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| Condoning Atheism.
Posted: 11/6/2009 6:51:09 PM | Some Jehovahs Witnesses recently left a copy of bible stories for children on my doorstep.
So i thought okkkk, i guess thats nice of them, spirituality is good for children, even though i have recently took initiation into the Dianic tradition and left Abrahamic religion behind, and normally do not care for the door to door religion salespeople.
So i handed my daughter the book, and told her why not read it out loud to her little brother, so they can both enjoy it.
Silly me, i thought thew book would be filled with sweet little things like "Jesus loves the children of the word" and stuff like that.
So my daughter approached me warily, book in hand, and said that the book is scary and she doesnt like it and that it will make Charles cry, she looked like she wanted to cry herself.
So i went through the book, it was filed with SO CALLED CHILDRENS STORIES of rape, murder, violence, torture, snakes, jealousy, bigotry, hatred, and sending out a big ole message that anyone who doesnt believe in one rigid way is "BAD" and thus deserves whatever atrocities they get.
So i told he her book is just a fiction book, and a very bad evil book at that.
She asked me seriously "I thought God loved people", i was like yeah i thought so to,
She asked "do we HAVE to believe in him"?
So i told her of course not.
She says will i go to hell?
I told her an atheist doesnt believe in hell thus thats a moot point.
She asked if she can be an atheist, i told her of course she can.
She seems happy with this.
My child is not A SHEEP. A leader, not a follower. Couldnt be MORE proud. If next week she wants to be a Buddhist, Jew, Wiccan, or Taoist, or go back to Catholicism, thats fine also. Long as nobody is sacrificing animals or hurting others, do as ye will.
Oh boy im getting a backlash though.
Is condoing atheism really all that awful?
I wolud prefer her to take a more spiritual path, but i amnot her and she is not me, thus i give my loving permission for her to believe in whe wants to.
I have tried to discuss this with family and close friends, but ended up bombarded by everyone from my mother in law from from the teacher to her estranged bio-father on how im poisioning her by telling her it is ok tio be an atheist.
IMO, the bible stories she has been exposed to are far more poisionious.
Yeah every kid loves a good tale of rape and murder before bed.
Sweet dreams honey!!!!!
Why not just pass out porn and the Satanic bible while at it/ couldnt be any WORSE than what the Christian soldiers have passed out.
Does anyone else think the bible is a disgusting book not for for children whatsoever? | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 7:09:09 PM | I have issues with the bible and organized religion. God(s) does not force things on people, people force things on people. I think the bible is like that game "telephone" kids play, as the years have passed it has become skewed and reconstructed how people want it to be. I personally believe in a higher power that has given me the gift of free-will to choose how I want to celebrate it.
I dont think your daughter is going to end up an atheist, I think the book just scared her. I also dont think its wrong to tell her that if she wants to be an atheist she can be. Kids want to be lots of things and dont understand most of the things they want to be. Hell how many times have you heard a kid say when they grow up they want to be some kind of animal, or a mermaid?
Im studying religion right now, some religions have thousands of gods and people get to choose which one they pray to.
I think if you had told her she couldnt be an atheist that would have been worse, you cant shove God down someones throat and expect them to swallow. | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 7:27:37 PM |
So i went through the book, it was filed with SO CALLED CHILDRENS STORIES of rape, murder, violence, torture, snakes, jealousy, bigotry, hatred, and sending out a big ole message that anyone who doesnt believe in one rigid way is "BAD" and thus deserves whatever atrocities they get. Pretty much par the course on Christian theology. You mean they preach something different? 
Your daughter is to be commended for following the way she feels and not what she is erroneosly led to believe. I don't think you are codoning 'atheism' perse. It seems she (and you) want and desire to believe in a higher power, but choose not believe in the 'higher power' that is taught by and through Christians (JW specifically). You and her were in your absolute right to reject such 'scary' indoctrination as it is not even the teachings of JC, but of people who have decided to give their 'perfect' god all the bad sides of human folly and free will - murderer, vengence, punishment, judgement, bigotry, rigidity, etc.
