| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 3:34:25 AM | What are your thoughts on the recent talk in the media by people touting a 0% alcohol limit for all drivers?...
how would it change your behavior if such changes were made?..
would you read the label on your mouthwash brand a bit closer..for eg...no cough mixture before work.... 
back off on the vanilla essence in the sponge cake?... no port trifle after Xmas dinner....or liquer mints.... . noooooooooooooo  ...
.... Pubs will be dead in the bush if you can't even stop in for one beer with your mates after work....... or anywhere without public transport/taxis/pub busses....
how would things change in your street with 0% ?... | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 4:20:50 AM | Means i...gulp...might have to walk the 30 meters to a mates place instead of using the scooter.
0% limit means the start of a totalitarian(yeah i know) state where the government controls all social activities and uses the police force as a means of controlling the public masses to ensure civil obedience.Anarchy will rein,revolution will follow,civil disobedience will be the order of the day and we'll desend into oblivion.Seen that in a movie some where.
Drink driving is a serious problem.Lowering the BAL to zero i can't see having an effect on the road toll which is the reasoning for such a measure.The DUI's who drive whilst in that state are still going to drive and a zero limit wont change that.The problem is the repeat offenders who continue to drive even when disqualified and drivers who have multiple DUI convictions.Lowering the BAL will penalize the drivers who go out to dinner and have a glass of wine or beer with dinner.I think a lot more rational study needs to go int this process and not be used as a stop go measure to combat the rising road toll.It seems like a desperate measure by a police commissioner and a government who have no idea on effective ways to lower the road toll. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 4:41:54 AM | Pubs will have to pick up locals and drop them off to get any business... expensive for a one pub country town....
though a lot of places have a club/pub bus now... it will become a must for those off the train/bus lines in the cities...
not everyone will be able to use/afford taxis for a few beers in town....
there'll be no point in just having a few to stay under 05,eh?..... you won't ever be driving home anyway..... Pi$$ ornnnn....  ....or you'll drink more at home,.. again no need for limits ... drinking visitors will have to stay or they'll sue if you let them on the road after one light beer,,,...
.... it might help the road toll... but not the alcohol problem... | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 4:54:46 AM | .... it might help the road toll... but not the alcohol problem...
Have you heard the latest road toll statistics? ¼ of fatal accidents are due to drink driving. That means that ¾ of them are caused by the sober drivers. Freaking scary – those sober drivers are the problem - get them off the road! [Don’t you just love stats – can twist them anyway you like]
What are your thoughts on the recent talk in the media by people touting a 0% alcohol limit for all drivers?...
how would it change your behavior if such changes were made?..
It wouldn’t because at .05 you pretty much can’t drink and drive anyway, especially if you are a female and are restricted to one an hour. The difference would be going from one to none. Pretty much a moot point. Unless you know which side roads to go down of course.
would you read the label on your mouthwash brand a bit closer....
Mouthwash? Who needs that when the blue water in the toilet does as good a job and is heaps cheaper? | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 5:16:57 AM | As a damn near non-drinker it wouldn't affect me... {even the last two lots of beer in the fridge has gone past use by date }
However, for the general joe public, I don't believe this would be a fair ruling... too many chances for error. From what I recall - as said in original post, mouthwash, cough syrup, even sugar and other 'incidentals' can affect the readings.
Those who are going to try and buck the system, will continue to drink, touting that they'll take the 'chance'. Supposedly not enough constabulary to police the situation so it's a fair chance one won't come across a breath testing unit too often if at all. {I haven't been through one in near on over 20 years}
Nup, I can't see it coming to standardisation, especially not nationwide. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 7:12:04 AM | Mouthwash? Who needs that when the blue water in the toilet does as good a job and is heaps cheaper?
Damn right! And, by the way, looking hot in your new pic there, myforumsite! You'll be beating the guys off with a stick hey?
I beat them off with sticks too. And occasionally baseball bats, shovels, crowbars... and I've just purchased my very first taser!
Basically, I agree with soulmate...
Time to start dating a designater driver..
