| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:05:46 PM | Not sure if this is the right place to post this, but here goes ...
Alright. I’ve been on POF now for four months, and the majority of my experience has been good. But I was at a party on Saturday when it hit me.
Judgement.
The incident reminded me of the saying, “don’t judge a book by it’s cover”. I’m not going to get into the slanderous incident, but the long and the short of it was that someone I knew was not only judged, but pre-judged, by someone who had never met or even spoken to them. It caught me off guard, how this person put on a display of having everyone in the room pegged, and judged, without any form of practical knowledge about a lot of people in the said group.
And it brought me back to the baldman experiment.
What is that you ask? Well ...
The experiment was about how people react to another based on their appearance. It was more a personal study based on my own experiences.
When I joined POF, I had long hair. For two months I was here, and the response to me, my posts, my emails, was probably more ignored than noticed. I had read forums and posts about the preferences and responses to long hair vs. short hair on guys, and was already considering shaving my head, as I had had long hair for the majority of my adult life and was considering a change. Well, one post suggested to ask my female friends at the time their opinion. So I did, complete with two pictures, one of me (with long hair), and another that I had generated on the computer without.
I was surprised when only one person preferred it long, and took the hint to get with the times. I shaved it, and it has been surprising the response, both here and even on the street.
Don’t judge a book by it’s cover.
Since then, I haven’t changed the written part of my profile, other than cleaning it up as I learned to use the bold and italic features of the program. I may have added a poem.
And yet, the response is significantly different. Even on the street I get a lot more smiles and hellos from strangers than I did with long hair. I wonder what people would've been thinking before, and what do they see now?
But this isn’t meant to be about my haircut or my ego.
It’s about judgement, more accurately, judging a book by it’s cover.
I believe I am still the same person I was two months ago. It only stands to reason. I have the same outlook, same goals, same hopes, dreams and desires.
My profile reads the same. It even says,
[u]Don’t judge a book by it’s cover[/u], and I have seen it in several others as well.
Now, I’ll be the first to admit, I don’t read EVERY profile I come across. I read a lot, in fact I would say most, but sometimes I look at a picture and continue on to the next one. But is that hypocritical? Am I doing the judging that I state, no, [u]tell[/u] people not to do?
I know there are a lot of threads about profiles, and responses to profiles out there. Maybe there is even one about this (and I apologize if it is redundant). But the profile is usually a small piece of the person. There's always more to know, especially if the person isn't very articulate. Some are well written, does that make them full of themselves?
So, I ask,
Do you find you judge people by their profiles before attempting to get to know them, or perhaps, do you feel judged by people out there who read yours? | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:12:26 PM | Everyone judges based on appearance. If you have long hair then you are a long-hair type of guy, not a short-hair type of guy. A woman that wants a long-haired guy is not going to be interested in me - or you. This is a dating site. Nobody is required to love you for you. They are not hiring you for a job. They are looking at you as boyfriend material.
People have to find you physically attractive before they even want to find out if you are even date worthy. So, the first thing they judge is your look to see if it appeals to them. Then if it does, it goes to step 2. Your personality. If you don't have the look they are after, then you don't get to step 2.
That's life, that's nature. It's been that way for 500 million years. When your ancestors were hanging from trees, they spied each other for their looks, not for their personality. When a peacock spreads his feathers, do you think he is showcasing his personality? | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:15:07 PM | Not really sure what you mean by "judge" We all judge and are judged.
But while here, I don't believe I JUDGE people based on their profile. I do evaluate them as far as their compatibility with me goes but I don't judge them as people. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:23:49 PM | Do you find you judge people by their profiles before attempting to get to know them, or perhaps, do you feel judged by people out there who read yours?
I do tend to draw an impression of someone based on what they have written in their profile. If after reading it - or lack there of due to having one or two lines - I will determine whether I'd want to contact her or not. Now I have read some profiles that had a few lines, but they were so intriguing that I did make contact. This however is a very rare find. I have to find it meaningful in order to draw my interest.
I value someone who can express themselves through written words as well as conventionally. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:29:14 PM | Like I said, it's not about my ego or my haircut.
It's not even about searching for compatibility.
The incident the other night was judgement with no basis. Like going the extra step and thinking someone is a loser or a b!tch.
That kind of thing. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:32:33 PM |
Do you find you judge people by their profiles before attempting to get to know them, or perhaps, do you feel judged by people out there who read yours?
