BOO HOO WHAT CAN I DO?? chat & forums.

Posted In Forum:

Home

MyForums

Show ALL Forums

Author

Thread: BOO HOO WHAT CAN I DO??

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 12 (view)

BOO HOO WHAT CAN I DO?? Posted: 11/20/2009 7:30:12 AM
Starting your own business doesn't resolve the issues discussed here.. Ibli its a strawman argument.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 58 (view)

Unemployment hits 10.2% Posted: 11/9/2009 11:10:05 AM
I am denigrating the award. It is prestigious to Economists but it shouldn't be. Frankly Nobel nor his heirs would have or desire to have the award bear his name. Those who have one the award have invariably been those who held the mainstream of "Economic thought" which has lead much of the criticism that it is a pat on the back award as opposed to one of any meaning. Most of those who have won the award have proven failures in the practice of the work of which they were awarded the prize.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 54 (view)

Unemployment hits 10.2% Posted: 11/9/2009 7:01:51 AM
I always hate to bring this up but.... There is no such thing as a Nobel Prize in Economics. They call it that to try and give it the prestige of the Nobel, but Nobel nor his heirs believed Economics as a valid science. It's pretty much a case of hangers on glory. The prize is actually the The Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel. It is administered by the same group of people who choose the other prizes but its history is far less promising.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 26 (view)

Unemployment hits 10.2% Posted: 11/6/2009 2:10:21 PM
reposted The package is mostly for show and useless. What needs to happen are fundimental changes in corporate law and a return of regulatory oversight. The new rules Obama has put forward about CEO salaries and bonuses are a start in the right direction but not nearly enough. Uncompensated offshoring needs to be eliminated. You offshore your labor then you either pay increased taxes or your product is considered import and TARRIFFED so. Tax Loopholes need to be closed Board conflict of interests need to be prosecuted Corporate personhood and lobbying stopped lots more. We will be lucky if this is just 5 years

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 16 (view)

Ft Hood Incident Highlights Dangers of Gun Control Posted: 11/6/2009 12:09:11 PM
Pirateheaven you are very mistaken. The simple fact is this issue has been researched and tested many times. Contrary to the popular opinion free firearms cause more injuries then less. It adds more confusion and distraction for the responding parties. In very few cases someone with a concealed or free weapon has been able to take down an agressing party before additional responders gather into the confusion but it is VERY rare. It would be wonderful to believe in the days of the old west where the good guys wear white and the bad guys wear black and everyone knows who to shoot. The modern firefight is far from so easily distinguished and failure to have witnessed the initial shot makes everyone with a weapon the possible target and you have on average less then 3 seconds to determine who you are supposed to shoot of those people assuming you evenknow who is armed..etc etc. Its gets very messy very quickly. From Bank jobs, through street firefights we have seen time and again unmarked officers getting shot from failure to identify while the actual criminal's escape etc. Further military personnel aren't trained to know who a shooter is perse only the source and to supress... not a good way to limit casualties. MP's and SP's are so trained and so they are given weapons.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 20 (view)

Unemployment hits 10.2% Posted: 11/6/2009 10:55:29 AM
Dmotz you might remember about a year ago when Bush started this I told you all what needed to be done. It still hasn't been and no one wants to face the hard truth of it. You're right the stimulas isn't working its just creating another bubble. We aren't producing anymore indeed we are producing less. We are still sending jobs away and having outside producers make more stuff that we aren't buying glutting up their warehouses all because the greedy ones at the top still haven't learned the basic lessons true lessons of econmics. Growth doesn't come from the top.. you NEED to tax and charge the money out of the top because short of Divine intervention, revolution, or the government as a rule they do no spend it. It's the lesson of Scrooge.. unless something makes them see their mortality the money doesn't flow. People need money to buy the goods that are made and most of the goods made round the world are intended for our markets.. the sad truth being that's the cause of the huge trade gap. And if we don't start becoming protectionist the corporates are going to turn us into a 3rd world nation.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 61 (view)

Republicans vote against anti-rape amendment Posted: 10/16/2009 11:55:45 AM
No etourdi you are just proving that you are stupid. The amendment does not preclude mandatory arbitration. It precludes mandatory arbitration in the case of a sexual attack. That would pretty much be anti-rape. It does not say there cannot be a manitory arbitration clause in a contract, I gave you the text of the amendment its very clear. It is an amendment that prevents a company from shielding its offshore effects and employees from all forms of legal redress of a sexual attack. It really doesn't get simpler you can keep making yourself look like and idiot by claiming its anti-arbitration, its not.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 58 (view)

Republicans vote against anti-rape amendment Posted: 10/16/2009 6:50:42 AM
etourdi you are standing on a house of cards your arguments hold no weight and only make you look stupid. It is an anti-rape amendment. You seem to be unable to understand so I'll make it simple. The amendment indicates that several issues that are specifically listed which are ALL CRIMES cannot be omitted from jurisdiction of American courts by reason of arbitration clauses if vendors want money from the government in the form of contracts. The reason for this amendment even being needed is because Bush and the Repulicans made contractors in Iraq immune from the Iraqi courts and the American Criminal courts. To go for complete impunity many of those contractors also threw in arbitration clauses even for those matters that should have been left to civilian torts.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 347 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/15/2009 2:14:48 PM
Munga I already did so you're inability to comprehend is not my problem. Again for the short version. Wiesel.. Brought the violence to light the was perpetrated against people because of their ethnic and religious backgrounds through his writing. Through further writing and education and speeches taught people not to follow the paths that excused the violence being done by the Nazi party in german's minds again. He spoke out and against those cases where people were being persecuted by ethnic and religious backgrounds. Be they Latin, asain, etc. The words of the Nobel committee then explain more clearly, then I have time to waste on stupidity, such as this both his and the earlier von Ossietsky did contribute to "fraternity between nations, for the abolition or reduction of standing armies and for the holding and promotion of peace congresses." http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/peace/laureates/1986/presentation-speech.html It's not incumbent on me to teach or prove to you, your own blind ignorance. Nor can I the old saying is you can lead the horse to water but you can't make it drink. I am not of the right nor is the right's argument mine. I do not hate Obama, my issue is not with him save in that he is not qualified and he should have turned it aside. Pete Seeger's works not his songs alone have inspired generations to action, artists and peace and labor movements world wide. This wiki isn't even complete enough to list all he's done but perhaps will waken your mind a bit http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pete_Seeger And he was just an example.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 48 (view)

