| | What’s gone wrong with America?Page 1 of 6 (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6) | I Like America and Americans. I like the humor of Woody Allan, Bill Hicks, Chris Rock, I like the music of the Talking heads and Springsteen, and I’m continually impressed with the intellectual firepower displayed in the posts and of Americans I meet. God help me I'm even grateful for all that Bill Gates has bought me.
But something’s going wrong over there.
We are asked to accept a creed that does not ring true nor seem sustainable. We are told that a huge disparity between rich and poor is necessary to provide the carrot and stick that will drive America into a prosperous future.
We are told that good corporations are those who that maximize profits for a few. These corperations are under no social obligation to the communities they live off or the workers that toil for them; In fact these workers are seen as little more than chattel.
To are told that taxation is an evil, a burden distorting peoples lives, so getting funds to maintain schools, hospitals, parks, etc is a struggle. The rich only have an obligation to the poor as their conscience dictates.
America, you are heading for a chasm. The future looks bleak. What’s going on? | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 10:11:46 AM | "We are told that a huge disparity between rich and poor is necessary to provide the carrot and stick that will drive America into a prosperous future."
Funny, I live in American and I've never been told that. That's what the left here would want you to think.
Think about this for a second.......
My best friend is black and liberal and he made a statement the other day which got me thinking. He was saying that conservatives are only "for" the rich and that if you're rich you might as well vote republican b/c they only serve your interests. He even said if he was rich, he probably would vote republican.
Now, libs here would have you think that they are "for" the poor and conservatives are "for" the rich. However, if that's the thinking, what good does it do conservatives to "keep" people poor?
So that's what I told him. What does it benefit the republicans to keep poor people poor, if in doing it keeps the poor supporting liberals? And what does it benefit the liberals to come up with ideas that make the poor rich, if in doing so (according to my friend) they would end up supporting conservatives. Doesn't it stand to reason then that conservatives would be the ones trying to come up with ideas to get people out of poverty?
Conservative ideas are custom-made to allow the poor to rise up out of their poverty. It might not seem like it at first however. People HAVE TO BE WILLING TO TAKE THE INTIATIVE ON THEMSELVES. You can't blame the government on your predicament. There are plenty who will think I'm wrong, but the evidence is all around us. Just look at anyone who didn't inherit their money but is self-made.
If you listen to any self-help book or motivational speaker they ALL say much the same thing. You have to go out and do things on your own. If you're solely reliant on the government one things for certain....you'll never be rich.
| |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 10:21:18 AM |
Conservative ideas are custom-made to allow the poor to rise up out of their poverty. It might not seem like it at first however. People HAVE TO BE WILLING TO TAKE THE INTIATIVE ON THEMSELVES. You can't blame the government on your predicament. There are plenty who will think I'm wrong, but the evidence is all around us. Just look at anyone who didn't inherit their money is self-made.
I agree: We have a social and economic mobility unknown throughout much of the world. And there is a big difference between the extremely rich and everyone else. But even the folks that are middle class are rich compared witht he world. Heck, our poverty standards of 12,000 Dollars a year is extremely high compared to the rest of the world. I think Americans believe that gov't is the last resort solution to social and economic problems. And that our money is better spent investing in our future and not wasted on social services that perpetuate poverty and entitlement. It's a different way of thinking but we've been very successful at it. We have our problems but so do societies that take a different approach. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:06:24 AM | The main difference between the two parties right now is that Republicans want to promote ownership by providing the tools it takes for people to get an education, obtain a good a job and live up to their potential.
The Democrats want the people that have worked hard to achieve their success, pay for it all so they can give it to everyone else for free...
If you are hardworking and a self starter with goals and ambitions you'll likely vote Republican.
If you think moral depravity is acceptable and everyone deserves a free handout, you'll probably vote Democrat... | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:16:55 AM | ^^^ Moral Depravity. Give me a fk'ing break. You are such a bigotted jerk.
I make a lot of money and worked d*mn hard to get where I am and
I vote Democrat and I always will. I believe I should help those less fortunate
than myself through paying taxes because if it were that easy to make it in this
world nobody would be poor and all would be able to afford a home and healthcare
and good eductation for their children. ... that is something most Republicans
don't understand because they're selfish people trying to fool themselves into
thinking they are being "pro-active" and have delusions of Moral Grandeur. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:21:37 AM | | Most conservatives don't have a problem with the gov't helping people who are actually in need. It's when the system gets abused that problems arise. And it gets abused A LOT. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:26:08 AM | ^^^ I agree with that... what I don't agree with is dismantling
social services all together because of the abuse of the system
and a few whiney babies complaining that the poor are "stealing"
their hard earned money.
