of Health Insurance
September 19th, 2009 · 6 Comments · Politics, Social and Economic Justice, Uncategorized, poverty

Talk about death panels! Physicians for a National Health Program is calling attention to a just releases–and very shocking–Harvard study that found…

Nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance. That figure is about two and a half times higher than an estimate from the Institute of Medicine (IOM) in 2002.

The new study, “Health Insurance and Mortality in U.S. Adults,” appears in today’s online edition of the American Journal of Public Health.

The Harvard-based researchers found that uninsured, working-age Americans have a 40 percent higher risk of death than their privately insured counterparts, up from a 25 percent excess death rate found in 1993.

In an e-mail blast, the doctors group calls for President Obama to “start from scratch”: to ditch the unpopular, badly thought out, solves-nothing proposals floating through Congress and bring the US into alignment with the rest of the developed world: a single-payer health care plan.

And the group’s leader, Steffie Woolhandler, M.D., M.P.H. of Harvard University, gave a great interview on this on Democracy Now.

Retired Senator (and former presidential candidate) George McGovern notes in a recent op-ed that all it would take is a one sentence law, extending Medicare coverage to all Americans.

I think all these folks are correct. I’ve been saying for months that the time for single-payer (something I started supporting in 1979, when I was a community organizer for the Gray Panthers and this was their main plank) is NOW.

If you’re in the US, tell your Senators and Congressional representative. And tell your state government to push for it.

Of course there are many more there to look at.

I'm personally interested in a single-payer health care plan, but if we can't get that then we at least need the public option.

Another issue that is disturbing are the number of bankruptcies related to health care issues. Imagine if you have to have major surgery and you don't have health insurance. I know many of you in here are saying that if someone is in a life threatening situation hospitals cannot refuse to treat them in the US, but that doesn't mean they do it for free and they will keep after you until you are bankrupt or living out of your car or under a damn bridge somewhere.

While living in Florida, I had a co-worker (nurse) who was so deep in debt from her ill daughter's medical bills that she was living out of her car ... she AND her daughter. They bathed in beach showers. She kept a cooler with ice in the trunk and used a Hibachi to cook on. She had to pay so much each month towards the bills that she didn't have enough money left over to save for a deposit on an apartment. She used the address of a local gas station (who was letting her park there overnight) so she could register her daughter so she could go to school.
 etourdi77

Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 9
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 7:17:51 AM
She was a Nurse and didnt get her own child Health Insurance?
I wonder how many Bankruptcies are caused by Job Loss? Just sayin...

The study was released by Physicians for a National Health Care Program...looks like the Doctors who did the study are members of PHNP.
Under Limitations in the study there is a brief explanation of how they arrived at some of the numbers...pretty sketchy...
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 7:45:56 AM

She was a Nurse and didnt get her own child Health Insurance?
Keep in mind that not all employers offer insurance benefits. Also, even if a person has insurance, people still have to pay co-pays and if a person is really sick, even the co-pays can run so high that people can't pay them.

In this woman's case, she had insurance (at first) but just as with another friend of mine who's son had Muscular Dystrophy, the insurance eventually told her they would no longer cover the daughter ... so that the woman had to pay the entire sum. She ended up having to move to Florida where the weather is warm and she could live out of her car.

I wonder how many Bankruptcies are caused by Job Loss? Just sayin...
No doubt not just job loss.

I've taken care of people who got so sick that they used up all of their sick leave and the company let them go ... which not only left them with no insurance, but no income to pay the mounting medical bills.

If you apply for Welfare, you have to have exhausted all sources of value ... you can't own a home or late model car ... junkers seem to be allowed because of the lack of value. You have to have a physical address to apply for Welfare and must be able to show a copy of a lease as well as utility bill in your name. But if you have no money to even pay rent, then you basically can't even apply for Welfare or Food Stamps.

If you are still lucky enough to have a roof over your head at the time you apply for Welfare, keep in mind that it takes up to 3 months to be finalized and by then you are so far behind in the rent that the landlord is evicting you and once you are evicted, you can no longer collect the Welfare because they have to have a physical address to send the check ... they do not send Welfare checks to PO Boxes.

The ideas that people have as to how easy it is to bleed the system are mostly fictitious.


The study was released by Physicians for a National Health Care Program...looks like the Doctors who did the study are members of PHNP.
PHNP has an interest in the study and may have released the quote I furnished, but I believe the study was done by Harvard ...

http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=3feb4d85d77b11ae40378c5fa28f5cfe
Harvard Study: 45,000 Uninsured Die Every Year

New America Media, News Report, Paul Kleyman, Posted: Sep 18, 2009

Having no health insurance means an early death to almost 45,000 people in the United States annually – almost two-and-a-half times the number previously estimated -– according to a study published Thursday in the American Journal of Public Health.

