| "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 9:08:46 AM | Theoreticaly, what if your parents took you away as a small child, before you learned about religion, to somewhere remote and told you that God was an orange or something different then what we all know. If they told you everyday and you practiced it every day and made it a religion. You now, as an adult, passionately beLIEve in this "religion" that you have learned and you teach it to your children. They teach their children and so on and so on.....You now have an established organized religion that many believe in where you live.....Then you spread the belief around to other civilizations (forcing it on some). Many many years later just about half of the people in the world believe in it...not knowing the truth....
So...........I ask you......Does religion just get in the way of true personal spirituality??? | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 10:58:49 AM | my parents brought me up not around religon..it was never forced on us...i believe that religon causes more problems then good..most of the wars all throughout history where fought over religon..it also splits to many people up, we are already categorized as in different races, why do we need to be split up even more by religon, especially where each group thinks there religon is better then eachothers..alot of vikings were killed of cause christians tried to force there christian ways on them..
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 3:09:47 PM | | Believing in religion, to me, is no different than loving steak and hating seafood. It's a matter of opinion; no more, no less. There's no shred of proof that ANY religion is real, yet people kill for it, people die for it, people change their lives for it, people raise their children for it, etc. It seems that the main thing it gets in the way of is progression of your own life. What would you do differently in your life if you believed or didn't believe?? That complete flip-flop of one person's life in this decision makes it really worth reconsidering either side, doesn't it? As for me...I always saw it like this: If I live my life as a "good person" and try to help people as a "religious" person would...but don't believe...isn't that good enough for whatever being might be there? If it's NOT good enough...then why would I give a flying fart in space??!! Carpe Diem people... | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 3:30:57 PM | Please lets not confuse ourselves into thinking that "all religion is bad".
Indeed, people do kill in the name of religion, and THAT I think is a bad idea, although my understanding of the bible (my doctrine of choice) indicates that God has approved of this in several occations. Religions that are BASED on hatred and killing (such as Islam?) infuriate me.
I got a thing in the mail recently asking me to buy books/casettes/videos/etc to learn the ways of some "ancient truths" BS. They claim that their "mystic ways" are sweeping the nation by storm, and they're probably (unfortunately) right. Their material was centered around things like reincarnation, crystals and crap like that. Pure new-age garbage, although they deny it. I KNOW WHY PEOPLE BUY INTO THAT TRASH: it's because they present their stuff AS FACT. This was the cornerstone of Hitler's technique: present something as solid fact, repeat it, and have others repeat it. Then people will swear to it on their life.
I pull my religious beliefs primarily based on "What has God commanded us to believe, and what has He done to prove it?". Follow that up with "does it make sense?". Too many people will form religions on simply either "what makes sense" or "what do I want to hear?". | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 3:36:10 PM | | I base it on the fact that I have no way of knowing if it is real or not, and don't want to gamble my life on what I'm not sure of...but make no mistake...I would never take anyone's beliefs away for anything. I could be wrong about all of it! | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 7:06:42 PM | PakanaHerruus - Perhaps, but nothing so far.
NearLifeExperience - true, as neither Science nor religion has explained anything sufficiently. Science is based on what has been referred to as "This World", but how far that can go to explain itself, as it would become a philosophical/religious matter of sorts in it's own right at least to some degree. | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 7:51:47 PM | | I am a Wiccan/Witch. Religion saved my life. I studied Christianity and found that it was lacking humanity. I found Wicca and Paganism by accident at a point in my life when I was considering suicide. I wasn't looking for someone to make it all better, I was just looking for someone to tell me that I belonged to something larger than myself. I guess my short answer is, religion is my way of being...it doesn't get in the way. | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/13/2004 10:22:35 PM | | well some religons arent all bad..but as you say your pagan..alot of ancestors of the pagan religon were killed of by christians cause they wanted to change them..the christians pillaged, and burnt pagan villiages, cause the pagans refused to obey them.. | |
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yna6
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Joined: 5/2/2004
Msg: 14 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 12:18:13 AM | I have found that by trying to be a "good person" to anyone, no matter what their religion, skin colour, sex, whatever, has always lead me in the direction I wish to go. NO hatred...jealousy...bias, prejudices. Just people. I may not agree with all they say or do....which can lead to some interesting conversations (ok, ok...and some hollering too...lol...politics gets like that!)...BUT....the "common good" always goes forwards. Islamic culture is slowly turning away from keeping half the population "downtrodden" (I am speaking of women here) Is it for the common good? I could argue both sides of the fence here....
Our Western culture gives women rights, freedoms, etc, supposedly on par with males. Mid-eastern ones do not. Here...all are supposedly "equal" in the eyes of the law. Not so there. BUT...how many broken marriages do they have? How many juvenile delinquints? Is youth crime a probelm there? There are many factors to look at....maybe they DO have the right idea....male "head of the household" ruling with a tight grip, to see his family does ok, rather than having his hands tied by "laws" that state he is no longer "king of his castle." (oh...and ladies...before you start....women there actually rule the roost....should hear some of the Muslim guys bitching to their friends about how bad their wives treat them at home....revenge! lol!) | |
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Ruby_
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Joined: 7/10/2004
Msg: 17 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 2:03:32 AM | I believe in a higher power than ourselves, why not call it it God. I believe in Jesus Christ and his teachings, whether he was man or son of God. If you go by his word and not how the different religions have distorted it over the centuries I think it is a good road. There will always be fanatics who use religion and and any other cover to try and hide their evil intentions.