Republicans vote against anti-rape amendment Posted: 10/15/2009 1:33:47 PM
Ohh good lord etourdi it most certainly is an anti-rape, amendment. There should and could be no justifiable argument voting agianst this bill it should have been unanimous in any thinking body. The text of the amendment is here http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?r111:1:./temp/~r111lFhYgo:e0: but more specifically here is what YOU should have been paying attention to. None of the funds appropriated or otherwise made available by this Act may be used for any existing or new Federal contract if the contractor or a subcontractor at any tier requires that an employee or independent contractor, as a condition of employment, sign a contract that mandates that the employee or independent contractor performing work under the contract or subcontract resolve through arbitration any claim under title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 or any tort related to or arising out of sexual assault or harassment, including assault and battery, intentional infliction of emotional distress, false imprisonment, or negligent hiring, supervision, or retention.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 333 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/15/2009 9:49:57 AM
Ready4 you mean like since 2000 when we got an illegitimate moron was given our highest office, and now where we can't get anything that would actually benefit the country because of a vocal group of half-wits who believe the GOP actually cares about anything other then inflating their pockets?

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 328 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/15/2009 8:06:24 AM
Mungajoe its more clear that you haven't read your own examples, or that you don't understand the issue by which at least I am objecting. Each of those you cite shows clearly very different criteria then what was used in accepting obama. Each of those you cited had demonstrated LIFETIME commitments toward peace. Indeed several of them risked life and limb in advocating such views and measures. Where as Obama has no such history or activity. Your comment that such efforts by NYC paramedics as "one offs" and not there for qualifying of the prize is equally usable in the case of Obama who had never previously made any efforts on the side of peace or reconciliation between faiths before the presidential campain. As with most of your arguments its specious and full of false logic if then statements that don't apply. While they sound good they don't measure to the weight of reality or true logic. Indeed its you espousing your personal beliefs in the face of historical evidence and since it seems to require it here's the break down of your folly. Fried was awarded the prize after years of being part of the peace movement, founding several periodicals dedicated to advocating peace in the midst of the building of the Axis powers that would ultimately lead to ww1. Further he advocated that peace would best be pursued not by the common disgust of war but rather by accepting a pan national organization and common community. Soderblom was awarded the prize being a contemporary of Nobel and for years of trying to bring compantionship/brotherhood to the christian faiths, but also for his outspoken support and drive in making the Christian faith preach peace over violence. To not only speak to overt it by outright condemn it. Something historically it had not done to that point. von Ossietzky spoke out against the re-armament of Germany and its growing nationalistic violence. Despite the personal dangers remained and sounded the warnings that Germany was violating the Treaty of Versailles. One of the very very few to speak out against the growing power of the Nazi's Wiesel a survior of concentration camps and writer who brought understanding of the horrors of such persecutions. Advocate of peace, human rights, and staunch reminder that such things must never be allowed to reoccur. Show me mungajoe how Obama fits in such company? Your argument holds NO validity

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 303 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/14/2009 3:43:38 PM
I see for the most part rational discussion on this topic has been rendered impossible. In the literal sense no the criteria has not changed. Then again if Harvard started handing out diplomas to people who just paid it money its criteria could be said to not have changed because the words on paper still say something even if no one followed them. Its a specious argument. The words on the paper haven't changed in 100 years but we aren't following it. Mungajoe you claim examples where it was argued and so that shows its the way its always been and yet the argument doesn't hold the historical weight you think it does. Indeed everyone you listed had infact DONE something either by word or by deed often at risk or against popular sentiment. Obama it is argued has done something by word and deed to promote peace and yet the reality is that there were better examples available in all counts that had done more. That the committee has made the decision does not make it the right decision anymore then the Dread Scott decision was the right decision. In almost every previous case of the Prize I can make and easy argument to support the award on the merits of the individual EVEN in the case of and I hate saying it Arafat. I really cannot for Obama. Missile shield? Reagan started it (just for fun to point out Seeger protested it) Bush one continued it. Clinton as a democrat immediately killed it. Stayed dead till Bush two brought it back. Duh a democrat got elected and killed it not because it was Obama preaching peace but because the democrats have never supported wasting that king of money on a military fantasy project. Obama preaching peace between muslims and the rest of the world? Clinton, Carter, Bush one, half the members of congress, every sane religious leader have all been doing that. Only reason Obama has been more graciously recieved as we saw during the UN meeting is that much like the right wing nut cases many of the arab and muslim world really think he is muslim. Do you really think I am happy about arguing that this award doesn't make sense? Obviously your brain washed blue obamabots do... since you've constantly thrown me with the rightwingers who can easily show you how many times I've gone up agianst them. But why be rational why THINK when we can just wave a flag. This is no different then when the right wing blinded themselves to all the screw ups of Bushco. I do very much love America I just wish she still had the brains left to be the nation she should be. I hoped Obama could be a great man rather then just another political show puppet....but how can he be when his only two choices for a sounding board are irrational nay-say limbots or irational yes obamabots. Good lord where is FDR or even better Washington himself when you need them.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 294 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/14/2009 11:26:35 AM
Just because President Obama says something doesn't make it true. The simple fact is as much as I generally disagree with Lax, is that there can be no reform without the public option. All other options fail to understand the true nature of the greed inherent in the current systems, and the utter failure of any regulatory control of the Pharma/supplier/insurance industries. Further it fails to understand the reality of the economic situation despite the claims that the economy is recovering and is healthy it point of fact it is far from it. However this isn't a discussion of healthcare reform so I'll stop there. To the point it doesn't matter what people think we don't decide the award. You are correct in that all of the discussion of worthiness and criteria is just "sour grapes". Then again that can be said of any and all awards, and therein lies why its important to measure an award to criteria people accept. Failure to do so reduces the significance of the award and that can have significant far reaching effects. Example what is a college diploma but an award? How significant the requirements and prestige of the college are indicates the value of that diploma. How seriously would you take Cracker Jack university as opposed to Harvard when looking at someone for a job? How seriously would you consider Harvard if you then found out for example that it was selling diploma's to cover its running costs and one never needed to take a class? The Nobel prizes mean something to people even if many of them don't realize how they came about or that it was all about the dynamite. If people start viewing the Nobel Prizes as nothing more then paperweights people get for being fast talkers they lose the value they have, and what they can project into discussions. That is why attitudes of dismissal toward selection criteria are so moronic.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 250 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/13/2009 9:48:25 AM
Item one.. I'm not "the right" there is 2 years of post history to prove this. Item 2 all argument about this as I said before is far from being a right/left or political ideaology thing. Who has done more?? I would say given the fact that the only reason we know Obama won was because Bush could not run again or god help us there are enough idots who might have voted him in again, is the Twenty-second Amendment limiting the Presidency so in practical answer the 1947 congress did more. Item 3 since when would the "right" even know what a Protest Ballad songwriter was? Item 4 do you know anything at all about history and the situations of which you are discussing? Do you know about the acts of the House Unamerican Committee and how many "protest ballad songwriters" were forced out of the Country? Do you know anything at all about Pete Seeger? His years organizing against nuclear weapons during the Reagan era? About his protests against Bush's war? Item 5 other then just blindly copying and pasting snippets of other people's writing have you any idea of what these people stood up against and did to try to bring about change? Can you compare that to someone who just read a speech? Are you even capable of rational thought outside of the red/blue prism?