Or, I'll just drink more when I'm out so that I'm so rat-faced that I'll go home with anyone who'll have me. Then I'll participate in a slobbering drunken fuk, pass out, wake up, puke in their toilet (if they are lucky), go back to bed to see who I've done, face the horror of my inebriated choice, retrieve whatever items of my clothing I can find off the floor, lampshade and ceiling fan... and then slink out the door to take the long walk of shame back to my car.
Coz by then I'd be sober, right? Zero%. And safety is of paramount importance to me. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 8:37:17 AM | Living on a farm 20km from town has pretty much made it zero% for me already anyway. Its a LONG walk home from the pub,trust me,Ive done it....and more than once Ill admit!
Its strange the way that 20km doesnt seem that far when you stumble out of a pub in the middle of the night,but it really doesnt. And at the time it doesnt seem that far either,theres only 2 steps to getting home.
Step 1. Put one foot in front of the other
Step 2. repeat Step 1
Geez,your legs do feel it in the morning though! lol
The country town point is interesting. I grew up in a place with a population of about 1000 and a lot of those people lived on farms 20-30km out of town. In those days the coppers had the attitude that if you were gonna come into town for a few drinks on the weekend and take it easy on the way home,theyd turn a blind eye,but if you were planning on getting plastered and driving like an idiot,theyd come down like a ton of bricks on you. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 1:17:46 PM | Absolute crap!.Fella goes to pub after work to see some mates.Having no intention to have a few beers he does.He leaves his car in the pub carpark and gets a taxi home.Rings up mate in the morning to pick him up so he can pick up his car at the pub on the way to work.Fella drives out of carpark and is tested by our friends in blue and records a BAL of 0.01%.What happens then? Loss of licence and possibly loss of job?.If this happened to me i would mount a legal challenge and claim that my ability to drive a motor vehicle was not impaired at a BAL of 0.01% so what right has the legal system got to fine me or cancel my licence.So a 0.00% for everyone i think would open up a can of worms.
As well i quite often call into my local watering hole after work and have 2 pots which is 2 standard drinks so i never have any more than that if i have my car as i know i will be over 0.05% if i do.So if they make it 0.00% for everyone does that mean local watering hole will have to shut down?. It is easy to plan your social life if you like a few drinks.Just don't include driving in your plans. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 2:04:26 PM | I for one will probably have my hours cut severely as I work in a ' Sporting Club' -
We trade till 2.30am Friday & Saturday nites and until 12.30am the rest of the week -
Our Club has a 'courtesy bus' and most people are responsible but I do notice it is the Women who tend to take the risk of 'drink driving' - We do ring the Police if we believe a Patron has had one too many and gets into their vechicle to drive home and we practise Responsible Alcohol as per Govt guidelines and have attained Certification Certificates which is a requirement to work in the Hospitality Industry - 'I remember the good old days when one was responsible for their own behaviour' | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 3:08:43 PM | I better solution would be drink driver tests.
you get your license the normal way in a driving test.
then you drink as much as you feel comfortable and re take the test..if you pass the test at .08 or .10 that your limit stamped on your drivers license.
pretty sure its .08 in a lot of US states and NZ.
courts are flooded with the just overs .06 .07 | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 3:44:42 PM |
Then you drink as much as you feel comfortable and re take the test..if you pass the test at .08 or .10 that your limit stamped on your drivers license
lol I'm thinking it might take several attempts to get just (not) pisssed enough, also wondering if reverse parks may infact be simpler pisssed | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 4:00:04 PM | next will be a push for 21 yr old drinking..... the wowsers are taking over...
fair dinkum. o5 is so low a level that if you can't drive safely with 05 ..you shouldn't have a licence... ....