The research team used the latest figures from the National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS) to update previous calculations based on 20-year-old data. They tracked 9,004 uninsured individuals ages 17-64.

The study included special “oversamples” of African Americans and Mexicans -– who were found to die at about the same rate as their white counterparts.

“Although blacks and Hispanics are more likely to end up uninsured, racial differences in the percentages of deaths was not statistically significant,” lead author Dr. Andrew Wilper said in an interview.

In essence, he said, once people are uninsured “they are in the same boat” –- a boat in which 3 percent will succumb each year from lack of care.

Researchers at Harvard University found that deaths by lack of health insurance are “more than those caused by kidney disease” (nearly 43,000 a year). The research team also included what they called a more “conservative” estimate of about 35,000 deaths annually, still double past findings.

Wilper, who recently joined the medical staff at the Veterans Affairs Medical Center in Boise, Idaho, said his research group analyzed data from NCHS’s Third National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey. This federal survey included detailed interviews and physical examinations of participating Americans.

The study’s authors cite a long list of previous research showing why lack of insurance elevates health risks for people. Past studies have documented such effects of having no insurance as rising hypertension, poor management of chronic illness, and reduced likelihood of receiving preventative and primary care, leading often to increased visits to emergency rooms.

Other studies have demonstrated that uninsured people get healthier when they turn 65 and go on Medicare. That’s because when they join the government system, these seniors receive expensive health treatments for long-neglected medical conditions.

Wilper and his colleagues conclude current public health alternatives for the uninsured, such as going to community health centers, “do not provide the protection of private health insurance.”

They add, “Despite widespread acknowledgment that enacting universal coverage would be life saving, doing so remains politically thorny.”

The study concludes that health professions should “advocate for universal coverage.” Wilper said the reports authors expect to be criticized for their activist stand, but argued their political opinion is based on solid scientific research, including major reports by the Institute of Medicine.

“We had no control over the timing of publication,” Wilper said. “We began this process two years go.”
 etourdi77

Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 11
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 8:00:55 AM
The co authors of the study are Members of PHNP..of course you know what they want...Universal Health Care..
Solid Scientific evidence really? They can't even explain their findings...they just came up with numbers that supported their cause..

this "Study" is suspect....One study done by Pro-UHC group really doesn't prove anything...
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 12
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 8:26:26 AM

this "Study" is suspect....One study done by Pro-UHC group really doesn't prove anything...
The study was done long before Universal Health Care became such an issue ... and was updated using the latest figures from the National Center for Health Statistics.

I was asked where I got my information and I provided a source. It's nothing new that there will always be selfish people out there who just don't care no matter how solid the proof is that people are dieing because they don't have health insurance.

I just wonder if these selfish people would feel differently if they personally even lost a fraction of those who are dieing. What if within one year they lost more than 10 members of their family and/or friends because those people just couldn't get health care? I just wonder how they'd feel then?

Of course there will always be people who just don't care about anyone but themself. We see evidence of that in here in the POF forums all the time.
 etourdi77

Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 13
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 9:52:15 AM
That may be true ..but when you post a study to support your position and the study is done by people who are advocates for your position then the results are suspect...UHC has been an issue since Clinton....
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 14
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 10:11:48 AM

but when you post a study to support your position and the study is done by people who support your position then the results are suspect
The study was not done by people who support my position. See Message 8 ...
Physicians for a National Health Program is calling attention to a just released–and very shocking–Harvard study that found…
The study was done by Harvard and PNHP is calling attention to it. That group merely used the results of the study to bring attention to the current issue they support. It's the same as what I did ... I used the result of the study to draw attention to the position I support.

I guess if a person doesn't trust Harvard ... then they're likely not going to trust anything any doctor might say ... eh?

Regardless ... there is more and more support for public option and even though I'm more in favor of "single payer" ... I could settle for public option over nothing at all. And I think more and more people are realizing that. More and more people are realizing that even the worst insurance in the world is better than none.
 hard starboard

Joined: 6/21/2008
Msg: 15
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 10:23:49 AM

Remember you heard it here. The current bill will never pass.

But they tried with good intentions. That's all that really matters.
 etourdi77

Joined: 7/7/2009
Msg: 16
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 10:26:01 AM
Nope, look at the names of the people who co-authored the study they are members of PHNP...If Harvard did the study and the people who were in charge of the Study were not advocates for Universal Health Care but were people who had no interests in the outcome the study would be credible as it is it is the results are not Credible...

