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| I don't do "separated"...
Posted: 11/2/2007 11:44:06 PM | I am looking for a guy who is SINGLE. I keep getting these guys who are separated from their wives. To me, that's not single. I don't want to date some woman's husband. I have never been married, so I've never gone through my own divorce. I don't want to go through anyone else's either.
I think marriage is important. I would NEVER violate that. Separated in your mind and heart doesn't count to me. I need paperwork!!
I've had guys call me biased because of my feelings about this. Am I wrong for not giving these guys a chance? | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 12:00:03 AM | | Nope. It's your personal choice. Seperated implies just that seperated. I, myself would not date someone who was seperated. I don't want to be the back up quarterback till the starting QB finally gets his shit together and starts throwing TD's. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 12:09:39 AM | Until the paper work is official, it's just another word for still married.
There are a lot of seperated couples, that give it another try.
I would'nt want to be caught in the middle of one of those.  | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:04:10 AM | In my opinion, you sound like you have a sensible reason to have a personal standard regarding this issue, whether you are 'biased' or not. Therefore, I consider you to be 'right' in this regard. And there is nothing wrong with being biased. As long as a person remains 'reasonable', in the proper sense of the word.
I do have issue with the separation thing though. In Canada, unless a person wants to guarantee that his/her divorce will be hell, and take at minimum one year and $100,000 to end, he/she is otherwise effectively forced to be separated for 365 long days before proceedings can begin. It is realistically next to being the only option for a person, unless you really want to f**k your life up. In the meantime, the law happily smiles upon all manner of adultery that may be committed by one's separated spouse for that year. Personally, I am far from ok being anything other than divorced from a serial adulterer, and I feel extremely disrespected by a government that effectively allows a situation where my only sensible option is to remain only separated from a serial adulterer for a year. It really feels like they are forcing you to take this sick treatment. The law needs to be changed, in my opinion. In the States, I believe the separation period is much shorter. It should be so here as well. By keeping the separation period to a year, the government seems to bask in the righteous appearance of taking the institution of marriage oh so seriously, but only as an 'open marriage' apparently.... thanks, but no thanks. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:12:55 AM | | dear cyn... you are not only beeyoutahfull but so smart... separated is being involved with separated people only to be part of a separated equation... you will always be separated so starting something in suspended animation will leave you in suspended animation ... no relationship of reward has no future ,,,, anyone who gets involved in mess is gonnah get messed up.... | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:13:38 AM | | I've lived a single life for 2 years since splitting with my ex but as I haven't gone through the inevitable divorce proceedings yet, I class myself as separated, not single. I'm still married but only in name. I wouldn't be put off by a guy who is separated either. When a relationship becomes a bit more serious and developed, then you have to accept his past and present as well as his future. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:25:36 AM | No. You are not "wrong" for not wanting to deal with someone who is separated. Especially since apparently the "separated" label is used by married people who are just looking to fool around on the side...
In my thinking separated should mean at least a year of living apart and/or divorce proceedings having been started... Personally I spent many lonely years in a "relationship" and see no reason to wait 1 - 3 yrs for the court system to process my case before continuing my search...
Having never been married I can see how you may view the "paper" in the court house as something sacred. For many others on POF (and elsewhere) that piece of paper has value only if everyone involved believes it has value... Personally I look forward to the possibility of a LTR WITHOUT anything other than both of our daily decision to nurture and care for the relationship to keep it going...
Or to put it a little more bluntly how much "honor" or "respect" does a "relationship" deserve if the only thing holding it together is the "men with guns?" (govt) | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:26:34 AM | | ln my eyes and in the eyes of the law "separated=still married" and l don't date married women... Have standards dropped so low that one can happily fornicate around with someone else's spouse. A sad reflection on todays society | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:43:42 AM | Nope Sweety stick to your guns. I also dont' do separated. You are so right. I mean separated can mean anything..
Let them call you what they want you are doing the right thing | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 1:51:36 AM | | To put a different slant on things. I'm "separated". Meaning my ex and I have Legal separation papers drawn up,and notarized. The only difference between a legal separation and a divorce is the fact that neither of us can legally re-marry without a divorce. The terms for our divorce are spelled out in our separation agreement and are identicle and cannot be altered by a divorce. Having said that, here are some points to ponder. 1) The main and possibly sole purpose of us getting a "separation" rather than a divorce was the viewpoint of our children. Being young and relatively naieve at the time, they may have been under the impression that there was a chance we'd re-unite. There is absolutely no chance of that and I'll not even ask you to believe me. 2) We can easily get a divorce at anytime, however the fact that we have to go through that consideration keeps us from JUMPING into another doomed marraige without valid consideration. 3) Is anybody really silly enough to think that two people who've been legally DIVORCED can never re-marry? Come on, we've all seen it happen, if not to someone we know, then at least in the news. What's the point in restricting yourself from meeting a previously "owned" individual. Remove the blinders and live your life. Be free to meet the right person. | |
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nCurls
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Joined: 8/11/2007
Msg: 11 | |
| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 2:31:23 AM | Interesting argument you put forward. You state, there is absolutely no chance of the two of you getting back together. Yet although you can easily obtain a divorce (if you so wish), choose not to on the basis that staying separated keeps you from jumping into another doomed marriage. Then in addition you come to your closing argument stating that "we" have all seen divorced couples re-marry. Huh????
