| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/27/2007 10:56:37 PM | I recieved an email the other day about certain jobs and random drug and alcohol testing. The person who wrote it worked really hard at a job and had to do these tests at least 3 times a week. He said he had no problem doing these tests as he didnt do drugs and wasnt a problem drinking but he brought up what in my opinion was a really good point. Him and other people at his work and other work places work damn hard for their money and they have to undergo these tests every so often. But what about the people that are sitting on Social assistance that recieve money to LIVE!! The ones that live off everyone ones tax money to raise their kids properly and provide them with the food and clothing and the other things that them and their children need! Why dont they get random drug testing and random alcohol testing?! Why should it not ok for people like the man who wrote this to spend his HARD EARNED money on whatever he chooses but its ok for people who sit around doing nothing to spend money and these things and not be questioned or punished for it!
Dont get the wrong idea about how i feel about social assistance cause in no way at all do i think its a bad thing if you need it. But i do agree with this guy that people on assistance who take their money and get high on whatever and drink all the time is WRONG!!!
Was just curious to know others opinions on this.. good idea or bad idea.. do you think something like this should be done?!?! Why and why not?! | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/27/2007 11:31:34 PM | "The ones that live off everyone ones tax money to raise their kids properly and provide them with the food and clothing and the other things that them and their children need! Why dont they get random drug testing and random alcohol testing?! Why should it not ok for people like the man who wrote this to spend his HARD EARNED money on whatever he chooses but its ok for people who sit around doing nothing to spend money and these things and not be questioned or punished for it! "
We don't live in a country that is run by a dictator. People have rights, yes even those on social assistance do to0. I would fear the day when the government would pull anybody off the streets they want and give them drug and alcohol test. Would it end there? I highly doubt it. Never mind the moral aspects of living in such a place but who would pay for these tests? The tax payers that's who. So now we are paying even more money...makes no sense to me.
Secondly the guy who wrote the letter...what does he do? Some companys have random drug tests as a condition of employment, if you do not like it then you can choose not to work there. Maybe that company needs to do such testing to protect their image? Maybe your friend is an athlete and such tests are used to keep the integrity of the sport?
In my own opinion I just don't like the idea of treating all people on social assistance like second class citizens because a few of those people abuse the system. Random drug and alcohol testing isn't going to clean the system up. | |
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svj
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Joined: 9/15/2007
Msg: 3 | |
| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/28/2007 2:13:08 PM | The contents of your bodily fluids (with the exception of DUI testing) are not subject to search and seizure, unless you sign that right away in say, an employment contract.
From the receiver's standpoint:
Social assistance provides many things for many people.
It allows people who have legitmately fallen on hard times to get back on their feet.
It allows mothers in trouble to raise their children. (Barely!)
It allows people that are content to live in a hole and do drugs to, well, live in a hole and do drugs. Whatever floats yer boat.
From the contributer's standpoint: (this is a pretty selfish thing to say, so brace yourself...)
It allows you and me to walk down the street a lot safer because most of the people that live in holes and do drugs are in their holes, and not holding up your local 7/11 so they can get drugs. (note: "Most", not "all")
Whatever money you would save by not paying social assistance, you would pay double in extra police, social work, and medical services. Not to mention your sleep probably wouldn't be as sound.
And window bars are just bloody depressing. ;) | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/28/2007 3:30:13 PM | There are a number of people on social assistance that have different needs. Some have problems and need something in their life to get them through the next day or two whether it be chemical in nature, gambling, or feeding wayward animals.
If these people had their sh*t together they would not be on social assistance. Unless we are willing to help them we can give them a bare living to exist in or we can cut them off and let them fend for themselves.
While a number may find the rude shock of having to fend for themselves a good incentive to change their lives many who have the resources to look after themselves may end up in worse straits or even dead.
It would be nice if we could help all the people out if they do have problems but quite often the person has to be ready for help otherwise it is a waste of effort. To be concerned about money not being spent on children is one thing but if we say we would cut off all funding if we find problems would only hurt the children more.
Life is hard at the bottom end of society and the dependencies some have are a way of coping with it. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/28/2007 8:39:29 PM | | Random drug & alcohol testing!! I'm there, dude ( or dudette) , sign me up :). What sort of drugs & alcohol will they be administering? | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/28/2007 9:22:03 PM | Hmmm, if random drug testing is a condition of employment as stated above - then I had the option before agreeing to take the job to NOT take the job. But, since I wanted to feed clothe and shelter myself I agreed to this condition of employment.
Now, the same effin thing should be applied to anyone applying for any kind of welfare - and if they dont want to be tested randomly then they too can NOT take the welfare.
Free will baby, right across the board!
