| What is art?
Posted: 12/31/2006 1:12:50 AM | Before I begin I would like to add that I did do a search and while there is a thread similar to the one I would like to make, there are some concepts I would like to discuss that I highly doubt where covered on the other thread.
I'm trying to wrap my mind around a concept that is brough up in a book of mine. The statement in particular that troubles me is; "Art belongs to a non-socializable aspect of reality, which is universal...but non-collective: to the nature of man's consciousness"
The book goes on to state that art serves no practical, material end. That art is an end in itself, that it is meant for contemplation which becomes so intense that it becomes self-sufficent and self-justifying.
I wanted to ask the opinions of other people....do you believe that art holds no practical ends? Is art made to serve the indivdual purposes of men or can it have a social aspect? Is there a difference between art and entertainment?
I don't want to know what you think makes good art....or even examples of what you consider art. If I can I would like to keep this as much philisophical as possible. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 12/31/2006 7:12:42 AM | Anything that stirs emotion within us.
It can definitely have a social aspect/impact, imo.That statement from your book makes no sense whatsoever to me. | |
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zamys
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Joined: 10/1/2006
Msg: 3 | |
| What is art?
Posted: 12/31/2006 3:41:37 PM | Art belongs to a non-socializable aspect of reality
huh???!!!!???
ok maybe Im not understanding his point, but this guy sure seems to shovelling the BS.
Aspect of reality....lol. Well most art is tangible. I would say that is pretty much a part of reality. And Art can be very sociable. Alot of artists create work so that people see it. We see art in galleries or peoples houses...we may talk about it. We learn about the masters in art history etc...is that not sociable. It influences many aspects of REAL life.
Art may not have a practical end, but art has been done since the cave man. It is a way to represent history. Tell stories. Relate to others. A form of communication in many ways.
And btw, some art does have a practical end. We decorate bowls, carve wooden handles etc.
Seems to me some people just like to hear themselves talk and have absolutely no clue about what they are talking about. Hope you didnt have to pay for this book.
Walk softly and carry a big shovel!!!! | |
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Scene2
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Joined: 11/23/2006
Msg: 4 | |
| What is art?
Posted: 12/31/2006 7:57:16 PM | .do you believe that art holds no practical ends?
Art is definately practical. Furniture, cabinets, ceramics, jewelry etc etc and so on.
or can it have a social aspect?
Art has had many influences on society. Art Deco, Art Nouveau, Mission Styles.
Is there a difference between art and entertainment?
There are numerous forms of entertainment that do not appeal to me. But most entertainment, if not all, needs to have some creative force influencing the performers. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 12/31/2006 11:31:33 PM | "Is there a difference between art and entertainment?"
well that part is easy, "art for art's sake, money for god's sake" 10cc.
art is not made for money, that is entertainment.
artist make art because they have to, so in that sense "Art belongs to a non-socializable aspect of reality, which is universal...but non-collective: to the nature of man's consciousness". they know not why they make art, they do because they have too. for me, it is euphoric and the process is all consuming.
Keith Richard's was asked once how he could keep writing music after all these years. he said something like he just reached up and grabbed a song.
Einstein said much the same thing about thinking and writing proofs. they are there at the edge of humanities consciousness waiting to be grabbed.
art does serve "practical, material end", which is to stir emotion. (thedemonswhip)
and art does have social aspect. (Scene2)
science is used to heal, to make drugs, and now to make people rich. but that is not the essence of science. the essence of science is discovery and proof.
art is used to entertain, but that is not the essence of art.
the essence of art is to manipulate reality.
so what is art?
a form of communication.
the act of creating.
the expression of emotion. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 8:01:15 AM | all id like to say is that i feel art should never have any true deffination or meaning, art is like complete freedom in a world where there is no freedom.
for me a true deffination of art would ruin the word itself and we would have to find a new word to express what people do.
 graffiti is not a crime | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 3:38:27 PM | What is art?
Art belongs to a non-socializable aspect of reality, which is universal...but non-collective…[blah blah blah]
Huh? OK, so the above quote goes well with my new definition of art -
Art is that which critics and writers interpret, misinterpret, speculate about, criticize harshly, worship and adore, and sometimes blab about so incoherently that the topic of the critique or story evolves from being about the piece to being about the academic prowess of the CRITIC.
By the way, graffiti IS a crime and rarely rises above the level of brainless and talentless tagging.
I know this may offend several gansta artist rebel wanna-be’s and “intellectuals” but the proof is there for all to see. Just look around you.
I live in the second largest city in the US and have spent quite a bit of time out on the streets and yet have seen only a handful graffiti worth looking at.
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 6:31:15 PM | Wow, interesting topic. I consider myself and artist so best add my two cents.
For me the definition of art is something that is created by someone with emotions - and it makes you feel something - but that feeling could be good or bad. So going back to the graffit - is it art, yes. Is it appropriate to deface someone's property - no. But whether or not you like it or it's right - it's still art. It may not even be good - but it is art.