I do believe that once partners become separated (within the legal grounds), they cannot re-marry until the divorce papers are signed and there is a time factor too, before obtaining a divorce ( correct me if I am wrong about this).
So what I am interpreting, staying separated is liken to being in a safe zone for you. You aren't divorced nor are you entirely on your own, meaning there just could be a possibility that your relationship could re- kindle. Sort of a cosy situation isn't it??
I think people who stay in the separated zone are emotionally not ready to move on and maybe should seek friendships only. So I guess I don't agree with your comments. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 2:45:30 AM |
I think people who stay in the separated zone are emotionally not ready to move on and maybe should seek friendships only. So I guess I don't agree with your comments.
I couldn't agree more, and OP, no you are not in any way wrong to set these standards for yourself. I am not disputing that some separated couples are as good as divorced already, but in a large percentage of them the chances are that one or other of the party will still have emotional ties to the marriage partner. It depends whether you look with the view that it is always best to be safe than sorry, or the view that if you don't take a chance you may miss a golden opportunity. Personally when it comes to being separated I would stay on the side of caution, because there are enough divorced and single people out there to take chances on. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 3:25:56 AM |
cyn3100 wrote:
I am looking for a guy who is SINGLE. I keep getting these guys who are separated from their wives. To me, that's not single. I don't want to date some woman's husband. I have never been married, so I've never gone through my own divorce. I don't want to go through anyone else's either.
I think marriage is important. I would NEVER violate that. Separated in your mind and heart doesn't count to me. I need paperwork!!
I've had guys call me biased because of my feelings about this. Am I wrong for not giving these guys a chance?
I think you would be wise to decide these things just on a person by person basis.
The slow wheels of divorce litigation sometimes being what they are, a person
could quite literally be completely separated from his or her ex-spouse for potentially
a few years before the "needed paperwork" came through. And do you imagine
that folks just put their emotional and social life on hold simply because lawyers
and the legal system don't get paid to be efficient?
Look, the fact of the matter is that you're probably come across some guys who
have just been separated and my be of the variety that at the drop of a hat they'd
go running back to their wife if given even half a chance.
And yet there are other fellows out there who also have this same label of being
"separated" but never have any desire to reconcile their past marriage, and
have gone through the grief process of that emotional loss, and have rejoined
the world of the living, as it were, yet still are waiting for the darn lawyers
(who again, don't get paid for being efficient) to finally be motivated enough
to get the supposed "paper work finished."
So are you going to live your life just looking a labels like "separated" and paint
all fellows with the same brush stroke?
In his book "Zen And The Art of Seeing," author Frederick Franks said this:
We do a lot of looking: we look through lenses,
telescopes, television tubes...Our looking is
perfected every day, but we see less and less.
Never has it be more urgent to speak of SEEING.
Ever more gadgets, from cameras to computers,
from art books to videotapes, conspire to take over
our thinking, or feeling, our experiencing, our seeing.
Onlookers we are, spectators .... "subjects" we are, that
look at "objects." Quickly we stick labels on all that is,
labels that stick once and for all By these labels we recognize
everything, but no longer SEE anything. We know the
labels on all the bottles, but never taste the wine.
What I'm suggesting to you here is to "taste the wine" -- just each man
you meet on his individual merits, and not just by some label which
only says "separated." Sift out where the fellow is at. Take time to
get a feel for where his head space is at. I mean heck, if you don't
do that, you might find that you've found yourself some fellow who
indeed has all the supposed "paperwork" you're calling for, and yet
find it really doesn't matter because it turns out he's just going
from one short term relationship now to another, and that you're
just part of an endless string for him.
By these labels we recognize everything, but no
longer SEE anything. We know the labels on all
the bottles, but never taste the wine.
Judge each man on his own merits. I mean it just seems to me to
be in your own best interest rather than at all only going by what
his label might say.
Hope that perspective is of some help,
CJ | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 3:58:50 AM |
I think people who stay in the separated zone are emotionally not ready to move on and maybe should seek friendships only. So I guess I don't agree with your comments.
I have to say i disagree with that comment based on my experience. This is such a tricky subject and one i am wrestling with...
