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| | Cheaters are people tooPage 1 of 3 (1, 2, 3) | Wow, it's going to be very very hard to defend this stance. I'll give it my best shot though. Please read everything before making a reply.
In high school I was a very large kid, I didn't have much going for me other than my ability to listen, my sense of humor, and the fact that I was a genuinely nice guy. I truly believe it's for those reasons alone that I was able date anyone at all during those 4 years.
I joined the Army just out of school and lost a ton of weight, I wasn't bad to look at, and I found my confidence. I'll spare the details suffice it to say my time in the service changed me. I went from this innocent kid, to a soldier on a power trip. I didn't have to approach women, they approached me and when temptation reared it's head I was powerless to do anything about it. I finally felt "pretty" and "desired" and it's for those reasons I did what I did. Not only did I cheat but I felt NO remorse for doing so. I liked the feeling that I was sought after, I liked the attention; I was cold.
I'm in no way, shape, or form proud of the way I conducted myself in my late teens and early 20's. It wasn't until Karma came and b*tch slapped me that I took a step back and looked at myself in the mirror and at what I had been doing, at all the girls I had hurt in the process. My ex-fiance cheated and it devastated me. No, I don't want nor do I deserve sympathy for that. I'm just telling my story.
I went on to grow colder than I was before I met the ex-fiance, I knew what I was capable of, and I was going to dish out that hurt that I felt 10x over because at the time I honestly felt that would make me feel better. Queue my relocation to Alaska. I'll give you the short hand version of the events that followed my move. I met a girl at my place of work, she was as pure as the virgin snow and after dating her a while I took that from her, only to cheat on her a few months later with her friend.
What I did destroyed this girl and to this very day I feel horrible (this was 6 years ago), I actually cared for this girl. I loved her, but I was so distraught over the hurt that had (rightfully) been put on me, that it didn't matter. I've ruined lives because of what I did. It was when this happened that I sat back and really examined my behavior from day 1. The more I thought about all the things I've done the more disgusted I was with myself. Who the f*ck am I to intentionally put this one someone who in no way deserves the recoil from my shattered affections. What happened to that fat kid in high school? The one that was so nice and caring. I swore to myself it wasn't something I'd ever do again. And to this day I've held true to that. I've dated, I've had chances to do so, but it's not even really a choice anymore; the thought of cheating exits my head before it even has a fraction of a second to plant itself in the form of an idea or scheme.
After a break I put myself back out there, and each time I've done so I've been cheated on. Again, I'm not asking for sympathy that I know I don't deserve. Hell, if anything I know karma still owes me a few more hits before we can call things "even". It physically sickens me to think of the things I did when I was younger. Yes, I could stay hidden from the dating game and duck out to avoid the beat down I know karma is waiting to give me but I'm done hiding. I'm going to take my licks like a man.
So to those that say "once a cheater, always a cheater" I offer myself as an example that this statement isn't always true. I can agree with you that 99% of the time it is, but in this one case it very much isn't.
On the bright side I use these experiences (as negative as they may be) for good. I could, at one point, juggle 3 women without breaking a sweat and at no time during my "tenure" as "that guy" was I ever caught. It's because of this that my female friends can come to me if they suspect their boyfriend is cheating and I can look at what they present to me as their argument and give them my honest opinion as someone who did this quite often. I can look at the situation and say either "Yeah, not only is he cheating, he's doing a horrible job at it. Take a closer look at this, this, this and that the next time you 2 are talking and if you really want to trip him up do this" Or I will say "No, to me it doesn't look like he's cheating and here's why *explanation*. I think if you're worried you should talk with him explain that you've been hurt and at times you need re-assurance. He'll understand".
So there it is, I know that when I see the phrase, once a cheater always a cheater they're not talking about me specifically, but it's a stigma and a mistake I have to take carry with me the rest of my life. I'm an honest person when asked a question, if this comes up and someone asks if I had ever cheated I own up to it. I've had relationships fail before they even started because of this. And again, I have it coming. I just wanted to get my story out.
