| | Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.Page 1 of 2 (1, 2) | | Abortion, fag marriage, homosexuality,etc. Many people other than Christians oppose these abominations against mankind , yet the anti-Christian bigots try to sell the lie that only Christians oppose these horrendous evils and their associated assaults on the family, motherhood,society and mankind. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 7:44:41 AM | | Thats easy because its in YOUR christian bible that its wrong... So essentially its your faith who started all this crap to begin with. Also as far as i know only Jedo-christian faiths are against abortion,homosexuality and the such so name a few of these other so called religions and were in there religious doctrine it states that its wrong... | |
|
| |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 12:52:50 PM | It is not just in the eyes of Christians that such things are wrong, I know for sure that people of Jewish, Christian and Muslim faiths agree on their sinful nature.
Abortion is a recent issue, so I cannot tell you what every faiths position is, but it seems that such a thing would be against any religion who considers our time here sacred. Denying existence to another is against most faiths (imo), but the exact belief of Hindus, Buddhists, wiccans, etc is unknown to me.
Not being a Christian is not evil, just a state to be pitied and if possible, through loving fellowship and testimony, rectified. (I do not expect you all to feel the same, I am talking for myself)
In looking these faiths and the issues up I found this:
Buddhism is basically against abortion, see http://buddhism.about.com/cs/ethics/a/Abortion.htm. Apparently, homosexuality is not good either to them, see http://www.buddhanet.net/homosexu.htm.
The Hindu religion doesn't specifically condemn homosexuality, that I found, but the Hindu followers do view it as an immoral practice. They also are against abortion due to their respect for life, see http://www.fnsa.org/fall98/murti.html.
The more I look these issues up, the more universal I find their opposition to be. I was sort of surprised that it was, given your earlier premise, but I can only assume it was a personal belief based on lack of knowledge rather than a researched position.
Anyway, if you have evidence I could not find I would be interested in seeing it, because what I found pretty much mirrored the Christian belief for the above and other faiths.
MajMike | |
|
| |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 1:22:31 PM | shannanigan
Okay, I accept your belief that you do not need our/my pity (or love, to use a better word), but my point in the last post was that it is not just a Christian code, but one that seems to be fairly universal around the world and across faiths.
Also, by defending family and marriage I am doing some real good for people (imo). And in showing these values are not just Judeo-Christian values, I am also showing that the world is more alike that we might imagine (or desire for some). [In an earlier post I stated that I do support civil unions for gay couples, but marriage is a union between a man and a woman that is blessed of God]
Lastly, my faith requires me to be concerned for your welfare, and the welfare of all mankind. Sorry, but I try to take the 'love thy neighbor' stuff to heart.
MajMike | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 1:31:19 PM | I appreciate your concern for others welfare... what I don't appreciate is attempting (or should I say accomplishing) changes in government to discriminate against people who
do not fall into your particular religious based beliefs of right and wrong.
I've argued this point around in circles with another person who thinks themselves a model Christian on this website and have no intention of doing it with you. I posted the link so others can draw their own conclusions. That is all. Thank you for you opinion, I will take it into concideration. I would hope you could do the same for mine.
Have a Nice Day. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 1:37:10 PM | I'm sorry if you thought I was trying to start an arguement, it wasn't my intention. Plus, I am not a 'model' anything, just a man trying to find his way in the world.
I am against an amendment about marriage, I get real nervous when folks talk about changing the Constitution.
May you too have a nice day.
MajMike | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 2:11:39 PM | | I'm not sure how other Wiccians/Pagans believe(because each one will believe differantly, we are so diverse), but me personally i don't think a soul is really in the child untill near birth, which is why some baby's are born dead, the soul leaves the body usually because of a defect or some other spiritual reason(it wasn't ready to come to earth yet so it leaves). At least thats my veiw, but others would probably argue the point, frankly i can't say i'm against it or for it, its the mothers choice and i don't think we have any right to say no she can't it is after all her body. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 3:18:17 PM | I have a question about that choice, I saw this in an article on marriage.
Women have the choice, but what about the man in the picture? If he is the husband/whatever, why does he not have any say? If the child is born he will certainly be expected to provide support, and it is his child too, so why does only the female control the choice?