JC was crazy but not scary. He had a lot of great messages that could go over well without scaring folks and condemning them to hell for their beliefs (or lack thereof). My favorite - judge not lest he be judge. Let those who are without sin cast the first stone. Very well to be practiced ('practiced' being the operative word) by all. | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 7:40:48 PM | Great perspective ladies.
Though i admit i taught her the word atheist, and told her to proudly use the word with no shame if she doesnt believe. | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 8:10:24 PM | | You could always approach it from the perspective of agnosticism. That's kind of how I approach it, though I've not yet had to impart any of that on my daughter. If/when she starts asking questions about those sorts of things, that's likely the approach I will use. Atheism is so dead endish. Agnosticism is a little more open ended. It's a way of believing whilst not having any doctrines that encourage you to hate. | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 8:16:46 PM | I think that it is important for people to believe in something. What that is, though, is completely up to them. There is right now a silly cult for a flying spaghetti monster. (look it up. It's real) I think that one is supposed to be more of a joke on organized religion in general though.
Whatever you choose to believe, I think what is important is your personal relationship with whatever that higher power may be. Whether it is Allah, God, The Crone, The Green Man and even, (god forbid I should actually say this one) Satan, I think the important part is that relationship. It is a very personal thing, and I think everyone's take is going to vary a little bit. There are too many people that assume they know the best and only way. And the only people that can actually tell us what is after death are already dead, so they aren't going to be doing much communicating.
You can read the Bible all you want, but that does not necessarily mean you believe.
I wouldn't recommend teaching her atheism specifically. But I would make sure she can make the choice for herself. Let her believe in something, even a flying spaghetti monster.
Religious beliefs offer hope to people that there is a reason for this miserable existence we have on Earth, hope that there is a reason for all the suffering people go through. | |
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Posted: 11/6/2009 10:16:34 PM | I have to agree with Valkyriehjr. I am also not a huge believer in organized religion or a book that was written by MEN two thousand years ago to scare the uneducated masses into compliance.. but I digress. lol
I went to an Anglican Church for several years; my daughter and I were baptised there because I wanted to belong to something and they were a good group of people. The Anglican diosese ended up closing our parish down because we were small and not making any money. I realized then that organized religion is like every other business in the world.. their bottom line is what goes into the collection plate.
However, I do believe that we are all a part of a greater "something". I haven't broached the subject of religion too much with my daughter because I know my beliefs aren't going to necessarily reflect hers. She'll make her own decisions in life regarding that.
I feel that, as Valkyriehjr states, teaching Athiesm might not give your child the hope they need that something bigger than them exists. Depending on her age, its probably okay for her to have her own views.. but help her to be open minded. Like organized religion.. their way isn't the only way. | |
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Posted: 11/7/2009 4:55:07 AM | There was one Hallowe'en when my kids were much younger where a house was giving out mini comic books. I thought this was quite unique and I was really impressed... until I read them.
According to these, Harry Potter is evil and if you read his books or watch his movies, you'll go to hell... same with Sabrina the Teenage Witch and other various fictional things including Disney. *Ok, Disney I get... but Harry and Sabrina?* 
I was amazed at the audacity of that family to push their belief on another person... if Hallowe'en is so evil, don't participate. Easy Peasy huh?
Well, being the level-headed person I am...  I decided to confront the family. So I went to a friend's house and got him and his old handy-dandy copy of the Satanic Bible to promote their word. (BTW... I've read a decent portion of the Satanic Bible - I would prefer that to those comic books for my kids to read - it wasn't bad in the least.)
For some reason they weren't interested in hearing me try to promote that religion...
I've raised my children in the manner of the Roman Catholic religion but in a way that they understood that this was simply one choice that they could make. I've also raised them to be tolerant and even curious of other religions in the event that they find one which is better suited to their wants/needs in their lives. As for atheism, I would prefer that to a religion filled with vitriol at the slightest transgression into sin...
