online dating service

Free Dating Site    

REGISTER | MAIL/PROFILE | HELP | NOW ONLINE | SEARCH | RATING | FORUMS | SUCCESS STORIES
Plentyoffish dating forums are a place to meet singles and get dating advice or share dating experiences etc. Hopefully you will all have fun meeting singles and try out this online dating thing... Remember that we are the largest 100% free online dating service, so you will never have to pay a dime to meet your soulmate.
     
Show ALL Forums  > Health Wellness  > Does Bipolar = Liar?      Mod Threads Home login  
Page 1 of 2 1, 2
 Author Thread: Does Bipolar = Liar?
 !somewhere

Joined: 1/16/2006
Msg: 1
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/12/2007 6:58:34 PM
I'm just curious. I don't mean for this thread to bash people who are bipolar. But in the past, I've gotten to know a couple of different people who were manic-depressive, who routinely lied about things.
I was just wondering if a compulsion to lie may be part of the bipolar disorder? or was it just coincidential that these people were both bipolar, as well as being people who's words couldn't be trusted?

I'd certainly never want to look down on someone with bipolar disorder. However, I usually have a lack of respect for anyone who'd deliberately lie to me about certain things.
But if the lying and dishonesty is part of the disorder, should it be excused, or overlooked?
 K-lo

Joined: 7/31/2006
Msg: 2
view profile
History
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/12/2007 7:20:49 PM
I don't know what the statistics are (and, don't care much for statistics anyway) - - but, the one bipolar guy I knew, who was definitely bipolar, couldn't lie to save his life. He was very very very honest. And, he dated my best friend - - and, if he ever did anything "wrong" - he gave himself away everytime, and immediately. It would make him too anxious to keep it in.
 1foothillguy

Joined: 1/16/2006
Msg: 3
view profile
History
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/13/2007 11:28:52 AM
I dated a gal for a few months who was bi polar and found her to be extremly honest and open. It was the mean streak I couldn't handle, she would just snap at me all the time for no reason. Call me crazy, but I don't like being yelled at.
 !somewhere

Joined: 1/16/2006
Msg: 4
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/14/2007 8:59:17 AM
K-lo and 1foothillguy, thanks for your posts. After thinking of a couple of people, who I knew were bipolar, and had had tendancies to lie, I wondered if lying was a common trait of bipolar disorder. I even searched through a few info sites on the web to see if I could find an answer. After not finding an answer, I decided to ask it here.

It was interesting to note that other people found bipolar people to be very honest.

Perhaps, manic-depression plays no role, or little role, in making a person honest, or dishonest?
Or perhaps, as different people re-act differently to the effects of mania and depression, it will make some people very honest, and others dishonest?
 sombient

Joined: 2/7/2007
Msg: 5
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/14/2007 9:09:14 AM
Q: Is pathological lying a part of bipolar disorder or attention deficit hyperactivity disorder? It seems like a game to my spouse to see whether he can get away with lying, whether big or small.

A: Pathological lying is not an inherent characteristic of bipolar disorder or attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD). That is, people with bipolar disorder or ADHD are no more or less likely to lie than are people with most other psychiatric disorders, or people without psychiatric disorders, for that matter. The exception might be when someone with bipolar disorder is in such a manic state that they lose touch with reality and report -- and believe -- things about themselves and other people that aren't true, but such statements are a manifestation of delusions rather than a conscious intent to deceive.

The condition that's most associated with pathological lying is sociopathy or antisocial personality disorder, which is characterized by a lack of regard for others' feelings and manipulating others for personal gain (or sometimes just plain amusement). People with antisocial personality disorder also frequently have erratic work histories and substance abuse problems and may engage in criminal activities. I suppose people with antisocial personality disorder can also have ADHD or bipolar disorder, but there's no inherent connection.


http://health.ivillage.com/mentalhealth/mhdissociate/0,,6fll,00.html
 backwarduck

Joined: 3/22/2007
Msg: 6
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/14/2007 1:55:49 PM
it's not that they knowingly lie...