I was talking to a mate last night and suggested that we drive test everyone at 05.. and if they can't manage that.... they can't have too many control skills.... or concentration levels.... or a will to survive.....
a local mates' brother doesn't drink.. so if we are going out for a night I slip him some dough to drive us there and come and pick us up, ... way to go... | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/6/2009 8:37:54 PM | As much as I am reluctant to jump on the bandwagon full of those stamping their feet in defence of this Aussie image that dictates we can't have a good time, relax, or be cool, without drinking alcohol...my first thought was that, well it does sound a bit harsh to go to zero. But then I thought, well for me, it really depends on whether it will actually make a difference to road safety or not. That is the relevant point that I would base my opinion on, rather than worrying about inconvenience, cost of taxis, and other peripheral issues. For me, preserving lives would always take priority over preserving "Aussie pub culture". If it harms people, it's a bad culture to have and might be time we evolved past it. So it's that "if" that probably should be the bottom line of any subsequent decision.
Traffic Accident Commission figures obtained by the Sunday Herald Sun show drivers with a blood-alcohol reading between zero and .05 were involved in accidents that killed 39 Victorians in the past five years.
^^^ So...driving with a level of under .05 hasn't contributed hugely to the road toll, but to deny it has contributed at all is probably a bit head in the sand. I'm not sure any of us would be comfortable saying to those 39 families...well yeah we could lower the limit but the thing is, it's just a bit difficult to organise designated drivers and taxis, and it's the Aussie way to like a drink on the way home from work. I'm sure they'd understand though. So would this guy I reckon...
Crash survivor Andy Harrison, 47, suffered a permanent brain injury, two broken legs and shoulder injuries when was involved in an accident with a driver who said she had consumed only one drink in 1992.
I guess we don't know what lies in wait for us and any of us could be the next Andy Harrison...or any of us could be the next driver who only had one drink who causes someone else to become the next Andy Harrison. Luck...timing. But, surely we can appreciate the desire to perhaps seek to lower the risks that do seem somewhat within our control? Basically, less drivers with alcohol in them = less risk of being/causing Andy Harrison. Doesn't sound so bad to me. Certainly I am not sure it deserves to be represented as some sort of evil attempt to strip us of our rights. If it comes to a choice about rights, then I'd sooner the right to have the highest possible chance of surviving the trip home in one piece, than the right to have a drink before I drive.
Road safety expert Ian Johnston, former head of Monash University Accident Research Centre and current member of the World Bank's Global Road Safety Facility, said a debate on the limit was important.
"The lower you have the legal limit, the more clearly you are saying (to drivers) you must not drive after drinking," he said. "There is evidence to show that there are changes in performance at .02."
The shift would bring Victoria into line with Norway, Sweden and Poland which have .02 limits.*** and excuse my interjection but refer to next quote box too in relation to these countries
But it would be at odds with Britain and many US states that have .08 limits.
The reduced limit is seen as an ideal model because international research shows drivers' reaction time and decision making first become affected when they reach .02.
The new limit would be a further tightening of drink-driving rules introduced last month that allow police to immediately suspend drivers found with a blood-alcohol content of .10. It would be the first change to drink-driving laws for full-licence drivers since the .05 laws were introduced in 1986.
The Alfred hospital's emergency and trauma director, Prof Peter Cameron, said a drop to .02 could save up to 10 lives a year and might reduce the severity of serious injuries.
"It would make a difference to accidents. Less than .05 can have an effect on reaction time," he said,
Prof Jon Currie, director of addiction medicine at St Vincent's Hospital, said there was evidence to show dropping the legal limit to .02 would have an effect on the road toll.
".02 is the point where a driver starts to become impaired by alcohol," he said.
"The only problem is that if there is resistance from the public at the limit."
Commissioner Atkinson says Queensland should do better when it comes to road safety."The best countries in the world in terms of the rate for the road toll and the rate is probably the best measure - that's the number of deaths each year per 100,000 of the population - the best countries in the world are the Scandinavian countries like Denmark, Norway and Sweden, and their rate is about four," he said. (and these are the guys with a .02 limit)
"The AMA thinks it's high time we had a debate on this issue of blood alcohol and driving," he said.
"We know that the statistics show that even one drink, even low levels of alcohol increase your risk of a fatal crash.
"So between 0.02 and 0.04, which is less than the legal limit, you have a 1.4 times risk of having a single-vehicle fatal crash.
"Between 0.05 and 0.09 that risk is 11 times."