There are those of us that have done things we're not proud of; we've hurt people and we actually sorta hate ourselves a little bit for what we have done. So the next time it comes up, before you judge the person and label them, remember that not everyone who was once a cheater; stays that way. We're people too, we're just... messed up people.
Have at you. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 7:09:28 AM | What's this Thread really all about,Op?
Do you want a medal?
Its a whole lotta words to me but im nowhere near convinced of anything other than you've cheated MULTIPLE times in your life.
People CHOOSE to cheat.
It'll be interesting to see other peoples' interpretation of your Thread. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 7:17:11 AM | sorry, i'm not reading all that but i hope it made you feel better to spill it. you could have gotten the same point across by just posting the first sentence of each paragraph.
in the meantime. everyone has skeletons in their closet (me included), otherwise they never learned a thing in this world. the only thing worse than a person who won't let go of their past is the person who refused to learn from it. you feel bad now?? and are those bad feelings bad enough to motivate you to stop doing that?? that's good; if you didn't feel bad, we'd know nothing had changed.
you don't really need lofty concepts like karma to explain someone's chronically crappy behavior and make it seem bigger and more cosmic than it really is. there's another word for it: selfishness.... something every small child with a snotty nose is intimately familiar with. just grow up now and move on. your past is supposed to be a lesson and a memory; not a perpetual burden, or a leash.
evolve. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 7:24:08 AM | Move forward. Decide from this day on you will treat people as you wish to be treated, be upfront and honest with the women you meet, and date smarter. Use your instincts before giving your heart away.
As far as the man-whore behavior? Get over it and don't look back. It's what your teens and early twenties are all about. Most of us traded up/broke up every 2-3 months when I was in college and it was always with somebodies friend. It's why I discourage younger people from anything other than very casual dating till they are ready. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 7:26:08 AM | | So you felt a need to catch up on the number of notches on your bed post because you were late out of the gate. This does not mean you need to continue playing the "bad boy". If you want a good woman you need to start being a good man. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 8:43:11 AM | | There are lots of people who've grown up as ugly ducklings only to be transformed into beautiful swans who don't cheat on people. If you think becoming attractive is a plausible explanation for losing control of your ego and your libido, you are mistaken. I am sure when you were a fat kid, you were secretly envious of the good-looking popular kids and idolized them and your "niceness" was more an act of survival than actual genuine kindheartedness. Because if you were truly "nice", your ego would not have exploded when you became attractive. Being cheated on by other women is not something you or anyone else deserves. The fact you think you deserve it, indicates that somewhere in your mind you still think cheating can be justified (ie: as karmic punishment). I get the feeling you want us to applaud your personal growth story here, but it seriously reads like a pathetic attempt for renunciation. I'm guessing you have someone new in your life whom you are trying to convince you've... changed? | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 11:47:43 AM | I was the ugly duckling in my younger days, so I can relate a little bit.
I guess there are two kinds. Me, having had my feelings hurt by others, learned how it felt and chose to never purposely cause anyone to hurt. You on the other hand, took that hurt and made it a justification to do unto others the same as was done unto you.
I believe actions tell the true story of who we are-and you cannot undo previous actions. All you can do is move forward with the lessons you have learned and in your actions going forward, do not knowingly cause harm.
You will have to understand though...that because you have cheated in your past, people who have resisted the temptation will not likely want a relationship with you. Personally, I would probably decline if faced with this information, unless you could prove to me that you sought some serious therapy or something. It cannot happen overnight that you switched from enjoying the pain you caused to feeling remorseful...what can you show to prove that you have changed, and that all of this isnt just a new angle to set up women for more pain? What physical steps have you undertaken to change you actual pattern of behaviour? In selecting women who cheat on you...shows me you have not done this hard work. All you have done is switched the roles...but you still seek unhealthy relationships. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 2:33:37 PM |
What's this Thread really all about,Op?
It's just something that was on my mind as I read through the various heart break stories. Something I just thought I'd share with a group that seems to think people can't change. I agree that it isn't often people will change, but it is entirely possible... though, it's rare.
It'll be interesting to see other peoples' interpretation of your Thread.