one week they tell you they love you with all their heart.

then two weeks later the say they hate you and you are the worst piece of crap that even walked on the face of the earth. they imagine and accuse of things you've never done. they are paranoid and delusional and drive every one away.

two weeks later they love you and can't remember what they just put you through.

the next week they are with someone new...

as you see i have some history with this...

and all the love in the world doesn't mean a darn thing.
 !somewhere

Joined: 1/16/2006
Msg: 7
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/14/2007 4:21:45 PM
sombient, I don't think the persons I was thinking of, when I made the OP would be classed as "pathological liars". More often it would be occassional lies to cover past behavior, or excuses made after their mind had been changed.

I've known compulsive liars. A one time freind of mine lied, or exagerated every single thing he talked about. As far as I know, he still does. He likely has some problems, yet manic depression isn't one of them.

I think backwarduck's post was a closer description of the lies that I was thinking of, associated with a bipolar person.

Not really habitual, constant, compulsive lies. Bbut just small lies at certain times. Such as saying different things at one time, than they may have said earlier; Or breaking previous promises, etc. When I noticed such behavior, I wondered if small lies, broken promises, etc, were coinciding with the cycling, or signs of the cycling, that a bipolar person may go through while bouncing from mania to depression.

They seem to be more a case of people who've promised something once, and later changed their mind and tried to deny, or back out of a previous promise; or make a weak excuse to avoid a commitment that was previously agreed to.
 Kassey0326

Joined: 2/23/2007
Msg: 8
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 8:28:21 AM
My son is actually bipolar and has ADHD. I don't think it has anything to do with trust and/or lies. I think the biggest majority of liars are in the work force and supervisors; politicians.... I think there is such a thing a compulsive liars, which we get a lot of on online. Other than that, I think, we all are guilty of little white lies, which are not connected with ADHD and/or bipolar.
 sombient

Joined: 2/7/2007
Msg: 9
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 8:28:33 AM
Again, you are confused - its nothing to do with whether one is bipolar or not. You asked whether or not lying is a trait of bipolar patients. The website I quoted clearly answered that question - from the perspective of lying as a pathology.

Now you're changing tacts and asking if small occasional lies are a feature of bipolar disorder. Msg 7 has is a broad comment bipolar emotional instability. That has nothing to do with your question. And it doesn't explain lying - it merely comments on the lack of predictable behavior from some undertreated bipolar patients.

Bipolar disease is a condition typified as very low stress recovery and neurotransmitter activity imbalances within multiple brain centers - a problem with chemical pathway impairment that is largely correctable and the symptoms controllable.

Small, occasional lies are common and they are NOT pathological! Got it?? You asked if these small occasional fibs are part of the bipolar disease behavioral syndrome - the answer is 'no', and furthermore, these lies are commonplace and typical in the population. They are not pathological traits either - they are a type of coping mechanism for flagging self esteem.


Why We Lie 15 May 2006 LiveScience.com
We all lie, all the time. It causes problems, to say the least. So why do we do it? It boils down to the shifting sands of the self and trying to look good both to ourselves and others, experts say. "It's tied in with self-esteem," says University of Massachusetts psychologist Robert Feldman. "We find that as soon as people feel that their self-esteem is threatened, they immediately begin to lie at higher levels."

Not all lies are harmful. In fact, sometimes lying is the best approach for protecting privacy and ourselves and others from malice, some researchers say. Some deception, such as boasting and lies in the name of tact and politeness, can be classified as less than serious. But bald-faced lies (whether they involve leaving out the truth or putting in something false), are harmful, as they corrode trust and intimacy—the glue of society.

Kidding yourself
Many animals engage in deception, or deliberately misleading another, but only humans are wired to deceive both themselves and others, researchers say. People are so engaged in managing how others perceive them that they are often unable to separate truth from fiction in their own minds, Feldman's research shows.

For instance, In one experiment, Feldman put two strangers in a room together. They were videotaped while they conversed. Later, independently, each was asked to view the tape and identify anything they had said that was not entirely accurate.

