|"Nice Guys"Page 1 of 13 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13)|
|Alright, I was thinking about my ex-husband the other day (doesn't happen often, but on occasion) and he was one of the men in the world who classified himself as a nice guy. In the whole "nice guys finish last" sense. Even after he had an affair with my best friend, he still made a comment or two about being one of the nice guys.|
So, this really got me thinking...gentlemen...when you say you're a "nice guy" in your profile, what characteristics do you mean?
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:16:40 AM
|I am not a nice guy... I am a mean SoB (ebil laugh hearing while covering his mouth)|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:17:59 AM
|Why does someone have to tell someone they are a "nice person"... should you not find that out for yourself... I always find if someone is "selling" themselves, then they are most likely trying to hide or convince someone of the opposite...|
So yeah, I am a a$$hole... :p
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:19:29 AM
|I KNEW it Seymour...well, it appears there are enough women who are after the mean SOBs, so you fellas shouldn't have a problem ;)|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:25:24 AM
|Nice guys are not into Oral Sex. Am I allowed to say that on the forum??|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:26:59 AM
|Apparantly... because you appear to have just said it.|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:27:54 AM
|You mean they're not into giving it or not into wanting it? |
I mean, to me, it would be a REALLY nice guy who wanted to give it all the time but absolutely refused to take it.."No, no, really darling, I prefer you don't, it's all about you darling, all about you...."
..and then she woke up. hehe
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:28:30 AM
|Nice guys are not into oral sex... |
Hmmm, me thinks me needs this one explain to me...
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:30:36 AM
|Just about every profile I read written by a woman says that she is looking for the nice guy. I call B.S. on that, because its the bad boy who gets the women - the nice guys get left holding the bag or going home alone.|
Now - I would consider myself a nice guy. The only reason I would say that is because many of the women I know have told me that. They also told me that they wouldn't date me because I am just to damn nice - and they figure I am just putting on a show to win them. Should I become a bad boy to get the chicks - or keep on with the single nice boy attitude and just be friends with the ones that I think could be more than just friends?
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:37:03 AM
Well, people look at me cuz I carry myself a little different and may look different then the other dudes on this site..
But I will asure you all, I am one hell of a nice guy..
Those of you who have met the Captain know what Im talking about!
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:40:15 AM
|I'm with you on this one Camie....I happen to think that the term "nice guy' is somewhat of an oxymoron...cause I don't think they really exist. There's a little bit of a$$hole in every guy.|
I got married to a bad boy when I was 19 and teh results were obviously what I should have expected....constantly out drinking and whoring around..brought home STDs to his pregnant wife, picked up strippers, abusive...and then got addicted to cocaine.
Ok...so next time I marry a "nice guy"...yeah, still ended up screwing a woman from work and choosing her over his family.
As for oral sex....huh??? Not exactly sure what that has to do with it at all.
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:41:52 AM
|I think i need to change my nic to grinch cause nice is one thing i am not..lol|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:43:28 AM
|well some of these guys that use the term 'nice guys' and turn out not to be screw us guys over that really are. how does a man that really is a nice guy win a woman over with using that phrase?|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:44:25 AM
|All men could have azz holes in them, just as all women can have some b!tch in them.. works both ways! |
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:47:22 AM
|Hell yeah...I'm a biotch...but I don't try to pretend I'm not !|
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:47:46 AM
|>>> Sorry it's so long, put it puts an interesting spin on the "Nice Guy" conundrum... <<<|
What's wrong with being a nice guy? Plenty, according to a local therapist
Friday, May 3, 2002
By CECELIA GOODNOW
SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER REPORTER
In an age of suicide bombers, contaminated mail, road rage and rampant rudeness, it seems the last thing we should worry about is an epidemic of overniceness.
But while America slumbers, says Federal Way therapist Robert Glover, an alarming number of men -- maybe 1 in 4 -- are morphing into wimps who live to please and end up pleasing no one.
"I think since World War II, Nice Guys have just proliferated," says Glover, 46, whose focus on "Nice Guy Syndrome" has spawned a best-selling e-book, a growing caseload and a global online community of "recovering Nice Guys."
"Now I'm seeing second- and third-generation Nice Guys coming along," says Glover, who acknowledges he has no hard data beyond clinical observation of a trait he has sought treatment for himself.
His concern is not with generic niceness but a specific constellation of traits such as passivity, conflict avoidance and emotional caretaking that in the past were more commonly associated with women.
Response to Glover's weekly "Nice Guy therapy groups" is so strong, he's about to launch a fourth concurrent group at his Center for Healing and Recovery. Also in the works is an intensive summer workshop he hopes to turn into a global series of events.
But his largest audience is at nomoremrniceguy.com, where he runs an online support group of about 100 members, fields e-mails from around the world and markets his book, "No More Mr. Nice Guy!"
