| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 12:22:37 PM | Hello.
I'm an atheist. I find it offensively insulting that christians actually compare atheism to christianity. I find it absolutely rediculous. However, I've read the bible anyway (I like to know what I'm not belieiving, other holy books might get read too); and agree you should turn the other cheek.
So! My solution was I will let the people have their opinions. Now, since this is a *Religion* forum, and open to people having their opinions, I've decided to make a thread posting my opinion's and asking a question.
In advance, I do apologize if you find this offensive. Please do not read it if you do.
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Alchoholism can be defined as (and is defined by my University as):
A primary chronic disease influenced by genetic predisposition, psychosocial, environmental and cultural factors. The alcoholic who chooses to drink does so because of a complex interaction between these factors.
Now, christianity is defined as:
A monotheistic system of beliefs and practices based on the Old Testament and the teachings of Jesus as embodied in the New Testament and emphasizing the role of Jesus as savior
And Religion is defined as:
Religion—sometimes used interchangeably with faith or belief system—is commonly defined as belief concerning the supernatural, sacred, or divine, and the moral codes, practices and institutions associated with such belief. In its broadest sense some have defined it as the sum total of answers given to explain humankind's relationship with the universe. In the course of the development of religion, it has taken a huge number of forms in various cultures and individuals. ...
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So, we since Alchoholism, and Christianity (a monotheistic religion) are both derived from cultural links, among other factors, they can be compared.
Thus, my question to you is which method of delusion do you believe to be worse? And why?
-Pyke
P.S.: It's not alchoholism. | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:08:38 PM | This seems a bit inflammatory, non? Tolerance, like Christianity, is also a cultural construct. If you have a bone to pick with Christianity, or other religions, pick something specific and argue your point.
Also, please spell "alcohol" correctly - it's one of the main words in your argument.
GE&H | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:13:45 PM |
Also, please spell "alcohol" correctly - it's one of the main words in your argument.
I can't.
After I've consumed enough, it becomes alchohol :p.
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Consequently, I have picked a bone in other threads. The post does not say we should get rid of alcoholics or christians, it just asks which is worse for you over the course of your lifetime.
There are many reasons for it, I just figured I would receive the opinions of others before personally citing my own views and opinions :). | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:24:34 PM | Pyke,
You're not soliciting views, you're just being antagonistic. It's the equivalent of asking:
"Which is worse, prison sex or Athiesm? After all, they both attempt to fill an uncomfortable void."
It's mildly amusing at best, but doesn't really further the discourse.
GE&H | |
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 7 | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:33:19 PM | | You know, if you look at A.A. there basic philosophy is to worship alcohol... Think about it, the first thing they force you to say is 'I have no power over it'. | |
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 10 | |
| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:36:54 PM |
You know, if you look at A.A. there basic philosophy is to worship alcohol... Think about it, the first thing they force you to say is 'I have no power over it'.
Gotta' point there, I've always thought of A.A. as replacing one crutch with another instead of ditching the crutch. | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:52:16 PM |
The comparison is silly, ...I think a more appropriate comparison would be Christianity and A.A.
OK fair enough!
To the OP, why would you want to compare something like this lol? Alcoholism and pornography , thats a good question, but anyways, it's your thread.
For the record, last I heard , there was nothing good about alcoholism. | |
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 12 | |
| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:55:40 PM |
For the record, last I heard , there was nothing good about alcoholism.
'nother good point.
I think a lot of people labled "alcoholic" aren't, and the converse.
Some folks are just dumb-asses who drink too much.
Alcoholism and pornography
An interesting mix. | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 2:56:15 PM | Actually his comparison reminded me of something I read some time ago that suggested that Religions in general, not just Christianity, were "memes"...self-replicating mental virii would be the best way to describe it.
So a comparison between Christianity and Alcohol addiction, which on the surface seems silly and perhaps a touch antagonistic, is a way of putting it in context for a Western mind what the OP might see as a similarity between religion and substance abuse...."opiate of the masses" and all that.
Just a thought...
Before the WingCo. comes in and tells us all to stop being so silly...
And Now, A Scotsman on A Horse! | |
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 14 | |
| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 3:02:53 PM |
So a comparison between Christianity and Alcohol addiction, which on the surface seems silly and perhaps a touch antagonistic, is a way of putting it in context for a Western mind what the OP might see as a similarity between religion and substance abuse...."opiate of the masses" and all that.