I also believe in Evolution. God created the world in 6 days he rested on the 7th. How long is a day to God, surely not 24 hours. 24 hours in a day is our concept. So why can't there be evolution in Gods world. A day could be a million years!
Have you forgotten there is a missing link between us and the apes?
Things of this world are not black and white. I take each day as it comes and I live the best life I can. It seems when I am doing the right things my life goes pretty smooth. If I deviate things just turn bad. This leads me to believe there is order in this chaos.
Faith is all about believing in what you can't see, hear or touch but you know it is real.
If you believe in something that makes your life meaningful, why can't we believe in different things. "In Gods house there are many mansions."
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 18 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 3:23:49 PM | First off no mater what i am taught the truth remains the same. meaning if i belive an orange is god. that the truth that the orange is not god is still the truth. GOD leaves an empty space in all our hearts just for him. that is why no realtionship, meterial things, fleashly things can fill it. that is why we fill empty.
Then as thinking humans we can weigh the eveidence for the orange and say JESUS.
what can the orange do? or is it's history? or power? it dies with out the sun? rotts, shrivels with out water? it eaten by man and birds? and so on.. plus it dosent fill that spiritual void that we have. just like when you get your heart broken it is not your flesh body tht hurt but your spirit man that hurts. something feed the spirit man and that is faith and GOD.
ok now to jesus vs the orange. he lived, his life is documented and recorded. he healed people, died and rose again. witnessed by over 500 people at the reserection that would stand up in any court. when people take faith in him there life changes. look at paul he went from killing christians and wealth to poverty and preaching and to his death for it. there is power there and something not of this world to it.
but i think religion it self is a man made thing. and twisted by man . spirit things are of GOD and GOD wants personal relationship with his creation not people doing it just becasue they feel they have to or that it is what they should do. if you could make some one love you it would not be the same as if they picked you. GOD wants to be picked, trusted and provide for his childern . tht is not religion.
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 19 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 3:33:04 PM | pakana The viking killed chirstians. they raided there monistarys and such.
also were did you get "most of the wars all throughout history where fought over religon"
world war one? nope... world war 2...nope. iraqi wars...nope.. veit nam? nope. korea...nope napolian....nope. alexander the great?...nope. ganghis kan....nope.
In fact more wars are fought over bad politics, race, mans greed and pride then religion. | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 3:42:30 PM | rubydue, you have no idea how much I agree with what you said.
Religion will always be corrupted by man by his own greed and thirst for power. From Christians (Branch Davidians) to Muslim (Taleban), people have always taken whatever is good in the belief in a higher power and twisted it to support their own goals. That doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bath water. You search for the truth in your own way and find whatever gives you peace.
I am a Christian myself, but I no longer believe what a good many others do about other religions. Basically, I don't know what to believe about the afterlife, so I leave that up to a higher power. My job is to emulate the person of Jesus and show respect and love to all people, no matter what their beliefs or opinions. | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 6:11:50 PM | | Religions are just another way of trying to answer the questions that have none. They only cause us problems when people are offended by them - but I think that's true of everything. If it isn't religion, we just find something else to argue about. . . | |
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| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 7:16:54 PM | | As fascinating as this thread is, and as popular as it probably will remain, the fact is...the right thing to do is not to discuss religion at all, as all will only agree to disagree. That's what makes religion "personal"...between one and God, one and Allah, one and an orange...whatever you choose to believe in. I don't care which side of a religion someone preaches to another...it's HIGHLY unlikely that any one person, whatever they believe, will change their beliefs for someone's advice. Only thing I ever found to believe in was myself, but the mind that thinks that opinion is the mind I was given...whether it's by God, the Earth, or only my parents. If my destiny is to be punished by God for not believing in him, so be it...it's the mind he gave me. For some reason though, call me crazy...I have a feeling EVERYBODY is wrong about the truth. Each and every one of us could be in for a surprise... | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 24 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 8:20:06 PM | | Dearest. I don't mean to take anything away from the jewish holocost. i love the jewish people and that was a horibal thing. but it was not only the jews that sufferd . it was a pride thing and a humanistic view that motivated him not that they worshiped johova. hitler killed retards, gays, gypsies, ethnics and anyone that he seen as lesser then the suprem arian race. It was a race thing not a faith thing. he was trying to make a super race of people he thought were superior. in fact i have never heard of an nazi church of anything? in fact he raised him self up to be worshiped the way i see it. | |
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jimi77
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Joined: 7/13/2004
Msg: 25 | |
| Re: "RELIGION"..............Does it just get in the way?
Posted: 9/14/2004 8:26:28 PM | If there is a GOD and he is holy and will not tollerate sin (Disobediance). or wrong doing like we all in our hearts know when we do wronge. then that places us in the bad box. so if GOD punishes sin and we all sin and all fall short. were does that leave us? in punishment. performance (being good) won't cut it because we sin daily. that leaves only one place to look for forgivness. kind of cleaver if you ask me.... JESUS a perfect scarifice to cover that sin. i am not trying to preach here just stating my view.
I like this thread, no figthing but people talking. that is good. | |
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