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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 2:27:55 AM | I have stated in some threads that I think another civil war will happen in the United States sometime in the next ten years, a couple have agreed, and to my knowledge, no one disagreed with that statment.
Its clear the right and the left have become very polarized, yet I'm thinking both sides want much of the same things. That became clear from my thread that asked why is socialism popular in the threads. That was a good thread, and believe it or not many of you have gained my respect. Yet many still look at the other side as if they are the Nazi Party of America, myself incuded...this has to change.
As if I were hit by a ton of bricks I have come to realize that my party is being hijacked like the other one is, and make no mistake it is. In another thread the question was asked if both parties act as one. I think the answers all down the other thread was yes. I think we all know its being done, yet why are we developing hatred for the other side, if in effect there is no other side?
It is clear to me, this invisable party wants to divide america, and bring about another Civil war. What is not clear is the who or the why and how it will develop.
Who is this invisable non elected party who has hijacked both the Democrates and Republicans? What can we do to stop it? Would it even matter if we replaced both parties, or would we be playing into their hands?
Note: Both Bush and Kerry belonged to the skull and crossbones...perhaps this is a very big clue. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/10/02/60minutes/main576332.shtml
http://www.bilderberg.org/skulbone.htm <---this also looks interesting | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 7:05:44 AM | I believe greed is Americas biggest enemy right now.
Greed from your power players, not your average citizen.
And if there was ever another civil war, it could very well be the rich against the poor, which would remain consistant with most uprisings in humanity's past. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 8:15:43 AM | It is imperative that the focus of the argument change from "Repub vs Democrat" to the real issues, because that one ain't it. One needs to look at the reasons for the mounting discontent, and then determine what the solutions are. While certainly not an exhaustive list, I see some of the primary "institutionalized" problems being:
1) Congress no longer works for the people's interests, and haven't for a long time,
2) Corporations have so much influence in Congress, that greed, money and gaining/retaining power have become their only true concerns,
3) The income gap between the rich and poor is widening at a frightening pace, causing socioeconomic issues to widen and become more divisive and hostile (school funding, lack of proper healthcare, housing affordability, jobs being cut or shipped overseas, etc)
4) Corruption in our gov't, in our elections, and in how corporations fleece the consumer
There is no "magic pill" that will solve all these problems at once, most people will agree. But, if we don't stand up to the criminals who are supposed to be representing us, and demand without compromise, three essential things, we will most definitely have a civil war in this country within my lifetime.
1) Comprehensive campaign finance reform, including publicly financed elections,
2) Comprehensive Lobby reform, strictly limiting the undue amount of influence corporations have on legislation and legislators, and
3) Comprehensive election reform, including paper trails for every vote, and reform in the way congressional districts are drawn/redrawn.
If we don't get these things done, this country will continue to erode from within, we will lose credibility and financial influence in the world, and the people will start rising up against their government.
I hope it doesn't come to that, but I don't see any other way around it. One look at how individual senators and representatives actually vote on the bills put before them will tell you that they only care about enriching themselves, pandering to big business, and keeping themselves in office. It should make people angry........very angry. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 3:19:14 PM | It's the rich versus the poor!
Well if you meen its the elite vs the non-elite I would have to agree. The rich on both sides are ruining the country and I think your right in part, but I think it goes much deeper. We will always have the rich and the poor, nothing can stop that. The elite are smart people, I think they want a war, but why? What would they have to gain by it?
The rich and to poor will fight on both sides, remember it takes money to start a war! It could be a simple thing like the rich vs poor or nationalist vs globalist. I think the ladder is the most likely, because as I already stated. the rich on both sides will be needed to fund the war. The invisable party I mentioned in the first post, could be strongly influenced by a foreign power.
The people who fought in the first civil war really didn't know what the war was about when it was in their faces. They thought they faught to keep the union in tact or for state rights, it was not about freeing the slaves. Ulysses S. Grant stated "I fought for the union, if I knew it was about freeing slaves, I would have faught for confederation instead!"
We have to be very careful, to be on the right side when it happends, because when and if it happends, we want to be fighting on the right side. The media in throwing so much BS our way its hard to sort fact from fiction.
1) Comprehensive campaign finance reform, including publicly financed elections,
2) Comprehensive Lobby reform, strictly limiting the undue amount of influence corporations have on legislation and legislators, and
3) Comprehensive election reform, including paper trails for every vote, and reform in the way congressional districts are drawn/redrawn. These are some interesting ideas, and a great place to start. I would also add that we have fight to make our government smaller too. We should have all non-elected government officails have two year employment contracts, Because the police and social workers etc. often abuse their power, and no one ever elected them. If they really do well they can re-apply for another two years. As its stands now, its very hard to fire these people for mis-conduct. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 3:58:47 PM | It can happen...But if the rich kick the poor's ass who the f ck is gonna work for them It won't be a war between the states it will be a war between the classes...A war spilling money, not much blood....At least the media won't report on it much..My 2 cents. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 4:43:06 PM | yea there will be another Civil War and how about you look at it this way, the haves
vs. the havenots, no, but the public sector vs the private, yeah, not the
rich vs poor.