I create what I do because as someone else said - I just have to. I get lost in it. I feel it. I see it in my mind before it's done. If I couldn't create I think I'd die.
So even though I have a "real" job during the day, I'm working on making more income from art so I don't have to have a job. To me what I do isn't work. Others get pleasure from what I do, which in turn brings me pleasure. But even if no one ever saw any of it - I'd still do it.
D. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 8:19:30 PM | For me, art is when the thing (art) transcends the medium. When it is no longer a toilet bowl, canvas, paint, medal, clay, or whatever but is more than its substance. The more it transcends the better the art.
Come on guys and gals, jump in. Don't be afraid. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 8:54:52 PM | some of the best “art” is graffiti
but that depends on your definition of something that is undefinable…
art is
a hop
a seed
a chance.
...the manifestation of energy
a "radial form" form of energy
created out of nothing that has the potential to evolve consciousness.
a chance to trigger a synapse in another mind
to plant a seed of an idea
a new direction... potential energy… perpetual… exponential…
hop hop
we are after all - "Half-asleep in Frog Pajamas". (Tom Robbins)
There are some 'ecological feminist theology of naturists' that say that human intelligence is a "radial from" of this energy that evolves with humanity and we control it with our intent. Thus, we are somewhat in control of our own evolution. (Expect we are told how to evolve by the top down hierarchy of historical male theology of the 5% of the greedy b@$ards that control 95% of the worlds wealth).
This is an example the manifestation of “radial energy” that i see in art.
Art is proof that we can and do create and control a “radial form” of energy that is human consciousness.
Thank you for the explanation… | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 9:00:36 PM | I'm troubled by that statement too... My take on it is this - art is an externalized mirror of our collective unconscious filtered through an individual's perception.
Some may think there is no practical end to this, but personally, I feel that if humanity doesn't wake up and deal with the crap in our collective unconscious pretty damn soon, we're scheduled for an early extinction. I'd call that a social aspect. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/1/2007 10:56:34 PM | | An artist cannot fail, it is a sucess to be one =) | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/3/2007 4:51:08 AM | My favourite 'definition' of art - and I've forgotten the source - art changes the way we see things - forever.
For me, visual art, writing and music all become 'art' when they have this quality. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/3/2007 7:56:42 PM | an artist can fail
if he/she puts their stuff out for public consumption and finds no consumers
no artist i have ever met wants their art to be just their own
they wish to be recognized as artists
and when they aren't
what do you call them?
beautiful losers perhaps
you can respect them
i do
but there are failures | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/4/2007 11:39:25 AM | Pertaining to the Visual Arts
Art is the expression of an idea, and it requires both a sender and a receiver. Good Art expresses that idea very well. Expression has never been found in an object; be it a painting, carved stone, or pot. Visual art travels from our eyes across synapses in our brains to a place where intuitive and immediate appreciation and recognition appear. It is found in our attempt to consider the object for what it is. Art is not still. It is not stagnant on a pedestal. What I can’t say in words, I will say in clay. What can clay express in the 21st century? Anything I want it to. I am the maker. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/4/2007 2:23:00 PM | When the flush of a new-born sun fell first on Eden's green and gold,
Our father Adam sat under the Tree and scratched with a stick in the
mould;
And the first rude sketch that the world had seen was joy to his
mighty heart,
Till the Devil whispered behind the leaves, "It's pretty, but is it Art?"
Wherefore he called to his wife, and fled to fashion his work anew --
The first of his race who cared a fig for the first, most dread review;
And he left his lore to the use of his sons -- and that was a glorious
gain
When the Devil chuckled "Is it Art?" in the ear of the branded Cain.
They builded a tower to shiver the sky and wrench the stars apart,
Till the Devil grunted behind the bricks "It's striking, but is it Art?"
The stone was dropped at the quarry-side and the idle derrick
swung,
While each man talked of the aims of Art, and each in an alien
tongue.
They fought and they talked in the North and the South, they talked
and they fought in the West,
Till the waters rose on the pitiful land, and the poor Red Clay had
rest --
Had rest til the dank, blank-canvas dawn when the dove was
preened to start,
And the Devil bubbled below the keel: "It's human, but is it Art?"
The tale is as old as the Eden Tree -- and new as the new-cut tooth --
For each man knows ere his lip-thatch grows he is master of Art and
Truth;
And each man hears as the twilight nears, to the beat of his dying
heart,
The Devil drum on the darkened pane: "You did it, but was it Art?"
We have learned to whittle the Eden Tree to the shape of a surplice-
peg
We have learned to bottle our parents twain in the yelk of an addled
egg,
We know that the tail must wag the dog, for the horse is drawn by the
cart;
But the Devil whoops, as he whooped of old: "It's clever, but is it
Art?"
When the flicker of London sun falls faint on the Club-room's green
and gold,
The sons of Adam sit them down and scratch with their pens in the
mould --
They scratch with their pens in the mould of their graves, and the ink
and the anguish start,
For the Devil mutters behind the leaves: "It's pretty, but is it Art?"