So clearly, and of course, the higher the reading goes, the higher the danger... but does that negate the risk of those driving with lower readings just because, "it could be worse"?? Why would we so strongly resist the idea of being safer on the roads?
I haven't researched widely, but based on the few things I've read I'd probably say a .02 limit seems like the go. Maybe they are talking zero initially for the purpose of getting people outraged, and then when they suggest .02 it will seem like a good compromise, and therefore will be more easily embraced than if they just outright said .02. Oldest trick in the book, and let the outrage continue...
Of course none of this 'potential danger' stuff applies to those who can drink and still drive like a legend....who clearly fall into the same category as those who drink and become legends on the dance floor/karaoke mike/with members of the opposite sex. Just ask 'em...they'll tell ya. 
(Sources of quotes: ABC and Herald Sun) | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/7/2009 1:05:19 AM | All the non drinkers.. clearly state.. you don't drink and are eligable designated drivers..
your dating prospects will go up..
but of course.. non drinkers,.... usually can't stand being around drinkers.. for lengthy periods.. because the chemical difference is acutely obvious to them..
damn.. sometimes... you can put...2 opposites together.. thinking ..it should work out perfect..like
but sadly... the reason they are opposites.. is predominately.. why they are not compatable..
but don't listen to me.. ive had 2 and half beers..
at home....
Personally I stopped going out.. at night.. years ago.... if I want a couple of drinks I stay home.... s
so Op.. living in the bush.. yep.. have to stay at mates places .. if I go to a party.. don't bother with the pub.. cause... unless I book a room...
can't drink..
So pubs are out.... except for a quick call in.. one beer.. a chat.. then go..
However I am all for zero tolerance for young drivers...
3reasons..
1. their brain dosen't stop forming/developing until they are 24..
2. their experience in driving/concentration...
3. learning to drive.. plus speed.. plus immaturity.. etc..
should never be mixed..
And yes every rule has an exception.. ie..kids can learn to operate machinary.. like tracters/paddock bashers etc... or be more mature than average etc,,
but statistically?..... I want to see young kids .. under 20.. get through those phases..
peace | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/7/2009 3:08:30 AM | Good post Naamah,i read a lot of the sources you quoted today and they did make me stop and have more of a think about it.Your probaly right in that they are buttering us up for the ol one two trick about zero to 02.Some of the statistics suprised me in relation to 02 to 04 range of driving impairment.Would of thought 0 to 05 would have hardly any effect on driving risk.
Thinking about it,ok first up i am a convicted DUI'er,some 19 years ago and it did involve taking a girl to the drive thru to get her more alcohol.Might of had something else on my mind other than alcohol.As i have a HR license,most of the time i'm on a 02 limit anyway and get differing views on if that applies at all times or just in a work sense.Even QLD transport give me alternating interpretations.
Jumping on my band wagon again.My first responce was bl00dy government trying to stop me having a few drinks with friends.Would i not go and visit friends cos of a lower limit.Nah,i'd just invite myself to stay.Still think that all this is about a government and police force that are lacking in forsight and reponding to the sprialing roadtoll.Maybe measures should of been enacted before it reached the level it is.
Agree that more rational debate is needed and while we're at it,look at other measures concerning the drinking and driving debate.Still feel that a real problem is the repeat offenders and driving while disqualified drivers who flaut their nose at laws and continue on their way to taking out some one innocent.So if we're talking about dropping the limit,lets have a debate about how to curb these people as well.Know that this thread is about zero limit and the effect on social life as we know it.But feel that if the debate is about zero alcohol limit,lets not just pick one issue of drink driving but open up the whole issue of drink driving as a whole.Maybe its time for alcohol locks for convicted DUI'ers and confiscation of cars for disqualified drivers and confront the problem that is DUI.
So back on my band wagon again.Keep hearing the same old thing with governments.Most of the time they're reactive and not proactive about the problems that society today faces.Thought for a long time that maybe it's about time we have a zero limit for the amount state pollies we need. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/7/2009 3:12:01 PM |
The Alfred hospital's emergency and trauma director, Prof Peter Cameron, said a drop to .02 could save up to 10 lives a year and might reduce the severity of serious injuries.