I understand the 'her body' concept, but it seems to me the man is a second-class citizen when it comes to having a say in the life of his child. If you want us to be responsible when we are the father, we need to have a say in the choice as well, fair is fair.
MajMike | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 3:23:13 PM |
anti-Christian bigots try to sell the lie that only Christians oppose these horrendous evils
Well it usually is huge groups of Christians who are opposed to those things.
In all my years as a pro-lifer I only met one non-christian at the pro-life meetings...and he went to a Christian youth group.
I don't think that anti-Christian bigots are 'selling a lie' so much as they are GENERALIZING about the type of people who care about these issues.
You have to admit--Christians DO have the loudest voice against abortion and homosexuality in this continent. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 3:28:14 PM | MajMike... when men can carry the burden of an unwanted pregnancy
for 9 months then I'll be all for them having a say. I'd gladly transfer
over the fetus to them if I don't want the baby, they can have it
and raise it and I'll gladly pay child support. Then fair will be fair. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 4:07:12 PM | shannanigan
While I am pro-life (lower case), I do not believe abortion should be illegal, I don't want to overturn Roe v Wade. I just have a problem with some women using it as birth control, to me the sanctity of life means more than that.
I believe in abortion in case of incest and rape, and when the life of the mother is in jeopardy. There are just so many forms of birth control, not to mention abstinance, that an 'unwanted' pregnancy should not be such a common occurrence (and yes, I believe birth control is a joint responsibility).
Anyway, I'm not trying to start an arguement. I just would like to see abortion as an absolute last choice, and it seems to me that to too many woman, it's just another day.
Peace.
MajMike | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 4:21:15 PM | I don't think so MajMike.... I know women who have had them, and believe me it was not a decision made lighty. People want you (general term, not specifically YOU) to think these women are heartless and sleep with everyone with no thought to the consequences... and that can't be farther from the truth in MOST cases... not some or a minority of cases.
Accidents happen, stupidity happens, ignorance of alternatives to unsafe sex (due to abstinence only information) happen... and its nobodys right to make this decision for her. Conservatives preach small government and personal responsibility, yet want to do just the opposite when it comes to this issue. And thats not right. Its not the Governments right to pry into a woman's personal life and put her on trial essentially to decide if she was raped, or if was incest so she can "qualify" for an abortion or just her being irresponsible and denied... This Government has no business being in a delicate, life-changing decision for a women like this, and neither do you (again in general terms). | |
|
jimi77
| | Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 15 | |
| |
| |
Jivin
| | Joined: 2/10/2005
Msg: 17 | |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 6:20:51 PM | There is nothing evil about homoseualty. This idea is JudeoChristian in conception (include the Islamic faith in this, as they are all 'religions of the Book'). Our postmodern society is strngly based in these outdated beliefs. There is nothing in science that shows homosexuality to be evil. Some people are simply born this way and to say that they are evil for acting on such feelings is like telling a heterosexual that they are evil for having sex with the opposite gender.
I looked up the link on buddhism which Mike provided, and noticed he selectively read what he needed to (or lied). The order of monks calls for a life of celibacy. Any type of intercourse is discouraged; "It is not singled out for special condemnation, but rather simply mentioned along with a wide range of other sexual behaviour as contravening the rule that requires monks and nuns to be celibate"
Just another example of people trying to hang on to old beliefs. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 7:07:45 PM | Excuse me Jivin, I do not lie.
The link simply stated that homosexuality was not considered normal by the Buddhist people, but that it was also not as big a deal as it is here. Even the Dalai Lama has said "From a Buddhist point of view [lesbian and gay sex]...is generally considered sexual misconduct." see http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_budd.htm
Now, I am not saying it is 'evil', just that it is a sin (imo). Evil requires harm done against one's will or against innocent people, this ain't that.
Even if people are inclined that way (I don't believe conclusive evidence supports the 'born that way' theory, but there is also no conclusive evidence the other way), they still have free will and the choice to act upon those feelings or not, just as with theft, adultery, etc.
I seek and respect the opinions of others, and when I use sources I do so with good intent. That the evidence supports my position is one thing, I try not to "selectively" read it, nor do I make up items. I would rather be wrong than a liar.