Rather than defining what counts as a lie and to avoid the moral tone of the word "lie," Feldman's experimenters simply asked subjects after the fact to identify anything they had said in the video that was "not entirely accurate."

Initially, "Each subject said, 'Oh, I was entirely accurate,'" Feldman told LiveScience. Upon watching themselves on video, subjects were genuinely surprised to discover they had said something inaccurate. The lies ranged from pretending to like someone they actually disliked to falsely claiming to be the star of a rock band. The study, published in the Journal of Basic and Applied Psychology, found that 60 percent of people had lied at least once during the 10-minute conversation, saying an average of 2.92 inaccurate things.

"People almost lie reflexively," Feldman says. "They don't think about it as part of their normal social discourse." But it is, the research showed. "We're trying not so much to impress other people but to maintain a view of ourselves that is consistent with the way they would like us to be," Feldman said. We want to be agreeable, to make the social situation smoother or easier, and to avoid insulting others through disagreement or discord.

Men lie no more than women, but they tend to lie to make themselves look better, while women are more likely to lie to make the other person feel better.

Extroverts tend to lie more than introverts, Feldman found in similar research involving a job-interview situation.

Workplace lies
Other research has delved into prevarication in the workplace. Self-esteem and threats to our sense of self are also drivers when it comes to lying to co-workers, rather than strangers, says Jennifer Argo of the University of Alberta.

A recent study she co-authored showed that people are even more willing to lie to coworkers than they are to strangers. "We want to both look good when we are in the company of others (especially people we care about), and we want to protect our self-worth," Argo told LiveScience.

The experiment involved reading a scenario to a subject, telling them they had paid more than a coworker for the same new car. When the coworker, in the scenario, mentioned what they had paid, $200 or $2,000 more in different versions of the experiment, the subject was asked to report how they would respond. Argo found that her subjects were more willing to lie when the price difference was small and when they were talking to a coworker rather than to a stranger.

Consumers lie to protect their public and private selves, she wrote in the Journal of Consumer Research with her colleagues from the University of Calgary and University of British Columbia. Argo said she was surprised that people are so willing to lie to someone they know even over a small price discrepancy.

"I guess closely tied to this is that people appear to be short-term focused when they decide to deceive someone—save my self-image and self-worth now, but later on if the deceived individual finds out it can have long-term consequences," she said.

Feldman says people should become more aware of the extent to which we tend to lie and that honesty yields more genuine relationships and trust. "The default ought to be to be honest and accurate ... We're better off if honesty is the norm. It's like the old saying: honesty is the best policy."
 IGotRhythm2

Joined: 7/27/2006
Msg: 10
view profile
History
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 11:00:43 AM
To message 7...yep I know all about this too...
My experience is not so much that Bipolar = Liar, more like Bipolar = lapse in memory. Not so much that they lie, more like they forget that you discussed and agreed to something, deny that you ever told them something etc.
 sombient

Joined: 2/7/2007
Msg: 11
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 11:06:27 AM
^^ Yup. Very well known problem with memory (mostly short term) storage/maintenance.
You HAVE to understand the disease and its symptoms if you are to have a relationship with a bipolar patient. Search for and read through several bipolar discussion groups that describe the metabolic aspects of the cause of the bipolar disorder and its (largely successful) management among the more progressive patient population (self treatment with diet/supplements/lifestyle adjunct to drug intervention).
 newidea

Joined: 12/21/2006
Msg: 12
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 5:44:00 PM
A person with bipolar is not continuously acting out or insane.
A good doctor can administer such drugs as lithium, clonazapam, and haldol to keep them normal in the general population. A person on lithium can appear stable in all their dealings with others.

The suppressed illness does not cause dishonesty.

There are 2 issues left. The bipolar cycle and the willful misuse of drugs.

The misuse of drugs is a choice not caused by bipolar illness. Sane people have choices about abusing their body.

I have seen abusers who claim the drugs help with the depression of bipolar. I don't accept this explanation. In the end it hurts the abuser.