I am completely done with my marriage, i have been legally separated for over 4.5 years. I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that i will never, NEVER, reunite with my ex. I haven't felt married since the day i told him i thought it was time we ended our marriage. I took a long time coming to that conclusion, i'm pretty sure i grieved the marriage for many months before i made that choice.
The problem is that we are having difficulty getting the divorce finalized. Our post separation relationship is not very good, his choice not mine as i was willing to walk the high road, but honestly i'm better off speaking to him as little as possible. He tends to be pretty abusive in any conversation. So why don't i just get a lawyer to deal with it? Well not sure if any of you have checked out the costs associated with divorce these days, but i certainly cannot afford it. Separation and divorce generally are a pretty big hit to both individual's finances as it is. Sigh. I would like nothing more to have all ties severed with this man, and in my heart and mind they are. I say this with absolute certainty.
Now the problem is, if you state you are separated, we have seen that the majority steer away from anyone listed as separated. Ugh. I live at least five hours away from him and have almost no contact with him, but that cannot be stated in the word separated. Somehow i don't really care for having to explain away this in my profile, i kind of like to focus on the positive. Do you all qualify your last relationship? Something like this..."Oh yes, i am certainly over the man i broke up with 4 months ago, i really loved him, we were together for 6 years, but really, you have nothing to worry about.." Yet for me, because of a piece of paper and the lack of a second piece of paper, i have this dilemna.
I've been in a few relationships in the past few years, i've also learned to enjoy and appreciate some time spent single. I feel pretty balanced and emotionally ready to be in relationships though i'm currently looking for friendship as i ended a relationship in the last 6 months and like to give things a little time. I never keep from anyone that i've been married and that the divorce has not gone through, but people are so judgmental before they know you. I guess that is a bitter pill i'm going to have to swallow and those that cannot see past that will have missed their opportunity to know me. | |
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B.Ann
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Joined: 5/23/2006
Msg: 15 | |
| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:07:01 AM | I tell men that i wouldn,t date them if they were separated,but they get really upset,saying things like,"Oh so that makes me a bad person,does it!" etc. they then proceed to be argumentative about the whole thing.To me ,separated is still married
I had two long term relationships with men who were separated,and they treated me badly,they just weren,t ready to be faithful,after splitting with their wives,before i came along.If i had known that i could have saved myself a lot of grief! | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:17:34 AM | Thank you Apolinary!!! Very well said. Just what i was trying to get at. Also the fact that even those with the correct paperwork are not necessarily anymore ready or capable of relationship as those lacking it.
I really appreciate your perspective, i am growing so tired of labels of every sort. I also can understand people's hesitation, so appreciate that some are not comfortable with getting involved with someone that is separated.
Plenty of Fish requires a level of disclosure at a glance unlike any other way of meeting people. As a very private Scorpio, i find this a bit galling, though in person people find me to be very open. I've never in my life been able to know if a guy is separated or divorced, or what books he likes to read, if he smokes, does drugs, or how much he drinks in the first few moments i laid my eyes on him. I understand wanting to know these things, but at the same time i think it is allowing us to very quickly label, stereotype and dismiss people. We could be verging on overkill. Sadly, i think this need to know as much as possible is a result of so much deceit, we are all wary.
Now if i started to get romantically interested in someone i would be sure to let them know about my "status", that is only fair. The same would go for someone that i happened to click with that i met in the "real" world. Honestly though, it is so far removed from my daily thoughts that sometimes i even forget about it.
I'm wondering if maybe we should also have sections on our profiles for:
Do you use pornographic materials?
Have you ever paid for sex?
Do you pick your nose?
Fart in public?
Pee in the shower?
Leave the toilet seat up/down?
Yell at your SO or children?
Experienced road rage?
Lie?
with all the applicable options, socially, often>3 times a week, no, prefer not to say, occasionally....
come on people lets all let our dirty laundry out, for every joe blow and sally moe to see.
I guess ultimately i am looking of people who are not rigid and stuck on labels, who are willing to take me as i am; understanding my experiences are responsible for who I am today and see the integrity i live my life with. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:21:11 AM | To B.Ann
very sorry to hear that, that's really not cool at all, but that sounds to me like a personality issue more than a separation issue.
If i disclosed to someone that my divorce has not been legally finalized and they were not ok with that, i would respectfully accept their feelings. I know i'm not a bad person, i know my circumstances have just made it difficult and that for all intents and purposes i am indeed single.
Then again, some people treat people badly anyway, and are still hung up on past relationships even though they were never married... | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:43:18 AM | I have made the dating separated person mistake. 6 months into the relationship he asked me to marry him and I said yes. Then he went to make final arrangements with his "ex" and she decided she wanted him back. He felt seeing as they had taken vows and she wanted to be back together he should give it another shot.