I would settle for real reform....not a BS plan set in place to use as a catalyst for an eventual total Government takeover of the Health Care System
 jack-d-ripper

Joined: 2/25/2008
Msg: 17
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 10:51:51 AM
.


But they tried with good intentions. That's all that really matters.



What really matters is the HUNDREDS of MILLIONS spent and the 3000 PLUS hired to spread the Corporate Message and screw the Middle Class...........

Its all about $$$$$$$$$$$$. Protecting American Values.............

.................Bend over the Premiums are going up Not YOUR PAY.............

.................Death Panels.... Commie Marxist ... Fascist ......

 2fuzy

Joined: 3/12/2006
Msg: 18
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 11:04:48 AM

Nope, look at the names of the people who co-authored the study they are members of PHNP...If Harvard did the study and the people who were in charge of the Study were not advocates for Universal Health Care but were people who had no interests in the outcome the study would be credible as it is it is the results are not Credible...

I would settle for real reform....not a BS plan set in place to use as a catalyst for an eventual total Government takeover of the Health Care System


one can find a study or set of stats to support any position the tobacco industry found science monkeys for 40 years to sell out and say cigarettes where harmless when any fool knows better

what I find more compelling is I have never seen a thread on here with Canadians or Brits complaining about their health care or have I seen it be a campaign issues with there politicians or ever personally met anyone who was on the **** about it whatsoever
we seem to do way more complaining about it then they do
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 19
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Support broad in U.S. for public healthcare option
Posted: 10/29/2009 11:53:26 AM

I would settle for real reform....not a BS plan set in place to use as a catalyst for an eventual total Government takeover of the Health Care System
I have no problem with a Government Health Care System. I had it while living in Germany and it was wonderful. If people are against a Government Health Care System then let's hope they have the money to get private health care because they sure won't want to use Medicare ... right?

… look at the names of the people who co-authored the study they are members of PHNP...If Harvard did the study and the people who were in charge of the Study were not advocates for Universal Health Care but were people who had no interests in the outcome the study would be credible as it is it is the results are not Credible...
I see … so just because you are against some sort of Universal Health Care … these particular physicians probably "doctored" the results of the study to suit their needs.

Amazing … they were probably also "doctoring" the statistics they collected between 1986 and 1994 as well? Likewise the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) as well as the Institute of Medicine (from 2002) no doubt also "doctored" the statistics they collected (which in turn were based on a pioneering 1993 study of health insurance and mortality).

Soooo … all those people got together and conspired to "doctor" the results of the study (back then and now) just so they could prove that 45,000 Americans are dieing every year related to the lack of health coverage.

http://www.harvardscience.harvard.edu/medicine-health/articles/new-study-finds-45000-deaths-annually-linked-lack-health-coverage

New study finds 45,000 deaths annually linked to lack of health coverage

Uninsured, working-age Americans have 40 percent higher death risk than privately insured counterparts

September 17, 2009

David Cecere
Cambridge Health Alliance

Nearly 45,000 annual deaths are associated with lack of health insurance, according to a new study published online today by the American Journal of Public Health. That figure is about two and a half times higher than an estimate from the Institute of Medicine (IOM) in 2002.

The study, conducted at Harvard Medical School and Cambridge Health Alliance, found that uninsured, working-age Americans have a 40 percent higher risk of death than their privately insured counterparts, up from a 25 percent excess death rate found in 1993.

“The uninsured have a higher risk of death when compared to the privately insured, even after taking into account socioeconomics, health behaviors, and baseline health,” said lead author Andrew Wilper, M.D., who currently teaches at the University of Washington School of Medicine. “We doctors have many new ways to prevent deaths from hypertension, diabetes, and heart disease — but only if patients can get into our offices and afford their medications.”

The study, which analyzed data from national surveys carried out by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), assessed death rates after taking into account education, income, and many other factors, including smoking, drinking, and obesity. It estimated that lack of health insurance causes 44,789 excess deaths annually.

Previous estimates from the IOM and others had put that figure near 18,000. The methods used in the current study were similar to those employed by the IOM in 2002, which in turn were based on a pioneering 1993 study of health insurance and mortality.

Deaths associated with lack of health insurance now exceed those caused by many common killers such as kidney disease. An increase in the number of uninsured and an eroding medical safety net for the disadvantaged likely explain the substantial increase in the number of deaths, as the uninsured are more likely to go without needed care. Another factor contributing to the widening gap in the risk of death between those who have insurance and those who do not is the improved quality of care for those who can get it.