The facts are that most faiths, societies and cultures see homosexuality as wrong (not evil), but it has varying degrees of stigma depending on the location.
It is your right to disagree with me, and I will respect that right, but the evidence I found via a Google search supports my position that most peoples see homosexuality as wrong.
MajMike | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 8:26:22 PM | @ loci you say;
Thats easy because its in YOUR christian bible that its wrong... So essentially its your faith who started all this crap to begin with.
My Christian bible also says lying, stealing and murdering are wrong.I presume from your above statement that you have a problem with those Christian beliefs as well? | |
|
Jivin
| | Joined: 2/10/2005
Msg: 20 | |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 9:50:43 PM | Mike -- You can do all of the google searches you want. The Judo Christian mentality still dominates the western world. Even though it has been greatly washed out over time, the idea of morality is affected by our roots. The vast majority of online content is published in a western nation. Honest question though; what is your suggestion to the countless individuals who grow up every bit as 'wholesomely' as the Bradiest Bunch family you can find, that grow up to have an attraction to their same gender? Should they live their life in celibacy? Should they try and marry someone of the opposite sex who they have no attraction to? I know far too many well-meaning, society contributing homosexual people (and far too many heterosexal misfits) to buy the idea that there is something wrong with their actions. I see no difference in their overall morality.
The link you sent me put homosexual behavior on the same level of 'condemnation' as heterosexual relations. Your logic is overly selective. There was a time when our society saw slavery as a right. Does that make it right?
BowVallly --that's also selective logic. Ideas of morality can overlap. You are conservativce correct? Both liberals and conservatives can agree that murder is wrong, while disagreeing on other topics. Murder, cheating, lying, and stealing all HURT those whom the action is being performed on. Apples to Oranges.... | |
|
koiguy
| | Joined: 10/21/2004
Msg: 21 | |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/17/2005 11:49:31 PM |
I do support civil unions for gay couples, but marriage is a union between a man and a woman that is blessed of God
No marriage is not a union blessed by God, while it is in the christian religion, but christians didnot start marriage, it has been around a lot longer than Jesus. For example my faith Buddhism sees nothing wrong with homosexual marriage, so to say that marriage is a union blessed by god is kind of bogarting the whole idea of marriage.
Civil unions are not ok because seperate but equal is a bigoted practice, that didn't work with the black and white issues, and won't work today, because it creates second class citizens. | |
|
koiguy
| | Joined: 10/21/2004
Msg: 22 | |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/18/2005 12:01:30 AM |
My Christian bible also says lying, stealing and murdering are wrong.I presume from your above statement that you have a problem with those Christian beliefs as well?
Your christian bible also says that women should be sent out of town during their periods, women should be stoned to death for cheating, and many more stupid laws, which I will gladly provide you with if you have forgotten them, but I am sure you are well versed in your bible, since you are such a nice chirstian boy. | |
|
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/18/2005 12:04:53 AM | Jivin' You ask:
question though; what is your suggestion to the countless individuals who grow up every bit as 'wholesomely' as the Bradiest Bunch family you can find, that grow up to have an attraction to their same gender? Should they live their life in celibacy? Should they try and marry someone of the opposite sex who they have no attraction to? I know far too many well-meaning, society contributing homosexual people (and far too many heterosexal misfits) to buy the idea that there is something wrong with their actions
Answer:Find a woman and practise. Practise makes perfect.
You State further:
The link you sent me put homosexual behavior on the same level of 'condemnation' as heterosexual relations. Your logic is overly selective. There was a time when our society saw slavery as a right. Does that make it right?
What? I never sent you any link. | |
|
| |
Jivin
| | Joined: 2/10/2005
Msg: 25 | |
| Why do people defend evil by pretending only Christians are opposed.
Posted: 2/18/2005 1:11:02 AM | BowValleyMike - regarding the link..I was talking to the other Mike you egocentric dork!
Answer:Find a woman and practise. Practise makes perfect.
Interesting. Go practice having sex with men. Practice makes perfect. No doubt the disgust you feel from that very thought is probably the equivelent of what goes through a homosexual person's mind from your above statement. The world's not as simple as your book of ancient superstitions would have you believe. | |
|
Home
login 