Hmmmmm... the meme angle is compelling, ...and kinda' legitimate if you think about it.
And Now, A Scotsman on A Horse!
Lemon curry? | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 3:05:36 PM | | I've read numours blogs citing religious addiction... It does seem to make sense viewed within the context of Evangelicals and Revival movments. However I do not think religious addiction extends much beyond the 'faith healer'. | |
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| Christianity v. Alcoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 3:17:35 PM | When I made the post, I was thinking about it in the sense that I view Alcoholism as a disease upon mankind, something that people need help to deal with.
I (being an atheist) view christianity in much the same light. I believe it hinders social progress and is an impedement as opposed to a sign of social progress. Admittedly my original post wasn't very clear but that's what I meant.
The logic of Karl Marx (and opiate) is also another way of looking at it, where it's a drug people need to forget about the realities of life.
Think about it. People use alcohol to delude themselves from reality and life. I think many people use religion for much the same reason.
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On the otherhand, Alcoholics Anonymous is an organization where people go to get help with there problems, and is a positive concept (sobriety) replacing a negative one (drinking). It is an organization that seeks to help people, though not always in the best manner.
I think you could draw comparisons to Christianity in that it does seek to help people, but at the same time, not always in the best way and sometimes with significant consequences.
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I'm pretty tired atm so apologies if I wasn't clear up until now. I had to stop and remember why I posted what I did.
-Matt | |
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| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 4:51:13 PM | Ahhh, well, I imagine it depends on what we are drinking, if drinking at all ... wine, beer, spirits ??? And who made it? Where did it come from? Has it crossed water? Who drove the boat? Was fire involved? What was the standing time? Was the land arid or moist? Man or machine made?
This might lend to a better argument; perhaps a clearer picture too.
If I were to deduce your question, you are asking why, no?
Lest we are here again, submitting to another ontological debate; hook, line and sinker.
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Msg: 18 | |
| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 5:11:57 PM |
Ahhh, well, I imagine it depends on what we are drinking, if drinking at all ... wine, beer, spirits ??? And who made it? Where did it come from? Has it crossed water? Who drove the boat? Was fire involved? What was the standing time? Was the land arid or moist? Man or machine made?
This might lend to a better argument; perhaps a clearer picture too.
If I were to deduce your question, you are asking why, no?
Lest we are here again, submitting to another ontological debate; hook, line and sinker.
You win!
Drink of your choice
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Joined: 1/9/2005
Msg: 20 | |
| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 5:38:27 PM | Ahhh... a true believer.
MORE WINE!
...and I'd like a Jameson's, with a twist of meme.
Water into wine?
Drink this for it is my blood?
Anybody for a nightcap?
It is a bit unerving when you think about it.
My dad (RIP) was a pastor's son, he told me stories about stealing the communion wine during "the depression", ...that rascal.
http://homepage.mac.com/ewald/.Pictures/Dad.jpg | |
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| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 7:27:50 PM | | Alcoholism is worse because losing control of yourself and your ability to function can directly harm others. Being a Christian does not because your still 'you'. | |
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| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 7:33:07 PM | Ah...but Are you the "real" you? It could be argued that repeated exposure to the patterning, group-think, behaviour reinforcement both positive and negavtive, and inevitably fuzzy thinking, that a pattern of behaviour might emerge that "alters" the real you and moves you away from your true potential as much as slavery to the bottle...
And speaking of which...
I had a cask strength, ten year old Lagavulin which was heaven...I'd love some of that to be enslaved to...or Bruichladdich...my heart weeps the angel's share of tears at the thought! | |
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| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/10/2006 10:51:50 PM |
Think about it. People use alcohol to delude themselves from reality and life. I think many people use religion for much the same reason.
I agree.
People also make the (unjustified) excuse "Sorry. I was Drunk." when confronted with their actions.
Whats the corresponding religious statement? ... I wonder? | |
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| Christianity v. Alchoholism: Which is worse?
Posted: 8/11/2006 9:22:37 AM | Wow. Of all the silly ways to insult people...at least this one has some...imagination. Not a lot of imagination, but it's better than mere name calling.
I'm not Christian, so I'm not offended on that front..but I do see the potential for harm in comparing the two things here.
A lot of alcoholics turn to various religion to help them beat the addiction, if you sit here comparing the two and some poor soul reads it and takes it to heart instead of in jest then we've got a problem. | |
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