Seriously... how happy can these people be when even a simple pleasure will send them into the pits of hellfire and damnation? And if they happen to be right... well, at least I have a decent stock of marshmallows to make use of the fires... | |
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Posted: 11/7/2009 5:29:27 AM | Q: Is condoing atheism really all that awful?
A: Only if the truth is really that awful. You see sweetness, there is no god or gods. But there are lots of people that do things in the name of god. I was on the phone to Fort Hood the last other day making sure none of my friends were killed in the name of god. Not many people getting killed in the name of being an atheist and that is all ways a good thing if you ask me. | |
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Posted: 11/7/2009 9:15:21 AM |
Oh boy im getting a backlash though. From whom? It's nobody's business but your own family's what your religious beliefs/practices are.
I wolud prefer her to take a more spiritual path, but i amnot her and she is not me, thus i give my loving permission for her to believe in whe wants to. She's just a kid, she's got plenty of time to find a spiritual path if that's in her future. Just being open to allowing her to explore is more than most parents give their kids.
I have tried to discuss this with family and close friends, but ended up bombarded by everyone from my mother in law from from the teacher to her estranged bio-father on how im poisioning her by telling her it is ok tio be an atheist. Again, it's nobody's business what her religious beliefs are/aren't. If you choose to discuss those things with others though, then you can expect that they will put their beliefs into the mix as much as possible. Religion is not a "reasoned" thing though, it's a matter of faith and emotion. You and a religious person are not even speaking the same language, so reasoned discussion isn't possible. Try just saying "I respect your views, please respect mine," and leave it at that. And if they don't, then say "we have to go now, call us when you have enough respect for us to accept us for who we are."
The teacher is way out of bounds though.
(unrelated question --- I thought your daughter and her father were building a relationship, why is he the "estranged bio-father"?) | |
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Posted: 11/7/2009 3:13:01 PM | Thanks for the replies. I have had my cell phone turned off for like 2 days so it wouldnt rong off the hook. Lint, i have read the Satanic bible as well some
time ago and yes it is better than what these people are wanting our kids to read.
Lorelie, yes the teacher was out of place, it is not a private religious school so not sure why she felt compelled o call me and ask if i was "aware" that my daughter was an atheist.
My family is haraguing me, (not that they are exemplerery catholics), my jewish mother in law is afraid for her soul, and her bio-father is one of those AA born again christians, (yes they are building a relationship, but i think being absent from my first month of pregancy up to she ws 10 years old counts as being a wee tiny bit estranged), oh my husbands sister got word from mother in law no she is reciting scriptures on my voicemail.
what are they so afraid of? Losing a sheep from the pack? Why do others CARE to begin with? More room in "heaven" for them.
got my marshmallows | |
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Posted: 11/7/2009 4:02:03 PM | Funny, my kids don't perceive of the Bible as having horrible stories because we go to a church that doesn't use fear as currency and focuses on teaching children to be kind, yada, yada.
Most people whether they remain involved in a church as they grow older and are more able to make decisions doubt the existence of God, duh. That's what faith is, believing when you have no proof before you.
I don't think you have approved or disapproved of atheism, just told your daughter that she can figure things out for herself and that it is okay to believe what she believes. That is the way I have raised my children and when my daughter asked about conversion once upon a time I told her that if she finds something that gives her peace and helps her to be a better person, she should do what makes her happy and what feels right to her.
Your experience makes me laugh. My brother and sister-in-law are born again, new wave, whatever you want to call it. The kids are home schooled and only allowed to watch G rated movies with no thought to the actual content and evaluating movies by the parents. They brought a DVD to my parent's house one time, they were allowed to watch it because it was "religious" and my parents were horrified because it was apparently the film version of that little book they laid at your doorstep.
I agree with you wholeheartedly. People that choose to share those types of Bible stories with small children when there are so many that illustrate good things like those that are in the gospels. But I have never been a big fan of the hell and brimstone rather than the loving God.
