| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 7:14:57 AM | | Maybe those of you who are/were chefs can explain this one for me. In my previous career as a journalist, I ran into a lot of people working at various publications and in various capacities who used to work as chefs but got out of that industry. What's going on? I was thinking once of trying to become a chef but, if the burnout rate is that high, maybe not. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 7:31:15 AM | I worked within the industry for a very short time.
I'm not sure if you would call it burnout or not but there can be a lot of negatives associated with this career.
For starters:
*long hours
*a lot of nights
*intense heat in the workplace
*depending on the location, the compensation can leave a lot to be desired
*if self employed, the competition can be incredible
*finding and keeping knowledgeable and dependable staff can be a challenge
*patrons can have unrealistic expectations of fine dining for take out prices
*fluctuations in the economy can greatly affect the market
The list can be endless.
There are pros and cons to every career, but it all boils down to your passions and what your personal choices are. I do agree with you though, there is an extremely high attrition rate within this field. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 8:30:30 AM | Stargazer, it's simple - if you "think" you want to be a chef then maybe you should be one. I've read some of your other posts and maybe you're just a hobby cook. That's fine, but the leap to cooking as a pro is MUCH bigger than you can imagine.
There's a VERY high burnout rate - VERY high. It can be abusive, lots of hours before you establish yourself, then once established, even more hours! No pension, you're working when others are out, no life.
IF after reading this you STILL want to wear the whites then go for it. Maybe you can go to a good restaurant and ask if they will let you help (99.9% of them will not let you cook online so forget about that) and see first hand if it's what you want. Don't what if yourself to death. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 9:14:18 AM | | I have read somewhere that the stress levels for chef's are almost that of ATC's... no weekends, or holidays, it's hot work, and really a thankless job..... | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 9:17:27 AM | | Speaking from experience: Very stressful. Statistics show food service (restaurant) workers have a much higher incidence of substance abuse than the national average. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/14/2008 9:38:48 AM | Been a chef for 30 years, had 2 restaurants & still have a small catering business. I taught Restaurant Operations at the local college. I have hung in there due to the variety factor. Keeps it interesting.
However, it is NOT glamerous or easy. I teach that unless you are prepared to work ungodly long hours, be freezing cold and broiling hot, have superhuman strength, can never afford to be sick, and don't really want any long-term intimate relationships, then RUN AWAY! Oh, yes, and if you don't come from a horribly disfunctional family, you will never be able to handle the constant crisis. Too busy, or too slow, irate customers, inept help, equipment failure, theft, substance abuse, soaring food costs, injuries...AND razor thin profit margins. The typical restauranteur pays about 78% in taxes, payroll and insurance. That leaves only 22% of the gross to buy supplies, utilities, advertising, equipment, signage, repairs, and all the million details that it takes to pull off a food service. You HAVE to do it out of love, because it will never pay what it' worth. In France , they treat chefs like doctors, or celebrities, they actually get respect. Not so in America. A thankless job for the most part. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 12:49:48 AM | I am not a chef. But I am a cook. What Malley and spumoni said is dead on.
I enjoy catering and someday may own my own place. But line cooking is a nightmare I am waking up from. Never again.... well maybe .. but prob not. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 1:40:56 AM | Watch food network's iron chef on tv. That's the pace you have to keep up on a busy shift for 10 hours. They are on tv for 1 hr. and look how stressed they are. It's a punishing job.
In my case I loved it. Lived for it. Dropped out of high school to be a chef. Loved the hard work as a young man. As a blessing in disguise after about 20 years I had a few nagging injuries in my lower extremities (though minor, your always on your feet) and realized I don't want to do this into my later years. When you get to be my age you either have an executive chef position in a hotel where the physical labor is minimal, own your own business, brand your name like a rock star ala Emeril Lagasse, or find another occupation. I did constuction for about a year after and it was a cakewalk comparitavely.
Worked with some of the greatest people though. Beautiful waitresses. Ate like a king every day. The business is by nature a party atmosphere. Can work theroritically anywhere in the world.
Good luck with whatever path you chose but I would not recommend it unless you have the drive and business mind to start a restaurant. Even then just hire a chef and sit at the bar and pick up girls. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 2:08:41 AM | | Have been a chef for 19 years, being a woman sometimes in a kitchen full of men who sometimes think they know a little more can be demanding, you need to be able to be on your feet at least 8 hrs at a time, cant just have a break when in the middle of something. I have always had a passion for cooking, always enjoyed doing it , yes sometimes difficult shifts or warm kitchen but still enjoy the challenge I say if you want to do it give it a go you never know. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 12:44:11 PM | You have to want it so badly that you are willing to live, sleep and breathe food. It has to be in your blood, not a field for the faint at heart. Bette Davis once said, " Old age ain't no place for sissies" and neither is ANYTHING to do with food service. Some of the executive positions are less challenging physically, but are still killer. Everyone who has posted has eloquently addressed it. It's like a dysfunctional love affair -- in fact it's like that crazy affair one of the characters was having on the short lived "Big Shots" last season. Food Service is a completely deranged mistress!! And anyone who can stand it, wouldn't do anything else. I haaaate being sick because I'd like to still be in the field!