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/30/2007 7:58:49 AM | | As far as airlines and other workplaces where safety is a factor , random drug and alcohol should be a must , but when it comes to other jobs it might not be as important ,,, A drunk Walmart greeter might be funny , lol lol lol " JUST KIDDING " | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 9/30/2007 3:32:54 PM | well,,,,,,,,,,, since I am recently unemployed by choice i might add,, "Drunk walmart greeter,,,,,,,,, now there's a job I want,,, picture this now! make mental note here!
ls at the door beepin all you little shopplifter wannabee's lmfaoooooooooooooo I'll get yah!
 
ls | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/1/2007 10:32:42 PM | maybe yes there should be more testing,, and not airlines ,, how about the construction guys,,, how bout ,,, each and every job especially drivers!
ls | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/2/2007 10:15:20 AM | | I have heard that a bunch of the internet providers are going to start connecting breathalyzer locks on the internet modems to help slow the recent surge of alcohol related random postings to internet forums. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/9/2007 11:09:12 AM | Some of the states in the US are starting to keep the "chemists" and other addicts and criminals off assistance!!!
There is this woman who is a friend of my sisters who was in prison for Manufacturing of Meth.... she is a single mother of three kids aged 1, 2, 3.... and due to her drug charges she can NOT get assistance for herself from social services!! She can get food and child care assistance for the kids but NOTHING for herself!
She is a nice lady and is trying to make a better life for herself and due to this rule she is FORCED to work a real job and not sit at home on assistance. If she was at home on assistance Im sure the "lab" would be up and going again due to her having nothing more productive to do with her life!
I feel for her in one way but Im damn glad she cant sit at home and get things handed to her!!!!!! | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/10/2007 3:33:32 PM | | They're looking atbringing in mandatory random drug testing at the place I work; does anyone know if eating poppyseed cake triggers faulty test results? Or is that an urban legend? | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/10/2007 4:03:54 PM | When they first started drug screening, poppyseed consumption could trigger a positive test result. The testing for opiates (and metabolites) used a threshold level that was too small. This resulted in many "false positives."
In the late 90's, the concept of false positives was well known enough that the calibration now looked for levels nearly seven times higher than they were before. It was acknowledged that some users may be able to pass the test, but the false positives would largely be eliminated.
Further testing can usually separate the addicts from the innocent. Things such as hair samples can be analyzed. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 10/10/2007 8:45:03 PM | | OK cool,ty for the info. Maybe I'll demand the bosses get a breathalyzer test if I have to submit to drug testing. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 6:48:10 AM | | I just got back from a pipeline job in Fort McMurray where drug and alcohol testing was mandatory before starting work on the site. They originally had enough people lined up but had to keep looking for more because of the failure rate. We only had to test once,so a lot of the smokers were going and buying their stash immediately after the test. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 7:58:18 AM | Not all people on social assistance are bad.
My father (aka Sperm Donor) is on Social Assistance because he was told by many doctors that he is unsuitable to work. Not only is he challenged mentally (more then a few loose marbles) but he takes a lot of medication that makes him prone to be off the work bench.
It's people who abuse the system that really tick me off. For instance I was laid off just before Christmas and was broke just after christmas. I went and tried to get money from social assistance and they denied me for many reasons that I doomed unfair. I concluded maybe I need to have a child and be a drunk in order to get a little help. Everyone has hard times, but apparently "normal" people are only allowed to pay into the system, not collect. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 10:59:12 AM | Interesting topic! I can certainly understand why there's a need for random drug tests & I think more & more places of employment should do them.
People have the freedom of choice to use drugs or not. However, when that choice becomes a neccessity & the drug useage interferes with the health, safety & well-being of themselves & others, then there's a problem.
I strongly believe that random drug tests will make more people THINK & finally come to the realization that thier choices/decisions affects others lives.
I also agree with BiancaPink's statement that those who abuse the system really tick me off! I would like to see Canada implement a system (as in Medicgirl's post) where those who are on Welfare & who are involved in the drug trade be made to pay back every cent they have stolen! | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 5:26:38 PM | As to Linen Sapphire's comments.... Depending on the company, most truck drivers are entered into a random selection of drug and alcohol testing. As of last year, now we also have to undergo a complete medical test every five years of which we pay for ourselves ($80.00 or so).
But as for random testing in welfare cases, I agree wholeheartedly. There are way too many people taking advantage of the system. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 5:35:50 PM | Anyone jailed for running a meth lab is NOT a nice person.
Meth labs are highly dangerous, and the toxicity involved requires the use of trained professionals to clean up and (hopefully) detox the property. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 7:17:33 PM | For the record in CANADA per the Canadian Human Rights Commission
The Canadian Human Rights Act prohibits discrimination on the basis of disability and
perceived disability. Disability includes those with a previous or existing dependence onalcohol or a drug. Perceived disability may include an employer’s perception that a
person’s use of alcohol or drugs makes him or her unfit to work.The Commission will accept complaints from employees and applicants for employmentwho believe they have been dismissed, disciplined or treated negatively as a result of testing positive on a drug or alcohol test. Workplace alcohol- or drug-testing policies that contain discriminatory elements may also be the subject of complaints. Because they cannot be established as bona fide occupational requirements, the following types of testing are not acceptable:
• Pre-employment drug testing
• Pre-employment alcohol testing
• Random drug testing
• Random alcohol testing of employees in non-safety-sensitive positions.