That's why I shared it.
Move forward. Decide from this day on you will treat people as you wish to be treated, be upfront and honest with the women you meet, and date smarter.
I have, these events transpired years ago and the change certainly wasn't over-night. I've since done exactly this.
This does not mean you need to continue playing the "bad boy". If you want a good woman you need to start being a good man.
I haven't played the "bad boy" in 6+ years. I realized long ago that if I wanted a quality woman, I'd have to be a quality guy and the person I was, wasn't quality in any way, shape or form. It's why I've gone back to school, it's why I help those that I can, it's why the long process of taking my walls down happened. I needed to be a better person before I even considered dating again.
Being cheated on by other women is not something you or anyone else deserves.
Exactly.
The fact you think you deserve it, indicates that somewhere in your mind you still think cheating can be justified (ie: as karmic punishment).
Nothing can justify cheating, I'm not saying I deserve to be cheated on, I'm really just trying to say... I know I've done some terrible things, and in no way should I be upset if those things were to happen to me. It's like trying to get upset that you got a ticket for speeding. I sped, I broke the law and I can't be upset when I have to pay the fine.
I'm guessing you have someone new in your life whom you are trying to convince you've... changed?
Nope, nobody new. I was just reading and thought I'd share. I'm not trying to convince people here I've changed. There's really no way to know short of actually knowing me through the years. Maybe I chose a bad title for the thread. I'm just simply sharing a story, friends that I've made since the time that all these things happened find it hard to believe I was ever capable of things like that. I've really got nothing to prove.
You will have to understand though...that because you have cheated in your past, people who have resisted the temptation will not likely want a relationship with you.
And I understand that completely. I don't blame them at all, I wish them the best in fact.
It cannot happen overnight that you switched from enjoying the pain you caused to feeling remorseful...what can you show to prove that you have changed, and that all of this isnt just a new angle to set up women for more pain? What physical steps have you undertaken to change you actual pattern of behaviour?
It wasn't an overnight thing by any means. It took months from the time I hurt Alaska to realize what I had done and being the process of reflecting and re-evaluating everything. From that point I just took myself out of dating all together until I got my sh*t straight. (which lasted a few years)
In selecting women who cheat on you...shows me you have not done this hard work. All you have done is switched the roles...but you still seek unhealthy relationships.
Now, this is something I've never understood and if someone could shed some light on it, I'd really appreciate it. When selecting a partner I don't think anyone intentionally chooses someone that will hurt them. When you meet someone you don't know everything about them, they could lie, so how does anyone know they're selecting people who will cheat?
By all means keep the feedback coming. I do however want to reiterate that if you don't read the whole thing spare the comments "tl;dr".
For clarification, this isn't something I struggle with currently. It isn't something I dwell on, and it damn sure isn't something I'm proud of. This thread was sparked from browsing these forums and like a grandpa would tell a story about how candy bars cost 5 cents back in his day, it's just a story; an experience to share with others. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 3:01:37 PM | You offered no example of NOT cheating, so once a cheater always a cheater DOES apply to the story you dished up. Not hating on you, just stating.
All the "I know I deserved it" and "don't need nor are looking for sympathy" statements just show you know right from wrong, but apparently you chose to be ALL ABOUT YOU! So the question is, will you/have you truly turned over a new leaf and decided to go back to being a good person.
Nothing you say here can prove it, only your actions in real life can my friend. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 3:55:43 PM | For some reason it wasn't letting me reply. I'll try typing this again at the risk of double posting.
I've had relationships since this story has taken place, one stands out, one where I had many opportunities to cheat again. I was with a girl whose ex had gotten out of jail (no, I didn't know she had an ex in jail) and she ended up cheating on me with him. She said she wanted to see if something was still there and that things didn't get resolved when he got locked up. I could have stayed with her, I could have done the same to her, but instead I broke up with her. All the while I dated this person a girl I knew would constantly invite me to parties or to come and hang out. I always answered with "Sorry, but I don't think my girlfriend would take too kindly to that if she couldn't come." or something along those lines. After a while this other girl stopped asking.