But the Lords and Ladies as defined by those who take a gov. pay check and the ones
who actually have to perform for their wage in the private.
I have no rancor toward the rich, but the public sector oh yea from the road workers
to the school teachers to the elected ones.
Come the revolution
1) Comprehensive campaign finance reform, including publicly financed elections,
don't like this one. If the public finances the campaign the
the ones running, already in office, decide the criteria for who gets the
money...see a problem? | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 5:35:24 PM | Has John Titor returned??
In all seriousness, it seems to me the Stone Cutters are definitely behind all this. . .
Who held back the electric car?
Who made Steve Guttenberg a star? | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 5:54:56 PM | I think it will be between the nationalist vs globalist or something, the rich and poor will fight together on both sides.
Here is how the next civil war could start. Texas can vote itself out of the union. It is the only state that has the legal right too. However Texas has oil and other resources. Now lets say they do it legaly, and publiclay state the USA is not following or protecting the constitution for one reason or another. This wouldn't be good for the United States in any way, infact it would hurt the USA both domestic and world fronts.
Washington would be insulted, and wouldn't recognize Texas as its own sovereign nation no matter how they leave the union. It would be considered a rouge state, and the national gaurd would be dispatched to Texas to "bring order". American citizines will die like the ones in Iraq.
Boths sides of the political spectum will blame the other for what had transpired, open riots will erupt across the nation. Many Americans who riot will be arrested and held as terrorist.
If the wrong president is in office, a state of emergancy will be declared. Thus the constitution and freedomas we know it will be suspended.
The US Military will be divided after they're ordered to open fire on American civilians.
Some will follow orders, others will obey the oath they swore to protect the constitution against both foreign and domestic enemies. Even if the domestic enemy becomes the US government itself.
The states can be divided as the were in the first civil war. There is more than one way it can start, I know it all sounds nuts...but if someone told you in 1999 that the WTC, The Pentagon and other events that happened on and after 9/11/2201 could happen you would have told me I'm nuts wouldn't you have? We live in a crazy time, expect to see a lot of crazy things in the future. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 7:13:37 PM |
Who held back the electric car?
Who made Steve Guttenberg a star?
We Do! We Do!
Who robs cavefish of their sight
Who rigs every Oscar night?
----
But I gotta say, the whole "President Bush and John Kerry were in the same frat when they were 20, so obviously, 20-40 years later, they're working together" idea is lame.
Did you know that John Kerry and President Bush are related?
It can't be a concidence! | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 7:27:46 PM | No chance in hell.
Civil war would have to be brought about by suffering in the US. As long as the US citizens enjoy such health, oportunity, and wealth there is no way in hell.
Edit... before you reply, think that the poorist in the US know wealth that much of the world has never seen. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 8:09:12 PM |
Edit... before you reply, think that the poorist in the US know wealth that much of the world has never seen.
Does....that even make sense?
Certainly the world is wealthy, not just the US....
But I do agree- something will have to change before Civil War starts. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 8:18:03 PM |
Edit... before you reply, think that the poorist in the US know wealth that much of the world has never seen.
Does....that even make sense?
Yes that makes a lot of sense.
Imagine earning an income of less than $2.00 per day. Thats what roughly 50% of the world have to get by on. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 9:11:48 PM |
Does....that even make sense?
I met a man in a very popular area of Pasadena known as Old Town, who makes $150 to $200, in handouts on Friday and Saturday night. He has no home, no car, etc etc... and is still poor. Even those that are in bad areas can find some cash... probably at least $10 to $20 a day... and thats enough money for three large meals every day if they chose to eat.
That doesn't include how many shelters and programs exist to help them get off the street.
So yeah... our poor are rich. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/10/2006 9:34:06 PM | | Not all poor panhandle many have no self esteem and feel they cannot do anything at all I knew a guy panhandled over two grand in one day quite amazing..But depression is a horrible thing I don't think our poor are rich but they are doing alot better than some other countries, and our working class poor have it pretty rough..As far as shelters and programs I have to disagree with you there they don't help everyone many shelters and programs get grants from the gov. and other sources and sh t on the homeless..My 2 cents..Also homeless children have no protection especally in the bigger cities they are forced into sex I saw it and experienced it when I was a kid, it's still going on..I know what you mean though there are cons in every class of life. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 12:02:55 AM | No civil war will ever be the result of the poor rising up against the rich, not in this country.
that other side of history bullshit will have nothing to do with it, although I can see the left wingers getting blamed too. I could also see that poor vs rich as a smoke screen to hide the truth, what ever that may be.
I do see a war happening if a globalist gets in the white house, and one will soon. If they sell out American rights to the UN there will be a civil war! Texas will likely seud from the union in that event, and the chain reaction I stated above will happen.