The following types of testing may be included in a workplace drug- and alcoholtesting
program, but only if an employer can demonstrate that they are bona fide
occupational requirements:
• Random alcohol testing of employees in safety-sensitive positions. Alcohol
testing has been found to be a reasonable requirement because alcohol testing
can indicate actual impairment of ability to perform or fulfill the essential duties or
requirements of the job. Random drug testing is prohibited because, given its
technical limitations, drug testing can only detect the presence of drugs and not if or when an employee may have been impaired by drug use.
• Drug or alcohol testing for "reasonable cause" or "post-accident," e.g. where
there are reasonable grounds to believe there is an underlying problem of
substance abuse or where an accident has occurred due to impairment from
drugs or alcohol, provided that testing is a part of a broader program of medical
assessment, monitoring and support.
• Periodic or random testing following disclosure of a current drug or alcohol
dependency or abuse problem may be acceptable if tailored to individual
circumstances and as part of a broader program of monitoring and support.
Usually, a designated rehabilitation provider will determine whether follow-up
testing is necessary for a particular individual.
• Mandatory disclosure of present or past drug or alcohol dependency or abuse
may be permissible for employees holding safety-sensitive positions, within
certain limits, and in concert with accommodation measures. Generally,
employees not in safety-sensitive positions should not be required to disclose
past alcohol or drug problems.
Now on the other hand you have the USA where Walmart actually DOES PRE DRUG TESTING on Greeter Applicants. Yes, that's correct and also random drug testing is present in ALL occupations and allowed.
Naturally I can only speak for myself but once again I am thankful to be a Canadian. It is my opinion that random drug testing is invasive and smacks of "Big Brother".  | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 7:35:47 PM | Soooo, as an employer, I would have no choice about accepting Joe doper as an employee? How the hell is that something to be thankful for? As a coworker I would have no choice about some crackhead being in the next cubicle and maybe not puting in as much work as the sober ones but getting paid the same and not being terribly concerned at all because his (or her) right to be out of it is enshrined.
In this case, the Americans are on the right path. | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 7:58:59 PM | Thorndyke
Well then I guess you and I will have to agree to disagree. RANDOM drug testing in the USA has done nothing to curb the rampant drug usage which is why it was intended in the USA. Just like the massive CCTV everywhere on every street corner on the UK filming every persons every move has made a dent to DECREASE the crime rate.
Did you know in Canada that addiction is considered an "illness" and also has certain protections within the Human Rights code?
IMHO the USA is NEVER on the path in the right direction - righteous maybe.
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 8:17:42 PM | MissDemeanor, All that may be so, but as an example,... in ****company, if you choose not to do a pre-employment drug test, then we will not hire you.
If you choose not to go for a random test (an independent company picks the names, not us) when you are called, then you are suspended from driving until you do.
If you test positive on a drug test, then you are to go for number of random tests during a specific period of time according to regulations. As long as you test negative in those tests, the program will be considered completed until such time that you may called again during a random test.
If you disagree, you can not continue to drive at this company and you will not be allowed to drive in the USA given that most companies do reference checks.
Truck driving is considered a safety regulated profession | |
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| Random drug and alcohol testing!!
Posted: 2/22/2008 8:35:50 PM | Pixter
I agree with the testing in the Transportation Industry as it is a Safety Issue. I support it wholeheartedly.
When I get on a plane....I don't my pilot high or drunk.
When I get in a taxi......I don't want my driver high or drunk.
I also support random testing 365 days a year on our streets and highways by ALL drivers.
It is NOT unreasonable for ANY employer to expect an employee to come to work NOT under the influence of drugs or alcohol. I agree. Does the employer have the RIGHT to monitor that at their leisure by the means of random testing? Hell no.
The thing I find invasive is the way some seem to think it's acceptable for people receiving Social Assistance to be randomly checked. Should we also put Scarlet Letters on all individuals on Social Assistance and paint them all with the same brush?
In the USA....being on Social Assistance means that the grocery portion of your funds come to you in Food Stamps. The stigma is attached there as now that person is paying with stamps in public view. Do you know why we do NOT do that in Canada? It is demeaning and disparaging. The intent in the USA is that those funds can ONLY be spent on food. Hmmmm do you think they are NOT sold for cash on the streetcorners or exchanged at a lower rate by profiteers? It does not stop the abuse of where the funds are spent. It is only another stigma attached to receiving "assistance".
Naturally the disclaimer applies: This is my opinion which only counts in my house.
Also Pixter...may I ask you something please? Just out of curiousity...as you are in the industry and subject to the testing......even with the testing have you yourself ever witnessed or been aware that the problem of drug and alcohol usage is still there? I am just curious as I am not in that industry.
Thanks! | |
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