Fix it. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:26:22 AM | | I don't vote either way generally, I vote for other parties, because I think that Republicans and Democrats are two hands holding same d1ck, and stroking it oh so gently. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:27:46 AM | ^^^ Moral Depravity. Give me a fk'ing break. You are such a bigotted jerk.
Nice....
There is a big difference between helping someone down on their luck and enabling someone who will never try and help themselves.
If you want to do good things and help those that won't help themselves, feel free to work hard and give your money away to them. I would much prefer to help people that want the help by giving them a good job so they can provide a good living for their families. I would much rather do this myself rather than have our Government try and do it. They are sorely ineffective at running such programs... | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:27:48 AM | Eccentric... I don't agree with either party 100%.
But the Dems are the lesser evil to me, and
voting for a 3rd party is a wasted vote that helps
the Republicans win. But thats a conversation
for 2006 when I have to vote again.... right now
I'm talking about us morally depraved liberal Democrats. | |
|
| |
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:31:54 AM | | Isn't that how we got rid of the wigs party, if enough people stop voting for those parties then they will lose control. Even if my differance is small now, I hope that I can affect enough people that our future may be brighter then our past or present | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:32:12 AM |
If you want to do good things and help those that won't help themselves, feel free to work hard and give your money away to them. I would much prefer to help people that want the help by giving them a good job so they can provide a good living for their families. I would much rather do this myself rather than have our Government try and do it. They are sorely ineffective at running such programs...
Exactly how do you think this is going to be accomplished without
social service programs and taxes? Do you really think the Government
controls private sector jobs? I'm curious.... should Churchs only give hand outs?
No fk'ing way. Its the Governments job to take care of its people when
the economy and job markets fail them. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:33:19 AM |
Isn't that how we got rid of the wigs party, if enough people stop voting for those parties then they will lose control. Even if my differance is small now, I hope that I can affect enough people that our future may be brighter then our past or present
Well none of the 3rd parties out their impress me either.
When one comes along that I agree with 99% then it
will be worth it to vote for them. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:37:07 AM | | People, please kepp calling each other names, that is if it makes you happy cause I'm grinnin' in the high country here. Considering myself Moderate but on the left, I asked this question in the budget post, Is Bush a Fiscal Conservative? Forget hearts and souls for just a minute, lets think about numbers on this one. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:39:14 AM |
Its the Governments job to take care of its people when the economy and job markets fail them.
What a ridiculous statement.
It's the job of families to take care of each other. There isn't a single person that could not change their future with well placed hard work. The Government's job is to provide a safe environment for people to pursue their dreams. It's not to change their diapers and give them free handouts.
Social programs are best operated by the people in that society, not by Government. Anyone with intelligence knows this. Volunteer and faith based programs are the most successful programs being managed in America. From schools to rehab centers they do a more efficient job with greater success.
Big Government mentality is a stop gap that uneducated morons cling to hoping that it will develop to the point of a total re-distribution of wealth... | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:39:34 AM | People, please kepp calling each other names, that is if it makes you happy
It does actually... I thoroughly enjoy swearing like a Sailor. 
As to the Bush question.... he is nowhere NEAR being a Fiscal Conservative
or a believer in "smaller government". Thats all lip service for his voter base... | |
|
| |
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:46:42 AM |
he is nowhere NEAR being a Fiscal Conservative
or a believer in "smaller government".
Amen to that. My problem with Bush is that he gets it on the terrorism issue. I know other disagree but my gut is he gets it. But when it comes to fiscal issues, he is no conservative. I think many of us fiscal conservatives feel the same way many liberals did when Clinton signed welfare reform. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:51:52 AM | I disagree Kadmus, Bush gets it but he had a mountain to overcome with what Clinton left him. Add to that the debt from 9/11, the creation of Homeland Security and the rest of the money spent on Afghanistan and Iraq and there is no wonder we have some issues to resolve.
I will say that he certainly does have a finger on what makes the economy move. Simply by building the economy he can reduce the Debt Ratio. He's already unveiled a viable plan that would cut the deficit in half in 5 years.