%25 of all fatal car accidents are drink driver related.
%75 of all fatal car accidents are sober driver related.
%100 of all fatal car accidents are CAR related.
why stop at saving 10 lives, we could easily save 1464 lives a year if we used cardboard boxes with paper plates glued to them for wheels just like they have on playschool.
(and zero carbon emissions) meep meep !!
dad my feet are sore are we there yet | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/7/2009 5:45:43 PM | ^^^ You make a good point. Unless we are willing to take that ultimate step and get rid of cars altogether then any attempt to modify any other aspect of our driving laws and behaviours under the pretext of "reducing road fatalities" is just laughable, and clearly not worthwhile even considering. Cos if we roolly roolly meant to stop road deaths we'd stay off the roads hey? And using your same logic, the only thing we need to do to reduce child molestation from occurring is to all stop having children...no other measures need to be taken, or even considered, until we're willing to take that step and show we really do mean business when it comes to stopping child abuse.
Where ya been Caves? I've missed tinkering with your head.  | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/9/2009 1:39:28 AM |
It wouldn’t because at .05 you pretty much can’t drink and drive anyway, especially if you are a female and are restricted to one an hour. The difference would be going from one to none. Pretty much a moot point. Unless you know which side roads to go down of course.
You sure about that. I have had up to 5 schooners in a night before 11pm had a great time getting the buzz. Stopped drinking sobered up by 2am. Drove home got tested at an RBT with a BAC of 0.00. The policewoman thought she was on to a winner when I advised her I'd had 5 schooners.
You can have a quite a surprising amount of alcohol followed up by a couple hours of water & coke and still be well under the limit. I judge my soberness by eyesight cos mine is very bad naturally.
Zero tolerance won't solve anything the accidents involving alcohol generally involve people with BAC levels well above even the current legal limit so I don't see how a zero tolerance approach is going to stop them from driving. | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/9/2009 3:13:21 AM | I haven't drank beer for over 15 yrs... so a drink at the pub would be a bourbon.... or a woody can with some pot glasses of ice to spread it out over an hour or so....
and get to socialise at the only pub in town with your friends.... a very human experience...
until the "cowboys" started doing laps around the pub wild west style and over the years the pub became dead as a doornail for the casual social drinking townsfolk.... just not worth the drama of going to town on a thursday night for the big footy club meat raffles ...
I don't drink and drive "on the bitumen" anymore..... though after dropping mates off home in the bush..often have a few with them at their place then drive the few k's of dirt road home... almost never seeing another car.... roo's are more of a worry...
... that sort of DD will always go on in the country.... rules or no rules....
... and police hanging around on lonely back roads won't help the most of accidents on the highways and busy urban roads....
and what of the 60%+ of "good" drivers causing mayhem?... hard to quantify and breath test stupidity,eh?....
low level drinkers in a drinking culture are easier targets and skapegoats,I guess.......
one would think habitual "sober" speeding drivers are more dangerous... than someone with a few under their belt obeying the road rules blending in with highway traffic caught in one of those blitzes......... then held up as some danger to the community...
Zero% would unfairly "trap" a lot of well meaning good drivers at home.... to drink their sorrows away.....
a bloke who might have had a few on the way home to be sociable, lined up some work,and left it at that..... will now bring the grog home to drink if he has a thirst for a few...... and might not worry about staying under .05....
is that it?... keeping people at home and off the roads?... selling more takeaways and employing less bar staff?... | |
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| ZERO% alcohol for all drivers.... how would that effect your social life?
Posted: 11/9/2009 3:29:14 AM | Incorrect regarding speeding it makes up less then 1% of fatalities in Australia & since dropping the legal limit in NT from unlimited to 130kmph the road toll has increased significantly.
There is nothing unsafe about exceeding the speed limit on a dead road in the early hours of the morning. Its the d*ckheads who weave in & out of traffic in peak out that are the hazard.
While the overall stats for alcohol aren't too bad something more alarming is that on a friday or saturday night the stats for alcohol related incidents is a figure around 70%. I know this as it was in my L's test and I answered way lower then that as it sounded absurd. | |
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