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 245 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/13/2009 9:01:34 AM
Actually they should, and both of them also pale to Pete Seeger and credit to him. You're arguing a losing battle if you knew what you were talking about imalwayssmiling. The truth bottom line par none is that Obama was not more qualified then the others nominees he was infinitely outclassed by them and that is why there is argument. You are basically defending the indefensible and insisting you're being rational, its ruffly akin to the Pope telling Galileo that the earth is the center of the universe. You will win only because you are the Pope but.. the earth still moves.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 243 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/13/2009 7:48:44 AM
I grant that many of those perhaps even most of those in this thread are as you say "haters" and "right-wing nuts". That said I don't think MOST of those who are questioning this world wide are. I think MOST of us questioning this are doing so because despite the incredibly flimsy excuses thrown up but those here, and the committee there were FAR better candidates who did far more not only in practice but in word and inspiration. Frankly I see as much blindsided "love" as I see blind "hate" being thrown about in this forum and topic. Simply put Pete Seeger has done more then Obama could in 10 terms if such could even happen, including according to Obama inspiring him.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 189 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 10:00:27 AM
No problem imalwayssmiling it wasn't an unreasonable question especially the way I had phrased my comment. Again my issue isn't Obama perse as much as I guess the Cult of personality that's been tossed around him. 8 years of blind following of Bush are we now to have 8 years of blind following Obama

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 186 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 9:38:17 AM
Way to stool in for silliness mungojoe. How can I KNOW there were better options without actually knowing the nominees which are sealed for 50 years? "In 2009 there were 205 names submitted for the Nobel Peace Prize; 33 of them were organizations. This was the highest number of nominations in the history of the prize." That alone makes you wonder... Among believed nominees.. Pete Seeger. He alone deserves the prize infinitely more then Obama. http://www.nowpublic.com/world/nobel-peace-prize-nominees-2009-list-not-available-till-2059 I could bet among the organizations Doctors without Borders which goes and provides medical care to people all over the world even where governments who would like to wipe people out such as in Darfur. I could guess the team of NYC Paramedics who went into the mountains of Pakistan after the earthquakes there to provide care despite the teritory being unfriendly to americans. I could guess the groups that have been trying to get landmines and cluster munitions out of common use and banned, while trying to removed them from civilized areas It's not hard at all to think of and infinate number of better choices and be fairly sure some of them would have been on that list. The long and the short of it, seems that a good portion of the world doesn't agree with you.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 184 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 9:02:11 AM
There is a difference between better options and knowing who was on the List. I have no idea who was on the list but there were far better options.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 180 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 8:38:52 AM
Because Obama got the award.. facepalm the problem that I have is the instant assumption, and I hate to use the phrase used by the right wing, by those who drank the kool-aid that objective disagreement is hating. I do not find him to be the great glory that so many here seem to but I definitely am not hating on him. Disagreement in how and what he does is not hating. Hating is finding every excuse to block or object to policies and actions. I don't hate on him for attempting national health care, I disagree with him on allowing the public option to be pulled from it. I disagree with him on not getting people to understand the fact that everyone knows the current system is failing and cannot remain etc. The Nobel issue is just ludicrous and there are huge numbers of his supporters and "left-wing" liberals who all have had the same issue. I'm not faulting Obama for the fact that he got it.. I'm baffled as to how he got it.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 175 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 6:46:43 AM
my problem is less that he's not completed things, but rather that he's compromised where no compromise should exist, AND failed in accomplishing. That's not even the issue here though... right now my issue is how does the Nobel committee award to him what so many better options deserved. Thats not always the case but this year it was.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 167 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/12/2009 6:06:21 AM
Wow this went to pot while I was away.. I'm not entirely surprised given some of the right-wing nuts and strong opinions being thrown around, but I still stand by my original comments. There is nothing Obama has said or done especially in the time that the committee had to review that justifies him having this award. I am pleased he's giving it to charity but there were infinitely better options for the award. I could put up the general I'm not a right-winger, but my posting history should do that far more effectively then any pointless attempt and clarifying my positions. There is not a requirement that someone accomplish the goals, I grant that but when faced with such options how do you justify putting the award into the hands of one who has so utterly failed by word, and deed to accomplish? In a year with horrible disasters and people reaching out across the ideological divides to show better ways. Nothing yet posted shows me justification of the Award and I am far from the only non right winger or bigot asking how the heck this award was granted. There are many rabid Obama supporters who are also objective enough to find this choice odd as well.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 23 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/9/2009 8:37:24 AM
Well we agree he doesn't deserve to be there. I'm still waiting Goldee honestly what has he done?? Show me something? Would you like to bet at the same time he got the award one of our bombers dropped a bomb? I am not a hater I certainly feel he was a better choice then McCain let alone the nutjob known as Palin. but what?