He's on the right track in most areas. Where he does miss it bigtime is with Mexico, Immigration and our borders... | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 11:57:04 AM | | perhaps the question isn't "what's wrong with America?" but it's "what's wrong with this world?". i watched a tv show last night on A&E (i think it was that channel) and it showed 1 day in different parts of there world where war is going on. in one country there was a 14 year old buy holding an AK-47. he was a gun for hire. after the show ended it stated that he had died 4 days after the show was made. perhaps it's things like that which show we're still much better off than other places. our hands should be reaching out to help countries like that. in the past there has been countries in which genocide has taken place, isn't this still going on somewhere? i wish i could remember where it is... anyhoo, the US isn't exactly taking a nose dive. there will always be problems here, as would be any other country. you should take a look around at these 3rd world countries and ask what's wrong there? i think that would be a better question. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 12:04:18 PM | I agree that he's got some issues to overcome. Creating the Homeland Security dept. was one of them. And generally I exclude the wars and DHS in my judgement. But he also created a huge federal entitlement with the prescription drug medicare program. He's also messing with state education with the NCLB act. His approach to many social problems has been to add more government. Then I see congress getting involved in Baseball's steriod issues and usurping the state of Florida's power in regard to right-to-die issues. And then further, he proposes a federal solution to a state marriage issue on Gay Marriage. These may be Conservative religious values but they contrict with the traditional conservative-libertarian values of Reagan. So instead of being the party of smaller government, we're the party of "not as big but really moral" government. That worries me.
I hope the economic growth we've seen and expect to see in the near term can curb public debt. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 12:09:07 PM | "I agree: We have a social and economic mobility unknown throughout much of the world. And there is a big difference between the extremely rich and everyone else. But even the folks that are middle class are rich compared witht he world. Heck, our poverty standards of 12,000 Dollars a year is extremely high compared to the rest of the world. I think Americans believe that gov't is the last resort solution to social and economic problems. And that our money is better spent investing in our future and not wasted on social services that perpetuate poverty and entitlement. It's a different way of thinking but we've been very successful at it. We have our problems but so do societies that take a different approach."
I saw a story on the news not to long ago here in Houston. They had went out and interviewed many of the homeless in our area. And guess what they found out....Many of the homeless were actually happy with their lives. They made enough money begging to be able to eat, drink and do drugs (their words not mine), which is exactly what they wanted. One guy said that he had gotten into drugs and had lost his home, but that he was happier than he had ever been.
The point is, how many people do you know personally who've ever starved to death (except for Terry Schiavo, but that's a different argument)? How many people do you know who actually go out and TRY to work who don't have a place to live?
If you actually go out and TRY in the United States you can do almost anything you want. What you'll find is, that most people who are struggling are doing so b/c of some mistakes THEY have made in their past. The mistakes may have seemed small at the time, but they were mistakes nontheless. It may have been dropping out of school or simply not trying hard enough.
Yet, we punish those in America who DO TRY for the mistakes made by those who didn't. We punish them with astronomical tax rates. Libs cry about tax cuts that are only for the rich. For the last time the rich are the only ones paying taxes!
I've posted these numbers before, but I'll do it again:
www.irs.ustreas.gov/pub/irs-soi/01in01ts.xls
According to the 2001 irs income tax figures:
The top 1% of wage earners paid 33.89% of all income taxes.
The top 5% of wage earners paid 53.25% of all income taxes.
The top 10% of wage earners paid 64.89% of all income taxes.
The top 50% of wage earners paid 96.03% of all income taxes.
The bottom 50% of wage earners paid 3.97% of all income taxes.
Those earning minimum wage wouldn't have paid anything b/c they would have gotten all of their money back. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 12:35:07 PM |
If you actually go out and TRY in the United States you can do almost anything you want. What you'll find is, that most people who are struggling are doing so b/c of some mistakes THEY have made in their past. The mistakes may have seemed small at the time, but they were mistakes nontheless. It may have been dropping out of school or simply not trying hard enough
I would agree with this with the exception of folks that are disabled, whether mentally, physically, or both. And we have safety nets in place for them. I would also state that we make it very difficult for people returning from prison to return to a normal life in society. | |
|
| What’s gone wrong with America?
Posted: 3/23/2005 12:49:47 PM | kadmus-
Agreed. I'm all for helping those who can't help themselves as are most all conservatives. | |
|
Home
login 
