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| Does "True" Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:22:28 PM | Can a person really love another and yet NOT want to marry them; or does his/her unwillingness to marry the professed object of his/her love mean that he/she really doesn't love as deeply as he/she claims?  | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:29:53 PM | I don't believe marriage is necessary as long as no children are planned. I would not have a child out of wedlock. But now that I'm past all that, I don't need someone else (the goverment, the church) to tell me that my feelings are now legitimized by their stamp of approval.
I will consider living with a man, but to me that is a permanent commitment, not a "see how it goes" thing. The day I move in, is the day I become "married" in my own eyes. And isn't it ultimately the two people involved that need to feel good about the status of their relationship?
Who cares if the government or the church hasn't managed to get money out of you for permission to commit? Not me. | |
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oshan
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Joined: 1/5/2008
Msg: 5 | |
| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:37:50 PM | | OP, I really like this topic. I've had discussions around this subject/issue before, and I would have say that it all depends on what each person in the relationship feels they need. For me, if I'm in a relationship with a man who tell me he loves me, and is in love with me, but he doesn't want to marry me...that would be a problem because for me, the institution of marriage is about announcing to the world that we belong to each other, that we are committed to each other, and that we truly love each other. We may already know this, but it's a matter of showing up in the world as a team. This doesn't mean, of course, that we do everything together. We still have our own jobs, friends, interests, and we share friends and interests as well. I think arriage ought to be seen as a way of honouring and celebrating each other and the relationship officially, not only in our own hearts and minds, but also in the eyes of the world. We can say that 'who cares what the world thinks or believes', and that is a valid statement, but we do live, work, play and love in the world...not only behind closed doors. Thus, if a man says he loves me and is in love with me, there would be no reason not to be married...imo. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:44:39 PM | "yet NOT want to marry them"
change "want" to "need" and you've got my opinion....
nopers- imho marriage is ordained and promoted / supported by the government (tax breaks, social stigma, lawyers' fees at the end)- yeah - I know the references in the bible for those who will take me to task....
but my opinion stands - marriage is not a requirement to prove one's love... | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:45:32 PM | | you can pledge to love someone forever and be totally devoted to that person only and never marry. what about divorces? marriage is NO GUARANTEE that you will be able to hang on to her 4ever. chances are you prolly won`t. it might make you feel for a lil while like "you own her" but in time things will prolly change. why get married to begin with when they are so easy to get out of these days? waste of time imo. if marriage was the "sacred" thing that it used to be maybe go 4 it but now days it`s simply not imo. so why bother. just be in love and enjoy that for however long it lasts. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:50:47 PM | The two can be mutually exclusive. Their unwillingness to marry isn't necessarily a measure of the depth of their love, it is rather, IMO, their uncertainty to commit. I generally find that older women who have been married before, usually are the ones opposed to marriage. Please note my use of the words "generally", and "usually".
"They" are also the ones who will state that their is no difference between being married and living together, that it is just a "piece of paper", etc. However, "they" have usually been "married" several times, either conventionally, or "in their own eyes".
As I stated earlier, people can love each other without making a public commitment (which is what marriage is), and they can also get married without being in love, making that commitment for various reasons. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 2:56:45 PM | There are several very good reasons why two people who love one another, and are committed to one another, should get married.
This is simply from a legal point of view, and not my personal opinion.
Unless you go to some extraordinary measures, marriage affords partners several rights, that are not granted to individuals, by operation of law.
First, would be the ability to receive a deceased spouse's property as your own. Let's say the two of you buy a house together, and you simply put it in both of your names, "as a single man, and a single woman," or whatever the case may be. When one, or both of you dies, and this will happen at some point, your heirs will receive your interest in the property.
But, let's say only one of you dies, and the one who died, had no Will. Hmmmm, then the laws of Intestate Succession apply. So, your state says that your deceased partner's share of your house goes to his/her kids, that never really liked you anyway, and want to sell their, undivided 1/2 interest, in the house.
Naturally, you're fuming about now, because it's YOUR house, your partner and you bought it together, as a couple, and intended it to go to the survivor of the two of you, when one died. But, you two never got around to creating Wills, leaving the house to the other partner, in the event of your death.
So, now, you are faced with "buying" the undivided 1/2 interest in the house you live in, at an inflated price, because the two of you were not married.
Naturally, there are ways around all of this, you buy the house as Joint Tenants, with right of survivorship. Then, if one dies, the other inherits the deceased's undivided 1/2 interest in the house, by operation of law, as if you were married.
This is just one example of the multitude of things that "married" people don't have to be concerned with, because the law has already provided for these things for them.
Another case is, that your partner is in a terrible accident, and has irreversible brain damage. You know their wishes were for you to pull the plug, but, his/her family says no, keep him/her alive; there will be a miracle and they will survive.