My kids have friends of many different faiths, many different denominations within Christianity. My daughter in particular has learned a great deal about different faiths and her friends of other faiths have also learned from her. | |
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Posted: 11/8/2009 6:12:42 PM | Sweetness.....sounds like you are in the middle of a religious maelstrom.....all because of the bible-thumping Jehovah's......I feel for you.
I'm not a religious person either....too many people have been killed in the name of God IMO using one religious text or another to justify the killing.......
I am however a spiritual person who believes in God. I never even discussed faith or religion with my son unless he brought up the subject. Like you, I explained what my beliefs are but told him they are mine...if they feel right to him, he can share them or he can reject them and find his own, or not.
Your daughter learned a new word and she is declaring it to the world....sounds like if anything at all, what she is really getting is a lesson in keeping one's beliefs private (assuming she has any awareness of the reactions of those around her to her declaration that she is an atheist). I'm sure it will eventually blow over (or not depending on how severely religious your relatives are).
Bottom line is that they are your children and as their parent, you are permitted to teach them/guide them in any way you see fit....people can have an opinion but you know what I always say about opinions...they are like azzholes...everyone has one. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 10:26:17 AM |
Is condoing atheism really all that awful?
Nah. The world needs more Godlessness, really. 
BTW, not believing in gravity doesn't prevent you from falling, FYI.
If next week she wants to be a Buddhist, Jew, Wiccan, or Taoist, or go back to Catholicism, thats fine also.
Sounds rather unstable to me.
Why not just pass out porn and the Satanic bible while at it/ couldnt be any WORSE than what the Christian soldiers have passed out.
Yes, I think you are onto something here. Especially awful is 1 Corinthians 13, which teaches you what love is and isn't:
1 Corinthians 13 (New International Version)
Love
1If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. 3If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.
8Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part, 10but when perfection comes, the imperfect disappears. 11When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put childish ways behind me. 12Now we see but a poor reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known.
13And now these three remain: faith, hope and love. But the greatest of these is love.
Dastardly stuff. Porn is way better for the minds of children. You are so right! Thank you for your edification on this matter, of which you clearly possess total understanding and a balanced perspective. Your daughter has been spared all that "love" nonsense and will be much better for viewing your porn. Kudos for your foresight.
Sister, I am sorry the church or a wayward sinner hurt you. But don't blame God. He is love. (1 John 4:8) | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 10:33:49 AM | Openheart, I appreciate your post, truly I do. And I think that is one of the many beautiful passages that the Bible offers.
But in this case, I think Sweetness was being sarcastic in reference to the porn issue. The pamphlet/booklet/other reading material that was handed to her child was something that was not about the love of God, but about the fear and horror of He!!. The images that were presented were probably horrible images that no child needs to see at any age when being introduced to the absolute love that God is and represents. That is the stuff of nightmares and enough to turn any child away from God. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 11:30:20 AM |
The pamphlet/booklet/other reading material that was handed to her child was something that was not about the love of God, but about the fear and horror of He!!. The images that were presented were probably horrible images that no child needs to see at any age when being introduced to the absolute love that God is and represents.
That's what happens when you don't review material before handing it to your child. Same is true for letting your child watch television shows unfiltered, too.
But when a parent hates Christianity, for whatever reason, true and responsible parental care isn't going to show up in how Christian materials are represented.
It's easier to just take it out of context and blame God, then say He doesn't exist and say the Satanic Bible and porn are more edifying. Seen it a million times. Meanwhile, if the God Hater is intellectually honest and willing to converse openly, one always discovers that the person is blaming God for something He allowed to happen, or blaming Him over the wayward actions of people who claim to be Godly.
Anywho, God rocks. It's His people who have a lot learn. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 12:04:55 PM | Atheist don't blame god for anything. God is a man made idea, that is not real, un-true, a big lie, how can you blame something that is not real for anything? Not logical. Now blame what people do in the name of this big lie, well that is founded in facts. Now want to talk about not logical, a belief in a god is a good place to start lol.