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 21 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/9/2009 8:25:31 AM
Ohh I'm not a hater as it were generally I kick dmotz around the forums on any variety of topics. THIS one.. THIS one should show you just how pathetic it is that we are in agreement. I have no problem kicking Bush in the leg. I loved Chavez saying the sulfer on the platform was gone. But Nobel and the family believed strongly in Peace, and Science as a way to that end. I want to see that prize even more then the others mean something. Tell me practically what he himself has done? Compromised on every meaningful subject to the point of making them useless? Is that the measure of peace? Ghandi wouldn't think so... MLK wouldn't think so. Show me something people.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 16 (view)

President Obama Wins The Nobel Peace Prize! Posted: 10/9/2009 7:34:28 AM
I think I am going to be ill. I'm sorry I can't understand this. There is NOTHING Obama has done that justifies this award. He's infact failed to accomplish anything of note. No health care, no peace, no end of terrorist threats, no reduction of poverty, hell not even regulations reactivated on wall street. What the hell!!! The award for peace has become as pointless as the award for economics a joke.

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 6 (view)

First Amendment protection does not depend upon the identity of the speaker. Posted: 7/13/2009 8:43:28 AM
The problem is Corporate Personhood. Remove it and restore the Constitution or leave it and we never have a real say. Those pretty much are your only choices . Good luck getting either party to go through with it. Amazing what one moron in 1860 has doomed us to.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 25 (view)

A new direction in Government? Posted: 6/18/2009 8:49:40 AM
Cotter because the rapid right wing is a bunch of brainwashed hypocrites. They accuse everyone else of being character assassins, and name callers all the while ignoring their own activities. You'll see them characterize anyone who disagrees with them as a Liberal or a Socialist, or hippie etc. You'll see them make claims that this nation is based on this or that. Most of them haven't read the Constitution and fewer have any idea what really goes on in the world let alone government. They call Thomas Jefferson a Conservative completely oblivious to the fact that one who foments rebellion or in this case revolution is by definition Radical. They pull quotes out of context and time to make their points sound intelligent and valid and ignore all evidence and history. We are in this mess because people have forgotten and are no longer taught civics people do not understand that they have a duty and responsibility above picking a political party. Instead we are left with brainwashed fools espousing quotes that even at face value are flawed. It's a new direction to these fools because some radio host told them so.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 94 (view)

Military burns unsolicited Bibles sent to Afghanistan Posted: 6/16/2009 3:35:17 PM
And if you were living there, and a group of Muslims tied you up in a barn, and systematically mutilated your genitals, while TORTURING you to get you to adopt the Muslim religion, just before they MURDERED you, my guess is maybe basic human rights like liberty and freedom of religion would all of a sudden mean more to you too? Hmm let me see if I got this particular stupidity right. Muslims in their own country, tie you up in a barn in their own country, mutilating you for trying to get them to adopt your religion in their country, just before they murdered you in their country. Are you saying that you so deep a religious individual as you are wouldn't do the same? Please the history of Religion is literally written in the blood of other Religions it serves purposes but don't presume you have any moral high ground here. For one thing Christianity has a history of being brought to this nation under force of arms. Another is that it is NOT our country it is soverign our rights do not apply there right wrong or indifferent its a fact. Trying to spread any religion in that country is treated the same way we treated people who tried to bring socialism to the US in the 50- 60's. Do I support the actions of Muslim extremists? Absolutely not. Nor do i support people trying to convert other people, and certainly not at the expense of painting an extra target on our soldiers who have having enough of a time without it turning into a holy war to appease you.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 7 (view)

A new direction in Government? Posted: 6/16/2009 9:56:07 AM
You know I agree threads like this do scare me. Not because they exist but because the bring to the front the people who are so deadlocked in their mind the conditioning of their chosen cause that no reason no logic is capable of reaching them. The espouse their chosen banner of failed logic against all evidence of its faults and failures and refuse to stop to consider those failures instead opting for some scapegoat. The free market is a farce and always has been. Any competent calculation shows that. Indeed the origin and and existence of Capitalism is antithetical to a Democratic Republic which is exactly WHY the founding fathers choose it. As with all things the founders choose a compromise of checks and balances. Democracy would always have the power and authority indeed even requirement to check Capitalism, and human greed in the hopes of Capitalism would check Democracy. Where it failed where it was not considered was the ignorance and foolishness of those who would in time take places of authority in all three branches and mess it up. As you tell people your view points and to watch video's Swamphunter I ask you when was the last time you actually read the Constitution and the Federalist papers? Indeed have you ever? Socialism isn't the problem and never has in its history been one. The problem is oligarcy, the problem is plutocracy. Plutocracy has been the failure of every society in history and yet morons and short sighted fools always seem to miss that. Government isn't the problem either, Government is merely the mechanism of movement of mass resources into dedicated tasks blaming government is much like blaming a hammer. It may not be as fast as a steam or a jackhammer but the job gets done and it seldom left to its own devices fails. Indeed our founders didn't have a problem with government either they created layers upon layers of it. What they feared was a centralized control capable of legacy and stagnation of the sort that brought about king george. What they feared is what has come to pass a Plutocracy of landed gentry backed by vast resources capable of maintaining legacy and heraldic title. Indeed Swamphunter your are advocating the epitome of what our founders debated and ultimately found to be the opposite of what they wanted.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 8 (view)