In this case, buy yourself a monthly parking pass at the Courthouse; you're going to need it. | |
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Mulva
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Joined: 12/28/2007
Msg: 11 | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 3:08:45 PM | | I think that it depends on the people in the relationship. If they're traditionalists, they tend to lead towards Marriage. If not, then a common law relationship will tend to suffice. I can't answer the question for anyone but myself, in which I would say if it was true love, then yes, it would require marriage. For my best friend, neighbor, sister, it could be a different answer. I know this doesn't truely answer your question, but I don't think there IS a right answer for it, just what one's perception of the answer is. Hope you can settle for that. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 3:25:35 PM | I agree with Needer. Ultimately, for me, I would like to get married again. But, the would require that ONE special person. God, I don't want to go through ANOTHER divorce. :-) But, that is for me, and me alone. If my partner didn't agree with that, obviously, they were not "the one" for me.
That being said, I don't think if you are deeply in love, that you HAVE to get married. It is just what *I* want to do. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 3:45:58 PM | | Many people are in long term marriages with no love involved. I dont see that getting married is proving ones love . If love is a committment, it is being committed to the person not to the institution of marriage. It may protect one legally , if there is a breakup and assets are comingled but that issue can be taken care of easily. It is an individual choice and I think , in some instances age appropriate. If planning a family or the possiblilty that can happen then maybe it would be the thing to do.. I dont see another marriage in my future. But I never say never to anything. And it certainly is not a requirement to prove being in love.JMHO | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 4:01:09 PM | | Lostcauz, marriage does afford some rights automatically to couples, but there are many other ways to structure your estate to accomplish the same goals and protect yourself against the things you mentioned without marriage. Surely the money you'd save in divorce court would make the legal fees up-front look like a bargain. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 4:16:42 PM | I don't know that love doesn't require marriage.
I don't think true love would either... but it would certainly be a higher quality relationship if the people made a legal commitment to each other regarding their respective property, etcetera, to let the other person know they're there if help is needed.
Conversely, I knew of a woman who was in love with a married guy and she was dying of cancer. He was a Maitre'd at a restaurant where she was a waitress. He loved her, but they weren't even dating exclusively. She saw other guys, but it was never anyone that she knew other than as platonic relationships.
Anyway, when she was dying, he anonymously (to everyone but her, probably) paid her hospital bills and even several years after she died, she had two underage daughters who were being taken care of by one of her adult daughters and her grownup kids would find an envelope with about $1800 in their mailbox every month. This was back in 1972, so it was not a small amount of money.
They finally saw him walking up to their mailbox late at night...
Quite a guy, he was. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/22/2008 6:43:28 PM | There are an infinite number of ways to structure your estate so that your partner has the same rights as if you were married. Unfortunately, the steps necessary to "cover all of the bases" so to speak are, rather involved, and very often, not taken by unmarried couples.
My aunt had a live in boyfriend before it was stylish, and they were together for over thirty years. They thought they had taken care of everything. However, when my aunt's boyfriend died, his family, that he'd only seen twice in those thirty-plus years, came sniffing around, looking for money.
Thankfully, my aunt, and her boyfriend, never had a joint checking account, or bought anything together; even the house they lived in was bought and paid for, by my aunt.
It was a process, but, we were able to protect my aunt's assets from being siezed by a bunch of money grubbers, and her wishes were honored when she died.
If you're going to live like you're married, get married, make it legal, and all of that other mess. It's a lot easier in the long run, for both your partner, and your family. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/23/2008 3:20:20 AM | What happens if you are dedicated to someone that will refuse to bring friends and family together and sign a LOVE CONTRACT ?
If it in fact is a TRUE LOVE..there should be no problem looking into their TRUE LOVES eyes and say..."This is a dedication to the one I love" as they sign the binding legal contract making future children legitimate and a partnership of love official. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/23/2008 4:30:02 AM | Thanks for the post so far but I'm really interested to hear -- aside from "legal" and "contractual" issues -- does her refusing to marry him (or vice versa) mean that she doesn't really "love" him??? And, if it doesn't mean that, should he bail out if she is showing no signs of reconsidering her position? Or, posed from the other perspective, should a woman break it off with a man she loves because he won't marry her, though he claims to love her with all his heart? Why or why not? | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/23/2008 4:45:44 AM |
Thanks for the post so far but I'm really interested to hear -- aside from "legal" and "contractual" issues -- does her refusing to marry him (or vice versa) mean that she doesn't really "love" him???
Does him asking her to marry him when he knows that she's not keen on the idea of marriage mean that he doesn't really love her?
A loving relationship is not about "if you love me then you will....". It's not about holding people emotionally hostage. It's about relating in a loving way.
Marriage means different things to different people. To some it means very little -- a legal formality hose functions can be covered with appropriate alternative paperwork. To such people, marriage is irrelevant to love. Love is about being loving, not about the label or the piece of paper. Personally, I do not see it as loving to tie someone to you rather than allowing them the freedom to chose each day whether they wish to stay. | |
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| Does True Love Ultimately Require Marriage?
Posted: 2/23/2008 5:24:14 AM |
Marriage means different things to different people.
There in lies the crux of the matter. The symbolism of marriage has been **stardised over the years to have lost its allure to most, meaning that to most, it will not be a vital component of a happy, loving relationship.
If the partner you or the subject of this discussion has, is of the opinion that marriage is the culmination of ones love for the other, then you either adapt, or you suggest that if one husband/wife would be nice, how about two or three. The big love defence is a sure thing! | |
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