There are simply to many people to get to know on this site. I think I read somewhere lately that POF was one of the largest dating Internet sites around, including pay site. You have to "prejudge", though I prefer to call it screen. I recognize that some people aren't as articulate as other, and most have a difficult time when it comes to writing about themselves, but the profile is where it all begins. "Don't Judge a Book By It's Cover" my sound fine, but l am pretty sure that came from a Writer who couldn't afford a Publishing Company.. With a lot of people, the cover is all you get. They spend a life time hiding their true self from all those around them. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:33:25 PM |
Do you find you judge people by their profiles before attempting to get to know them, or perhaps, do you feel judged by people out there who read yours?
That was your original question.
As far as what happened to you the other night, any judgement without basis or information is invalid and says more about the person doing the judging. Just tells me that they're not people that I would choose to know. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:37:47 PM | So, the first thing they judge is your look to see if it appeals to them. Then if it does, it goes to step 2. Your personality. If you don't have the look they are after, then you don't get to step 2.
Actually, I think you can ignore step 2 if you can get to know someone’s personality first... through the forums for example. A lot of people would agree that someone's personality would be readily displayed in the manner in which they post and comment on any given thread. I think it is possible for people to in a sense get a feel for someone based on this. It may affect change on their original impressions of the way someone looks, or it may not. I think it is possible nonetheless.
When a peacock spreads his feathers, do you think he is showcasing his personality?
This would depend on the manner in which he ruffles his feathers, how he struts his stuff, whether he slowly displays his feathers or quickly, his body language, whether he has his back to the sun or is facing it, further illuminating the magnificence... In spite of what we think, I believe personality has more to do with it than we'd like to think.
My $0.02.
Edit:
I recognize that some people aren't as articulate as other, and most have a difficult time when it comes to writing about themselves, but the profile is where it all begins.
I agree, for you have nothing else to go on other than what you read and see within it. If we didn't take this into account, than what makes this any different than meeting people on the streets? Just the fact that you see people you would never have had an opportunity to otherwise. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:37:55 PM |
any judgement without basis or information is invalid and says more about the person doing the judging
couldn't agree with you more. I was caught totally off guard, and so I was just curious how much of this goes on. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:42:09 PM | I don't think you contributed to ease of judgement by going from one extreme to another (long to shaved).
Times change, styles also. What was so cool yesterday is "retro" today. What's looking at us from the covers is what we expect to see in the mirror and in those around us.
Great decision to experiment based upon opinions. Of course you are the same person, but when we look at pictures - do we really expect to see "personality"? Nahhh... | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:51:44 PM | "Don't judge lest you be judged." I try to make my judgments fair. Alas with the vast majority of e-mails I send to people on Plenty of Fish, very few respond. Only two became reasonable friends, and a few rejections. I know many more people in the real world I've met who I've had better luck with. So it would seem much is judged, and few people take the opportunity to find out more. Of the two friends, one initiated contact though didn't quite seem to have the right schedule in my life to make it serious, and the other I initiated contact. At least 30 people I've written have not written back. And I make an effort to articulate well, check my spelling, and check my grammar. It seems either these people are getting too many responses to bother responding, or don't care the fact they are still leaving themselves up as available on PoF, or basically don't know what they are missing when they disregard someone like me without asking further questions. I try to be as interesting as I can be, because I enjoy being myself. Still doesn't seem to win many dates. Must have not been looking the right places.
Still looking! | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:52:36 PM | @ ex-princess
But that's the point! How can anyone make a decision based on looks? Or even a profile? Two radically different "looks" produce the same person, and yet the reactions are so different, and without basis.
To judge the book you have to read. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 6:59:00 PM | But that's the point! How can anyone make a decision based on looks? Or even a profile? Two radically different "looks" produce the same person, and yet the reactions are so different, and without basis.
Bald men are less threatening... or so it may seem.
Why do you buy that pair of shoe vs. the other? Why do you buy those jeans vs the other? Why this colour vs. the other? We judge anything and everything because we have the power to do so. From the type of watch you buy to the relationships you desire, there is no escape. For when you make your choice, you've decided that the one you elected is your preference vs all of the other given choices made available.
We all judge as it is a behavior that is defined in our way of life. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:08:54 PM |
Bald men are less threatening... or so it may seem.
really? I've been told more of the opposite.
Why do you buy that pair of shoe vs. the other? Why do you buy those jeans vs the other? Why this colour vs. the other? We judge anything and everything because we have the power to do so. From the type of watch you buy to the relationships you desire, there is no escape. For when you make your choice, you've decided that the one you elected is your preference vs all of the other given choices made available.
Sure, talking about products there are different makes and models with different features. But in the experiment, it was simply the cover of the book that changed. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:10:15 PM | Have to admit I have: Saw a profile the other day that said FOR BLACK WOMEN ONLY. Thought it was funny because of it's blatant racism so I thought I'd read the whole thing. The whole thing was even funnier. The guy said he was "college educated" and had his Masters in Child "Phsychology". Couldn't even spell the name of the damn degree he had supposedly gone to college for!