" people who have a lot learn" and openheart is one of them. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 1:53:43 PM | There is right now a silly cult for a flying spaghetti monster.
It's not a cult. I have a FSM emblam on my car. If you get the joke, you usually laugh hysterically. If you don't, you simply ignore it. But to give it cult status is a little much.
For what its worth, I grew up Catholic. I had several issues with the church, and scripture that when I challenged them I was always told I had to have faith. There came a point when I was just not allowed back into Religion class. Currently I have zero plans to baptize my child, much to his grandparents horror. I will help him to explore other beliefs and cultures, but the choice will be his.
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Posted: 11/9/2009 2:28:56 PM | Now want to talk about not logical, a belief in a god is a good place to start lol.
Okay, this is fast becoming a religious debate over who is right and who is wrong and which religion or non-religion is right and which one isn't. And I don't think that was what the OP intended.
But in response, almost everyone throughout history has questioned why we are here, why we have to suffer so much through this existence, why things happen the way they do, all of that. Don't you ever wonder why you are in the situation you are in? Whatever it may be? Why things happen the way they do? It is not illogical to try and explain these things. Why does the sun come up every day in the east? And set every night in the west. Other than the obvious answer that the Earth revolves around the sun in that direction, why does it revolve around the sun? Where did we come from? How did all of this come to be the way it is?
These are the questions that scientists try to answer. And they do come up with nice logical answers that seem to fit into scientific answers. But then their answers always introduce more questions. Darwin's theory of evolution, that we all evolved from one lifeform over a few millenia, brings up the question of the missing link. The Big Bang theory begs the question of where did the matter come from that caused the explosion? It had to come from somewhere. Even logical minds have to admit that there are some things that cannot be explained. And that is where religion comes in. I explains the unexplainable. It offers hope when someone suffers a horrible tragedy. It offers hope to those people that are suffering from incurable diseases, or have to lose a limb or watch their child die.
Mankind is not a logical species. We hope, we love, we co-habitat with our chosen partners, we hate, we start wars, and most of all, we believe. This does not pertain to any specific religion. I don't know which one is right. They could all be right for all I know. We could all be wrong too. Really the pastafarians could have the right idea. (They are real. Google it. It's quite silly actually).
My personal belief is with Openheart in the God is awesome! But I am not everyone and one of the fantastic things that God did for us was to grant us free will.
Edit for above^^^^^ Pitterpat, I agree in how you are doing it. I am raising my children to keep an open mind. We go to church on Sunday. But I want to encourage them to keep their choices open and seek out their own relationship with a spiritual power. I have come to the conclusion that religion and spirituality is a very personal matter and should be kept between the person and their higher power. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 3:56:21 PM |
Mankind is not a logical species.
Womankind, on the other hand, is always logical.
one of the fantastic things that God did for us was to grant us free will.
Far more powerful that way, yes.
The Big Bang theory begs the question of where did the matter come from that caused the explosion?
And who lit the fuse on the bomb?
But some of these folks who believe they evolved from monkeys may be right! | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 7:35:34 PM |
I have tried to discuss this with family and close friends, but ended up bombarded by everyone from my mother in law from from the teacher to her estranged bio-father on how im poisioning her by telling her it is ok tio be an atheist.
I realize that religious people feel strongly about this.
However, I would really like to understand how you can "poison" someone by telling her it is ok to use critical thinking and look for reason and logic rather than beliefs. This is a fundamental lesson to teach every children : think before you accept something as true.
Be skeptic until proven. Learn to think in shades of gray.
If we follow our own advices about critical thinking, however, we would then adopt an agnostic stance rather than an atheistic stance, since it's not yet possible to prove "god" wrong. In science, an idea is a science if it can be disproved. If it cannot be, it's a belief, an act of faith - not science. There is nothing wrong with letting your child think for herself.
Another poster was saying:
I think that it is important for people to believe in something. What that is, though, is completely up to them. I believe in what I can study and understand. I would like to hear an explanation - ANY explanation - as to why it would be important in any way shape or form to "believe in something" ?!? Why? Why would condoning atheism be wrong?