is there honor Posted: 5/27/2009 7:47:39 AM
Yes there is honour left in the world. It is rare, very very rare but it is still there. SFZ honour is not about right for whom but rather what is right. It doesn't mean you are all knowing, it means that if such action that you take should wind up being a mistake that you make all efforts to correct and amend such mistake. Honour is not about pride but it is about sticking to the hard choices that are against your own best interests because it is the right thing to do.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 306 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 5/20/2009 7:28:53 AM
ds I think you are being either slightly intellectually dishonest OR you aren't being very effective in your search terms. If you googled as you said "hydrogen-sulfide poisoning pig farms death" you would find 3790 hits so you would not have found nothing. Among those hits are a CDC report http://www.cdc.gov/Niosh/face/in-house/full9228.html The Australian Governments NPI national pollutant inventory fact sheet on the substance and this article from a Canadian pro pork source http://www.albertapork.com/news.aspx?NavigationID=2272 of which this line is of particular note "For hog farm operators, the major cause of accidental death is exposure to build up of gases such as hydrogen sulfide in a confined space. Younger, less experienced workers are the ones most at risk. The report states that there were four instances of multiple deaths from hydrogen sulfide poisoning - involving 18 people in total - during the 1990s and more than half the fatalities were on hog farms." Further my post was not about there being a high number of deaths only that the "stench" is not just a matter of comfort its about the only warning since the gas is colorless and I believe tasteless that you are being poisoned. There is growing bodies of evidence long term exposure is causing poisoning as well. As better shown in this link http://www.safetydirectory.com/hazardous_substances/hydrogen_sulfide/fact_sheet.htm The obvious issue being unless someone is actively measuring (and they aren't) the air quality around these farms no one knows when or how long they are being exposed to the gas. I may be naive in this but I believe the researches getting this grant will be working on dealing with the gas and not just removing the stench, the difference between the politicians who probably never studied Chemistry and the Scientists, however I would be greatly concerned if they were just going to remove the only warning of this dangerous gas. Ultimately the point is as with many industrial problems far more are affected then anyone really knows.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 302 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 5/19/2009 3:13:22 PM
DS clarify your question please are you asking how many people die from Hydrogen-sulfide etc poisoning in general or just those attributed to the farms? Further being these are airborne gases you are aware that people may not even be aware they are being poisoned untill the ppm has reached threasholds above what is required for poisoning?

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 294 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 5/18/2009 10:13:39 AM
Lar if you had the slightest clue of history and really studied it as opposed to what the WSJ and other self motivated keep the status quo'ers keep telling you it might get you somewhere but it doesn't. The simple truth of the matter is you're wrong a careful review of history shows that its just not as simple as private sector creates jobs. Never has been. Capitalism's default prefered status is ironically self destructive. It wants slavery with a captive market which inturn means it cannibalizes itself. Indeed Capitalism comes almost directly from feudalism except that authority moved from "nobility" to the "controller of means of production" not even one might add the creator of a product, nor the labor that is needed to produce the product. This becomes even more amusing when we discuss the modern situation of people who claim the "rich" take risks and so are worth rewards history also shows us the Rich are far FAR less likely to take risks. Study of how the USA fell to Japan as maker of electronics in the 70's-80's is a literal case study of the stagnation of the "private sector" when it comes to risk. Wonder why all movies seem to be the same? music always the same? etc? On the other hand almost all innovation and advancement has actually come from the public sector or by its intervention. At least until McCarthy made people match Capitalism equal Democracy in the same sentence something that was NEVER meant to be. Further the WSJ is actually wrong historically the only way to redistibute wealth and cause growth has been the soaking of the rich usually by force of arms so be happy its taxes. The history just doesn't agree with you or the WSJ. Indeed the only reason companies are moving is because we allow them to in order to avoid taxes, if we did as is our right in the constitution and charged them import fees and removed our protections from them the would hardly be as eager to move. The problem with the concept of listening to the status quo is they don't want you to think which saddly suits the majority of americans lately. ohh and no its not just the smell nor does your family farms equate to the corporate pig farms that are being discussed by the bill. which by the way would result in new products for new businesses to be founded on and make which would in turn create more jobs. DUH

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 23 (view)

New Bill Proposes to Federalize Computer Security Posted: 5/11/2009 7:46:15 AM
cncgandolf actually it is a matter of legality not just admissibility. There are many things that are done to get information on cases that may not be legally admissible in court. Then there are the things you just plain aren't allowed to do without a court order. These fall under the court order issue. The government is not allowed to just invade your privacy until recently without being able to convince a judge that you are some version of a threat, or you are entitled to recompense for the violation, from any who cooperate and pass that information on without your express consent. It is entirely possible that even with these changes in law a judge may rule that the information gathered is inadmissible. What has changed is that you will not be able to hold the government or whatever private companies who complied with these illegal taps accountable.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 280 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 5/5/2009 10:50:18 AM
Hmmm yes the NY Times is worried... why because wall street is worried why? because wall street is the ones who caused and created the mess in the first place just as it did in the great depression. If I had the time or the patience to educate you or even believed which your history indicates would be futile that you could learn I would explain in detail why it really doesn't matter. The reason wall street is really worried is because it limits the ways they can profit on this mess and evade the responsibility of paying down their portion of the debt. As for the pig smell research I have been ignoring your ignorance of the topic but frankly i'm just tired of seeing you throw this around. Saddly this isn't a luxury because the Corporate farming industry not the family farmers have so overloaded areas with pigs and taken no responsibility for the environmental damage they do. Contrary to your ignorance the smell is just the precursor for such nastiness as hydrogen-sulfide, methane, and amonia and in concentrations sufficent not just for discomfort but poisoning and in long term exposure death. It isn't the smell the money is going to but the means to deal with the waste.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 6 (view)

Arlen Specter ... newest Democrat in the Senate. Posted: 4/28/2009 11:43:40 AM
very true Pazoozoo very true. Saddly no elected official seems to care about service and far too many care about their own job/future.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 4 (view)

Arlen Specter ... newest Democrat in the Senate. Posted: 4/28/2009 11:29:22 AM
There is eezzee a difference between breaking a filibuster a sometimes necessary thing, and eliminating one. There has been no discussion I am aware of despite the GOPs greater use of it then the dems ever did any discussion of eliminating the filibuster or using the "nuclear" option. On the other hand this change would allow finally some real business to go through instead of everything being a party line vote.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 17 (view)

New Bill Proposes to Federalize Computer Security Posted: 4/28/2009 11:03:25 AM
Actually sanderick I think I've kept it very much to the topic. The op wanted to create a aura of fear and uncertainty that ooh no the government is going to take away our rights. However this same op stood by while those rights and more were covertly taken away and stood there and applauded. The difference of course in this case other then the fact that the internet was created by the government essentially is that the danger to it is far too complex to be handled by individuals and without cooperation and coordination on a massive scale. If you don't deal with networks its really hard to express the dangers of bot nets, the confliker worm, and zombie nets. Suffice to say its rather hard to take the school bully seriously when someone else comes in and takes his lunch money away. Nor do I need Larrisan to read what Lawerence's book says about it trust me when I tell you my knowledge on the technical part of the tale far exceeds his and that such information was obtainable without violating everyones civil rights to get.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 5 (view)