Cycling is the frequency a person enters into and out of a bipolar episodes. Some cycles vary from daily, weekly, monthly or some greater time. We should worry about the loss of hope for the fast cycler, when the medicine can't help.

They tend to be brighter and capable of superior work performance over the average person. They do not want the illness to keep them off the job. They like the independence of their own money.

People suffering from a bipolar episode should be in the hospital and not in the general population. People who are having bipolar episodes will behave wierd or crazy. Call an ambulance and get them to a hospital quickly. You could be saving a life.

Lying is not associated with this mental illness. Treat the bipolar person equally with the people without bipolar. It is easy enough to question a subject for truthfulness.
I have read children 10 to 15 tend to lie. So I would learn about children and their propensity to lie. This is the age range of the bully.

Would you expect a bully to tell the truth? Evaluate the age of your subject.
 offthewheel

Joined: 3/8/2007
Msg: 13
view profile
History
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 4/15/2007 6:43:30 PM

one week they tell you they love you with all their heart.

then two weeks later the say they hate you and you are the worst piece of crap that even walked on the face of the earth. they imagine and accuse of things you've never done. they are paranoid and delusional and drive every one away.


...soooo right!
 mindyjo

Joined: 6/10/2007
Msg: 14
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 6/24/2007 6:12:09 PM
I, being bipolar and quite well in comparison to some out there, I say bipolar is like a giant emotional magnifying glass. Every emotion, thought, desire, insecurity is magnified unlike our normal counterparts. In other words, if you are a lier by nature, or violent by nature or horney by nature, it is just going to be intensified by your illness.

Hope that makes sence for ya'll, I know it isn't easy for those without a mental illness to get!
 NotGayOrBi

Joined: 4/9/2007
Msg: 15
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 6/25/2007 2:00:27 PM
I myself am probably mildly bipolar (see below) and lie less than just about anyone. I think there's an underlying personality that affects how the person acts, whatever the disorder. In general I'm a very caring person and don't want to trick anyone, so I don't lie--well, okay, also to avoid having to remember which version I told which person.

Maybe with the more severe afflictions, more of the personality is blocked out by the disease.

However, I've had problems with changing my mind about a person I've dated, someone I met on this site. Breaking up, getting back together, breaking up again--it's painful for me but he says it's not so painful for him. I've never called him names or told him he was "crap," just that for various reasons I can't do it any more. He's always been willing to "try again."

(The reason I say "probably"--I've been to a psychiatrist, about 5 years ago, and that was one of the possibilities he mentioned for my problems. I do have times when everything in the world looks good, and other times when everything in the world looks terrible and hopeless. Fortunately for me, it usually looks just on the high side of okay. The doctore settled on OCD, the thought version--I worry too much about whether what I'm doing is right, things like that.)
 mlm_mlm_mlm

Joined: 4/29/2007
Msg: 16
view profile
History
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 6/25/2007 2:41:49 PM
bipolar used to be called manic depressive.

I dont know if they all lie but they are all a little unstable moodwise for sure. Not someone I would ever consider for a relationship... not even a close friend.... that is creepy stuff to me.
 SunsetStorm

Joined: 5/27/2007
Msg: 17
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/16/2007 4:06:57 AM
I think it would just be when they are unmedicated .. and their storys get a little Fantastic ;o} But at that moment thats what they are living from my understandings. I knew a man who was bipolar and the only times he lied they were glaringly obvious lies ( ie no one would do them thinking no one would know ) but It was an episode. I dont think It really matters .. if they have this trait with the illness ( some do some dont ) just have a laugh about It and play along with It at the time. Its an Illness after all, not their choice.

Look up a bipolar website most have about this on there - its delusions but as it explains someone with this delusional can operate normally ( count change ect all perfectly ) but slip In and out of a delusion. Normally as subconciously they feel not good enough at that time so boost It to cover. Honestly it was never a problem with him - as I said It was obviously when he was manic.