With business so good, Glover theorizes -- debatably-- that he has hit upon a problem for our times. Wading further into roiling waters, he blames Nice-Guyism on an array of 20th-century social change.
His list of causes responsible for creating Nice Guys -- inclusive enough to rile nearly every interest -- includes absent fathers, the anti-war movement of the Vietnam era, the sexual revolution, an educational system that he claims is "dominated by women" and "women's liberation and feminism."
The end result, he argues, is that a lot of male baby boomers and Gen-Xers grew up adopting "a female perspective on masculinity."
To which family historian Stephanie Coontz replies, "Oh, puleeze."
"Do you have any idea how many times in history someone has announced breathlessly that women are raising men to be wimps?" says Coontz, co-chair of the national Council on Contemporary Families. "Every 40 or 50 years, somebody decides this would be a great thing to worry about."
Coontz says the debate over male upbringing goes back to the Roman Empire. If e-mail had existed in 1900, she added, the same kind of virtual hand-wringing would have taken place then.
Coontz, on leave from teaching history and family studies at The Evergreen State College in Olympia, doesn't dispute that overly self-effacing people exist.
"I certainly think there are many men, just as there are many women, who fit this description," she says. "But the idea that they're becoming more common is just absolutely groundless, as far as I can see."
Glover, a psychologist specializing in marriage and family therapy, says he has spent about a decade -- half his career -- working with men who try too hard to be nice.
It was partly because of his established, online following that Barnes & Noble Digital agreed to publish his e-book (priced at $5.95), which quickly and briefly became one of its top five e-sellers. In February, the company added a print-on-demand paperback, priced at $14.95 and sold over the Internet.
Glover calls his message "unashamedly pro-male," but says he's heard from women who agree with his premise.
Wiry, with a high forehead and trim mustache, Glover has an acerbic sense of humor and a tone that veers between conventional psychological counsel and edgy outrageousness.
He says he hasn't received any negative feedback from other therapists, "if they actually read the book and get past whatever preconceptions they have from the title."
One Seattle psychologist who hadn't heard of the book said it sounded on first blush like "another marketing ploy." After reviewing Glover's first chapter, however, psychologist Robert Strazicich revised his opinion upward.
"I'm not sure what the validity is for saying this is a new personality type for our age," Strazicich says, "but he does describe a pattern of male behavior that really does exist."
Specifically, says Strazicich, "He seems to be describing an insecure, dependent and probably depressed adult male."
From a "packaging" standpoint, he adds, it's much easier to hook readers by describing them as Mr. Nice Guy, "instead of saying this is something for 'Mr. Insecure, Dependent or Depressed.' That's not very appealing, is it?"
Some of the men in Glover's online support group are, in fact, struggling with serious life issues that have sent them to therapy.
Glover went that route himself, two years into his second marriage. His wife, Elizabeth Oreskovich, is a therapist and co-director at the center.
"My frustrations were pretty typical Nice Guy relationship issues," he says. "Not feeling appreciated, not feeling sexually desired by my wife. I didn't feel like I could make my wife happy, (didn't feel) like I received as much as I gave."
Glover surmises that a lot of "Nice Guys" grew up with fathers who were abusive, overcontrolling, alcoholic, distant or just plain absent. Vowing never to be like their fathers, these men overshoot the mark and become ineffectual, emotionally repressed, manipulative and sexually dissatisfied.
In fact, says Glover, "Nice Guys" really aren't nice at all. Avoiding confrontation at all cost, they wear a mask of agreeability that hides a buildup of resentment, rage or passive-aggressive behavior. All of which he recognized in himself before seeking therapy.
"Elizabeth would often state that she never knew when she was going to 'get it' from me," Glover says. "I decided to seek some answers. I loved Elizabeth and didn't want my second marriage to end in divorce."
Glover, who spent a total of five years in therapy, says the emotional overhaul wasn't easy.
"Doing this recovery from the Nice Guy Syndrome isn't just tweaking things here or there," he says. "It is a dramatic shift in paradigm."
Glover steers clients toward an ideal he calls the "integrated male" -- someone with a strong sense of self who acts with integrity, sets clear emotional boundaries and knows how to nurture without caretaking.
His ideal is a leader who is comfortable with his masculinity and willing to "provide for and protect those he cares about."
Strazicich responds that it's a pretty good list, as far as it goes.
"His notion of striving to become an integrated male generally sounds like a good thing," he says.
Strazicich adds, however, that the list fails to note that "being flexible and adaptive and accommodating -- those are strengths as well."
As much as he lauds honest expression among men, however, Glover is no sensitive, New Age male.
Take his counsel regarding wifely chitchat, for instance. Glover makes no bones about telling husbands not to listen when their wives run on about "work, family, girlfriends and rude checkout people."