New Bill Proposes to Federalize Computer Security Posted: 4/27/2009 10:11:53 AM
As you just proved my point is your full of crap and your just trying to be alarmist over anything that isn't done by your dear friends the GOP who have done and would do FAR more harm then anything proposed by this bill. It is a bill that is being discussed which makes it a public matter the events by Bush and Co were acts done outside of the legislative process and without discussion or review. Torture has been clearly defined and your ditto head answer of sleep dep being torture proves again that you are willfully ignoring the issue in order to downplay the issues involved. The wiretaps WERE illegal, they have been being used Illegally by the governments own reviews into the programs. The Patriot act did not make them legal the FISA act was amended to make them so post facto and is technically unconstitutional but not yet challenged in the supreme court. I'm not even going to get into the intelligence issues about 9/11 what we knew, when we knew and who failed to act on it. Valarie Plame was not considered outed by the CIA nor the Federal Government it was an issue that was considered valid enough for Justice Department action and Prosecution and the Clear and standing rulling of obstruction with a Jail sentence to be imposed. YOU may not find that an issue the rest of the world certainly does. Nor was the Cover agency that was blown by that same act previously outed as you say and we will never know how many assets may have been lost or compromised by that unthinking action. Finally my point being that you have no idea or credibility either as a cyber security expert.. or even as a concerned citizen since you never bothered to be worried during the most universally acknowledged power grab by the executive in history. In other words coming from you its bitter grapes.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 3 (view)

New Bill Proposes to Federalize Computer Security Posted: 4/27/2009 7:25:58 AM
Let me see if I got this right Larissan.... When Bush and co outed a CIA operative, and cover agency you didn't care. When Bush and co violated everyone's rights and privacy with illegal wiretaps you didn't care. When Bush and co supported and ordered the use of torture you didn't care. When Bush and Co began to create a database to store information about american citizens and their behavior headed by former Admiral Poindexter who was part of the Iran Contra affair you didn't care. Now when someone talks about needing to set up defenses around cyberinfrastructure to prevent botnets like confliker that you don't even begin to understand the complexity of you have an issue? Geee biased spin propaganda much?

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 77 (view)

The publican's alternative budget is a huge joke Posted: 4/21/2009 9:43:38 AM
ohhh lord I see we are back to the same old people unable to grasp reality and basic math. Okay folks lets go over the problem with the idea of Globalization and why things are all so screwed up, and understand right now before we even begin this is a matter of extreme greed and corporatism which the founders of this country were aware of and argued about and ultimately tried to prevent and obviously failed because of the stupidity of the modern American. Pretty much all the money is in the first world, most of the first world money is in the US, England, and Japan in fairly close to that order. Everyone got this so far? Now Americans by virtue of being Americans are a melting pot of every nation and culture and so we buy things from everywhere and everyone. Americans also believe if something is good more of it is better and so be buy a lot of it. Ergo we consume from all over the world, the rest of the world however doesn't for the most part give a rats behind about American culture, products, or can for the most part afford them or our services, most infact don't want our products competing with theirs even if they did overlap with their interests because generally ours are or rather when made here were better. Everyone got that part so far? Now it starts getting complicated. The Corporatist wanting more access to those foreign markets convinced the government to reduce tariffs on incoming goods to the states that protected us from gluts of overseas merchandise in the assumption and backroom dealing that forgien governments would do the same. They didn't. However the Corporitists noticed an interesting back door from that. They could use foreign labor to make products ship them to the US and not have to pay for it and so began a vicious cycle. It got worse and worse and people kept being stupid and not seeing the problems with this and the Corporatist convinced you all it had something to do with taxes. Then the real problems started showing the cracks in the plan and this is what the Global Corporatist haven't figured out in their stupidity and arrogance. Remember where i said all the money is?? If an American doesn't have a job they don't have money so they can't buy things.. they cant buy things from foreign companies, and they can't buy things from american companies. Anyone remember the Disney Stores in the 90's they were EVERYWHERE almost as ubiquitous as Starbucks. Problem was they decided they could make more money by moving their factories that made the items to Singapore and still sell them at the same price. American's lost jobs from the factory closing, the places that supported the factory, the restaurants that fed the workers etc all the way down the line and American's couldn't afford to buy the Disney stuff.. did they lower the price? No, did the people not in America purchase the stuff? No they don't like Disney things outside of the US other then when they come here as tourists, Disney closed the factories and most stores went under. Moral of the overly simplified story here? Stop listening to Free-marketeers and Corporatist they aren't interested in the truth they are still only looking at short term answers and goals which ultimately as we see going on kill us while they rake in the dough. Solutions. As I posted a long time ago. Reinstated import Tariffs charge appropriate tariffs and fees to those corporates claiming to be foreign Charge outsources the appropriate payroll taxes based on the labor costs here, shut the shelter loop holes and provide incentives only to american companies using American labor stateside.