OpenHeart, why would we need the bible to teach kids what love is? Isn't loving them the very best way to teach them - BY EXAMPLE - what love is? Rather than from an old book which also promotes so many death and stood by so many wars and caused so many blood to flow throughout history?
If next week she wants to be a Buddhist, Jew, Wiccan, or Taoist, or go back to Catholicism, thats fine also. Sounds rather unstable to me.
Why is that unstable? If you believe in god then who cares from what religion or set of beliefs you believe in him/her/it ? Does your definition of love, according to your Corinthians 13, only applies to Christian love, then?
Does anyone else think the bible is a disgusting book not for for children whatsoever?
The bible is a huge book, written by adult men for adult people, full of every possible stories that you can interpret ANY way you want. It really has nothing to do with spirituality, and everything to do with indoctrination. And they aren't stories for kids. Couldn't agree more with you on that one. | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 8:05:44 PM |
I think that it is important for people to believe in something. What that is, though, is completely up to them. I believe in what I can study and understand. I would like to hear an explanation - ANY explanation - as to why it would be important in any way shape or form to "believe in something" ?!? Why? Why would condoning atheism be wrong?
You believe in what you can study and understand. Okay, then, can't you read and understand religion? I have studied so many religions, and read about so many different religions. I love to study them.
Don't you ever just ask, "why is this happening to me?" Haven't you ever had something horrible happen in your life and you wish you knew why it happened? I am not talking about the circumstances surrounding the tragedy, but the reason it happened to begin with. Belief in anything offers people hope that there is something greater than them. That there is a reason why these horrible things in our lives happen. People have a fundamental need to have a belief in something greater than themselves. If they don't have that belief, then later in life it may develop. But there has to be some hope for an afterlife. Otherwise people will lose the will to fight for the things they want and love and believe in.
But that is just my $.02 | |
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Posted: 11/9/2009 8:40:56 PM |
You believe in what you can study and understand. Okay, then, can't you read and understand religion?
You can't read religion, but you can read religious books, yes.
Can I understand religion? Oh yes, all too well.
As far as I am concerned, and as it has been demonstrated throughout history, religion is an organized way to control people and gain power over them. The Jesuit in France used it quite successfully to control the kings and princes, to keep them in check and to keep the balance of power. In every country, in every single use of religion - whether mainstream or sect - we find power and control.
I can understand spirituality. But religion and spirituality are two vastly different things.
So is morality. I have noticed that around me: many people seem to assume that as an atheist, I cannot develop a strong ethical and moral code. I dare to challenge this. At least, when I help someone, I truly do it for free, out of the goodness of my heart, and not because a "god" asked me to do it or because I am scared of "hell" or aiming for "heaven" and afterlife rewards.
As for understanding religion itself - it's message, it's meaning? No, sorry, but I cannot. Critical thinking cannot be applied to an "act of faith", to a beliefs rooted in absolutely nothing concrete.
Don't you ever just ask, "why is this happening to me?"
I sure do. Asking questions, being curious, these are values I condone a lot. But that's the thing: why do you insist that there has to be a reason to everything? Roll a dice a hundred time and you will get quite a few 6. Or maybe you won't even get one. Why does it has to have any super-natural meaning?
Haven't you ever had something horrible happen in your life and you wish you knew why it happened? I am not talking about the circumstances surrounding the tragedy, but the reason it happened to begin with.
I hear you. And yes, it is comforting to feel like "someone" is out there taking the hard decisions from you, giving "meaning" to a seemingly random event. If it makes you feel better, sure. I consider these to be crotches, but hey, who knows? I cannot exclude the possibility. However, I don't see how this is supposed to make me feel better, because someone planned it ?
Belief in anything offers people hope that there is something greater than them.
There *are* many things greater than us, in every day life all around us. No need to be religious to see this.
That there is a reason why these horrible things in our lives happen.