Months went by as I re-affirmed my decision to not be that guy anymore and after my feelings for that most recent ex were gone I ran into the girl that always invited me to the parties and I asked if there was anything going on this weekend. She was a bit surprised and asked about my girlfriend and what she'd think of me going to a party and at that point I said "We've been broken up for a few months now, I don't think she'll mind"
Me and this girl went on to date for a few months, she was in the states on a work visa saving up for med school. When the relationship ended because she had to go home we were both sad but knew it wasn't something that would have lasted forever. We had an amazing few months together, it was for lack of a better word, perfect. She's a doctor now and we still talk from time to time, making jokes saying I should move to her and be a trophy husband. We both remember that amazing summer and it'll be something we can always look back on fondly.
I've gotten side tracked though, yes, I've had chances to cheat since this happened and no I haven't taken them, I haven't even been tempted in the slightest. We all do stupid things that we're not proud of, this is mine. You're right though, I can't prove it with anything other than my actions, and it's those that I let do my talking. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 4:14:57 PM | Glad that you ae doing better, OP.
One thing I want to suggest that you re-ponder:
The whole "karma" reasoning, for why others are cheating on you now, is a dangerous way to think of this. The world is NOT all connected by magical strings, such that you are getting comeuppance for your prior misdeeds. What is actually happening, is that just as you had to go through your learning experience, so too do other people. And those other people might or might not learn what you did, when you did, or how you did. They might go through their whole lives, and cheat all the time, or they might do it just once.
But the problem with your thinking this is "karmic balance," is that somewhere underneath your attempt to accept this from others, you are subconsciously calculating that you have paid back your wrongdoings. Keeping such an emotional ledger is NEVER a good idea, even when it is serving to make you behave yourself, and to make it seem to you that you are forgiving others.
You have at least one more stage to go through or to reach about this, where you both accept that you did do it all wrong before, while still realizing that it is just as wrong for someone to cheat on a cheater, as it is to cheat on an innocent. When you can recognize that someone is cheating, and give them the response from you (you leave them) that is correct for cheaters, and you neither count it as "penalty served" on your own tally sheet, nor bother to keep track of the recent cheater's standings in your mind, then you will have truly left that part of your childhood behind. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/24/2012 5:29:01 PM |
So the next time it comes up, before you judge the person and label them, remember that not everyone who was once a cheater; stays that way
I don't judge people, I judge their actions. YOU cheated,,,,more than once. I'm gonna judge you for that. Got a problem with that??? Too bad,,,I'm still judging what YOU did.
I'm glad you are feeling all nice,warm and fuzzy that by the time you reached 27 years of age, you figured out what MOST children already know before they reach their teens. Feel better yet???? And yeah, don't tell me what you are going to do, or not going to do in the future. SHOW ME. After ya die, than we can all say,yeah,,,he never cheated AGAIN. Till then, you're just talking outta the side of your mouth and basically it's BS.
YOUR OWN HISTORY tells a different story than the words you have posted. Funny thing about history, you can't rewrite it. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/25/2012 1:02:31 AM | I'm sure all the people that get cheated on are lighting candles in support of those that hurt them. And most everyone that does cheat has no problem doing it again. Sorry but I'm not going to feel sorry for people that cheat multiple times and then want others to say awwww and give them a pass. I'm glad you have seen the pain it causes; there is hope; but many cheaters have no conscience and that is scary.
Things dont happen for a reason, they happen because of our choices. doesn't take any character to cheat and lie. Takes tons of it to not do so.
To judge something isn't a bad word. It means to form an opinion, estimate, notion, or conclusion, from the facts and evidence that is given. There are a million other ways of saying it.
I am glad you are honest now and that you are sorry for it. I hope you also will understand that not all people will want to date you because you do have a history of cheating. I personally would not give a person like that a shot, but there are women that will and that's great. There is hope and it's a sign of maturing. I'm glad for that and hope all things work out for you. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/25/2012 6:55:39 AM | Ive heard that most people would cheat in the right circumstances - ie gorgeous proposition, desert island nobody would ever know...