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 13 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 2/5/2009 1:42:51 PM
Can't do it. This is illegal under the treaties that have been signed and ratified in order to make the WTO, which is, interestingly enough, the only International Organization that can make any binding decision against countries. Absolutely can do it, it has nothing to do with the WTO don't even get me started. Before you start arguing with me at least have your ducks in a row. First and foremost Congress not the WTO or the UN or anything else determines our import and export rules. In the words of Yule Brenner "so let it be written so let it be done". Ladies and Gentleman the US Constitution "The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;" "To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes" "To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, and uniform Laws on the subject of Bankruptcies throughout the United States" Are we clear here? It can be done it should be done and it needs to be done. Good luck. One can attempt to make something as air tight as possible, but it is almost always possible to find a way around things, and people will find those ways. It is part of human nature, and why a lot of corporations pay top dollar for lawyers and accountants, to find these loopholes. I would suggest that this is almost impossible, if not impractical. Thats because we keep putting lawyers into congress not because we can't make the laws tight. More over this goes into the issue of corporate personhood and its representation and lobbies in government which is honestly illegal on its face but we'll cover that later. A conflict of interests is almost an ethical gray area. On top of that, it is almost impossible to make a decision that does not contain some sort of conflict of interests on some level. Also, considering the sociological principal that has shown consistently that 10% of the people do 90% of the work, you would quickly run out of people or have some extremely lazy people making important decisions. Does anyone else want to point out to him the idiocy of this statement? Other then the fact that its happening right now? Corporate personhood makes sense, yes. However, lobbying is something that one can not stop, be it corporate or otherwise. Ever since it was decided that money = speech, and that all people have a freedom of speech, it has been created an ability for those who have the most money to have the most access. All corporate personhood would stop is GM from coming in a lobbying a legislature. It would not stop G. Richard Wagoner Jr. from lobbying. Corporate's are not supposed to be people. They are not intended under the Constitution to have rights ergo they aren't allowed to lobby. The whole damn problem of money=speech and all people have freedom isn't even in exsistance if we finally correct a very stupid oversight that's been going on since the 1860's. Corporates are NOT people, one very STUPID Federal judge ruled in a case and in the opinion supporting that ruling said that Corporates must have been intended as people since they are not mentioned in the Constitution and it must have been an oversight/or they didn't know that there would be corporations The actual fact of the matter is the Founders DID know about Corporations and were fighting against them as much as the Crown of England as it was the Dutch East India company that got the tea tax raised in the first place. Further they specifically left commerce which includes corporations as regulated by every branch and level of government. So we have been dealing with a situation that NEVER should have happened except in Hamilton's wet dreams in the first place. You are right that it would not stop G Richard Wagoner Jr from lobbying but HE would have to show up himself as himself and all his doing be duly recorded. Very different from modern lobbying. While your ideas are good ideas, I would suggest that they are all but impractical, and in some cases, border on unconstitutional. Mostly because you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about or the Constitution

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 2 (view)

How do you really feel about this large stimulus package? Posted: 2/5/2009 9:47:12 AM
The package is mostly for show and useless. What needs to happen are fundimental changes in corporate law and a return of regulatory oversight. The new rules Obama has put forward about CEO salaries and bonuses are a start in the right direction but not nearly enough. Uncompensated offshoring needs to be eliminated. You offshore your labor then you either pay increased taxes or your product is considered import and TARRIFFED so. Tax Loopholes need to be closed Board conflict of interests need to be prosecuted Corporate personhood and lobbying stopped lots more. We will be lucky if this is just 5 years

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 156 (view)

Where is our country headed now, is this really a depression Posted: 2/3/2009 11:52:19 AM
It is all Republican Congress ever says..... give money back to the wealthy. F the middle class. What amazes me is that the middle class has years of experience now that the money doesn't trickle to them and yet they keep on supporting it. Amazingly stupid and self-destructive. The simple sad truth was spoken or rather written back in 1972 in the musical 1776 which saddly too many people never bothered to see or learn from. From the words of the character John****nson (I do not believe this to have been a real quote of his) " But don't forget that most men without property would rather protect the possibility of becoming rich, than face the reality of being poor. "

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 806 (view)

would you date a stripper? Posted: 1/30/2009 7:40:01 AM
as a representative of Crab Monsters local 26 I object strenuously to not being given equal chance under the law. We will picket you sir... we will. sorry I couldn't resist. Seriously the point remains everyone makes choices good and bad no one should be forever cursed by one choice. Find out who they are before you judge.

fireknight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 12 (view)

Does government does its job? Posted: 1/22/2009 4:31:35 PM
I agree that we have long since abandoned holding Government accountable but as someone that has dealt with numerous Government agencies in recent years you will not convince me that Government is efficient. Competition in services creates a necessity for efficiency that does not exist in Government/Monopolized Services. Respectfully I have to say I have probably worked with and for more government agencies then you have, and I have worked for some corporate interests as well. I have never seen anything that shows me Corporates are any better in point of fact I've found them to be far worse in providing efficiencies, or services. That theory was eliminated when Ford was still alive. When corporations became means for the "shareholders" to make maximum profits as opposed to quality product/services, there was no longer anything that made them better. Worse while there are laws to try to deal with unfair practices in government there is nothing that prevents cronism, nepotism, etc in corporations or private industry. Indeed the level of activity to limit quality and expertise lauded in private industry for some of the reasons complained about by another poster. In the corporate/private sector being good at your job can limit you chances for advancement if not get you fired. If you are sucessful at your job it can get you laid off because it becomes determined its cheaper to higher lesser skilled people elsewhere etc. In the government sector such problems are far less frequent and have means of redress just for an example. I'm sorry to say friend that your allowing the aforementioned brainwashing to cloud your evaluation. Don't mistake that I am saying Government is good and needs no improvement as I said there's A LOT of accountability that needs to be restored and things to be fixed. But the mantra private good Government bad is just plain wrong at this point. ALL the evidence points the other way. Ohh and to the poster who made a comment about someone's photo such... way out of line, shows that you have no legitimate arguement, and a good way to get the thread killed.

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 8 (view)

Does government does its job? Posted: 1/22/2009 8:32:12 AM
I think it's quite clear that we all have different ideas of what the Government's job really is but we should all understand that when Government gets involved, it seldom does so efficiently or cost effectively. Well its been awhile since we've butted heads LOL, but I have to disagree with you. Government has been as efficient and cost effective as any other human enterprise. Philosophy is not fact, We in America have been brainwashed by capitalist interests and more specifically corporate interests that this is the case. Reality shows us its not so far almost every example of privatization of government services and responsibilities has been an UTTER and UNMITIGATED failure. Higher costs lower services less quality less recourse less responsiveness The simple truth is as I stated before its not Government that's failing its the Citizens in holding the Government accountable. Congress has had a 90% incumbency despite its failures who holds the responsibility for that?

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 5 (view)

Does government does its job? Posted: 1/21/2009 10:21:55 AM
Well isn't this an amusing question. It reminds me of Douglas Adams famous question "What is the meaning of life the universe and everything" the answer of course was "42" which caused the cast of characters great consternation. So here we have a situation where the question isn't the one that fits the answer, because people have their own mistaken agendas in asking it. The question asked Does Government do its Job? Has only one obvious answer contrary to those who posted it and that is Yes government does do its job and it does it VERY well. The reason for the consternation at the answer much as 42 for the meaning of life the universe and everything is because that wasn't the real question. The real question is do the Citizens do their job and that answer is a resounding NO. Government answers to the people not only by the social contract realized back during the Renaissance but even more directly via Democracy and Republic. We don't define the duties of Government clearly and so it does not always perform clearly. Nor is it that government fails to provide the services its defined to provide but rather individuals who fail to execute their responsibilities in providing that service. Its not that private industry does it better in fact in all of history there is nothing that is a standing testiment to private industry, but many examples of government from Stonehenge to the great wall of china. From aqueducts to space shots. The failure point is people not government.