Only bipolar Issue I have Is the In and out - the hot and cold - the run and burn without so much as an explanation .. however well you know them. And this seems a very common one to a lot of people. Knowing Its an Illness stops the hurt from a obvious unreality ( I dont like to call it lie as they themselves believe it at that moment ) but It cannot stop the pain of the one you love just dissapearing Into thin air no explanation to pop up again sometime .. no explanation
 LittleMissScareAll

Joined: 11/11/2006
Msg: 18
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/18/2007 10:51:52 AM
Depends. The last guy I was in a serious long term relationship with claimed to be bipolar and he's the shittiest person in existance. Lied to me about EVERYTHING...
But then I have another friend who's bipolar and he's the sweetest person ever, has never lied to me about anything that I know of and I couldn't imagine him lying.
 LittleMissScareAll

Joined: 11/11/2006
Msg: 19
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/18/2007 10:53:19 AM

I think it would just be when they are unmedicated


That's a good point. My nice friend is on medication and my sucky ex wasn't... could be the reason they're the way they are.
 Paprikash!

Joined: 1/18/2007
Msg: 20
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/19/2007 1:13:54 PM
Bi-Polar means mentally ill.
 Loloche

Joined: 5/14/2007
Msg: 21
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/21/2007 12:03:03 PM
Bipolar has different level. And every person diagnosed with bipolar is different. You won't find many people behaving the same during a manic or a depressive episode.
Bipolar defenetly doen't=liar that's for sure.
The person's behaviour you are commenting is not relevant for all bipolar people.
Stability in emotions is something possible. Cognitive behaviour therapy is essential for someone who suffers from bipolar.

You said:

-can't remember what they just put you through: ...What they put YOU throught...!! You have no idea what that person IS going through. That person is sick... you're not...
-and all the love in the world doesn't mean a darn thing: I agree for somebody who's selfish but it has nothing to do with somebody suffering from BP

Can you confirm that you are talking about an ex girlfriend...
 Loloche

Joined: 5/14/2007
Msg: 22
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/21/2007 12:13:54 PM
You are so right sombient!! They are so many on here talking about bipolar and just don't know a thing about it!
Before talking they should have some knowledgee about it... And internet is the right tool to use to know better on this subjet
 Alzena

Joined: 6/12/2007
Msg: 23
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 7/22/2007 12:33:08 PM
Your very correct. Someone can be bipolar and a sciopath at the same time. An if they are cycing rapidly they may contadict very often. I was told once to remember a dog can have flee and ticks at the time time. I'll add they can also have worms and mites.

On the defense of people with bipolar problems. It is a very difficult problem to live with with the problem. Meds are not one one pills fits all and the side effect are sometimes worse than living with the problem. Also the meds are very costly int his country. Once someone gets label it impacts all areas of their life.

Mental health problems in this county are in the dark ages. That is why the American Department of Correction is the Biggest mental health provider in the world. An the medical prodical there is to take the off all their meds and wait for them to fail. They they try endless formulas until they put them back on the meds they were on before at a high dose and they roll over into diabetes.... Ah, but the reason it say God on our dollar bill is that's what it has become to many...

Thanks for letting me rant...
 Lizerbug05

Joined: 5/31/2007
Msg: 24
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 10/27/2007 3:53:07 PM
There is no direct correlation between lying and Bipolar disorder. Though there are various types in which the symptoms are different, none of them truly seem to reflect on the aspects of honesty. Though one can argue that when someone is in a manic state, they can bend the truth simply due to the fact that they are usually in a state of euphoria, and can have a different view of what they are saying and/or doing.

I'd say that lying is more or less, just a personality flaw, in which one is trying to impress or express some idea to another. Talk to the person, and see what their real motives are. Maybe that will help you gain some insight.
 mikeilike

Joined: 9/22/2007
Msg: 25
Does Bipolar = Liar?
Posted: 11/6/2007 2:15:39 AM
I am bipolar and research shows that lying is not a symptom.
Page 1 of 2 1, 2
 
Show ALL Forums  > Health Wellness  > Does Bipolar = Liar?