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 1:49:28 PM | Here's an analogy in the journalist sense. I've always heard (the stereotypical) definition of stress is a journalist that had to meet a deadline. In the (industrial, not domestic, huge difference) kitchen there's a deadline to meet every 30 seconds. Sometimes you have 40 deadlines all working in your mind and you have to focus on this one thing at the moment but in 10 minutes need to have all 40 accomplisned, then get 10 more orders with 40 more deadlines all night looooooonnnngggg.
Alot of excitement if you got it all under control which was my expertise. If you don't it literally gave me nightmares in my rookie years.
Loooovvved every minute of it !! No joke. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 6:28:24 PM | I got my appreciation for cooking from my dad but I think watching the Food Network gave me a bit of a glamourized view of being a chef. At the same time, I'm not unfamiliar with stress - I've worked a newsroom. When I started to feel burned out by journalism, I was giving serious consideration to formalizing my relationship with professional cooking.
Unfortunatley, it would mean going back to school and I just don't have that as an option.
I'm just surprised by the number of "former" chefs I've encountered in my journalism background. Why would they end up in publishing, I wonder. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 7:31:21 PM | I recall being one of the few people in the restaurant biz being right where I wanted to be. Seems most were there as means to an end. A place to get hired in any town easily with a pay check and a couple meals a day. Maybe while going to school.
You hear the stories from Hollywood right? I'm an actor. No time to talk, I got tables waiting. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 8:09:16 PM | | No place for sissies...truer words were never spoken. It's a difficult dance made to look easy & graceful( from the front of the house) The dance requires years of grueling practice, and a devotion that defies all common sense. But the love of the dance is everything. When the curtain comes up, and it's showtime, you play it like a sporting event, because the dance changes constantly. Keeping on top of the ball with customers all happy, is the hugest form of gratification. We do it for the nod, man. Instant gratification. And the endless little deadlines reap endless approval all night long, if done correctly. And for the dude who wants to cook professionally, you don't have to go to school. Just get a lil job in the business, & keep your eyes open. You learn a heck of a lot more on the job, get actual experience, and get paid to learn...duh! Those culinary schools aren't all they're cracked up to be. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 8:48:31 PM | it isn't so much burnout...i loved what i did but just could not continue to do it and support myself. the pay scales for actual certified chefs is extremely low. the outlook of most restaurants? why hire me at a higher rate of pay when they can hire teenage high school drop out and pay them minimum wage. the quality of work sucks and it takes longer to train them, but it's all about the bottom line. and the hours do suck...but i loved the work that it didn't bother me so much. the other issue i had was working my ass off with long hours, having 12-15 waitresses screaming at the five cooks in the kitchen yet they had the gall to not do tip pool! the service can be top notch but if the food sucks?...NO TIP FOR YOU! some waitresses would walk out with 200-300$ cash daily and none of us, not the dishwashers or cooks would see a dime of that.
at the end of all the sweating, crappy hours, screaming and hard work, the paycheques didn't reflect it...it was insulting. i was often left working 2 full time jobs to make ends meet. i still work in the food industry because i do have a passion for it, but now i work for a hospital. it's government (canadian) so the pay is much better, the hours are on rotation so it's fair. not as much cooking, but it's still fast paced and more rewarding. if you're going to be a chef, you truly have to have the passion for it. it isn't glamorous or laid back as food networks on tv make it. hell's kitchen is a more accurate job description...my mother thought it was extreme for tv purposes and i laughed because that is exactly how it is. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/15/2008 11:09:27 PM | I'm a line cook at really busy restaurant...just doing it to get myself through university...
Vicious vixen....you describe the way I feel about my job perfectly.
kitchen=hell
Don't get me wrong, I love cooking, just not for the masses lol. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 2:38:47 PM | Ms spumoni you really said it all.
First of all it is much like being an athelete in many ways including this --- as you age you lose a half a step physically and mentally, possibly in desire as the years prey upon your dreams. You can still answer the bell but know you'll never be at the top of your game again.
The dance ? -- oh yes.
Grads of culinary schools have to do the same thing as non grads. -- go out and get a job and learn how to cook under the pressure.