FireKnight

Joined: 4/24/2006

Msg: 125 (view)

do any girls actually want nice guys? Posted: 1/14/2009 2:25:02 PM
I get sooooo tired of these threads for so many reasons, more often then not because the same tired excuses and arguements come about. I'm going to pick one of the posts to answer the general populace so if the poster of this post should read this please understand I am not infact talking to you perse an nothing should be taken as directed to you even when I say you after this disclaimer LOL. Lets clear this up: I'll be brutally honest here. Difference between Nice Guy, Great Guy, and Bad Boy. No let me clear this up you can't be brutally honest here because your own perceptions and personal defense mechanisms are engaged. When discussing relationships the definition requires two parties, when you classify you are explaining them but not yourself and in so doing are missing a full half of the equation. Infact there are more then Nice Guy, Great Guy, and Bad Boy. There is far more which I'll get into later. Nice Guy- To himself, he is good looking, successful, responsible, etc. To her, he is lacking something... looks, success, or responsibility, etc. She may pity him, and stick him in the friendzone. He hates this. He becomes bitter b/c he is not getting laid and writes angry Nice Guy posts in forum. The first example of your bias and the root of the problem in honest discussion of relationships. This definition more then all others is the core defense of males and females one generated to justify treatment they have given others or justify treatment they have received acording to their own perception. This definition says that the guy views himself as .... How can you know what someone else feels of themselves? You cannot. It says that good looking successful, responsible,etc is the definition of nice? That's not right either a nice person doesn't have to view themselves as any of those things. You say "She may pity him and stick him in the "friendzone" do you know what it feels like to be pittied do you think its a feeling anyone likes to feel? I assure you any nice guy that has been "pittied" has right to be bitter its a cruel thing to do to anyone. We'll discuss more about nice guys a bit later. Bad Boy- He is a pig. He hates women. His picture is in the dictionary next to misogynist. He lives dangerously or very lavishly. Stupid girls (see, not Women) who have self esteem issues are drawn to the promise of excitement and thrill of taming him. They will fail. He will crush their spirit. Then will then seek another bad boy or will grow up and repeat the cycle of pain or ... start acting like WOMEN who now seek Great Guy. Ohh it goes so much further then this and its not something that gets faced often. For one its not even that the bad boy is a pig, he doesn't have to be its again an issue of the defensive nature kicking in. What he is is absolutely the worst possible match for the individual, BUT has some trait or feature that is either exciting to you or attractive to you and so you will ignore everyone, and thing that tells you that this is the worst possible person to be around. If you survive you might start being wiser about your relationships but in many cases will not be. This brings us to.... Great Guy- He fulfills all the expectations and needs that particular woman is seeking (Varies from woman to woman). She feels like she is blessed to be with him, not "settling"... Literally swept off her feet. The feeling is mutual. He might be average to everyone else in the world, but for her... he is perfect. Again a perception filled view rather then an honest one. A great guy doesn't have to fulfill all the expectations and needs of anyone but themselves an a woman who is wise will see that and if those needs and expectations meet hers. They will learn about each other an see themselves honestly good and bad. They may be literally swept off their feet or it might sneak up on them.. the feeling does not always start mutually and he doesn't even have to be average, because who he is is what matters to her. Now, for some woman out there, you ARE Great Guy. You simply haven't met her yet. For the women in your past, do you really want to be with them out of PITY? How happy would you be? How long do you suppose they could keep up that act? When women get into relationships with Nice Guy, infidelity seems to creep in. She didn't dump you because you were NICE. She dumped you because she wasn't attracted to you. Would you stay with a woman you weren't attracted to because she was NICE? I thought so. And so in the end we have the closest bits of truth that can be gleaned from this view point. That in the modern view if you are not attractive and immediately so you are to be discarded no matter what virtues you may or may not have. All you can do is either pick yourself up and move on, or persevere and try again. However in modern society that is more often viewed as harrasment then flattering. Now for the real truth of this topic. There are many kinds of men and women but more importantly then that is the perceptions people have created around themselves to support and comfort their experiences. These things exist in both genders but we'll stick to the male for consistancy. Nice Guys exist but they are often confused with a more insidious type of the "bad boy" called the manipulator. He acts a certain way in order to achieve goals and desires not out of genuine nature or interest. He acts politely and chivalrously because it has worked before and allows him to charm passed other warning signs. He might even have convinced himself that he is nice. However observing carefully how he treats others and most specifically those who can offer him nothing shows far less kindness and patience, warns to changes to come. Your friends will probably see through this an warn you or they might not. They can also be confused for the insecure guy. This guy isn't manipulative in the sense of trying to get something, but rather because they do not believe they are good enough to be anything but nice. They feel themselves lacking in value for some reason weight, looks, social class, family life, and try to make themselves get along. This guy may grow into a genuine nice guy or upon finding what ever made them insecure change into something different perhaps even self loathing and can become almost overnight opposite of everything they seemed to be. The true nice guy aka a man. Is someone who has come to grips with who they are not always what they want to be. The will treat all people with a basic kindess and respect and offer more to those who show themselves deserving. They will deal honestly with people and attempt to keep their own flaws from effecting others and make amends when they do. They may be good looking they may be ugly they may seem exciting they may seem mild. BUT they do what they say they will do. In modern society we have forgotten about this we expect because of the fantasies of Hollywood and our own preoccupation with our own egos. That others are supposed to fit us rather then the truth of it which is we need to fit each other. The simple truth is most people don't want to admit their follies and mistakes, or their own dark behaviors. We've become spoiled wanting instant resolutions rather then realizing that its always been a long process to find a mate and love not a short one. The truth is most women right now aren't looking for a nice guy or a man.. Not because that isn't what they really want but because they have confused lustful infatuations and the criteria required for those vs love and relationships. If you look only for what you find attractive at first glance you will almost never find anything of value. That is the truth

Show ALL Forums