I think much of what is going on is by foreign intrusion into our politics right now. The USA is the only standing super power left in the world. We can't be hit head on, we will destroy any attacking forces with a great deal of ease.
The best way to deal with us is to try to manipulate a civil war by hijacking the political prosses. They do this in many ways, and many things that are related seem unrealated to the other. Look at the border problem, look how they are trying to give non citizens the right to vote! Look at how much of our technolagy was stolen by China in the Clintion years, look at how we seemed to lose some freedoms in this administration. Don't fool yourself into thinking its unrealated. Thats just what we can see on the surfice, and a few pieces to a much bigger puzzle.
A war could very well be looming around the corner, and not to many people will ever know what it is about. Some of what I read shows that shows me how easy it will be to distract you from the truth........the best way to stop a civil war is to become re-united. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 1:02:40 AM | It's highly unlikely, but it makes a great fantasy for passing the hours in your bunker in the mountains of Idaho. But how will I justify the thousands of dollars I put into survival gear? No, I'm kidding , usually I don't like my ideas being made fun of, but that was funny dude. 
Anyway, I don't wan't a civil war, that would Fu*k up my day. I'm just starting to see connections through the haze given of by the media. I'm telling people not to say "oh that won't happen to me" or "that won't happen again or in america". because things like that can happen. The only way to pervent it is to watch for traps that will lead us there.
As the old saying goes.."an ounce of pervention is better than a pound of cure". I think thats a understatment in this case, but I think you get the idea.
People, you got to quit with the Communist poor will rise up against the rich Bullshit, there is no way it will happen like that, because as I said above.....Wars costs lots and lots of money, the poor could not afford it. Plus as someone stated, our poor are richer than most of the world, I agree | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 9:48:47 AM | I guess the Democrats will lose any war...let alone a civil war...Why you ask?...The second amendment....very few tree huggers own guns! It would be like taking candy from a baby!
I have all my guns loaded...I have over 4000 rounds of Ammo...buying more every week...come and get it fella`s! | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 10:23:31 AM | Not sure RWGG...but you sound like a candidate for a hooded sweatshirt and a manifesto. You are fond of saying how moderate you are but when the possibilty of getting a chance to shoot some Dems comes up..you're at the front of the line....very telling even if you're kidding.
There will be no civil war. Too many people in power w/ too much too lose on both sides of the aisle. No class warfare either. As has been stated....war costs $....and unless RWGG turns arms dealer for the poor...that won't happen either.
Yes this is a very divided nation now. But relative to the problems much of the rest of the world has...it's really not that bad. I am as disgusted as any by the behavior of our gov't. the last 6 years but not to the point of armed revolt. Our worst fears about war may be realized in the next ten years.....but if our foriegn policy remains the same, someone else will attack us long before we take to fighting amongst ourselves.
This isn't 1861.......we can't just walk out, grab our rifles, and go fight some yanks in a field somewhere. And what would be the divisive issue? The first Civil War had the state's rights and slavery and other issuesthat were clearly defined. Either you thought the slaves should be free or you didn't. Either you thought the states should be able to leave the Union or you didn't. What would we be fighting about here? This group of people has more money than me? Every group has their own issues they care about. I won't fight for yours if I don't care about them(gay marriage for example....couldn't care less if gay people marry....but some people get downright violent about it). As i'm sure many people wouldn't care about my concerns(foriegn policy, fiscal irresponsibility, illegal wiretaps, Patriot Act).
It's our divisive nature that will prevent any such "civil war". | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 11:40:41 AM | Cavalier...
I will defend myself against anyone....would you not?...
I do not see a civil war coming...Nor do I want one. And yea...some dems need to be shot...along with some Republicans....But why would I waste a good bullet. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 11:51:56 AM | I think it quite likely.
But it won't be rich vs. poor. It will be 'Right' vs. 'Left'.
People on both sides of the divide are coming to believe that the people on the other side aren't Americans. And as such have no right to 'Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness'. Indeed, in my opinion, the people behind the current administration are working very hard to deepen and sharpen this idea. And there are people opposed to this administration who are working just as hard.
Plus the U.S., again in my opinion, has a taste for violence. From what I've read in history the U.S. more than any other Western nation has been shaped by the violence within it.
When your neighbour is one of 'those people', you have weapons and are willing to use them, it's not long before the shooting starts. Look at the former Yugoslavia. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 12:38:04 PM | I don't think we'll have a civil war. the economy is too good.
However, we may have occasional violent outbreaks from time to time: from large segments of the population in the hoods, we may have riots, like in Los Angeles.
From individuals on the right in the red states: terrorist attacks ... like the Oklahoma City bombing...
At least, that's been the pattern for awhile now. I doubt it will change much. | |
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| Another American Civil War, is that likely?
Posted: 9/11/2006 12:46:43 PM | I think a revolution in the US would be to elect non major party candidates into the whitehouse and other offices. ;)
We are boring people I guess. | |
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