The magic happens during a slow night when everybody's standing around trying to look busy then all of a sudden you got 12 burners fired up, oven doors opening and slaming shut, stuff tssssizzeling all over the place. flare ups reaching 5 feet from the flambes, people running through the kitchen, shouting their needs, looking at each other and as a whole saying without words "you rock" "no you the one".
Fond memories.
Star, maybe get a part time position at a small biz that's not too busy. If nothing else you can apply at the ones with the best looking waitresses. That's why most of us are here eh? | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 2:50:55 PM | Unfortunatley, it would mean going back to school and I just don't have that as an option.
Don't think twice about it. (That's what Dylan told me to tell you.)
And for the dude who wants to cook professionally, you don't have to go to school. Just get a lil job in the business, & keep your eyes open. You learn a heck of a lot more on the job, get actual experience, and get paid to learn...duh! Those culinary schools aren't all they're cracked up to be. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 3:39:57 PM |
Those culinary schools aren't all they're cracked up to be.
i wouldn't go quite that far. while yes, hands on is much better, it's better to find a school where you are doing hands on and not just classroom. sorry, but i've trained dozens of cooks who had more experience than me in restaurants yet couldn't cook a steak on a grill to save their life because there is an actual proper way to do it. same with baking. there is an actual science to it and you learn why things react the way they do...how to tell things by smell, sight and touch. you also learn how to be artistic, to properly present a plate, learn how food cost is calculated (and no it isn't solely based on the cost of the actual food!) it's both a business and an art form. don't trash cooking schools if you've never actually experienced one. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 5:10:08 PM | True that more knowledge is better. I wouldn't let the lack of education keep me from jumping in with both feet. Depends on what your ultimate goal is. If you have the time and money (and time to be not making any income) you are right on .
I think most of us men would say I cook the best steak in the world. Of course it's just an excuse to get out of the house and have a cigar and a beer and fire up the barbeque. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 5:21:07 PM |
the other issue i had was working my ass off with long hours, having 12-15 waitresses screaming at the five cooks in the kitchen yet they had the gall to not do tip pool! the service can be top notch but if the food sucks?...NO TIP FOR YOU! some waitresses would walk out with 200-300$ cash daily and none of us, not the dishwashers or cooks would see a dime of that.
I used to joke about my idea of having a pitcher on the end of a broomstick. When a waiter asks for special treatment, forgot to fire an order and needs it rushed, need to re-fire a steak, want something off the menu etc., in their face comes the apparatus with a big sign that says TIPS on it. Maybe someone can use that one. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 5:57:48 PM | Blood, sweat and tears would be the proper analogy here. Not enough money. Long hours, weekends and most holidays are shot. But just like one of you mentioned earlier, it's about the simple nod without words of "Man, you rock..." and just the "wow" of kicking out the food in a melodical fury. The "dance" as someone noted before is a beautiful and perfect way of explaining it. There's no better rush than having the perfect crew on and everything flowing in perfect rhythm... But nothing worse than having slackers working next to you either.
I've always felt that cooking is a personal satisfaction. It's instant gratification, not only from the customers- but from the co-workers that look at you in awe ( for some reason ) for having the ability to know how to mix the perfect ingredients to create a beautiful ( and tasteful) dish.
I'm one of the crazies who got out of the business due to the money, schedule and quite frankly the party atmosphere. But man- o- man, do I miss it. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 6:41:19 PM | well put daisica^^ i loved that feeling as well when everything was going right. it was great when you could run the grill, stove and fryers alone and it felt as though you were moving 100 miles an hour doing it and everything came out great and the slackers would stand back and let you do your thing. a few of them shook their heads at me one night and said i was like a machine with the way i moved and how precise everything was. the best part came next when the manager had been watching too and told them they should take notes and maybe someday they'll be half as good! those times were what made it all worth while. it truly is a passion that you have to have deep down to do.
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 8:24:30 PM | Reminds me of once when there were two of us handling the whole kitchen on the busiest night this places had ever seen and all the staff were running around crazy. The owner, who never
gave us anything, ever, comes back to the kitchen and found the both of us sitting down chatting. Without saying a word he turns around and comes back a minute later with two beers. We had just happened to finish putting out our last order when he saw us. One of the most satisfying brews I ever had.
Along those lines --- ALWAYS takes care of the bartenders, especially if they're fat. And the local police. | |
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| So many former chefs
Posted: 5/16/2008 8:50:49 PM | never been a chef but a line cook, and loved it.
not for everyone though. its a great feeling when your in the middle of a white out and things are going great. also loved it when you just cleared the board everyone is eatting and you have about 10 min to restock and hopfully suck back a quick smoke before everyone is done and orders come in twice as fast as the first time. | |
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