The outrage at cheaters is an expression of peoples fear of the cheater within maybe?
Mixed on this site at least with some personal & painful experience I know
Ive been both sides of the equation & its rarely as black & white as pof posters make out! | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/25/2012 2:17:07 PM |
Now, this is something I've never understood and if someone could shed some light on it, I'd really appreciate it. When selecting a partner I don't think anyone intentionally chooses someone that will hurt them. When you meet someone you don't know everything about them, they could lie, so how does anyone know they're selecting people who will cheat?
I have to wonder if the women you allowed into your life who cheated on you...did they give you small clues and because you believe in this Karma thing, you allowed yourself to continue with them because deep down you feel you 'deserve' it?
Such as, maybe in conversation you learned she cheated 'just once' and she then went on to either blame the ex or say she was too drunk and couldnt remember? To me, this is people telling us who they really, really are, and most people disregard these comments....until it is too late. This says she takes no accountability for her actions and will likely repeat it because she has not admitted she actually made the choice to do it.
I firmly believe that with time and clever conversation, people do tell us who they really are. We just have to be willing to see it for what is is and be firm in our boundaries. For example...I dont care how hot a man is, what effect he has on me physically (chemistry). If I learn he has a past of cheating and then blames everything under the sun except his own stupid head-there will be no relationship with me. I try very hard to surround myself with humans who take accountability for thier own choices. I cannot be around people who do not see the role they themselves play in life. It frustrates me too much, so I just dont allow them into my inner circle. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/25/2012 3:54:38 PM | | I know cheaters are people too but who knows if you goin to turn around an go cheat on the next person you have in your life my point exactly you have to prove yourself | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/25/2012 5:47:26 PM |
Ive been both sides of the equation & its rarely as black & white as pof posters make out!
I'm gonna tell ya a little story. I've got a little book in the back of my truck where I write down the reasons/excuses that some of my guys use when they phone in and tell me they can't make it to work that day. You probably would be amazed how many times the "same" reasons/excuses come up,by different people that have come my way in the last 25 years.
Hang around long enough in this world and you'll end up "hearing them all", and usually more than once. So yeah, go ahead and tell me again that it's "rarely" black and white, and I'll call BS. Same shiat, different story teller. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/26/2012 10:58:40 AM | | You may be a cheater, but that doesn't mean you can't try to not continue to stay one. Therapy may help you in your situation, give it a try with your heart and soul and maybe you will be a better person in the end. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/26/2012 8:32:36 PM | yes cheaters are people too. This is true but people make their own beds and have to lie in them.
I was in a marriage 7 and a half years. was "kicked outta the bedroom" after a year and a half. She did so not me. I found out for 6 years she was cheating with an ex boyfriend the whole time. I had ample time and chances to cheat but I did not.
We do choose to cheat and in todays society espacally it is easy to do so. On line dating, craigslist, swinger websites its all so easy.
But again we choose to do it. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/27/2012 11:31:30 AM | That's great that you don't cheat anymore, but let me sum up your experience. It took a couple ruined relationships (and possibly ruined lives) for you to get to where a decent human being starts at. Is it better than you remaining a cheater? Sure, but that doesn't fix your past mistakes.
It's only been a few years too, this post might be more legit if you were nearing the end of your life after decades of being faithful. You getting drunk and making a mistake could render this post useless the next day.  | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/27/2012 2:27:20 PM | | You cheated because you're selfish and Your meanderings are a testament to the fact that you no more care for the women you hurt than Ted Bundy cared about the women he murdered. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/27/2012 8:35:50 PM | You RUINED THE LIVES of some of your girlfriends just because of your sleazy behaviour? Do you really think you're that important, and that you have that kind of power??? Ha! That's arrogant...
Listen, the only life you are going to ruin by your perpetual cheating is your own. So for YOUR sake, I truly hope you have indeed changed your ways. | |
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| Cheaters are people too
Posted: 4/28/2012 3:24:42 AM | | I don't even regard cheaters as human male or female all of you should be put on a island and bombed. | |
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