I judged him based on his profile. I think he's an a$$.
(In hindsight I no longer think it's as funny as sad.) | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:18:19 PM | Imagine my surprise when I saw this thread 
I have used this same quote as my tag line since I joined POF; and trust me a lot of people do judge a book by its cover.
Some are strait out cruel and some more tactful but believe you me when it comes to this quote truer words were never spoken.
If any one cares to really see what I mean just look up some of the treads I have been involved with and some of the comments I have received.
I think the hardest thing I have tried to let people understand is that I am not looking for a care giver I am looking for a partner. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:19:42 PM | I was at the same place you were Saturday and if there was any judgement going on, these people were pretty smooth......is that part of the judging? do they do it behind your back? or is anyone willing to not judge and just come up to you and face you and see who you really are apart from the profile?
me thinks..........its time to rethink................ | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:20:30 PM | @ JMBlucat
@ ex-princess
But that's the point! How can anyone make a decision based on looks? Or even a profile? Two radically different "looks" produce the same person, and yet the reactions are so different, and without basis.
To judge the book you have to read.
Let's define "decision" here - to like what we see or to like what we may see if we really look?
Nahhh... easier to go to the next profile... For some, I guess. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:26:51 PM |
To judge the book you have to read.
You can't possibly read all the books out there, so you have to pick and choose. Your profile is only there to spark someones interest in you. Once the interest is sparked then the book will be read. I don't know anyone that goes into a book store and reads part of the book to decide if they are going to buy it. They read the profiles first. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:30:35 PM | for some reason I dont think this thread was based on profiles, as this was an event where people were one on one, two by two.....and if someone wanted to explore another person and get to know them....the perfect opportunity existed...yet they still choose to judge people by what they saw!
shame shame shame | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:35:47 PM |
But that's the point! How can anyone make a decision based on looks? Or even a profile? Two radically different "looks" produce the same person, and yet the reactions are so different, and without basis.
Be honest here. I can show up at a bar unshaven, unwashed and yet still be the very same guy. But I can't possibly reproach anyone for thinking poorly of me and reacting negatively. You seem to suggest some sort of spiritual decay in society that such a thing would happen.  | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:36:56 PM | really? I've been told more of the opposite.
It's not so much a personal opinion, but something I've been programmed to think... can't remember if I read it somewhere, or how I came to have this idea. I don't find people threatening based on a visual survey, it's more about the behavior that determines whether I will feel uneasy.
Sure, talking about products there are different makes and models with different features. But in the experiment, it was simply the cover of the book that changed.
I understand, yet most people I do not think can identify the difference. We are so used to comparing anything and everything day after day, that it's as though a habit has developed. On top of this, we have the media reinforcing all of these notions of what a "nerd" looks like, what a "bad guy" looks like, what a "nice guy" looks like, and most importantly what a "good looking person" looks like. That is probably why people have changed their views after you shaved your head. Our views of certain cookie cutters are defined by the sources we accept as valid.
GQ & Vogue are seemingly valued more than our own eyes. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:40:11 PM | I know, the diamond in the rough needs to be polished, needs work done to it.
I think a lot of people really miss out on meeting some great people here. It is so easy to say hello. I've done it, and by gosh those people said hi back most of the time.
Maybe expectations and preconceived notions should be put on the back burner in a lot of cases. I guess that's why I look for friends first. It can take time for true colours to shine, or go dull ..
.. and yes Mirage, we were under the same roof, but not always in the same place, not always at the same times, not always talking to the same folks .. | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:41:50 PM | Judging a book by it's cover...well, well, this must have me written all over it..I just replied to another thread which is similar..I am going to post almost the same thing...
Your right OP..People do judge books by the cover.and not just profiles..but by looks or demeanor.... I feel I am average, attractive..clean up nice..but it's not just the men that judge it's also the women....I think women actually are twice as bad..no one bothers to see the real person..or to maybe consider that the person is shy..they look at the "cover" and don't bother..
I am rather fed up with it..but have come to the conclusion that these people are not worthy of my time and effort..I shouldn't judge them by the fact that they are judging me..as it is not in my nature..BUT
If they don't want to get to know the real me..or can't be bothered because thet feel threatened..by the "cover" then phffttttt and that includes the women..I have gone to several events...and because I am shy..I am classed everything from aloof to b!tch to the "c" word..
Just my two cents worth..
GEB | |
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| judging a book by its cover ...
Posted: 8/15/2006 7:51:14 PM | Well GEB, when I was a kid, I was shy and everybody thought I was a jerk because of it. So now I'm a jerk for real.  | |
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