Really? Please let me know. I'd love to know. I don't see how playing the "it's god's will" trump card explains anything more. In reality, if that is your belief, then you would have to push it one notch further and ask: "and WHY did he do this?" and now here is the nice part - the answer: because "God works in mysterious ways". Ah-haaa!!! There you go.
And here your so called "logic" stops to meet the "act of faith".
You can apply the same "reasoning" to the big bang. "So who lite up the fuse?". Okay, say it's god. And who created god? answer: "do not question God.". End of reasoning.
But there has to be some hope for an afterlife. Otherwise people will lose the will to fight for the things they want and love and believe in.
WOW! Excuse my sarcasm, but I find this sentence at tad insulting for all the people out there who happen to have a great will to live, to do good around them, and yet who simply do NOT believe in any afterlife what so ever. Please don't make huge generalizations and assumptions about how I feel about life as a non believer.
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| Condoning Atheism.
Posted: 11/9/2009 9:14:09 PM | I'll tell you what, CS, give it about let's say 20 years. For some reason, as people get closer to death, those beliefs start to surface. You may be a non believer now, and that is perfectly fine. I am not one of those crazy super christians that tell you you are going to burn in hell and my way is the only way. And I am not going to shove my beliefs down you throat. That is not my way.
Just as you study child development, etc. I study things like religion and culture. Except I do it for fun. It's my passion, so yes I know a little bit about what I am about to type. As people get older many start to contemplate the afterlife. And for many, maybe not you, but many others, it gives them some comfort to know that there is something better waiting for them after this existence. And you may be right, there may be nothing for us after death except to become worm food. I choose to believe otherwise. And there is no proof that I am right or wrong, or that you are right or wrong. In fact, there are a lot of people that have documented near death experiences that do talk about the light, or something to that affect. But the only way to prove that which idea is correct is to actually die, and I am not willing to do that to test my faith. Because that is exactly what it is, faith.
As for not questioning God, go ahead, question him. I did for a very long time. But I look around and I see to many things, minor things even, that are too amazing and wonderful to just be explained scientifically. Things like the colors in a sunset or sunrise. Sure, you can say that it's the light from the sun bouncing off the different gases and moisture in the atmosphere from different angles, or whatever, but why does something like that have to be so amazingly beautiful? And why is every sunset new and different from the one before? or even the one in another location? To me, that is a miracle. Maybe it is a minor miracle. But it is still a miracle. I don't question why it is that way. I just thank God for that beauty every time I see it.
I will give you one thing, I may have made a sweeping generalization about how people feel. And I shouldn't have done that. Maybe I should have worded it differently. It goes back to what I was saying about people as they get closer to death.
Here's one for you.....why do you study child development/psychology or whatever it is? (I am not trying to be dismissive of what you study, I just cannot remember what it is exactly off hand. I did read your profile though.) Because you like it? Because you want to be something that involves it? Why? | |
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| Condoning Atheism.
Posted: 11/9/2009 9:24:31 PM | Well.. that's just one children's version of the bible. My cousin 6 provinces away sent up a big box of things last year for an early baby shower gift. Lo and behold there was a children's bible. It was an 11 paged cardboard book covered in brown fuzzy material and on the front of the book it looked like a bear(had little ears that stuck out a bit too), now im not religious but i think its very cute. Thankfully i read the thing before i read it to my son and luckily there was no stories about burning in the eternal flames of hell. What I did like about it , it's called "Tiny Bear's Bible" , was that the stories all rhymed and were no more then 10 sentences or less.
I agree though, most Children's Edition bibles shouldn't be given to them at all, I have one from way back when i was 10 or 11 from my grandmother, If i would have gotten that a lot earlier.. it would have scarred the hell out of me too.
Be skeptic until proven. Learn to think in shades of gray.
You should tell that to Kent Hovind.
To anyone who doesn't know who Kent Hovind is, he's an Evangelist, who goes around and gives lectures about how the world is only 6 thousand years old. | |
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