Now if we could win to the Eden Tree where the Four Great Rivers,
flow,
And the Wreath of Eve is red on the turf as she left it long ago,
And if we could come when the sentry slept and softly scurry
through,
By the favour of God we might know as much as out father Adam knew.
Rudyard Kipling | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/9/2007 12:40:33 PM | | art is a commercial from the mind that is used to present new concepts to piece together and explain the accumulated knowledge of the history of existance that have been repress within the subconscious ... once art becomes stagnant so does the mind ..in other words, just doing the same old same old | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/9/2007 9:25:33 PM | To the OP. I agree that art is a means to it's own end. Any social aspect attached to art is usually an interpretation by the artist imposed on the person viewing the art.
Much like myself presenting my artwork an explaining that my exhibition is about insert-social-aspect-here.
But if art is left on it's own, it will derive its own emotional meaning, but not necessarily anger or happiness, but more of a deep inner reflection of humanity. If art is simple it should be able to relax you and let you enjoy the colours, patterns, shades etc. But if it is complex then the human mind attempts to find meaning within it for which there may never be gotten an answer.
In regards to art versus entertainment. Isn't ballet entertainment, isn't it art as well. Sure the writer of the ballet wants to make money, but that's the writer. The ballet in itself is self-fulfilling art.
It's like they say people kill people, not guns. So people create art to make money, art doesn't create itself. Art is art and people exploit the art.
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/14/2007 10:12:29 PM | May I ask what book you're reading?
I'm assuming you're talking about the visual and plastic arts?
Is the author interested in a particular period or movement?
Personally I think his or her claim is preposterous. It's the complete opposite, to my mind: you have to remind yourself that when you write or paint or play music, you draw in mysterious ways on the courtesy and genius of the community. I think it's this sensitivity to gifts welling up unbidden, this awareness of the fate of the community, no matter how ego-driven or self-absorbed a writer or artist might become, no matter how singular the work, that divides art from commerce. I've always understood art as seeking intimacy with the world and then endeavoring to share it. It's an effort to illuminate or explain or imagine in which we help one another understand what's going on. I've come to think that, in some ways, this is our purpose with each other. | |
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Joey a
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Joined: 7/27/2006
Msg: 20 | |
| What is art?
Posted: 1/14/2007 11:02:36 PM | What is Art,,,,humm,Well being a pretty good artist I would have to say! Art is,feelings,passion,desire,blood,sweat,heart and soul slapped on paper,,,,o yeah and don't forget the coffee that makes it all happen.........lol | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/15/2007 1:26:30 AM | Art is communication, in another form.
A good artist has something to say and says it outright.
A great artist has something to say, but only hints at it. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/15/2007 2:09:19 AM | | I can help you. I think most of us view art as the "product" of art, whether it be a painting, play, furniture, etc. We often miss or cannot conceive of the "process" of art. Perhaps what the author is stating that it doesn't matter what is "done" (the physical end) but that you "do" (how it's done. the process.) How often have you heard someone say "Oh, I could paint that!" The point is that they don't. Also, I think that you will find that art is a pretty solitary thing. It's usually the expression of the opinion/view of the artist. At some point an artist has to stand away from their art and a subjective response is made by the viewer. Good art communicates. If it doesn't communicate something (I don't get it) whether it be the idea, some technical skill, etc etc enough clues weren't given, we call it bad art....I think that the author is saying is that what we made wasn't important but the fact that we made it was and that somehow we will all, in the end, understand that. Haha... | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/15/2007 5:14:35 PM | This is an interesting subject. When I was young taking art classes I thought I knew what it wasn't. At that time I would roll on the floor laughing if someone told me Art was an oil painting with a red barn to the right a lake to the left and a bunch of redwood trees all around.
Then I grew up and realized art is art to the person who enjoys it. Maybe someone would come along and say heyyyyyy. That old red barn reminds me of Grandpaps place in Medicino! I want to buy it and I don't care if it is 1000 dollars! If you have fun who cares what it is or what it isn't. You have created something. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/15/2007 9:37:26 PM | (my bit of hot air about what 'art' is...)
Art CAN be done for profit, even for hire... it CAN be entertaining, funny, misunderstood, aggravating, insulting... but first and foremost it is an expression of something within the artist... so in that way it's primary generative force is not practical.
In the same way it's not socializable... because the artist would pain/sculpt/sing even if no-one was there to hear it... if no-one wanted to pay for it... the artist creates for himself first... and the audience second.
If any motivation drives the creation MORE than that need for expression then the creation itself is driven commensurately farther from being art and closer to being 'mere' product.
On the other hand, a person could look at something that was created without any artistic intent at all (a brick, a rock, a fly) and react to it in a profound way... and at that moment, for that viewer, that thing is 'art'.
So... everything CAN be art... and IS art... if conceived or perceived in an way that is personally meaningful. | |
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| What is art?
Posted: 1/16/2007 8:17:11 AM | | The breath of my soul. | |
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