Turns out she just didn't want him to be with anyone else. We broke up, she never followed through and he spent too much time and tears trying to get me back. It could never be the same though. Marriage is a sacred vow and I walked away knowing they deserved to make every attempt at making it work. Seems I was the only one felt that way.
I will never date separated ever again. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:52:11 AM | My sentiments exactly........I've never married either and separated is still married to me and I don't do separated either!
And then there are those men on this site who consider themselves separated but still live in the same home as the wife! Right..............that's a good separation..........
That would be separated when they are away from the wife at work or out with the guys....
Then we get in to the married guys who after reading on your profile "not interested in married men"................they still send the email saying I'm interested....can I try to change your mind   | |
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Nona37
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Joined: 10/3/2007
Msg: 20 | |
| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 4:53:21 AM | I so agree with you on this topic. If a man is TRULY interested in you, he will stay in touch with you but finish up his divorce and respect your wishes. When one dates a "seperated" man/woman, they are taking chances, such as,,,what if the man/woman goes back to their wife/husband? One can not blame them for doing this, but it leaves the other person who chose to get involved with this seperated person out in the cold, it's not worth it in my eyes either, and if a man/woman has a problem with this, then obviously they are not serious about getting their divorce anyways. Why invite the drama, therefore, I agree with you wholeheartedly. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:10:03 AM | | I have to jump on the band wagon about not dating separated but still married men. I understand the legal separation angle but that is a rare thing anymore and usually done for legal, religious or financial reasons. If it was clear up front that it was a legal separation, I might consider dating him but the down side is what if we fell in love and wanted to marry? It would not be an option or he would then have to persue the divorce. Being an American, I can understand the Canadian frustration regarding separation/divorce and it taking a year. Believe it or not, in the US--my first divorce took 10 months as did the second. If both sign and there are no children or financial hassels--those can sometimes be done in a few months. I had a friend whose divorce took 3 years because they had businesses and lots of land. The law, in its infinite wisdom, (tongue in cheek) is probably hoping you will reconcile. I am not up on the England/Canada connection as far as law, but I believe I understand you are considered part of the British Empire--think about it--the Royals use to never divorce--just had the daliances on the side so why would they care if the populace could divorce? I guess parliment has other things to do and if it does not impact them, they don't care. I am not slamming your government in any way, beleive me, I know how many problems ours has. I guess the bottom line is that we all have to choose what we can be comfortable with. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:29:49 AM | seperated people are legally still married, period. i also prefer that if they are divorced they have been so for at least 6 months so that any bitterness has a chance to fade away.
to me there is no gray area either you are married or you are not. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:31:11 AM | Well not sure if any of you have checked out the costs associated with divorce these days, but i certainly cannot afford it. Separation and divorce generally are a pretty big hit to both individual's finances as it is. Sigh. I would like nothing more to have all ties severed with this man, and in my heart and mind they are. I say this with absolute certainty.
So what happens when you DO find the right guy and want to marry him? Will you suddenly afford a lawyer then or make him pay for it?
Sorry. Weak excuse.
Just a wild guess, are you still covered by his medical insurance?
The bitter pill for you is cutting back on any habits, vices or excesses in your life and hiring the lawyer. With all of the "prefer not to say" responses I have an idea you spend your money on drinking, smoking, generally things you could do without if the divorce really mattered to you.
It takes a year in Canada. 20 bucks per week is $1000 a year. What do they charge up there? My divorce was $250 here in Ohio.
PS Include legal fees in your plea since HE is holding this up with specific demands.
ON topic, you know what you want and you are correct to stay focused on that. Separated means "married and looking for sex with anyone not my spouse" most of the time, particularly on an anonymous, free dating system like this. Though you never said anything POF specific, you ARE here......
Dating someone separated is a "He was married...." post waiting to happen. | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:31:31 AM | Mystic Magic ...just goes to show how nasty some people can get
Kahuna | |
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| I don't do separated...
Posted: 11/3/2007 5:35:16 AM | | If your goal is to have a one-on-one exclusive relationship it wouldn't seem to make sense to be with someone still entangled with someone else. I was separated before and I was in no real shape to be initiating anything at that point. I eventually got divorced and after a year or so, maybe more than that, emotionally--I was able to be present more in a new situation. I can't dictate what other people would need. Some people are samplers--regardless of status. I can't do multiple intimacies and/or deception--paperwork is just that, actually. But to me if a person can't take care of business in that department, it's a telling sign. The truth is, after being all ready with paperwork to do dissolution in 1996, my former wife and I went another round until 2000 (albeit not very conventionally married--we lived in two different places the last two surprisingly still engaging years). I don't like to have too many unfinished projects in life--same for relationships. I like the friends idea. People sometimes pickup later when things are clearer--but to pretend it will sway your way when things are ambiguous is naive. Love isn't really very practical at times, though. I avoid trouble if I can. | |
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