"I don't think men are inclined or even interested to hear about every detail of a woman's day," Glover says. "I'm just encouraging men to listen more selectively so they'll listen more carefully."
Without blinking, he adds that women may be drawn initially to men who "listen to them for hours and drink coffee with them and never sexualize them." But in the end, he claims, women "come to despise" them for those very qualities.
His term for such men: "A girlfriend with a penis."
That draws an incredulous snort from Strazicich, who responds, "That's just absurd. That's humorous, really."
Coontz adds that Glover's assertion is "just not true." But she adds, "It is true that women have conflicted feelings and give conflicted messages to men."
Maybe that was the case with Cally, from Perth, Australia, one of Glover's e-mail correspondents.
"Wow, your description of the Nice Guy sounds SO much like my ex-boyfriend, whom I broke up with for the same reasons -- that he was too much of a nice guy," she told Glover. "Note (that) nice guy = desperate guy."
Glover says he gets e-mails from all over -- so many that he has just launched a program of intensive workshops called NMMNG (No More Mr. Nice Guy) Worldwide Institutes.
The first, in late July, will be in Seattle. Others are planned for Boston, Phoenix, Washington, D.C., and London. He also has created an "associate program" for recovering Nice Guys who want to lead support groups in their hometowns.
Coontz has misgivings about the assumptions fueling the movement. Solutions that seem to turn back the clock on sexual roles are seductive, she says, but not the answer.
"They offer people an easy, over-the-counter patent medicine," she says.
But try telling that to Nice Guys like Tom of New York, whose e-mail suggests that the scales have fallen from his eyes.
"I am now realizing," he messaged Glover, "that I have a distorted view of how to be a man."
Posted: 1/22/2006 11:48:04 AM
Nice guys are not into Oral Sex. Am I allowed to say that on the forum??
Oral? I love to eat. Can't be bothered to have a chick go down on me - feels good, but its not the earth-shattering-ride that most guys think it is. Now, give me a tasty clean clam - and I'll eat for hours! Can I say that on here?
Colonel Harland Sanders said it best - finger lickin' good. Madonna said it better you can eat all you want, and you don't get fat!
Posted: 1/22/2006 12:13:20 PM
|I'm apparently a "nice guy" butthat's just the opinion of those who know me...|
if i wasn't a nice guy why would all the players, pretend to be like me..but not too much
cause everyone knows women don't really want the nice guy, they only want the bad boys and rebels...
but that's just my opinion... heck what do I know i'm just a hermit...
and lol of the very few women who've actually gotten to know me , I got turned down because i'm too nice and they like me as a friend more...guess that says a lot
Posted: 1/22/2006 12:29:08 PM
|How does that saying go again?|
Oh right, nice guys finish last!
Posted: 1/22/2006 12:41:37 PM
Can't be bothered to have a chick go down on me - feels good, but its not the earth-shattering-ride that most guys think it is.
man...speak for yourself!!! Provided she's doing it right I'll start to see stars becuase I'll be hyper-ventilating...
Posted: 1/22/2006 12:46:28 PM
"Nice Guys" really aren't nice at all. Avoiding confrontation at all cost, they wear a mask of agreeability that hides a buildup of resentment, rage or passive-aggressive behavior.
true...but its not so gender specific, women can fall under the "too nice" syndrome as well.
Posted: 1/22/2006 12:55:03 PM
I found this article to be an interesting read. Not only does it address the issue of the "mixed up male" but also brings about other issues such as society's need for "over-the-counter patent medicine" (quick and easy solutions to complex problems) as well as society's unrealistic expectations of the perfect man / perfect woman.
Posted: 1/22/2006 1:05:11 PM
|I think people just need to quit hiding behind facades and be who they are; be themselves.|
Also, when meeting people, get to know them by chatting and trust your gut.
Me, I can't be anything other than who I am.
I AM getting tired of guys saying "I'm nice" and then pull crap like stop calling or emailing. Nice guys don't do that. Nice guys realize that we are people with feelings and show some manners.
Posted: 1/22/2006 1:05:23 PM
true...but its not so gender specific, women can fall under the "too nice" syndrome as well.
I would agrue that although this is true, it seems rather like a passive aggressive defense without actually addressing the main idea of the thread, "the nice guy".
I bring this up because it is too easy to segueway into the familiar male verses female thread.
It's sort of like the following:
"You're a jerk!"
"Yeah, well, you're a jerk too".
Which offers no real insight.
Moreover perhaps facilitate an arguement such as:
"You're a Jerk!".
"Really? That hurts. Why am I a Jerk?"
which seems much more constructive and interesting.
Posted: 1/22/2006 1:05:45 PM
|LOL! This forum really does allow you to 'express' yourself eh?|
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