The researchers analyzed U.S. adults under age 65 who participated in the annual National Health and Nutrition Examination Surveys (NHANES) between 1986 and 1994. Respondents first answered detailed questions about their socioeconomic status and health and were then examined by physicians. The CDC tracked study participants to see who died by 2000.

The study found a 40 percent increased risk of death among the uninsured. As expected, death rates were also higher for males (37 percent increase), current or former smokers (102 percent and 42 percent increases), people who said that their health was fair or poor (126 percent increase), and those who examining physicians said were in fair or poor health (222 percent increase).

Steffie Woolhandler, study co-author, professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School, and a primary care physician at Cambridge Health Alliance, noted: “Historically, every other developed nation has achieved universal health care through some form of nonprofit national health insurance. Our failure to do so means that all Americans pay higher health care costs, and 45,000 pay with their lives.”

“The Institute of Medicine, using older studies, estimated that one American dies every 30 minutes from lack of health insurance,” remarked David Himmelstein, study co-author, associate professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School, and a primary care physician at Cambridge Health Alliance. “Even this grim figure is an underestimate — now one dies every 12 minutes.”

Other authors include Karen E. Lasser, Danny McCormick, David H. Bor, and David U. Himmelstein. The study was supported by a National Service Research Award.
 pirateheaven

Joined: 5/11/2008
Msg: 20
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 11:19:39 AM
I just found out that the State " Opt Out" option is a smoke screen. States will be able to Opt Out of the plan BUT they still have to pay the govt the SAME amount as if they were IN the plan.

If a bill has to pass by subterfuge, then it is a bad bill to begin with. In addition, a 2,000 page bill in itself is an issue. How many pay backs and buried nonsense does it contain?

http://www.anncoulter.org/
 jack-d-ripper

Joined: 2/25/2008
Msg: 21
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 11:57:28 AM
.




Give a real source .... States Paying....

Not Ann Coulter.... she makes crap up..........

States receive Fed Funds for The Program?

Just like Medicaid, a state can opt out. Arizona did not join the Medicaid program until 1982....

Why don't the Red States drop out of Medicaid?

I sure wouldn't mind.... Blue states support Retirement Havens like Florida and Arizona....

And I would not miss Texas, & S>C>>>>>>>>>>>>

.
 pirateheaven

Joined: 5/11/2008
Msg: 22
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 12:10:19 PM
Support of govt healthcare drops to 45%

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/september_2009/health_care_reform
 cotter

Joined: 10/17/2005
Msg: 23
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 12:14:53 PM

I just found out that the State " Opt Out" option is a smoke screen. States will be able to Opt Out of the plan BUT they still have to pay the govt the SAME amount as if they were IN the plan.
Do you have a more trustworthy source?

Even if that's the case, that would be fine with me because then the states might not be inclined to opt out and neglect their residents ... take away their chance to get affordable medical care.

It's difficult to imagine that a state would do that ... wouldn't they want their residents healthy and able to work and pay taxes?


Just like Medicaid, a state can opt out. Arizona did not join the Medicaid program until 1982...
You can't compare "Medicaid" to anything Federal ... because it's two different sources.

Medicaid money is generated from local tax dollars ... it's not funded by the federal government. There are guidelines but if a state/county/city can't generate the tax dollars it takes to offer Medicaid there will likely be no Medicaid ... unless they raise taxes.

Medicaid benefits differ from county to county in states as well. Medicaid can cut back to nothing more than emergency medical care in one county because there are too many cases to provide for but could be a full program in a neighboring county because they have hardly any cases to take care of.

Why don't the Red States drop out of Medicaid?
That surprises me given that the conservatives don't want the uninsured to have medical help. Maybe Medicaid in the red states don't offer medical benefits?
 jack-d-ripper

Joined: 2/25/2008
Msg: 24
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 12:35:34 PM
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Medicaid receives ...Half ? ......its funds from the Fed.

Changes were made 90's ...The states were allowed to set Guidelines. They now get a Block of funds...

So there is no standard... a single man 19-64 is sol in most states...

However the States can opt out... Hi way funds the same....


Medicare isa National Single Payer. The Public Option would be set up like Medicaid State Control. State Controlled....






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 hard starboard

Joined: 6/21/2008
Msg: 25
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Subterfuge In the Govt Healthcare Bill
Posted: 10/30/2009 3:41:45 PM
You can get (and read) the House bill here...
http://www.tribune-democrat.com/specialsections/local_story_218111445.html
Trick or Treat?
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